anyone up for a homeopathy/flower essence thread? - Page 50

[Panserbjorne]

Originally Posted by moonmamajess 

or should I just ditch the star tulip?

that would be my off the cuff answer-I'll come back when I have more time.

Edited by Panserbjorne - 3/23/11 at 2:10pm

[aweynsayl]

lol, if there are actually any ocotillos growing in canada, they'd be in a hot house of some sort! 

bluets~ ha! now you're just teasing me. try rock water yet? 

pb~ i want a book that has 20 pages on one flower! which ones do that??? 

so... i'm going to be dealing later this week with a situation that would typically send me into a negative state of sorts.... i have been sticking with my silica/centaury combo and really doing well and all that, but i am finding myself panicking thinking about this upcoming situation. i'm thinking that i *might* be ok if i dose acutely with the silica/centaury...... but honestly, i am thinking a big glass of something to address my fear (kali phos at the least, maybe aspen or mimulus as well) might be in order. thoughts, pb? if i do that for the duration of the situation (it would be 4 days) and then go back to my usual silica/centaury is that likely to disrupt the progress i've been making? i'm seriously freaking out about this situation, and wanting to have something i know i can go to if i do feel afraid/nervous. maybe i should look at it, too, and see more clearly why i'm so frightened....i'm not really sure if i would benefit most from aspen or mimulus....

speaking of..... mimulus vs aspen. i'm hoping, panserbjorn, you have one of your wonderful stories like you did with centaury/cerato/scleranthus..... 

[Panserbjorne]

Originally Posted by aweynsayl 

so... i'm going to be dealing later this week with a situation that would typically send me into a negative state of sorts.... i have been sticking with my silica/centaury combo and really doing well and all that, but i am finding myself panicking thinking about this upcoming situation. i'm thinking that i *might* be ok if i dose acutely with the silica/centaury...... but honestly, i am thinking a big glass of something to address my fear (kali phos at the least, maybe aspen or mimulus as well) might be in order. thoughts, pb?

Yup, that's what I do !  I don't rely on my type flower if I have to go to the dentist

Mood flowers are there to help you with the things that come up.  You can always use them in addition to your type flower to help you cope with things.

if i do that for the duration of the situation (it would be 4 days) and then go back to my usual silica/centaury is that likely to disrupt the progress i've been making?

nope.  I'd even keep with that and just add the others as an intercurrent.

i'm seriously freaking out about this situation, and wanting to have something i know i can go to if i do feel afraid/nervous. maybe i should look at it, too, and see more clearly why i'm so frightened....i'm not really sure if i would benefit most from aspen or mimulus....

well, look at the keynotes of both.  Mimulus are specific fears, ones you can put a name to.  "I'm afraid of public speaking, I'm afraid that if I get up there I'll forget everything, I'm afraid that people will not show up" etc. etc. etc. 

Aspen fears are vague fears.  That feeling that "something" is wrong, but you don't know what.  The hair is standing up on the back of your neck.  The line between imagination and reality is blurred.  They create problems and write big stories in their head.  So instead of the mimulus, "I'm afraid of public speaking and that I'll forget everything I am supposed to say."  The aspen situation would be more "Something terrible is going to happen. What if they ask me things I don't know?  What if someone there knows more than me?"  At it's core it's fear the Aspen fear is created in the mind as opposed to being a rational fear. 

**IF you were bit by a dog, it's rational to be afraid of dogs (mimulus.)  A mimulus person would avoid dogs and possibly restructure their route to ensure that they didn't come across one.  If you're afraid of the ocean because of what *might* lurk beneath the waters that's more an aspen fear.  Aspen, IME is also more likely to have dreams that leave them feel uneasy in ways they cannot explain.** 

IN your example if you were struck by fear each time you thought of the stressor and what it entails for a specific reason, mimulus.  IF you have just an uneasy feeling, a sense of foreboding that's with you constantly as you anticipate it, and that you can't really describe then it's aspen.

speaking of..... mimulus vs aspen. i'm hoping, panserbjorn, you have one of your wonderful stories like you did with centaury/cerato/scleranthus..... 

