The Queer & Pregnant thread - January/February 2008! - Page 5

[solejean]

NZmumof2 Congratulations!

As for getting anything done - I've been too tired to get anything done. Plus my brain only seems to want to focus on pregnancy. So Angela you're not the only one.

KK Can't wait to hear about your scan.


Scalpel What a cute peanut!

[kk_davey]

Well, bit of a mixed bag at the scan today. The baby's absolutely fine, which is the main thing and is such a relief because I had really talked myself in to something being wrong (when did I become such a hyper-paranoid person?!).

But unfortunately the baby had it's legs crossed tightly so you couldn't see it's bits, and we still don't know if it's a boy or a girl! How unfortunate! And because it's the last necessary scan for tests, there won't be another one before it's born. So now we're going to be in that 'keep it as a surprise' category of people (who don't want to find out), which I really didn't want to be in!

The ultrasound technician lady said that if she had to choose, she'd guess it was a girl because we couldn't see any dangly bits, but she really wasn't at all sure, which she kept reminding us about over and over.

I don't want to keep the surprise - the baby itself is enough of a surprise for me on the birth day! I want some of the surprise joy now!!

We were all so sure it was going to be a boy for some reason (something to do with the last scan) that it was a good warning to start thinking of girls names, which we're really struggling with. You think finding a name that 2 people like is hard, try 3 - it's impossible!

How is everyone else going on the naming front? I only seem to like unisex girls names, which Rob is okay with but Annie doesn't love. At the moment the only consensus on a girls name is Fin. Which I really love. But it would be good to have a few to choose from when we meet the baby. Any girls name suggestions I can pilfer?!

I'm interested to hear about the genetic & other tests done in America. In Australia the standard tests are a down syndrome test (1st trimester involves a blood test + ultrasound, or you can wait until 2nd trimester and just do it via blood test), and a spina bifida scan at 18 - 20 weeks (the one I had today).

The government will pay for the 2nd trimester down syndrome blood test and the spina bifida scan, but if you want the downs test in the 1st trimester you gotta pay for it.

Does that sound anything like the American system? I'm just curious to see how they compare...

[msjodi]

kk davey- Hmmm... I don't really know about what the government will pay for over here. I think most of it just depends on what type of insurance you have. Do you have a universal health care system in Australia? I am on dp's insurance, and we are very lucky that it is awsome. Paid for all our TTC costs (including IVF), excluding sperm and embryo storage. (I call them our "siblings on ice," my brother thinks that sounds like Icecapades!)

So our insurance basically covered any testing we wanted to have done, and any scans or ultrasounds. I also work for a women's health clinic, so I confess to having a quick peek at her a couple of times during slow days.

We are naming our little girl Delaney. No middle names yet, but I am hoping dp will agree to Rain. Something about Delaney Rain just sounds so perfect to me. We also liked Jayna, Anya, Tess, Sage, and a couple of others... none of which are gender neutral.

And I LOVE LOVE LOVE the name Fin. One of our cats is Finn, but that's short for Finnegan.

[AngelaM]

KK- I'm so glad everything turned out healthy and happy! Congrats!

I too though would be going crazy to not know the sex of the baby! I already have the day picked out for our 18-week ultrasound. I've been thinking about names, but somehow I feel like I can't get too serious about it until I know whether it's a boy or a girl. Which is funny, because I want a gender-neutral name either way... Now, of course, your story has me worried that I'm not going to get to know ahead of time!

In terms of testing and scans, as MsJodi said, there isn't one standard protocol here. It depends both on the midwife/ob practice you see, and on what your insurance company will pay for (which varies widely depending on the company). MsJodi, that's great that yours payed for IVF. My state mandates that insurers pay for infertility treatment, but only for straight married couples. : As you can imagine, this makes me crazy. I was lucky in that I got pregnant without too much medical intervention (I basically just payed for sperm for six months of trying- I mean, that was still expensive, but nothing compared to IVF). One of my good friends, however, is a single lesbian and is having some significant fertility issues as she ttcs, and it makes me crazy that her insurance won't pay for the things for her that it would pay for a married hetero couple. Grrr...

