Obsession with princesses/princess movies

[Mama2MyMonkeys]

Hi everyone,

I would love to hear your advice on something that has been bothering me for quite a while. My almost 5yo dd has been obsessed with princesses for over a year, now. She could watch Cinderella and The Little Mermaid non-stop if we would let her.

I have several issues with this: I don't like letting my kids watch a lot of TV, especially since we are really starting to get into homeschooling and it messes with our day. I'm not crazy about the "happily ever after" themes that they all have, where they foster the idea that marriage magically works without any effort. Plus, the princesses all seem to have perfect figures with unrealistic proportions, like a Barbie, and she's already very concerned about her appearance and what people think of her.

I'm trying to gently distract her from them, but it's getting more and more difficult as she gets older. I wondered if there's a way to incorporate real princesses (not Disney) in our homeschooling to help her get her princess fix? Also, any opinions? Am I just blowing it out of proportion and it won't really have a negative effect on her? Am I depriving her of something that most little girls really enjoy?

Thanks in advance, and I really look forward to being a part of the forums!
Melissa

[lakesuperiormom]

my dd5 is in love with princesses and would do the same if i didn't put my foot down. she would prefer i read to her so i do and include a wide variety of princess stoories.we started with cinderella and explored the cinderella stories from all over the world...korean cinderella the egyptian cinderella etc. there are alot of free links in the holistic eclectic thread.

[reeseccup]

My dd9 has been very into princesses/fairy/unicorns/the mystic since as far back as I can remember. I've not bothered with trying to divert her, though. Once she started reading on her own, and was able to decide for herself what she reads, she's expanded her interest to historical princesses and women of power in history as well as mythology. She loves researching Cleopatra and Nefertiti, and Queen Elizabeth I.

OH and she loves Shirley Temple movies and anything to do with horses, esp. if a girl is involved with those horses. This includes books as well.

I don't think it's such a bad thing, necessarily. I do get tired of the concern on looks, but she's not obsessed with it other that excitedly awaiting her breasts to develop... *sigh*

I guess I'm not much help since I've just rode out the Disney princess obsession, which has turned into real princesses/queens/women of power in history interest. I don't find that a bad thing necessarily.

OH, how to get her interested in other things...hmmm...well she's been interested in horses for as long as I can remember, that's not much help. Well, she really got a lot of exposure to 16th century English history this past year, we were involved in our local Renaissance Faire which is dated in the Elizabethan era, so she's been surrounded by that history this past year. Also she is very much into Ancient Egypt, which has brought her interest with those ladies of power. She's exposed to a lot of other interesting things in many ways. We watch a lot of historical programs, read a lot, subscribe to National Geographic (the adult kind, not kid), she loves to read the Encyclopedia and to use the computer one as well. She loves the non-fiction section at the Library and we just don't limit her options of interest to what we think she ought to be into. Yes, she even chooses fluff commercial type stories and we don't limit those either. I'm not as big on censorship as I am on diversity of interest and exploration.

[singin'intherain]

Luckily my daughters have not been really obsessed with princesses of the Disney variety. I'm guilty, though- I banned those 'happily ever after' disney cartoons and Barbies from my kids lives. That only lasts so long, but I think it did help. I have also talked a lot about gender roles, and the training that goes into people feeling they have to fit stereotypes instead of being themselves. Some topics that seem to have really sunk in with my dd are how some girls and women starve themselves and get sick in an effort to live up to beauty standards, and all the heroines I've given her over the years like Susan B Anthony, Harriet Tubman, and Rosa Parks. I'm not afraid to get on my soap box and go on about how much I admire people who are willing to go against the grain to stand up for what is right, etc. If I were you I would do a lot of that kind of educating and NOT try to take away the princess stuff overtly. It does seem reasonable, however, to limit the tv and also the content. If I were you, I would also feel concerned about seeing my dd too worried about looks and other peoples' opinions of her.

[Ruthla]

I would try to work within the "Princess" framework rather than trying to completely distract her from it. Certainly, limit TV time/ frequency of videos if you're concerned about it interfering with other play and learning time.