I don't know how *wonderful* that was, but hopefully it helped differentiate a bit!

[sunnysandiegan]

It helped ME!

I don't have nor plan to get either one, but I am always curious about subtle differences like that. Thanks! :)

[aweynsayl]

Originally Posted by Panserbjorne 

Mood flowers are there to help you with the things that come up.  You can always use them in addition to your type flower to help you cope with things.

if i do that for the duration of the situation (it would be 4 days) and then go back to my usual silica/centaury is that likely to disrupt the progress i've been making?

nope.  I'd even keep with that and just add the others as an intercurrent.

right, i just was unsure of starting "mood flowers" for me at this point.... i'm glad you think it'll be ok, because i'd probably do it anyway, lol. just curious-- is it ok because it's related to a specific event, as opposed to treating something that came up as a result of the centaury/silica? (that makes sense, now that i think about it. i remember you saying "if you hit your head, please take arnica" lol.... i just dont want to disrupt the progress i've been making!)

IN your example if you were struck by fear each time you thought of the stressor and what it entails for a specific reason, mimulus.  IF you have just an uneasy feeling, a sense of foreboding that's with you constantly as you anticipate it, and that you can't really describe then it's aspen.

that does help. but i'm still... augh. i *feel* like i have specific fears, but if you were to ask me WHY i'm afraid of them, i'd get all flustered and not really be able to answer. that might be what i'm stumbling over-- specific fears, but non-specific reasons... it's like half mimulus, half aspen, lol. 

this might help me decide-- one thing i'm trying to process out between the two is relating to sensitivity.... i read that mimulus is good for oversensitivity to things like noises and smells... but i would think aspen if i was thinking "easily startled" (as in by noises). thoughts about that?

[Panserbjorne]

Regarding noise-yes....aspen is sensitive to anything that's going to rattle them-they are already quivering, right? 

And for the mimulus being assaulted by fear-it will pass, for the aspen a loud slamming door could ruin the rest of their day.

I'd say that aspen is more oversensitive in general-I think of them as more jumpy.  the aspen type generally feels unsafe in the world.  they are the ones tuned in to the supernatural world and the vibes of others.  they will also tend to be the ones sensitive to EMF's, ley lines, environmental changes etc.  It is probably the second most sensitive remedy in the Bach system.  For instance, I tend to NEVER give an aspen type aspen without something to protect them-like walnut or star.

Mimulus gets kind of rigid as a result of the fears.  They'll control their lives so they aren't controlled by the fear-but of course, that means they ARE controlled by the fear!

I'm going aspen for you.  Without knowing more, it's hard to say-but that's my best guess.  Also, the world won't explode if you use both. 

[Aubergine68]

Wow, this thread is fast moving! Or maybe I'm busier than I thought I was.

Moonmamajess, I'm quite sure there are no ocotillos growing in Canada, outside of greenhouses. Can they be grown as houseplants, does anyone know?  In fact, honestly, I have never heard of this plant before. I'm assuming that someone who was developing FEs for Prairie Deva had a special connection to that plant, and maybe because s/he is a snowbird and has spent time with it in Arizona.  Charles de Lint is a Canadian fantasy writer, based in Ottawa, who spends lots of the year in AZ and he has written books set in both landscapes that are really very spiritual.  So this is the kind of connection to Canada and to the Southwest that I imagine is behind Ocotillo on that list of essences.  Someday, when I know more about essences, I am going to write to or take a class from the people who are selling the Prairie Deva ones and ask them all these questions.