Anyway, in terms of my own scans, tests, etc.- my midwife's practice doesn't do the first trimester downs scan, because the insurance of the most of the women they work with won't pay for it. So, I didn't have that done, though I'm wishing now that I had. It seems to be one of the best non-invasive indicators for downs, but it's not standard practice everywhere in the States. (It is, I believe, in the UK, and more places here are starting to offer it.) I'll have a scan at 18-20 weeks to determine the sex and check for any anatomical abnormalities. There's a blood test (the quad test) they can do at 15 or 16 weeks that indicates potential risk of downs or spina bifida. The problem is that it has an extremely high rate of false positives- for every 50 women who test positive on it, only 1 will have a baby with downs or spina bifida. And the only way to confirm the downs or SB is with an amnio. I think I'm going to do it, and just pray that I test negative on the blood work. I'm terrified of the idea of having an amnio (needle in the stomach! my worst nightmare!), especially since even with a positive blood test result, there's only a 2% chance that the amnio will reveal anything abnormal. Anyway, I'm sure my baby will be absolutely fine, but I have spent a lot of time worrying about this, for some reason...

Okay, off to try and get some work done!

Hope everyone's having a good day...

[solejean]

KK I think some coverage depends on the state you live in as well. I know in California some of the early testing is covered if a woman can't afford to have it done. I have pretty good insurance and could have done the early testing - blood work, ultrasound and chorionic villus (SP?) testing, but I decided to do the AFP blood test at 16 weeks and then if that isn't good then I might consider amnio. But with the false positive I don't know if I want to risk anything with an amnio. Guess I will cross that bridge if I come to it, but I am thinking positively that my baby is just fine and the test will come out just fine.

I go in March to get my 20 week scan - seems like a long time from now. I hope the baby cooperates because my DP really wants to know the sex.

I love the name Johnny, Sam, Jamie, Charlie for a girl.

[kk_davey]

Wow, America couldn't be more different on the health front! The whole concept of health insurance depicting your quality/style of health care is very strange to me. What if you can't afford insurance? From a purely financial perspective, wouldn't it be cheaper for the state if they paid for the tests and then didn't have the subsequent expense of a special needs person for 50+ years? Or would the state not be covering the medical expenses of, for example, a spina-bifida patient? (Sorry - it sounds so callus talking about people purely in financial terms, but I'm just thinking of it in terms of state.)

Doesn't the current system also mean that the tests you get very much depend on the standard of your midwife/OB, and how informed they are??

I didn't realise there was such a high false positive rate for the blood test - we have it here and they mentioned it was a possibility but didn't quote stats like you guys are saying. Doesn't the amnio bring a risk of miscarriage with it? It would be hard to come to terms with if didn't need it in the first place & then miscarried.

Angela - I can't believe the health insurance companies have to cover married people but not queers/single?! (Australia's very homophobic in its policies also.) It seems amazing that you pay the same health insurance cover but don't receive the same coverage!

msjodi - good that they recognise your relationship and allow you to be on your DP's insurance? I don't think Australia would even get that far! Plus, I would LOVE to be able to sneak a peak whenever work was quiet! Then I would be able to determine the sex! I also love the name Delaney. It makes me think of good quality literature for some reason?! Australians would butcher it though. We're a very unsophisticated bunch, and all (nick)names have to end in 'ie' (like Billie) or 'o' (Stevo), and anything above 2 syllables is a definite no-go. I like Anya. I haven't heard that before. It has a smooth, pleasing sound to it.

Solejean - those are all the names I chose for a girl! But Annie wouldn't have it. I love Jamie and Charlie especially. I just think of a little girl with those names and think of a cheeky little thing with strong character.

Rob's friend is a radiographer, and has offered to do an MRI for us for free to try to determine the sex. The only problem is, I remembered having to sign a form saying I wasn't pregnant when I had my MRI done. I did a bit of research and the state of affairs seems to be this: there's no known problems for pregnant women, but hospitals only do them if there's a significant problem that can't be handled with any other imaging (e.g. ultrasound). I.e. they try to avoid them where possible. I spoke to Rob's friend though and she assures me that it's fine. She says they image pregnant women all the time. When I mentioned it to the ultrasound technician though, she said no don't do it. So I'm totally unsure now. I'd really love to but it's not worth a risk at all.

[MollyKenzie]

Hi all, I havent caught up on all the past posts yet, but I just found this thread. I hope it doesnt die out! I am pregnant with our 2nd and 3rd (twins), due in June or July, and have a 2 year old with my wife Kari.

I am sooo glad that there is a place to talk about this, but I thought I would put something out there and see if anyone has some similar experiences or advise. My partner is a manager of a local hardware store (yes a total cliche, but she loves it and is really good at what she does ) needless to say she works with a lot of guys and most of them and the customers have had...well not so much exposure to lesbians (that they know of) or at least lesbians who are out and proud.

