Feminism and Breastfeeding - Page 3

[the_lissa]

Originally Posted by meowee

There are basically 2 views... that breastfeeding and mothering are the quintessential expressions of being "feminine." and then the opposing view, that any bond to a child that cannot be outsourced is a burden to women's advancement.

I for one am not able to pump. I have BF 5 children and have tried more pumps than I can count. I never, not once, got more than an ounce at a sitting. If I had to work, I could not breastfeed, unless I BF only at night. But my supply tends to crash unless the baby has constant access... so again, for me, BFing and working outside the home would not be possible, which severely limits m employment opportunities (I couldn't even go to school to finish a professional degree while successfully BFing) which makes me more beholden to my husband, which means I am in many ways a second class citizen in the household.

I'm not saying women can't work/ study and have 100% BF babies, but for me it was not possible.

Another thing I support is workplaces that are baby friendly, so if you wanted to work, you could bring your baby to work or flexible scheduling, etc so you could do a lot of work at home.

[siobhang]

Originally Posted by meowee

so again, for me, BFing and working outside the home would not be possible, which severely limits m employment opportunities (I couldn't even go to school to finish a professional degree while successfully BFing) which makes me more beholden to my husband, which means I am in many ways a second class citizen in the household.

I think this is an excellent point. Much of the way our society structures work makes it very hard to be successful at breastfeeding - forcing some women to CHOOSE between them. And work will almost always win, especially for those who don't have partners to support them while their infants are nursing.

Humanity however, has always needed to support mothers of small infants. Because our infants are born so incredibly fragile, requiring intensive care for the first year +, it is often very difficult for a woman to carry an infant AND gather enough foodstuffs to cover her own calories (and her infants, through her own intake). Add on additional children, and it becomes nearly impossible.

The support of others in the community (often the father of the child as well as the grandmother, sisters, etc) is crucial - either to provide food and other necessities or to hold the infant while mother provides food or necessities. If the allomother is a lactating woman, she can feed the child, to boot, making her a preferred caregiver, though rare since lactating women usually have their own offspring.

Formula opens up the opportunities for non-lactating individuals to be allomothers, giving women more opportunities to support themselves and their children, especially when they cannot rely on members of their community to support them.

We as breastfeeding supporters cannot truly support breastfeeding without acknowledging this fact. The current world of work DOES NOT support breastfeeding. Most women in the US, especially the populations we most wish to reach, do not get any maternity leave and most have to work (especially when health care is tied to work).

So arguing for maternity leave and affordable healthcare not tied to work, as well as for equitable part time work, protection for pumping breaks, and telecommuting/work at home opportunities are all lactivism, in my opinion. As well as feminist.

Don't make women choose. Remove the barriers, instead.

[the_lissa]

Exactly!

[wildflower18]

Mothering article that mentions feminism and breastfeeding connection past and present... http://www.mothering.com/articles/ne...la-profit.html

[mamajake]

Originally Posted by meowee

There are basically 2 views... that breastfeeding and mothering are the quintessential expressions of being "feminine." and then the opposing view, that any bond to a child that cannot be outsourced is a burden to women's advancement.

I don't think there are only two views but I agree that these two seem to dominate. The first is anti-feminist and the second in my opinion characterizes much of second wave feminism. I also think that to a large extent the second is true as a practical matter in our current U.S. culture when "advancement" is defined as "advancement in the public sphere" or "economic advancement."

Originally Posted by meowee

I for one am not able to pump. I have BF 5 children and have tried more pumps than I can count. I never, not once, got more than an ounce at a sitting. If I had to work, I could not breastfeed, unless I BF only at night. But my supply tends to crash unless the baby has constant access... so again, for me, BFing and working outside the home would not be possible, which severely limits m employment opportunities (I couldn't even go to school to finish a professional degree while successfully BFing) which makes me more beholden to my husband, which means I am in many ways a second class citizen in the household.

I'm not saying women can't work/ study and have 100% BF babies, but for me it was not possible.

I could pump a ton but my first would not take ebm. I also faced, as most women do, the reality that part-time work could not support child care and the sheer lack of adequate child care. Full-time work is sixty hours a week minimum in my profession and I do not think I could have been a good enough mother being away from my kids that long. So I had to choose between all or nothing in my career. It has rendered me second class economically in my home and second class socially in the world.

I hope that third wave feminists, who seem not to have started having babies in large numbers yet, will find a way to successfully demand child friendly workplaces. As it is, if I had a daughter in her 20's or 30's who valued her place outside of the home, I'd advise her not to have kids.

[honeybunch2k8]

Originally Posted by the_lissa

Another thing I support is workplaces that are baby friendly, so if you wanted to work, you could bring your baby to work or flexible scheduling, etc so you could do a lot of work at home.