Aloe vera is also on the Prairie Deva list, and that is also definitely not a native Canadian plant.  That one, I  absolutely did grow up with, though - my herbalist grandmother always had a gorgeous huge  aloe vera on the counter in her sunny laundry room and she was always breaking a leaf off for first aid or giving cuttings away.  Given our harsh, harsh climate, I would argue that we have to allow for a little flexibility in what we consider native.  Lots of our herbs are annual here but perennials to most of you, for example. Some of us grow things in our gardens that are started in greenhouses and that may never set seed or may not even flower in our climate.  That doesn't make our relationship to these plants inauthentic.....just...different (sorry if I'm sounding a little defensive, was reading a long passage quoted from Bach I think about how only plants grown in the wild really have the proper virtue to be made into FEs. And I certainly intend to experiment with plants I grow in my garden! And maybe even plants I grow as houseplants.)

And, while I was researching how to make flower essences online today, I came across a note that not all of Bach's flowers grow in England, even.  Olive, Vine and one of the others, I forget which, are not native English plants.  So there is precedent!

Speaking of looking for the overlap in explanations....I can understand why practitioners would want/need to do this, but I think I am much more interested in looking for the meaning that each flower has for me, and I think I want to look at local varieties instead of those growing in England or California.  Why not my own beloved backyard northern heritage apple trees instead of the Bach Crabapple (which, admittedly, seems very useful in itself)?  I have so much to learn, but I think a few years of tinkering and  experimentation with both some of the traditional FEs and homemade ones sounds really appealing.

 I have been researching the Bach and FES FEs - well, trying to learn the basics, at any rate.  One thing that really stands out for me - Bach has WIld Rose, FES has California Wild Rose, and Prairie Deva has Alberta Wild Rose -- three very similar plants.  Bach and FES emphasize apathy as the keyword indicator for the use of their wild rose essences.  This really irritated me - based on my own knowledge of the Alberta Wild Rose that grows on the northern prairies, there is so much more to the wild rose!  The Prairie Deva description does mention apathy, but emphasizes other qualities as well - tenacity, self-protectiveness, renewal of that which has gone numb or dead through a long winter ....And there is a dimension of personal meaning for me with my local Wild Rose that is so important beyond even this description.

Originally Posted by singin_angel 

I haven't heard of these but as a fellow Canadian...I want to know more! I think it is a great way to connect with our local environment (although granted I am not in the Prairies). I am certainly going to check these out...wonder how much shipping would be across provinces...haha!

singin, I'd be really surprised if there wasn't someone in Eastern or Central Canada doing their own FEs. I think I've read about Australian ones?  That is exactly what I'm interested in - connecting with my local environment, building personal relationships with the flowers.

At the same time, I didn't think I was really interested in Bach, but I've been browsing and Water Violet is really intriguing in particular...and I found about five of them that I think my dh should take, lol!

.I really have no budget atm for FE purchases, though I do have a nice bottle of brandy I could use to get started on homemade ones! (if only I had any plants growing....still a very wintry spring.)  I want to spend some time with the descriptions of Bach and FES and let them settle before I decide to buy any more traditional ones.  Has anyone here experimented with making their own flower essences?

No time to proofread further, laptop battery about to shut off.  Hope this makes sense!
 

[Panserbjorne]

Originally Posted by Aubergine68 

 \This really irritated me - based on my own knowledge of the Alberta Wild Rose that grows on the northern prairies, there is so much more to the wild rose!  

oh there is SO much more!  The problem is that they only put the blurbs online whereas many companies put all their info out there.  Again, I could easily write 10 pages of indications for wild rose-and not because I'm brilliant or "in the know."  The information is out there amongst practitioners, in reading, etc.  Wild rose is a very deep flower with a ton of layers.  I find a difference in california wild rose's action vs. Bach's.  So there's something to that.  I've put people on wild rose because they had easy access and it did nothing.  When I sent california wild rose (my first choice) the shifts happened.  Great for kids who won't eat after being sick, and babies who can't feed.

  Has anyone here experimented with making their own flower essences?

Yup!  Love it!  A doctor in my clinic and I go hiking for the sole purpose of gathering flowers for essence making...getting ready to make some snowdrop now!

[moonmamajess]

Ok so obviously I was confusedlol. Was very curious as to why and WHERE that could be growing in Canada. However, if they are growing them in greenhouses? I would think that the vibes would be MUCH different. Moving on...