Well, having twins, and I guess I remember this when I was pregnant with ds#1 too, makes for a weird situation for her. She totally realates to couples talking about having kids and especially lately anyone who has twins, but surprisingly finds herself censoring what she sais in the name of professionalism. I think it must be so hard for her. I mean, I can obviously talk about her and being pregnant (I am a teacher in a very open community) but I dont know what to say that would help. I sure wish she felt like she could talk about expecting and me being pregnant and all....

sigh...the life in a homophobic (even if only subtly) society.

[solejean]

MollyKenzie

I don't have any advice, but my DP, Lydia is in a similar situation. She works at an auto repair company. Lydia has worked there for around 14 years, but never has been out to them. When we discussed her taking off time from work for the birth of the baby she had to make some tough decisions. She came out to most of the people she works with and asked for time off in August. They were completely cool, but I know she still censors herself because in that environment there is some homophobia. I feel bad for her having to deal with that every day. But I am very proud of her for coming out and getting time off for the baby's birth.

[AngelaM]

Welcome MollyKenzie!

Twins! How exciting!

Hmm, that must be challenging for both you and Solejean's DPs. I too feel very lucky in that I work and study (I'm a grad student) in a very open, liberal environment, and have always been able to be very out about my sexuality, and now, about my pregnancy.

So, I had an exciting, nervewracking experience today, that relates to our earlier conversation about insurance coverage. I testified today, along with another queer friend who is ttc, at the State House, in support of a bill that would expand Rhode Island's infertility coverage to single women and lesbian couples. Currently infertility coverage is mandated, but only for heterosexually married women. This bill passed the house and senate last year, only to be vetoed by our governor, who said that he could not support a bill that would encourage children to be "born out of wedlock." Grrr... Anyway, the bill is back up for consideration in the house, and we spoke before the house committee that is dealing with it. It was my first time testifying at the state house, and although I'm generally a very confident public speaker, I definitely found it intimidating to talk about the very intimate personal details of my life to a room full of bored looking men in suits. But, hopefully it will make some difference. The governor will no doubt veto it again, but if we can get enough support in the legislature, they can override the veto. :

Alright, I'm off to Mexico for six days of vacation on Thursday, and need to do about 8 million things before I leave. The other day I tried on my favorite bathing suit, only to discover with horror that my annoyingly pregnant boobs could no longer be contained by it. Oh dear... Anyway, if there are any changes or updates to be made, I'll be back next Wednesday, and will make them then. In the meantime, good luck to everyone! I hope to come back and find that the entire TTC thread has graduated and joined us!

[venustx]

MollyKenzie, we're in a similar situation. My partner is out to some of her friends at work, but not her supervisors, and she is somewhat worried about how they will receive the news. I actually feel the same way - I am a teacher and I know the gossip will spread like wildfire both because it's triplets AND because of my family structure. I will not lie, so if they ask about a husband or anything, they will know. I am really NOT looking forward to it. I'm a good teacher, I love my job and I hate that we have to worry about these things.

[Scalpel]

I am a bit nervous as well. I have to ask the doctors I work for, for the time off when the baby comes and I know that they have no clue I am a lesbian which I know will come to a complete shock to them. I guess I just need to grow a pair and get it over with. How soon do you all plan to ask for time off for yourself or Dp?

[msjodi]

Hi everyone. My DP and I went through some of this stuff over the past year or so. Dp is a District manager for Pepperidge Farm, so she works in a corporate environment with alot of straight-laced suits. It's definitely a "man's world" in corporate America and she was worried about how it would go when she needed to tell them about the baby.

IT WENT AMAZINGLY WELL! Hopefully this will be encouraging for some of you going through the same stuff. Dp and I are both out and have been for a very long time, but her sexuality is not something Dp spends much time talking about at work. It just "is" kwim? But we needed to look into insurance coverage for the baby (I'm covered by her company, but we didn't know if the baby would be as well, because the adoption won't be finalized until 4-6 weeks after the birth), so she had to get over it and just start asking questions.

Every single person she talked to was enthusiastic and encouraging and helpful. She even got congratulatory gifts from several people. We are both over the moon about becoming moms, and I know she is so relieved that she can now be open about her joys and fears with the other corporate monkeys. I know that we are very lucky, and that this is not the case everywhere... but I would encourgage everyone to bite the bullet and share the wonderful news.

I've had to think alot about what message it sends to my daughter if Dp and I are not open and proud of her and our family... I don't ever want her to think for a single second that her family is in any way LESS than any other family. And if we are not proud of us, how can we expect her to stand up and be strong in the face of the inevitable teasing she'll come against?