I would try to seek out princess stories (non-Disney) with stronger female roles and more of the values you DO want to instill in her. When she plays dress up, try to get involved with the games sometimes and see if you can direct it away from "meet Prince Charming and live happily ever after" and maybe more towards playing house, pretend cooking and ironing and babydoll care while in princess costumes.

The Paperbag Princess is a great book, as is Sleeping Ugly. I'm sure there are more great books out there that build on the Princess theme without re-iterating the "happily ever after" myth. You can also talk to her directly about "real" vs "pretend" and explain that "happily ever after" is "pretend" unless "happily ever after" is defined as "lots of normal family squabbles but nothing earth shattering or worthy of a sequel"

[Lillian J]

I think it would be less effective to focus on her interest in princesses than it would be to slowly (there are lots of years ahead) begin to point out creative and powerful women who have made it on their own - there are lots of them, so there must be lots of good children's books about them. And many of them don't fit the traditional societal models of good looks at all. Hearing about the satisfying ("fun") things they've done, are doing, with their lives might sound a lot more interesting. I think you should just let her be on the princess stuff, though, because she'll be able to see what you're doing and get the message that there's some charge in it, and that might just peak her interest rather than change it. And, as she grows older, she'll see that there have been some pretty unhappy princesses in real life - women who might have been a lot happier if they'd had a chance to build a life for themselves in a more regular sort of way.

I wanted to be a cowgirl when I grew up, by the way, six-shooters and all...
-Lillian

[Treasuremapper]

My six year old went through a princess phase, which evolved into an interest in unicorns and magical horses. Now my four year old is into princesses, but my six year old considers princesses too "babyish".

In our case, I just indulged her as much as she wanted and eventually she got tired of them. I understand the concerns, but I figured -- if it makes them happy, it can't be that bad. And princesses did make her happy.

[mammal_mama]

Originally Posted by Treasuremapper

In our case, I just indulged her as much as she wanted and eventually she got tired of them. I understand the concerns, but I figured -- if it makes them happy, it can't be that bad. And princesses did make her happy.

That's how I look at it, too. If it gives happiness, there must be something good in it. My kids aren't stupid!

I don't see anything wrong with introducing related stuff that I think might be more interesting and mind-expanding to my child (with her, as usual, having total freedom to take it or leave it). I just think it would be counter-productive to interfere with my child's current interest: taking away the princesses would likely cause her to have a closed mind to the stuff I was introducing, anyway.

[lilyka]

We indulge it to an extent (we never watch the movies but have some of the products etc . . . )

to counter it we rea a lot abuot Queens/Princesses/other royalty that became saints. Ava's patron is Saint Queen Ketaven of Georgia (She not only was an awsome example of Godliness but she totally kicked butt and was in no way a frumpy, lazy, spoiled brat. She was a beautiful, self sacrificing, self disciplined warrior queen who refused to marry the hansome prince who wanted to give her the world. instead she held out until a brutal end for her God, her people and her integrity.) Mine is the Empress Alexandra who also rocked. She is also associated with Saint George which gives her a hero link without a sappy love story.

Elizabeth the New Martyr is another good one. Beauty. royalty. she had it all and she gave it all up for a higher calling.

[3momkmb]

They aren't real princesses, but you might want to check out Gail Carson Levine's Princess Tales. These are her stories for the younger set and the princesses tend to be stronger characters then the Disney versions and the stories a little less simplistic. They are chapter books, but very short, easy reading.

Also this book http://www.amazon.com/Ten-Queens-Por.../dp/0525471588 might be intersting to you, but I would pre-read the stories for a 5yo, some of them are rather brutal.

[Openskyheart]

My now 11 year old dd was way into the princess themed movies, and dress-up play. I just let it be. She no longer watches those movies (though we did enjoy the new movie Enchanted together! ), but she still dresses up as a princess at times - when she's performing in ballet productions.

