Torn between 'AP' beliefs & breastfeeding - Page 2

[PatioGardener]

Originally Posted by MarcyC

EACH AND EVERY nursing session ends up with either he or I or both in (severe) emotional distress. Do you think he's meant to breastfeed that much that the emotional distress is worth it? Or do you accept the fact that he has physical limitations that will (at this point) more than likely go untreated and let him have a bottle in peace and tranquility?

Still sending many s


This post is a little different than your original post, so I just want to clarify. Do all your nursing sessions end up in this awful distress? Even when you don't pump and just nurse with the SNS?

If so, that is horrible No wonder you are stressed! From your first post, I read that the stress was from the pumping at the same time.

What about a mix of both bottle and breast? I wonder if your baby would like to get his nutrition from the bottle, and then snuggle and finish off by nursing at the breast? That way he wouldn't be desperately hungry, but could still latch on and suck for a while for comfort. And perhaps with time he will grow and be able to suck better and take more from the breast and less from the bottle.



It sounds like your doctor is working with you and respects you and you respect him - that is so important. I'm glad you have that support right now. Hang in there, and know that whatever you decide, you are making the best decision for you and your family at this time.

[bri276]

just so you know where I'm coming from-I ep'ed 21 months for my baby because she was born with a bilateral cleft palate and a tongue tie AND very low muscle tone and had NO chance of nursing successfully, couldn't even create suction on a bottle until about a year old. And I'm 99% sure I wouldn't have made it past a month if I'd had more than one child.

EACH AND EVERY nursing session ends up with either he or I or both in (severe) emotional distress. Do you think he's meant to breastfeed that much that the emotional distress is worth it? Or do you accept the fact that he has physical limitations that will (at this point) more than likely go untreated and let him have a bottle in peace and tranquility?

You're the mother, so the great thing is, you and only you can answer that question. 400 people will tell you it's not worth it, let go and give the bottle, and 400 others will vehemently disagree and tell you keep going, any breastmilk is better than none, etc.

what do you think? how much longer are you willing to feel this way? the answer might be one day, one week, one month. At some point, I truly believe, breastfeeding is not worth it at all costs. What that point is, I believe, is mental/emotional despair created by this situation, affecting the mother/baby relationship. I agree with you that the most natural parenting is following your baby's cues. While I obviously am obsessed with the benefits of breastfeeding, you have the right to stop when the risks are outweighing the benefits. If you are waiting for the moment that it will feel good to stop, I can tell you that moment will probably never come. Even when you've done the best you can it can feel like it's still not enough. What I'm hearing from your words is that you're searching for the justification to stop- you don't need outside justification- your life is important, your happiness is important. If you truly want to keep going, I and thousands of women here would support you completely. But if you truly feel it's time to let go and move on, you deserve support in that too. Only you are living through this, so only you can make the decision either way. My dd was bottlefed- still is, actually, I plan to let her self wean, and she never suffered for it. She was fed on demand, never bottle-propped, cuddled and hugged, kissed and carried everywhere, and only fed by myself or DH- I think maybe five times in her life has someone else given her a bottle, if that, and it's been a grandparent each time. She's a very attached, happy, loving child. Do I wish she could've nursed from the tap? yes, of course, but our relationship couldn't possibly be better or closer. It just would've been more convenient and I could've gone longer. Anyways, that's my take!

[PatioGardener]

Originally Posted by bri276

If you truly want to keep going, I and thousands of women here would support you completely. But if you truly feel it's time to let go and move on, you deserve support in that too. Only you are living through this, so only you can make the decision either way.

:

These are very wise words. Thank you for summarizing so eloquently.

[jessjgh1]

Originally Posted by PatioGardener

This post is a little different than your original post, so I just want to clarify. Do all your nursing sessions end up in this awful distress? Even when you don't pump and just nurse with the SNS?
.

I was wondering the same. Something needs to change in the positive.

Stress is contagious and your little one might not be able to relax if you are not relaxed.

It is not an easy decision to make, and none of us can make it for you, but a change needs to take place. For ds and I, I was lucky that liedown nursing (to destress) and a nipple shield (to protect from the pain) FINALLY got us to the point that I was not dreading every nursing session. It was still a long haul to correct problems and heal, but I at least felt some of the stress drain from my body.