I don't know. I don't have the answers. But I'm glad this is coming up because it's definitely stuff we've been dealing with recently...

and ANGELA... WOW! Good for you... that's amazing! I am a public speaker, by trade, and I think I would still be really nervous talking in front of Congress. Good for you for getting up there and speaking your mind. I'm a native Rhode Islander, so I am definitely interested in hearing how this plays out.

[MollyKenzie]

Originally Posted by venustx

I actually feel the same way - I am a teacher and I know the gossip will spread like wildfire both because it's triplets AND because of my family structure. I will not lie, so if they ask about a husband or anything, they will know. I am really NOT looking forward to it. I'm a good teacher, I love my job and I hate that we have to worry about these things.

Thats so funny - I'm a teacher too! And we are having twins! So here we both are, in the new multiples club : But I am out to my supervisors, I just made the decision when I first started to be open so that I wont have to come out to them years down the line. Sometimes I think that is harder. but I dont really think any of the other teachers I work with know. I dont think it would be a problem so much as just an annomily. (sp?) I live in a fairly queer positive environment, but really only if you pretend that you are normal...does that make sense. Its like you have to be able to pass/or not have it be a big deal for other people.

Anyway...I just thought I would put this out there for all the first time moms too...we already have a son, he is 2, and I have to say there is no censoring 2 year olds, so be prepared to have your kid(s) out you everywhere. Just a simple thing as what he calls you (we are mama molly and mama kari) outs you in public places. It was a little hard at first, but then it becomes this great thing, because they dont care or know to care what other people think and it forces you to be okay with it. There is no way I am going to let him think that we are in any way less of a family because he has two moms, so I have to put on the brave face and not let the nagging voices in my head dictate what I do or say. Okay, I should get off my little now.

I am so glad to have discovered this thread!

[jentina]

MollyKenzie--Twins!!! congratulations! But that's certainly a tough situation for your partner. I hope she'll find a way to make things work. My partner and I are both able to be very out at work and it makes things so much easier. In fact, DP's work threw us a baby shower! But I did still get some advice from a long-time co-worker about what tasks to have my husband do for the baby. I have to say, I didn't have the heart to correct her. I know she would have felt like a jerk and I just didn't want to make her feel bad. Although I'm very out, I know most people assume I'm straight and I also know that even more people assume pregnant ladies are straight! Still, it makes me feel bad to "pass" like that. I hate it when that situation arises.

AngelaM -- Wow. that's so great. The more legal rights we can get, the better. Yay!!

On the subject of being out and tolerance, I wanted to mention that, after our car accident a few weeks ago, we ended up in a small suburban hospital that we hadn't been to before. We felt so welcomed and accepted--it was awesome. The hospital staff didn't miss a beat treating us like any other couple. They kept me overnight because I'd gone into preterm labor (which they stopped and all is well!) and they brought a couch in for DP so she could stay with me. We highly recommend Hudson Hospital in Hudson, WI!

[solejean]

Originally Posted by msjodi

ANGELA... WOW! Good for you... that's amazing!

:

[kk_davey]

Hi all. Sorry I've been rather absent. My Ph.D. supervisor said I haven't been progressing fast enough so I've been madly trying to get some work done. To no avail. Somehow work just doesn't seem important anymore. I keep trying to get myself motivated, but then I feel the baby kicking or something and get completely sidetracked with pregnancy web sites!

Gee, I would find it so damned hard if I couldn't be out at work. Luckily, my supervisor is a lesbian and they're just starting the ttc process! Couldn't be luckier. Having to talk to a bunch of people about a situation you're in too (having twins), but can't talk about because it's not deemed socially acceptable, must be super hard. I do think people are generally more accepting and supportive than you anticipate, but the scary thing is that once it's out there's no going back, no matter what the reaction. I've found often people are just intrigued, so if you're happy to put up with a myriad of questions it's fine. But I always feel questions are good because talking about it normalises it, which is the ultimate aim.

Wow, I can't believe you folks having twins and triplets! That's amazing! I'm a twin, but back when we were born there wasn't the support for multiples that there is now, so Mum didn't get any advice on how to cope. And she had 4 kids under 5 so she was pretty flat out! I know you're probably getting advice from everyone, but I thought that I'd give you my two cents worth from my experience...I wish my Mum had received some advice so she'd done things kind of differently...

