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Would you booster a 3 year old - Page 3

post #41 of 88
The youtube above is a good explanation of the benefits of rear versus forward facing.

This youtube shows 2 dummies - one in a 5pt and one in a booster. Watch the range of motion within the seatbelt, and watch the reduced range of motion in the 5pt behind.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V2kO8...eature=related

This video is interesting - look at the range of motion even at 15mph. Why, if a child can be seated in a 5pt based on height and weight, would there be another choice (understanding that the seats can be expensive and circumstances can arise)?

http://www.which.co.uk/reports_and_c...74_74191_9.jsp


I'll repeat what others have said above - the standards typically cited are the minimums, and woefully inadequate. Optimal safety is achieved by keeping them rear-facing in a 5pt harness as long as possible (based on weight and slot height); keeping them in a 5pt harness as long as possible (again, based on weight and slot height); and in a booster as long as possible. My preference is for a backed booster - there may be additional weight in a crash, but I think it keeps the child positioned better more of the time.
post #42 of 88
Quote:
Originally Posted by sapphire_chan View Post

If you've got a 5 year old who can still ride rear facing (under the weight limit of the seat, head an inch below the hard frame of the seat) then if you worship a deity you should be offering thanks to that deity in whatever manner is most appropriate to your religion for the blessing the deity has bestowed upon you.

Having to stop RF is a reason to cry.
YES, this. I have extremely tall kids and they outgrew the slot heights of all available seats far earlier than I would have liked. When I had to move my DS to a booster at 4 I was very, very unhappy.
post #43 of 88
unless it was a life or death emergency i would NEVER put my dd1 in a booster until she were ready, and even at 46inches and 53lbs and 3.5 years old she is NOT ready.
she is in a regent on my and my moms car (both cars have one that doesnt get removed) and i have two Marathons for dd2, so if i need to, i can take those for both dd's if i need to go somewhere with, like, my sister.
post #44 of 88
Quote:
Originally Posted by joensally View Post
The youtube above is a good explanation of the benefits of rear versus forward facing.

This youtube shows 2 dummies - one in a 5pt and one in a booster. Watch the range of motion within the seatbelt, and watch the reduced range of motion in the 5pt behind.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V2kO8...eature=related
.
: From the videos connected to that video, this:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HZFMmNqCvbc&NR=1
is why I will call the cops on anyone who looks like their child isn't in a car seat. (Notice how the unrestrained dummy went through the front passenger seat space? Yeah, that's the kid killing mom or dad as they get killed themselves.)
post #45 of 88
Quote:
Originally Posted by joensally View Post
Wow, really shows how much better it is to have the car seat in the middle of the back seat if you can. Even the good seats were taking a beating from the side of the car.
post #46 of 88
Quote:
Originally Posted by sapphire_chan View Post
Wow, really shows how much better it is to have the car seat in the middle of the back seat if you can. Even the good seats were taking a beating from the side of the car.
Yes. But then also think about having multiple kids in the back seat and the limbs in motion.

I'm waiting for that new Monterey (I think that's what it's called) to come out and have a look at it. It looks like it may contain the child more.

(I'm in Canada, so our options are more limited).
post #47 of 88
Quote:
Originally Posted by joensally View Post
I'm in Canada, so our options are more limited.
At least your government actually tests the seats instead of just spot-checking the manufacturers.

Hey, maybe they'll decide to let you guys use the Swiss findings and the seats they've developed? Then you could RF to like 6 years! (Just a happy thought for you as you go to bed.)
post #48 of 88
Gee, I remember when I was a kid and we didn't even use car seats! I don't even think we used seatbelts...

When were the 'shield' seats banned? That is all I have and all I have ever used with my kids. They aren't 5pt. seats either. I tried to get my seats checked by the police at the safety fair last year but the line was horrendous. I gess I should have waited as they gave out new seats to anyone whose seats were not up to snuff.

What about those seat belt adjuster thingy's they sell at One Step Ahead that makes an adullt seat belt more child friendly? Are those an acceptable thing?
post #49 of 88
OHS seats are still in production and do fit a niche for those who can't use a 5pt harness correctly or chooses not to. They are limited in use as they shouldn't be used for small babies and can't be used over 40# and height wise I'm guessing most would get to only about age 3 in them.