It is my solid plan to make my own flower essences this spring/summer! I think I asked about it earlier up thread, but didn't get any bites! It seems like such a simple, yet exhilerating thing to do on a sunny early afternoon! I too have a bottle of brandy waiting to be used! Can't wait to swap expereinces once it warms up!

Gotta go play with the babes be back later... 

[aweynsayl]

<editing... back later....> 

[bluets]

other places to look for your favorite essences (non-English):

http://www.lichenwood.com/flower%20essences.html

http://www.healingorchids.com/index.html

http://www.woodlandessence.com/essences.htm

[redveg]

Morning:)  I wish I knew how to print this thread so I could catch up while waiting in the car for my kids.  I am having a time finding more than about 10 minutes a day lately to get in front of this machine.  I am going to try to find some books online which is not my favorite thing, I am a need to hold the book type of a person.  It is also very difficult for me to sit in front of the computer and read for any length of time.  

[_ktg_]

PB - I love how you broke down Mimulus & Aspen as I've been considering working with both, like I did with pine & willow.  I know from what I've journaled before & expressed here - Mimimuls is in the mix, but I kept feeling that Aspen should be there too.  Its like someone could have 2 layers of fear (oh my get me a therapist couch now!) the immediate and then the vague or uneasy fears, and both of which can mix and feed into each other.

Question - so the protection concept, is because an individual would be feeling so vulnerable, sensative and aware of these energies, they would just feel overwhelmed?

Oooh this is so much fun and now I'm off to read more on walnut, star of bethelham and agrimony (it popped up for me in a recent dream  so time to investigate)

[aweynsayl]

well, i'm glad nothing will explode if i take both, lol! i have been realizing that "fear" is a big aspect for me. i dont know about "layers," per say, as that's been a problematic word around these conversations, lol.... but i do think there are two types or categories... i've been leaning towards thinking of mimulus fears as bodily tension (from what pb has said, and from my own experiences), and aspen fears as more mental agitation. if you think about being near an aspen tree~ for me, that quaking clears my mind... it's a crown chakra sort of feeling, ime.... while if i imagine being near mimulus (and from reading the barnard, who is so atmospheric, and being that he's talking about one of my favorite places on earth, i can imagine fairly well...) it's a soothing, glowing, belly, solar plexus sort of feeling. that's what i'm going with.... also, the other night i took some aspen, and my mind quieted. but my body was still tense, rigid.... i took some mimulus, and my belly softened. it brought me back to chamomile~ and how i'd said it "only did so much for me..." while chamomile is "for people who hold tension in their belly" i realized that if WHY i do that is from fear, taking chamomile will help~ but not address the WHY..... like treating the symptoms, rather than the source.

[aweynsayl]

there's so much here i want to talk about.... let's see how well i can do on half a cup of coffee....... 

Originally Posted by Aubergine68 

Some of us grow things in our gardens that are started in greenhouses and that may never set seed or may not even flower in our climate.  That doesn't make our relationship to these plants inauthentic.....just...different (sorry if I'm sounding a little defensive, was reading a long passage quoted from Bach I think about how only plants grown in the wild really have the proper virtue to be made into FEs. And I certainly intend to experiment with plants I grow in my garden! And maybe even plants I grow as houseplants.)

what was the quote, do you remember? because his essences do not fit that-- cerato is from china, and only cultivated in gardens, while honeysuckle was possibly even made from a plant he planted in his garden....... 

....I think I am much more interested in looking for the meaning that each flower has for me, and I think I want to look at local varieties instead of those growing in England or California.  Why not my own beloved backyard northern heritage apple trees instead of the Bach Crabapple (which, admittedly, seems very useful in itself)? 

when you say "meaning each has for me" are you speaking of personal associations/memories of the plant? or do you mean how you feel around the plants? because there's that whole doc of sigs thing.... your apple trees would be different from bach's crab apple. as in, they would do different things, because the signatures are different. but if you get a certain feeling from those trees that is something you think would help you, then that would be fun to try....  if you just love the trees, and have memories attached to them, that would be a very different thing... imo.