My twin sister and I were always extremely close. We did absolutely everything together, and we were always in the same class at school (actually even in high school we were in the same class all day at school because we were in an academic extension program) so we literally spent every second of every day together. It really became very unhealthy. I remember in high school that if I had to talk to someone when my sister wasn't around my heart would start pounding! We shared money until we were 26 years old. Our loyalties always totally lay with each other - we had a rule that we were each others priority, over partners also. It left no room for partners and I had several break ups directly related to my partner feeling like she was dating 2 people, only the second person she didn't choose. For example, if I had a partner and my sister didn't it was 'mandatory' that I spend several nights a week sleeping at my sisters house. Basically, a relationship that worked when we were kids was no longer tenable in an adult environment. The last few years have been really hard on us as we've had to go through a process of separation. We went through a phase of arguing all the time as the rules between us were changing but hadn't be rewritten yet. We only now (in the last 6 months or less) are finally returning to some sort of (new) equilibrium. And we're 30 years old. It took a long time and a lot of tears! I guess in short I'm saying I wish mum had raised us to be more independent. Such as putting us in different classes at school, encouraging us to have different friends or play different sports or something. I wish she hadn't allowed us to be quite so joint at the hip. Anyway, sorry if it's just a little more annoying advice from a stranger!

[MujerMamaMismo]

Originally Posted by kk_davey

Wow, I can't believe you folks having twins and triplets! That's amazing! I'm a twin, but back when we were born there wasn't the support for multiples that there is now, so Mum didn't get any advice on how to cope. And she had 4 kids under 5 so she was pretty flat out! I know you're probably getting advice from everyone, but I thought that I'd give you my two cents worth from my experience...I wish my Mum had received some advice so she'd done things kind of differently...

My twin sister and I were always extremely close. We did absolutely everything together, and we were always in the same class at school (actually even in high school we were in the same class all day at school because we were in an academic extension program) so we literally spent every second of every day together. It really became very unhealthy. I remember in high school that if I had to talk to someone when my sister wasn't around my heart would start pounding! We shared money until we were 26 years old. Our loyalties always totally lay with each other - we had a rule that we were each others priority, over partners also. It left no room for partners and I had several break ups directly related to my partner feeling like she was dating 2 people, only the second person she didn't choose. For example, if I had a partner and my sister didn't it was 'mandatory' that I spend several nights a week sleeping at my sisters house. Basically, a relationship that worked when we were kids was no longer tenable in an adult environment. The last few years have been really hard on us as we've had to go through a process of separation. We went through a phase of arguing all the time as the rules between us were changing but hadn't be rewritten yet. We only now (in the last 6 months or less) are finally returning to some sort of (new) equilibrium. And we're 30 years old. It took a long time and a lot of tears! I guess in short I'm saying I wish mum had raised us to be more independent. Such as putting us in different classes at school, encouraging us to have different friends or play different sports or something. I wish she hadn't allowed us to be quite so joint at the hip. Anyway, sorry if it's just a little more annoying advice from a stranger!

*lurking and fantasising about being pregnant*
Thanks for sharing those thoughts KK - I'm facinated by twin relationships and this was a great insight.

Sorry to hear about your PhD struggles. I dropped out of my post grad program last year, in part because I was too distracted by TTC. I can't imagine trying to get through a PhD pregnant.

[frog]

I'm doing what MMM is doing--lurking and fantasizing--but I just wanted to give a shout-out to jentina. I'm so excited that you're so close to birth! Go you!

[jentina]

Thanks, Frog! We're pretty excited. And good luck to the lurkers--we lurked a long time before everything fell into place.

We saw the midwife today and she says the head is "well-engaged", for whatever that's worth. I think it's still going to be another week or so. I finished working on Friday though, which is nice, and I'm full-time nesting until the baby shows up.

Hope everyone else is feeling good!

[venustx]

Originally Posted by kk_davey

I know you're probably getting advice from everyone, but I thought that I'd give you my two cents worth from my experience...

Sorry I'm a little late with the reply...the exhaustion is so bad lately that all I can do after work is come home and collapse into bed. I really appreciated your viewpoint on this, though! I'm not sure if we have identicals who split early (they are in separate sacs) plus a fraternal, or all fraternal triplets because of one hidden follicle (we only saw two), but either way they are multiples and I think they will share some of your experience. We're not doing rhyming/matching names or matching clothes (well, except for a few tiny outfits that were irresistable), so I hope that will help a little, even if it's only with other people's treatment of them than anything. We will definitely take all of your school/sports/friend advice into consideration, also! Thanks for the 'insider' experience and advice.