I cannot imagine dealing with all that I did with other children to care for. It is all very hard and personal.

((Hugs))

Jessica

[MarcyC]

I guess I should have clarified better in my original post. Yes - every nursing session is like this. Because of the tongue tie, it's a constant session of pop on/pop off/pop on/pop off, etc etc. When he does "pop off", it's accidentally. He doesn't want to pop off...he wants to nurse. But he doesn't have the tongue/muscle strength or coordination to stay on. So he pops off and gets frantically upset and then I have to try and calm him before I can him latched on again (have you ever tried to calm a starving baby?) so I get him re-latched, he's on for a few minutes and boom!...he's popped off again. It's heartbreaking. Plus, because of this he's not able to transfer milk well so even after an hour of on again/off again, he's still hungry. The SNS tubing and pumping just aggravate the situation.

I know of people who offer a bottle first so that the baby isn't crazily hungry, then nurse. I also know of people who nurse first, and then "top off" with a bottle. I suppose some combination of those would work. I'm so hesitant to use bottles, I haven't really tried much (although he has had some).

I purchased something called a Gabriel feeding pad. It's a bottle-holder thingy, but it's not necessarily a bottle propper. It's like a burp-cloth actually and it acts as a third hand, holding the bottle at your chest and promoting holding the baby in a way similar to nursing.

I think at this point I will give him the bottle while holding him on one side using this bottle holder and pump the other side at each feeding. I don't expect to be able to pump enough for all of his feedings, but I think I'll feel better about 1 or 2 bottles a day.

One of the MANY MANY things I despise about bottle feeding is that other people always want to take the baby. "Oh, here, I'll feed the baby while you ___________." I don't want that. He's my baby...it's my bonding time...I feed him...period. I think by setting up a bottle/pumping routine I can multi-task and still have that bonding time with him that no one else can have.

That's where I'm at for now. Although, I could change my mind in the next hour so stay tuned.

[Lunaria]

I just wanted to say that I think you must be so very strong to have made it this far with breastfeeding. I think you are absolutely right that if it is also making your baby miserable then it's time to move on with bottle-feeding. I am a huge lactivist, but you need to be able to look forward to feeding times. Cuddling up skin to skin, gazing into his eyes while you both enjoy yourselves.

I understand that it might be possible to still use the sns with formula, but if you are just fed up with the whole thing then it is absolutely ok to feed with a bottle of formula. He is so blessed to have already gotten your milk, I know whatever decision you make won't be easy. But please don't feel guilty, you are a great mamma!!

Jenny

[Lunaria]

I just noticed you posted while I was typing my reply so I didn't see you've made a decision. That sounds like a great idea to use the gabriel pad, and pump too so he still gets some breastmilk bottles. I can't imagine the frusteration you've been going through. I hope this works for you. If someone offers to feed him you can just politely tell them that it's your special time together. It is after all! Keep us posted.

Jenny

[khanni]

I just want to say that I don't see there being a conflict between AP and not breastfeeding. AP is more than just breastfeeding--it's about having a healthy, loving, attachment between parent and child. If that means you have to stop breastfeeding and instead give a bottle to save your sanity and your relationship with your child, then I don't see a problem with that.

I understand the guilt. I have low milk supply and could not exclusively breastfeed my daughter no matter what I did (please no advice, I really did try everything). The SNS is also very frustrating, as is pumping. She didn't have latch problems, so I eventually stopped the SNS and the pumpping because they were stressful, and would instead breastfed her for awhile, so she could be at the breast, and when she would complain because she was REALLY hungry, I would give her a bottle. Or I would breastfeed her when she wanted comfort. It stopped being about food (though she did get some milk) and more about our bond. She weaned herself at 7 months, though I would have gone on forever if she wanted.

And, yes, I still have a lot of guilt and pain about not being able to feed my daughter. But, I do consider myself to be an AP'er.

Good luck!

[garretsmommy]

MarcyC- You've given your baby a wonderful gift by breastfeeding him as long as you have. People can talk about how important breastfeeding is- but the happiness (and ulitmately mom and babies mental health) is most important. Reading your last post really says to me that you're able to accept an alternative to breastfeeding- please follow your heart. Best wishes...