When she was 3, she wanted to be a "ballerina princess" for Halloween, so my mom got her a pink tutu with silver sequin trim, and we also got her a little tiara and wand. Around the same time, in our super-crunchy nursery school co-op, an 8 year old sister of one of the students would come in every Tuesday after she got out of school, and get ready for ballet. Her mom would brush the girl's long blonde hair, and put it up in a bun. The girl would put on her black leotard and pink tights, and off they would go to ballet class. My dd would stand next to this girl and watch her hair being done with rapt attention. She decided then and there that she wanted to grow her hair long, and be a ballerina with a blonde bun. I kinda waited for this idea to fade into the distance, but it didn't. She worked me and worked me and worked me for months on end, until finally I signed her up for a little weekly pre-ballet class that the mother of the ballet student had recommended to me.

That was almost 8 years ago. Now, she takes ballet classes 5 days a week, and recently auditioned for summer ballet intensive programs that take place back east. She was accepted to her first choice program, and will be spending a month in Pennsylvania, dancing several hours a day/5 days a week. I recently had a conference with the director of her ballet studio who told me for the first time that my dd has talent and potential. So, even though I wasn't crazy about princesses, and I never, ever would have chosen ballet (and pretty pink pointe shoes!) to be her passion, I feel like, if I hadn't followed her ideas, and trusted her to know what she loved, and who she was, she wouldn't have been able to express the dancer that she is becoming. And that would've been a terrible loss. Dance is how she expresses her deepest self.

She's not exactly like me in her interests, and makes different choices than I would make - but her interests and choices reflect who she is. And she's wonderful!

She is a dedicated ballet student. She's also friendly, outgoing, affectionate, creative in many other ways (loves to write, loves art), strong-willed, opinionated, feisty, and wickedly witty. She also has a brother and a father who keep her grounded and realistic about what guys are like (er...wonderful in their own ways, but nothing at all like the princes in Disney movies! ) and she lives in the real world, and knows that happily-ever-after, like her father and I are , also involves disagreeing, arguing, finding the win-win, putting ourselves in another's place, and trying to understand each other's point of view, etc.

Do see the movie Enchanted if you get the chance - maybe when it comes out on DVD. It's uplifting, and a great send-up of the Disney Princess movies' most cherished assumptions. Good Fun! When your dd gets a bit older, maybe 7 or 8 or so, Ella Enchanted is a great book to read together.

[Treasuremapper]

Open, good for you for listening to your girl. I saw Enchanted and LOVED it. My daughters saw it four times, twice with me, and twice with their father. Princess Power!

[mommy68]

I'm the voice of difference as usual, lol. I don't have a problem with the movies. I think moderation is the key word. We have control over what our children do and don't do, especially television and video games. It's probably just a phase and she will get out of it. I don't mind movies with happy endings. My daughter will have plenty of adult years to live in the real world with adult problems and challenges. I'd like her to enjoy fantasy for as long as he can. Be thankful she's not in school where all her peers are pushing the Bratz, Ipods, flashy clothing, etc.etc on her. I hate that for my DD.

[Mama2MyMonkeys]

I would like to say a genuine THANK YOU!!! to all of you who have given me such wonderful perspective on this, and for all of your great ideas!! I think I'm realizing that I need to lighten up a bit and restrain my dislike of the Disney princesses, but I especially love the books suggestions for different women that she can read about.

Openskyheart, you really caught my attention because she's very in to ballet stuff, too! Maybe I'll have a little dancing princess in a few more years!

Thanks again to everyone!
Melissa

[dharmamama]

My daughter, now 13, was obsessed with princesses, real and Disney, from the time she joined our family at age 11. It was actually a real problem, because she was comparing our family unfavorably to how her life would be were she a princess.

Dh limited her to one princess movie a week.

What really worked was this book, which thoroughly disabused her of the idea that being a princess is all fab, all the time. That was not my intention when I got the book from the library; I had no idea what it was about. But it was a very honest portrayal of what being a princess (modern and historical) entails, and Desta finally decided that it didn't sound all that great. Nothing we ever said to her made a difference, but reading it in a book made it believable.

In general I don't have a problem with princess play. I wanted to be a princess, too. But if it feeds unhealthy ideas, then I think it needs to be worked on.

dm

[Lillian J]

Originally Posted by Treasuremapper

Open, good for you for listening to your girl. I saw Enchanted and LOVED it. My daughters saw it four times, twice with me, and twice with their father. Princess Power!