.....  This really irritated me - based on my own knowledge of the Alberta Wild Rose that grows on the northern prairies, there is so much more to the wild rose!  The Prairie Deva description does mention apathy, but emphasizes other qualities as well - tenacity, self-protectiveness, renewal of that which has gone numb or dead through a long winter 

actually, that sounds a lot like what i read in F&F of bach's wild rose..... i think the blurbs are dangerous. i personally have tossed out the FES blurbs. they are helpful for key words, but can be so... misleading, imo. 

....And there is a dimension of personal meaning for me with my local Wild Rose that is so important beyond even this description.

again, the personal meaning interests me.... how they make you feel? as in, would transfer to an essence, or some memory? i'm not being clear enough, but do you see there is a difference? i'm just wondering which you mean...

That is exactly what I'm interested in - connecting with my local environment, building personal relationships with the flowers.

i posted, maybe here, maybe somewhere else, when we moved back to AZ, that i was interested in local FEs. i did try some, and, while they were sort of nice, and they did help me transition to being here, they felt *very* different from how the english FEs feel to me.

now, there are lots of reasons that might be-- and it might just be me. i do wonder if it's at all because the az flowers maybe dont fit bach's "rules" (iirc, he said cactus would not work as an FE... i need to look more at his rules.)

there's also the element of plants we do love.... you're lucky, imo, to have that with local plants. i wish i did. 

taking FEs of flowers that have meaning to me has sometimes yielded interesting results (sometimes resulted in virtually nothing that i perceived). while, flowers to which i have no personal connection at all have been stunningly powerful, and felt on a totally different level. 

there are flowers i love, and on some level would like to experience an FE of... but then there's what an FE from that flower would "do"-- the idea of white rose of york FE, as a playful example-- of course i would want to try it! but what would it do? help with family feuds? but now i'm just being silly. 

i should say, though, that my personal approach is towards healing.... which is very different from what you're talking about, connecting to your local environment.

i would LOVE to make FEs in my own back yard... but that's more fantasy for me than anything~ i live in the center of town... i would not feel good about taking a FE made here. but i think it's what bach had in mind. i just feel there's a difference in how you go about it...... 

does any of that shed light on how you're feeling/thinking about things?

[aweynsayl]

Originally Posted by bluets 

other places to look for your favorite essences (non-English):

http://www.lichenwood.com/flower%20essences.html

http://www.healingorchids.com/index.html

http://www.woodlandessence.com/essences.htm

funny. i had been wondering if anyone made orchid essences. it bugs me, though, and i wonder how others feel about it, that they're made in a green house, and the flowers are not actually put in the water.....obviously, bach would not have approved, but that's not to say there's nothing to it. i just cant personally see wanting to take it. i'd want wild orchid growing on the side of the cliff near the waterfall.... *that* i can see a doc of sigs for.... kwim? 

anyone know if there's vanilla FE? i would be so curious about that one....... 

[_ktg_]

Originally Posted by aweynsayl 

well, i'm glad nothing will explode if i take both, lol! i have been realizing that "fear" is a big aspect for me. i dont know about "layers," per say, as that's been a problematic word around these conversations, lol.... but i do think there are two types or categories... i've been leaning towards thinking of mimulus fears as bodily tension (from what pb has said, and from my own experiences), and aspen fears as more mental agitation. if you think about being near an aspen tree~ for me, that quaking clears my mind... it's a crown chakra sort of feeling, ime.... while if i imagine being near mimulus (and from reading the barnard, who is so atmospheric, and being that he's talking about one of my favorite places on earth, i can imagine fairly well...) it's a soothing, glowing, belly, solar plexus sort of feeling. that's what i'm going with.... also, the other night i took some aspen, and my mind quieted. but my body was still tense, rigid.... i took some mimulus, and my belly softened. it brought me back to chamomile~ and how i'd said it "only did so much for me..." while chamomile is "for people who hold tension in their belly" i realized that if WHY i do that is from fear, taking chamomile will help~ but not address the WHY..... like treating the symptoms, rather than the source.