[Tendaironi]

Don't feel that you have to tailor your life to a philosophy that may or may not work for you. Go ahead and give your baby formula in a bottle if that is what works best for you and your family. Then you can focus on comfort nursing and bonding with your baby. Your baby won't be so stressed out at trying to satisfy his hunger at nursing but will look to nursing as a source of comfort.

Sometimes babies also find the noise of the pump stressful too when it is nearby while nursing. I was concerned about how you don't feel bonded to the baby. What good is nursing if you don't feel bonded to the baby?

[MarcyC]

You know, sometimes we'll get all settled in with the SNS, then I turn on the pump and he gets really fussy. I don't think he likes the pump at all.

I'm still doing the same routine. Nothing has changed and it's still stressful.

I've got this bottle holder that holds the bottle at my chest.

My options now are:

Give him a bottle on one side, while pumping the other (we've been doing that a lot lately, actually).

Just use the SNS w/ formula, no pumping.

OR

Just use bottles w/formula.

I've narrowed it down to 3 options and basically it takes either the pump OR the SNS or BOTH out of the equation.

Now I just have to decide.

[MarcyC]

Oh, I forgot to add...he's also got a high palate and a shallow latch. So even if we can find someone to fix his tongue tie, we've still got a long road ahead of us.

[Samjm]

Hugs to you mama.

I agree with previous posters. You need to make a decision here. You've already breastfed for a lot longer than many women do, and your son is incredibly lucky to have someone who was so willing to persevere.

There is definitely a place for formula, and from what I can tell, you are perfectly justified in stopping nursing.

If I were in your shoes, I'd stop the pumping and feed formula with the SNS.

Good luck with your decision.

[Tendaironi]

Originally Posted by MarcyC

You know, sometimes we'll get all settled in with the SNS, then I turn on the pump and he gets really fussy. I don't think he likes the pump at all.

I'm still doing the same routine. Nothing has changed and it's still stressful.

I've got this bottle holder that holds the bottle at my chest.

My options now are:

Give him a bottle on one side, while pumping the other (we've been doing that a lot lately, actually).

Just use the SNS w/ formula, no pumping.

OR

Just use bottles w/formula.

I've narrowed it down to 3 options and basically it takes either the pump OR the SNS or BOTH out of the equation.

Now I just have to decide.

You could also comfort nurse when he is full from SNS or after a bottle. Then he is getting some breastmilk for medicinal purposes!! The first thing I quit after I got my son home from being in the NICU for over 2 months was pumping!. It is hard work and you are such a good mama for doing this as long as you did with your circumstances. Enjoy your baby!

[MarcyC]

Yes...he's developed a cycle of sleep-wake-eat-play-sleep-wake-eat-play-sleep, etc...

I've honestly thought about giving him a bottle for his "eat" time and then letting him comfort-nurse to sleep. That would eliminate both the pump and the SNS but still let him equate the breast with comfort, although not with satisfaction, kwim?

So that is an option, too.

I have a hospital grade rental pump that I have through Feb. 2nd. After Feb. 2nd, I will be using my 10-year-old Medela PIS. So I probably will phase-out pumping.

Using the SNS doesn't help much with his latch so I'll see what I can do.

My mind knows that I've probably gone well-beyond what a lot of other women would do. But my heart wants to breastfeed him so badly, especially since I know he's my last.

[p1gg1e]

My SIL's DD has TT and it got allot better after 6 months. It was really hard those first 6 months and it hurt every time she latched but it did get better and she is still nursing at almost 3.

So it can get better and your doing a great job.

I would stop pumping so much and just use the SNS while you nurse...it might make things less stressful.

[Ruthla]

Originally Posted by MarcyC

My options now are:

Give him a bottle on one side, while pumping the other (we've been doing that a lot lately, actually).

Just use the SNS w/ formula, no pumping.

OR

Just use bottles w/formula.

Could you alternate them? Use the SNS with formula for some feedings, and give him a bottle while you pump for other feedings?

Honestly, with what you've described about his frustration with trying to latch on, I'd go with bottlefeeding and pumping.

Remember that any breastmilk is better than none. Even if you're only able to pump once a day, and use that milk to supplement his formula, it's still worth the time and energy to pump that little bit. Certainly, if you're able to pump several times a day that's even better!