Alternatives to counting...

[Way Up North]

The other counting thread reminded me~ I really need to find an alternative! I don't even know how we started...
We have started counting to three when dd doesn't do as she is asked~ ie, lunch is ready, time to get in your chair. We only do it after announcing the upcoming transition, doing transition stuff, like clean up etc. The counting is when she is just wandering around testing what happens if she doesn't follow through LOL.
She seems to like it!: She gets a big grin and runs to do whatever was asked. We always make it clear what the consequence will be 'if you don't come to your chair before '3' I will pick you up and carry you to it' ~ which at the end of the day IS a threat! Albeait a benevolent one with a choice.
But it has become a game. I used to have a dog (well I still have him, but he quit this) who would jump up on me before he'd sit ~ inadvertantly the jumping up got rewarded and built into the behaviour ~ this feels the same....
So if we quit counting, what else can we do to keep dd moving along?!

L

[LilyGrace]

Why wait? I use the "say it once, do it the second time" method. I make sure the child can hear me clearly (getting their attention, asking for repeats if necessary), and wait. The second time I tell them, I get up and go do it with them.

Example:

You need to come sit in your chair.

Second time:
Take child's hand, look at her calmly, and say You need to come sit in your chair. Lead her over or pick her up and bring her there.

Then, Thank you for sitting down. Now we can begin.



P.S. I still use counting, but in a different way. We count down here, and usually as a way to quell the noise or transition.

[anne+arun]

Ive found that an excited "lets..." combined with moving into action is very powerful.

"lets clean this up" as i start to do so and pass the bin to my kids. "lets eat some yummy food" as i help ds (21 months) into his chair (which has a couple of his favourite toys pre placed there).

Also rather than giving kids three seconds i highly recommend parents to take 60 seconds at least to establish how x, y or z could also work for your child rather than just focusing on getting what we want (ie. a win win)... i know it means an extra 57 seconds each time but i figure if i skip a movie or two before i die ill break even time wise

this might mean:
- an exit strategy (so its not about leaving somewhere, its about going somewhere or doing something that our kids find appealing)
- a fun game (with our vegie juice which has beetroot as well as brocolli, carrot etc, we see who can get the biggest red moustache on the top of their lips while drinking... its only just stopped working for our 5 year old!)
- a compromise and being flexible (will it really destroy the space time continuum of the universe if a child wants to eat standing up rather than in a chair? I used to think so, but i let go and the world kept spinning... asking myself "why not?" before i respond has been marvellous here)

all the best
arun

[MamaB2C]

Originally Posted by LilyGrace

Why wait? I use the "say it once, do it the second time" method. I make sure the child can hear me clearly (getting their attention, asking for repeats if necessary), and wait. The second time I tell them, I get up and go do it with them.

Example:

You need to come sit in your chair.

Second time:
Take child's hand, look at her calmly, and say You need to come sit in your chair. Lead her over or pick her up and bring her there.

Then, Thank you for sitting down. Now we can begin.

Yep, asking over and over again doesn't make sense to me.

In my opinion counting only teaches them how many times you have to ask before they have to do it. Another thread describes a child saying "You only asked 4 times" or something along those lines.

Now, I think giving warning is helpful for kids old enough to understand "We eat in 5 minutes, so please finish up your game and wash your hands", " 3 more minutes, are you washing your hands" or with younger kids helping them finish up whatever they are doing "Oh, it's time to eat, let's put the toy away and come to the table".

[brightonwoman]

I count in my head.
I have toldthe kids I only ask once (ie, they need to respond the first time they hear me) but actually i ask twice--to give the benefit of the doubt in case they genuinely didn't hear me th efirst time.
"It's time to brush teeth"
(count to about 5 in my head)
a little louder, being sure to use his name "Bilbo, you need to come brush teeth now"
(count to 5 in my head)
go get Bilbo, take his hand, guide him to the sink

something like that.

Essentially, counting out loud tells the child that theydon't really have to obey until you get to three (or five, or ten, or whatever). so guess what, they're not going to get upand go now because they know they have all this time!!!

Of course, I try to give warnings beforehand that a change is coming
"in 10 (then 5, 3, 1) minutes we will need to leave the park"
"as soon as we finish ____ it will be time to ___"
"time to get jammies in 5 minutes, so please wind up your game"
etc. So he's not broadsided in the middle of something, kwim? Transitions can be hard for kids (especially spirited ones like mine) so I try to ease them into it as much as I can.

[Xoe]

i'm another "say it, do it" mom. it saves time, and gets pretty good results.
but realize you'll need practice before you've totally transitioned. your kids may need a long period of your being consistent, too.

xoe

[Way Up North]

Thanks mamas. All excellent points.
I agree, it is frustrating because she has caught on and waits until we count... therefore when we ask something we don't really *mean it*.

Nope, the world won't end... but when she runs the other way, away from the food, the boots,whatever.... LOL

We get lots done by doing it together, but there are the noticeable hot issues (mealtime, getting dressed for outdoors), which means that we need to step back and strategize for those specifics (thank you for helping me to see that).

At this point most of the situations where this happens (all transitions), going and taking her by the hand would be tears and tantrum ~ which I think is how we ended up counting, giving her an out to do it herself, since that is where we ended up anyway, but that is backfiring!

Again, thanks for helping me think this through. i am still fuzzy but will work on it because I am not happy with the current choices.

[tankgirl73]

I confess that sometimes I count to 3... but I reserve it for when DS is being TRULY belligerent, and is not responding to logic or gentle guidance or other such things, and when it's something that MUST be done. And he's 9 and very strong lol so just walking over and 'doing it with him' doesn't always work!

He can be 'explosive' (SO much less now than when he was 5, 6, 7...) and if he gets into 'that' mood, I'm likely to get injured in his thrashing tantrum. It would not be safe for me to physically move him. Sometimes I still try, sometimes I hold him and hug him and gently stroke him through his tantrum, but only if he's not SERIOUSLY thrashing.

So, I count. And it works just about every time. There have been less than a handful of times I've reached '3' in the many years I've had to do this. The most recent was about a month ago, and involved the Playstation... made it to 3, so the Playstation was removed for a week.

Trust me, I wish more 'gentle' approaches would work, and while I'm far from a perfect parent, I do try not to pull this out until after the gentle things haven't worked, and I just need to break through his disconnection. By not using it frequently, it's still a usable tool.

I think if you're over-using it, then all those things you're talking about will happen (kids learning it just means they have that long to not do something, etc). If it's your MAIN tool, it loses its power. As *one* tool to use in specific situations, though, it can be useful IMO.

[KindRedSpirit]

::

Strike that, reverse it.