I was just re-reading Dugan about some Chakra exercises and of course she mentions the link between the solar plexus and the third eye chakra (not necessarily the crown, but hey its up there )  That has me thinking if you have so much fear in your life, can you effectively block your own psychic awareness via holding tension in the solar plexus or in the 3rd eye/crown regions?

[aweynsayl]

Originally Posted by _ktg_ 

I was just re-reading Dugan about some Chakra exercises and of course she mentions the link between the solar plexus and the third eye chakra (not necessarily the crown, but hey its up there )  That has me thinking if you have so much fear in your life, can you effectively block your own psychic awareness via holding tension in the solar plexus or in the 3rd eye/crown regions?

as in, i'm protecting myself by giving myself migraines and bellyaches? 

[Aubergine68]

I'm not going to have time to get to much of this as the naptime  proceeds apace. I'll post when I have to run and get back to the rest if/when I have time.
 

Originally Posted by redveg 

Morning:)  I wish I knew how to print this thread so I could catch up while waiting in the car for my kids.  

I know what you mean - I keep dipping into it but it is too long/too interesting for computer reading only.  Wish I could snag it onto my kindle.

Originally Posted by aweynsayl 

well, i'm glad nothing will explode if i take both, lol! i have been realizing that "fear" is a big aspect for me. i dont know about "layers," per say, as that's been a problematic word around these conversations, lol.... but i do think there are two types or categories... i've been leaning towards thinking of mimulus fears as bodily tension (from what pb has said, and from my own experiences), and aspen fears as more mental agitation. if you think about being near an aspen tree~ for me, that quaking clears my mind... it's a crown chakra sort of feeling, ime.... while if i imagine being near mimulus (and from reading the barnard, who is so atmospheric, and being that he's talking about one of my favorite places on earth, i can imagine fairly well...) it's a soothing, glowing, belly, solar plexus sort of feeling. that's what i'm going with.... also, the other night i took some aspen, and my mind quieted. but my body was still tense, rigid.... i took some mimulus, and my belly softened. it brought me back to chamomile~ and how i'd said it "only did so much for me..." while chamomile is "for people who hold tension in their belly" i realized that if WHY i do that is from fear, taking chamomile will help~ but not address the WHY..... like treating the symptoms, rather than the source.

Very interesting conversation.

ktg, I'm interested in agrimony, larch and walnut for my dh.  If you start using agrimony and walnut, I'd be interested in hearing about your experiences.

Originally Posted by aweynsayl 

there's so much here i want to talk about.... let's see how well i can do on half a cup of coffee....... 

Originally Posted by Aubergine68 

Some of us grow things in our gardens that are started in greenhouses and that may never set seed or may not even flower in our climate.  That doesn't make our relationship to these plants inauthentic.....just...different (sorry if I'm sounding a little defensive, was reading a long passage quoted from Bach I think about how only plants grown in the wild really have the proper virtue to be made into FEs. And I certainly intend to experiment with plants I grow in my garden! And maybe even plants I grow as houseplants.)

what was the quote, do you remember? because his essences do not fit that-- cerato is from china, and only cultivated in gardens, while honeysuckle was possibly even made from a plant he planted in his garden....... 

You are right - I wrote hastily and didn't say exactly what I'd understood.  What I understood is, wild plants are by far the best, a garden plant in the perfect circumstances is second best but still acceptable, never use plants growing near a highway because of toxins.  I can't find the exact quote quickly but that is the sense of what I read.

....I think I am much more interested in looking for the meaning that each flower has for me, and I think I want to look at local varieties instead of those growing in England or California.  Why not my own beloved backyard northern heritage apple trees instead of the Bach Crabapple (which, admittedly, seems very useful in itself)? 

when you say "meaning each has for me" are you speaking of personal associations/memories of the plant? or do you mean how you feel around the plants? because there's that whole doc of sigs thing.... your apple trees would be different from bach's crab apple. as in, they would do different things, because the signatures are different. but if you get a certain feeling from those trees that is something you think would help you, then that would be fun to try....  if you just love the trees, and have memories attached to them, that would be a very different thing... imo.