IA. If I ever had a business, I would make it as mom friendly as possible.

I think a good thing is that more women are starting businesses. We have a new health food store which is female owned, and they even set up a little playstation for kids with toys and all. It's very cute! I think it's the granddaughter that they bring with them, and other kids like to play there as well. I also saw on Tv (or youtube) about a woman entrepreneur who takes her baby to work with her (in a sling). I am very inspired.

I definitely agree that in the USA our maternity leave is just awful! That needs to be changed pronto.

[DavinaT]

While I think that whoever said now we have birth control pills to stop us from menstruating, c-sections to stop us from using our vaginas to give birth, and formula to stop us from using our breasts to feed our babies has made an excellent point I thinbk it i over-simplistic becuase we have to look at the reasosn WHY such interventions are in place.
we have birth control pills to stop us from menstruating because for a small but of course significant group of women - periods are 6 - 10 days of sheer bloody agony - pun intended involving pain extreme enough to stop them functioning, severe nausea, diahorea and fainting - there is nothing feminist about being a victim needlessly.
That said, there is a societal view which deems periods as 'yucky' at worst and a nuisance at best.
The first time I declared to a friend that I missed having my periods, she looked at me like I was horse with two heads!!
Formula was originally intended as a substitute in the cases of women who could not breastfeed.
With c-sections, again this needs to be looked at in context. Yes, some c-sections may well have been unneccessary but again in the case of a small group of women - they save lives. There is nothing feminst about being a victim needlessly.
To say however that stopping these functions means tht they are simply for mens enjoymnet is in error. Like Honolula, they fulfill sexual funcitons which women enjoy also.
This may well dismiss some female sexuality outside of its reproductive function and indeed not all women, including those who become mothers have sex with men.
I agree also that Women who are childfree by choice are no less feminine or feminist than women who have had ovariectomies/mastectomies to save their lives

But to asnwer the point in question - yes I view breastfeeding as a femine act - but feminist provided its by CHOICE not enforced or pushed on women. But not only that - I see the RIGHT to breastfeed as also feminist. That of course is not to say that I see those who don't breastfeed as any less feminist or feminine. As one pster pointed outk, it is in so many commiunitoies, something which ties a woman to her baby in many instances and thus limits a her economic choices and as a result, economic freedom.

I agree with Amitymama, In our grandmothers' and even mothers' days, there were women who were given no other choice but to birth naturally when they may have wanted pain relief; been refused formula [ tho in Irleand it was amot the other way around] even when they had tried valiantly but failed to make breastfeeding work for them; refused a return to employment once they'd had children.
They had to fight to give women a choice in what they did with their bodies and their lives - and this to me is the heart of feminism - the CHOICE - CHOICE in what they did with their bodies and lives.
While I can understand a woman being a SAHM, Breastfeeding on demand or having a NCB, even tho I may not choose these things for myself, I CANNOT for the life of me understand a woman choosing to be submissive to her husband. To me, husband and wife or partnersare equal but not the same therefore in my ideology and the one I was brought up in, they cannot therefore either be submissive or dominant. Maybe someone can explain it to me.

Dandy - would LOVE to hear more about your research paper on weddings. Is it published anywhere? PLEASE say yes?

On a final note - I peronally think that the lack of matrnity lave in the US is just HORRIFIC. It is almost like you are being penalised for having a baby.
Statutary matrnity leave here now is 6 months and if you really ant to, with creative paper work you can work up to days of the birth + you can take what is called familyleave for a month after maternity leave if you want to + paid holidays.
That said, there is practically no state support for childcare (get this - you get tax back on your garbage collection but not your childcare - how dumb is that?) and workplace creches are the rare exception.

[Dandy]

Originally Posted by DavinaT

Dandy - would LOVE to hear more about your research paper on weddings. Is it published anywhere? PLEASE say yes?

I'm afraid that it is buried in a crate somewhere ...

[honeybunch2k8]

Originally Posted by DavinaT

On a final note - I peronally think that the lack of matrnity lave in the US is just HORRIFIC. It is almost like you are being penalised for having a baby.
Statutary matrnity leave here now is 6 months and if you really ant to, with creative paper work you can work up to days of the birth + you can take what is called familyleave for a month after maternity leave if you want to + paid holidays.
That said, there is practically no state support for childcare (get this - you get tax back on your garbage collection but not your childcare - how dumb is that?) and workplace creches are the rare exception.

IA 1000000000%. Our maternity leave in USA is flat out disgraceful. I can't help but suspect that those weeks a woman might get is just to heal and is less about bonding with baby. Heck, some women get almost no maternity leave. Also, I suspect one reason some women just have to go back to work is because that family insurance is so expensive, which is another shame. I know this was one of the first issues that came up when I told my SO i was preggo.