Crash test of a low back booster: http://www.oeamtc.at/netautor/html_s...g_P3_vorne.mpg
high backed booster: http://www.oeamtc.at/netautor/html_s...i_P3_vorne.mpg
high backed w/ SIP: http://www.oeamtc.at/netautor/html_s...ordliftpro.mpg

That's why lbb should never be an option as a main seat until after the child has outgrown all hbb, but still needs a booster.

AJ will be 5 in May and is harnessed in a Sunshine Kids Radian 65, I suspect he'll outgrow it right after he turns 6 and then I'm considering the new Graco Nautilus for him. He rf to 34mos when he hit 34# and got too tall. Evan is 38 mos and still rfing in his seat. He's slated to hit 33# at 5.5yo and will rf till then unless we get a foster baby early next year and then he'll go ffing, but at 4 that's o.k. if needed. Ilana is 21# at 15 mos and will be rfing as long as possible as well.

Has everyone seen this site? It's all children rfing past 1/20#, including my boys. http://www.cpsafety.com/articles/RFalbum.aspx Then there's this one w/ kids all harnessed over 40#, including my AJ again. http://www.cpsafety.com/articles/FFalbum.aspx

Quote:
What about those seat belt adjuster thingy's they sell at One Step Ahead that makes an adullt seat belt more child friendly? Are those an acceptable thing?
No, most of things not only make the lap belt ride up on the stomach (giving the child serious internal injury), there's no way those would ever hold up in a crash. Take a 40# child in a 20mph crash, that child then becomes 800# of force, no little snap or velcro is going to w/stand that kind of pressure in a crash. That's why booster seats are so important and unfortunately about 80% of those who need them, don't use them. Car crashes are still the #1 killer for people 4-34yo. I reccomend kids use booster seats till they just don't fit anymore. Here's a crash test of a 10yo dummy who fits properly in the seatbelt w/out a booster. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ntPks...eature=related
post #50 of 88
Quote:
Originally Posted by thepeach80 View Post
You yourself said it has to do w/ how they sit, maturity comes w/ age. I don't know a single 2yo who can sit properly in a booster (and very few are the 40# min) w/out someone next to them to keep them in their seat. It also has to do w/ bone strength and physiological development. By 6 a child has a fully developed and fused spine and pelvis along w/ other pelvic development that helps keep the lap belt on the hips and off the stomach. That's why while 4 is the reccomended MINIMUM, 6 is a better minimum.
Well you haven't met every kid. You definitely haven't met mine. He spent the first 2.5 years of his life in a country where most cars our friend drove didn't even have seatbelts, making our careseat fairly useless...we spent a lot of time walking that first year, but alot of time in taxis and busses. He knows very well how to sit still in a moving vehicle without being fully restrained. It's just a fact of life outside of the modern western world, that a lot of people just have to get used to.

When we got our own car we bought the largest GRACO model on the market there, and when he outgrew this second carseat (being over forty pounds and his shoulders a full inch above the last slot of the straps) just before we got to the UK, we decided to put him in a booster...and that is the POINT of the booster, FWICT, to "keep the lap belt on the hips and off the stomach." It is my opinion that putting a child into a restraint when he is above the maximum height and weight is equally unsafe.

If I felt he was slouchy, or in any way not ready for it, I would of course use my discretion as his mum to get a car seat, but I have no idea where I'd get one big enough for him to fit into. He's a giant toddler, what can I say? I'm 5 foot 9 and his dad is 6 foot, and we're both the shortest people in our immediate families. I guess we should just walk for the next three years until he's SIX? Is that the idea?
post #51 of 88
You do what you have to do. If you don't have seats that harness past 40# where you live, than you have no real choice do you? It doesn't equate to the US where we have plenty of options for seats that harness past 40# and it's safer so why not take advantage of that if possible? Sure, if I had to choose between a booster at 2.5yo or using a seat that the child was too big for, a properly used seat is always better as long as the child could use it properly.
post #52 of 88
That's all I'm saying. If you have no option for greater safety, a booster isn't equatable to a death sentence, ya know?
post #53 of 88
Quote:
Originally Posted by hakeber View Post
That's all I'm saying. If you have no option for greater safety, a booster isn't equatable to a death sentence, ya know?
Not always, there are cases when children have been killed in boosters just b/c their bodies are not able to w/stand the pressures put on them in a crash when using a seatbelt. Like I said, you do what you have to do w/ your situation, but if there is a safer option, a person should always take that if they can.
post #54 of 88
I would not booster a 3 yr. old. A child who is 4+ yrs. and 40 lbs., I would on occasion. My 5 yr. old is 45 lbs., 44", and in a 5-pt. harness. My 2 yr. old is 31 lbs., 36" and rear-facing. If my 5 yr. old lost 10 lbs. he'd rear-face too.
post #55 of 88
Quote:
Originally Posted by hakeber View Post
That's all I'm saying. If you have no option for greater safety, a booster isn't equatable to a death sentence, ya know?
Boosters are very safe when used properly. In this case, with a 35 lb 3 year old, it would definitely not be safe.
post #56 of 88
Just want to let folks know that some 2 (yep, two) year olds no longer fit in car seats (even when the manufacturer claims to fit up to a certain height and weight). BOTH my sons are large, tall and wide, and even though it was challenging, we had no choice but to put them in booster seats when they were two. Even the expensive Britax that was supposed to fit larger children was not wide enough for them. We went to a kids specialty store for their knowledgeable salesfolk to fit the boys into a car seat, and the car seat into our van.