One of my apple trees is pretty crabapple-y.  I expect it would be similar to the English one the way that the different wild roses are similar to each other.... Yes, I think personal associations/memories are part of it, but I also feel that I have relationships with plants/trees.  Especially ones that I have grown from seed or ones that I have harvested from or pruned or cared for.  I wonder how that would affect essences, if at all?  I have an oak in my yard descended from an English oak, probably the same variety Bach used for the Oak remedy.  But this oak is the grandchild of the original English Oak - grown from an acorn from a tree in Ontario that was grown from an acorn of a beloved oak from a family home in England.  (And I have a personal relationship with this tree as well, long story).  Would the fact that this oak was grown out of England, in a climate where it really shouldn't have survived matter?  The acorns are much smaller than you'd get, the plant is prone to leaf bolls, etc.   To me, there is an extra layer of virtue there - survival against odds - in the oakish qualities of this particular tree.  The genetics are the same, but the signature maybe a little different?

Also, I suspect every oak that Bach ever made essences from had its own history, its own relationships with people.  Plants and trees are members of their species but all individuals, both physically and (I would maintain) spiritually, just as people are, y'know?  I feel in reading about how to make essences a hint of the thought that there is a Platonic ideal of each plant that is the only right plant to take an essence from, and I resist that implication. Maybe I'm resisting it because the English landscape and even the Californian one are so inaccessible to me.  Is the essence of the orchid that grows in a hothouse *really* different/inferior to the essence of the orchid that grows on the side of a waterfall? I can understand why you would prefer the latter, but if you didn't know which flower the essence was made from, would it make a difference in its efficacy? 

actually, that sounds a lot like what i read in F&F of bach's wild rose..... i think the blurbs are dangerous. i personally have tossed out the FES blurbs. they are helpful for key words, but can be so... misleading, imo. 

I was actually reading from the only book my library has on essences, Chancellor's Illustrated Handbook of the Bach Flower Remedies.  A chapter on each essence, but the rose one did not inspire me, no.  

So where do you find good discussions of the FES remedies, beyond the online blurbs?

again, the personal meaning interests me.... how they make you feel? as in, would transfer to an essence, or some memory? i'm not being clear enough, but do you see there is a difference? i'm just wondering which you mean...

Well, correct me if I'm wrong, but it seems I've read that the essences are vibrational....if that is so, would there really be a difference?  Wouldn't the attitude, memories and intention of the maker of the essences affect the product?  Would you rather have an essence made from the perfect orchid grown by the waterfall, made by someone who didn't love plants, did not believe FEs work and was only out to make a buck, or would you rather have an essence made from hothouse orchids made by someone who understood and valued and was trying to emulate what Bach was trying to do?

The first description of how to make essences that I came across online talked about communing with the deva of each plant, asking permission to pick it, etc. I'm assuming that Bach didn't talk about devas, but did he talk about a frame of mind you have to be in to make essences, ie. that the attitude of the maker influences the product?  I've read of procedures like this in harvesting wild herbs for tinctures and teas, too - you have to have the right frame of mind to harvest them or you won't get all the virtue of the plants.

 

now, there are lots of reasons that might be-- and it might just be me. i do wonder if it's at all because the az flowers maybe dont fit bach's "rules" (iirc, he said cactus would not work as an FE... i need to look more at his rules.)

Yeah, me too.  

there's also the element of plants we do love.... you're lucky, imo, to have that with local plants. i wish i did. 

taking FEs of flowers that have meaning to me has sometimes yielded interesting results (sometimes resulted in virtually nothing that i perceived). while, flowers to which i have no personal connection at all have been stunningly powerful, and felt on a totally different level. 

Very interesting.  I look forward to experimenting.  There's probably more I should say, and probably more to clarify in what I've already said,  but the toddlers are popping their heads up (reminding me of little sunflowers) and I have to go.