I saw it twice and delighted in it each time. I took a friend the second time - she's a real "movie buff" who's generally almost annoyingly analytical and critical of movies, and she loved every minute of it - she said she couldn't stop smiling during it, and went on and on about how well done it was. She was so glad I'd nagged her to go to it with me before it left the big screen. But for those of you who haven't seen it, it's a complete spoof of all the old Disney fairy tale movies. I didn't really think of it as a children's movie, though - it seemed to me that the wonderful humor would be lost on someone who hadn't seen all those old movies or who wasn't old enough to put it all together. Lillian

[mamoma]

I completely get the problems with princesses.... but Disney princesses aren't all bad, right? Ariel, for instance, is a princess who rebels against her father to go on land because she wants to "stand on her own two feet". It's actually a really heavy handed bit of feminism - plus, giving up her voice to win Eric completely backfires. I think that The Little Mermaid is a great movie for little girls to be into. "Part of That World" is a wonderful song about wanting to grow into an independent woman... and "Just Around the Riverbend" from Pocahontas is explicitly anti-"settling" for marriage and pro-having-better-adventures. Belle's a giant nerd and a bookworm, who, again, rejects her jock of a suitor in order to do a good deed, and Mulan is a warrior.

The older princesses are kind of nightmares.... but I always wonder if some of the more rabid anti-princess folks have watched the movies (or just seen the revolting pink-and-sparkle merchandise).

[elizawill]

Originally Posted by imaqt

I wondered if there's a way to incorporate real princesses (not Disney) in our homeschooling to help her get her princess fix?

melissa, I got an email today from one of my yahoo groups with a great unit on cinderella & this thread came to mind. i don't know if this will interest you, as it's a lapbook, but i thought it might be fun for you and your dd to branch off of something she obviously loves a lot and is very familiar with. i know you are trying to steer clear of disney - but the book recommended is not disney. hope it helps. good luck mama!


http://www.homeschoolshare.com/cinderella.php

[ShaggyDaddy]

Rent/find a copy of the REAL little mermaid story, you know the TRAGEDY that Hans Christian Andersen wrote, you know the one that actually teaches a lesson... Like if you lie cheat and steal you can lose and hurt the ones you love. Rather than "Just keep lieing, it will all work out in the end and you will end up happy if you look a certain way.".

Might help with the princess thing..

Also maybe read to her about Joan of Arc, Queen Elizabeth, or any other "princess" story that is significantly different from the whole "Boys will like me if I wear lots of pink" lesson

[Smokering]

When she's a little older, you can read her George MacDonald's The Princess and the Goblin, The Princess and Curdie, and The Lost Princess: A Double Story. The latter's one of my favourite books. It's Christian/allegorical, just so you know, and very delicately written--sends shivers up my spine! But she's probably a touch too young for it at the age of five.

Ariel, for instance, is a princess who rebels against her father to go on land because she wants to "stand on her own two feet". It's actually a really heavy handed bit of feminism - plus, giving up her voice to win Eric completely backfires.

Um... I always thought of Ariel as a spoiled brat who virtually sold her soul to the devil in order to win the love of a guy she barely knew, but OK. Disney's Little Mermaid annoys me more than most of their 'Princess' stories, simply because the original tale is so beautiful and dark and poignant, and gets mutilated into this happy-ever-after comedic-lobster routine. But YMMV... certainly it's an interesting discussion point, although again, probably above the head of a five-year-old. Introducing her to the original Princess stories is a great idea though--although pre-read them first, if she has a low gore/horror tolerance. Depending how broadly she defines 'princesses', there are some amazing Celtic 'fairy' tales out there, as well as African ones, Dutch ones, South American ones... They don't all involve princesses per se, but then, the category can be a fairly loose one. Even half of the Disney 'princesses' aren't actually princesses at all--Mulan, Naala (commoner, went straight to Queen), Belle (commoner, went straight to--um, it's never quite explained--was the Beast king by then?), Pocahontas (chieftain's daughter, not quite the same thing). So maybe you can subtly nudge her in expanded directions of the genre--Arthurian legend, Robin Hood, the twyleth teg, 'Good People', Narnia, Boadicea, The Water Babies, Greek myth...