Please don't be judgemental. These boys simply didn't fit, and we were willing to spend the $350.00 the larger car seats cost at the time.

By the way, neither boy is particularly heavy, just tall and large-boned. Both boys wore size 6 diapers when they were 6 months old.

Maybe as a society we need to address the fact that children are getting bigger. Our health care provider told us that the height-weight charts are due to be adjusted because they are simply no longer accurate--lots of kids over the 95th percentile.

Yep, there were many times where we had to pull the car over the explain that we couldn't drive until their seat belt was properly over their shoulder, etc. (and one child learned quickly how to undo the seat belt). I have noticed with the second child that more appropriate booster seats are now available for a reasonable price. Hooray!
post #57 of 88
Quote:
Originally Posted by kandamom View Post
Just want to let folks know that some 2 (yep, two) year olds no longer fit in car seats (even when the manufacturer claims to fit up to a certain height and weight). BOTH my sons are large, tall and wide, and even though it was challenging, we had no choice but to put them in booster seats when they were two. Even the expensive Britax that was supposed to fit larger children was not wide enough for them. We went to a kids specialty store for their knowledgeable salesfolk to fit the boys into a car seat, and the car seat into our van.

Please don't be judgemental. These boys simply didn't fit, and we were willing to spend the $350.00 the larger car seats cost at the time.

By the way, neither boy is particularly heavy, just tall and large-boned. Both boys wore size 6 diapers when they were 6 months old.

Maybe as a society we need to address the fact that children are getting bigger. Our health care provider told us that the height-weight charts are due to be adjusted because they are simply no longer accurate--lots of kids over the 95th percentile.

Yep, there were many times where we had to pull the car over the explain that we couldn't drive until their seat belt was properly over their shoulder, etc. (and one child learned quickly how to undo the seat belt). I have noticed with the second child that more appropriate booster seats are now available for a reasonable price. Hooray!
Your 2 year olds seriously don't fit in the Regent???? The seat that a lot of 8-10 year olds fit in just fine? Wow. Not being judgemental, but you've got some large kids there!
post #58 of 88
Quote:
Originally Posted by crazydiamond View Post
Your 2 year olds seriously don't fit in the Regent???? The seat that a lot of 8-10 year olds fit in just fine? Wow. Not being judgemental, but you've got some large kids there!
I would have to see it to believe it. I've never seen a 2yo that had a longer torso than 20" (the top slots of the Regent) and would be wider than 21" across. If you see the other post about 7yo w/out a booster, you'll see products there that would work to harness a child who wouldn't fit in a seat. I have known parents of 70# 3yos who use the Regent (80# limit) or the Traveller Plus (105# limit) w/ no problems. It's one thing to not be able to afford those seats for your children, but another to say they just wouldn't fit. Thankfully these seats are becoming more mainstream and more readily available when needed.
post #59 of 88
Yeah that. I'd have to see it to believe it. a 2 yr old not fitting in a regent is beyond what I can imagine.

-Angela
post #60 of 88
Well, I have to say that I am hugely embarrased but I want to thank you all for this thread. Maybe I shouldn't admit this but I had my 3 year old in a booster. He's (approx) 41 inches tall and 46-47 lbs and I thought it was appropriate. I'm so upset thinking that he hasn't been safe. We don't go out a lot but still. I don't know if I live in a bubble or what. I guess I probably thought it was the age OR the weight that was the guideline. I don't know. I just now ordered a Graco Nautilus though that I am assuming will fit him.
No flames please. Thanks guys
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