[Panserbjorne]

Originally Posted by Aubergine68 

I

Originally Posted by Aubergine68 

You are right - I wrote hastily and didn't say exactly what I'd understood.  What I understood is, wild plants are by far the best, a garden plant in the perfect circumstances is second best but still acceptable, never use plants growing near a highway because of toxins.  I can't find the exact quote quickly but that is the sense of what I read.

precisely-you got it.

One of my apple trees is pretty crabapple-y.  I expect it would be similar to the English one the way that the different wild roses are similar to each other.... Yes, I think personal associations/memories are part of it, but I also feel that I have relationships with plants/trees.  Especially ones that I have grown from seed or ones that I have harvested from or pruned or cared for.  I wonder how that would affect essences, if at all?  I have an oak in my yard descended from an English oak, probably the same variety Bach used for the Oak remedy.  But this oak is the grandchild of the original English Oak - grown from an acorn from a tree in Ontario that was grown from an acorn of a beloved oak from a family home in England.  (And I have a personal relationship with this tree as well, long story).  Would the fact that this oak was grown out of England, in a climate where it really shouldn't have survived matter?  The acorns are much smaller than you'd get, the plant is prone to leaf bolls, etc.   To me, there is an extra layer of virtue there - survival against odds - in the oakish qualities of this particular tree.  The genetics are the same, but the signature maybe a little different?

no it should not, not really.  Your relationship with this plant could make it more healing FOR YOU, but it would still be healing, IMO.  AND in terms of climate, if it survived it's less of an issue.  The different climates can present different challenges to the plants though, which is why it matters.  Again, what you posted is correct.

Also, I suspect every oak that Bach ever made essences from had its own history, its own relationships with people.  

Yes, but that really shouldn't matter so much.  I'd say that it's what the plant has had to deal with, it's growing conditions, how it survives, if it's a solitary plant or grows with others, if it wants water, or shade etc. that determines, in large part, it's usage and application.

Plants and trees are members of their species but all individuals, both physically and (I would maintain) spiritually, just as people are, y'know?  I feel in reading about how to make essences a hint of the thought that there is a Platonic ideal of each plant that is the only right plant to take an essence from, and I resist that implication. Maybe I'm resisting it because the English landscape and even the Californian one are so inaccessible to me.  Is the essence of the orchid that grows in a hothouse *really* different/inferior to the essence of the orchid that grows on the side of a waterfall? I can understand why you would prefer the latter, but if you didn't know which flower the essence was made from, would it make a difference in its efficacy? 

I think you're resisting it because it's not what we're supposed to be looking at!  We're looking at the tendencies of the plant, not it's relationship with people.  IF you cultivated the plant, visited it often, had a family history with that particular tree then as I said, it would probably be more beneficial to you than it would to me...but if we both needed it it would work.

Well, correct me if I'm wrong, but it seems I've read that the essences are vibrational....if that is so, would there really be a difference?  Wouldn't the attitude, memories and intention of the maker of the essences affect the product?  

YES!  which is why it's important to be discerning and know your source with ANY energetic medicine. 

Would you rather have an essence made from the perfect orchid grown by the waterfall, made by someone who didn't love plants, did not believe FEs work and was only out to make a buck, or would you rather have an essence made from hothouse orchids made by someone who understood and valued and was trying to emulate what Bach was trying to do?

definitely the latter.

The first description of how to make essences that I came across online talked about communing with the deva of each plant, asking permission to pick it, etc. I'm assuming that Bach didn't talk about devas, but did he talk about a frame of mind you have to be in to make essences, ie. that the attitude of the maker influences the product?  I've read of procedures like this in harvesting wild herbs for tinctures and teas, too - you have to have the right frame of mind to harvest them or you won't get all the virtue of the plants.

yuppers.  very important part that's often overlooked.

Very interesting.  I look forward to experimenting.  There's probably more I should say, and probably more to clarify in what I've already said,  but the toddlers are popping their heads up (reminding me of little sunflowers) and I have to go.