cow's milk too early at WIC?

[prettymom]

I am frustrated that WIC starts providing cow's milk at one year while claiming to promote breastfeeding. On the back of a pamphlet they gave me for DD's age group, it pays lip service to continuing breastfeeding, but the clinic offers no support. I was wondering what the opinion is here - do you think cow's milk at one year affects breastfeeding rates or does it not even matter?

DD is allergic to milk, so I can't even drink it, and the vouchers do us no good. It would be so much more helpful to continue to get the foods we did when I qualified as a breastfeeder.

Are there many other moms in my position? Or do most parents find the cow's milk helpful at one year?

Also, at our last appointment, I told the nutritionist about DD's allergy and that she was still nursing. She asked "Does she drink any kind of milk...Did your doctor recommend soy milk?" Uh, she drinks breastmilk.

I don't mean for this to be a rant, and after the conversation the nutritionist was actually very supportive. I just feel like there is an underlying attitude that breastmilk is inferior to cow's milk after 12 months, and that no one will breastfeed after 12 months so why bother helping. I could still use the support! Anyone else?

[Ruthla]

When I was on WIC, I (and my daughters) drank the cow's milk that was intended for DS and I kept on nursing him.

I don't think that offering cow's milk for toddlers (and discontinuing the BF mama package) at 12mo really affects the BF rate for WIC recipients. A good many of them have fully weaned by then anyway (so the cow's milk is replacing formula for the baby) and those who are interested in long-term BF aren't going to be swayed by the contents of the WIC checks.

If anything, it still pays to keep on BF because the total food package has been cut by about 2/3 (one toddler on the program instead of a lactating mother plus an infant) and the total amount of cow's milk is cut by half. Why use up that milk on the one family member who has happy without cow's milk up until now, when breastmilk continues to be free?

[Meiri]

If anything, it still pays to keep on BF because the total food package has been cut by about 2/3 (one toddler on the program instead of a lactating mother plus an infant)

But that doesn't make sense. In a family that is sustaining nursing, there is that toddler, but there is also still a lactating mother-two people, not just one.

If they were truly supporting breastfeeding, they'd be providing the same level of support for at least that second year of nursing. It's only after that (in my experience) that the continuing-to-nurse child really starts to taper off to any meaningful degree.

[amandaleigh37]

My 16 month old has never had cow's milk either, even though we get WIC vouchers for it, we use it for other things or my husband drinks it. I do wish we still got some of the food for BFing moms, that was very helpful.

[Ruthla]

Yes, you're right. It would be more supportive of toddler nursing if they gave out the BF mama package to nursing moms of 12-23mo babies. They only offer the extra foods for the BF mama for as long as they'd otherwise provide formula for an infant- the BF mama package is "instead of" the formula package for that family.

I'm not denying that it would have been helpful to have had that extra food from WIC for another year. But it still didnt' make economic sense to wean DS to whole milk at a year old just because of the change in the WIC package. I don't think that WIC is "encouraging weaning" at 12mo because of the way the packages are set up.

[RoadWorkAhead]

Baby at Keys

Interestingly, WIC will cover formula for the 2nd year if the child's docotr is willing to certify that it is medically necessary (As in milk allergy since soy milk is not nutrionally comparable to cow's milk, breastmilk or formula). I wonder if the same could be done for BFing the food allergic toddler. I mean if you weren't BFing, your LO would have to have formula that they would provide in order to meet the child's nutritional needs so therefore it would be just as cost effective to continue a breastfeeding mother's package (maybe sans milk since obviously that wouldn't be necessary). It's worth checking into...They may not go for it, but it brings to light a problem that I am sure not many others have thought of.

[thixle]

I was really disappointed at the one year re-cert as well. They actually cut "our" milk, cereal, eggs down drastically and the carrots and tuna completely. But we got a crapload more juice. *sigh* I felt like I was being shafted for bfing I know there are many factors, but that's how I felt...
Our last appointment (2 year) was a weight check and nutrition screen. When they asked how much milk a day, and I said less than 8oz, she looked at me weird. DD bfs 3-4 times a day. She smiled and said, "Well now, that's good to hear! Too bad you ladies that make it this far get the short end of the stick."
So, yeah, she's aware of the disparity, too. And I drool when I hear about the farmer's market vouchers in other states

[ruhbehka]

Originally Posted by Kierdan'sMom

Baby at Keys

Interestingly, WIC will cover formula for the 2nd year if the child's docotr is willing to certify that it is medically necessary (As in milk allergy since soy milk is not nutrionally comparable to cow's milk, breastmilk or formula). I wonder if the same could be done for BFing the food allergic toddler. I mean if you weren't BFing, your LO would have to have formula that they would provide in order to meet the child's nutritional needs so therefore it would be just as cost effective to continue a breastfeeding mother's package (maybe sans milk since obviously that wouldn't be necessary). It's worth checking into...They may not go for it, but it brings to light a problem that I am sure not many others have thought of.

My WIC office (in NC) will cover medically necessary formula for my son in his 2nd year (and beyond, actually), such as Neocate (his current formula), but they won't cover soy milk or hemp milk or any other alternative milks, even though he would be unhealthy if we discontinued his formula before about 18 mos old and didn't replace it with some sort of nutritionally adequate milk substitute. Even with a doctor's Rx, they can't cover any alternative milks in my state, only formulas. Neocate costs $600 per month; hemp milk would be about $150 - $200 per month. Go figure.

They also don't provide any additional food packages for me (I also bf), despite the fact that my son (until he turned about 18 mos old) really couldn't have healthfully survived without breastmilk (or a hypoallergenic milk substitute or formula), even with a doctor's Rx. Again, go figure.

[prettymom]

I also drool at the states that get farmer's market checks.

[lacysmommy]

One reason they discontinue the mother's nursing package at 12 months is because of the cost of the food and funding issues. Formula feeding moms get a post partum food package for themselves for 6 months-- I wish they would cut that down to 2 or 3 months and extend the breastfeeding mom's package length until 18 months or so. Until they do this, use the baby's food for yourself.

[tbone_kneegrabber]

Originally Posted by prettymom

I also drool at the states that get farmer's market checks.

PA gives farmer's market checks, but its $20 a YEAR! So yeah it's nice, but it's like one trip to the farmer's market a year, not like monthly or anything. They are also on a "first come..." basis so sometimes they run out... that sucks.

I wondering if I can hijack this thread for a moment and ask what you do when you think your bf lo has a milk allergy, green poop etc, will WIC give you anything else, (and not Lactaid as the issue is not lactose, naturally present in breastmilk, but cow milk protein)??? I have m y appointment tomorroww

[kdubs_mom]

yea! I'm not alone.

So glad to find other WIC mommies out there.

I find that offering eggs, milk, and cheese to BF moms is weird. These can be "fuss foods" according to Dr. Sears.

I don't mean to complain because I appreciate the help, but WIC needs to know how we feel about things. Also, if they made the BF package more conducive to BF maybe more moms would try it and stick with it longer

[Shelsi]

Originally Posted by kdubs_mom

So glad to find other WIC mommies out there.

I find that offering eggs, milk, and cheese to BF moms is weird. These can be "fuss foods" according to Dr. Sears.

I don't mean to complain because I appreciate the help, but WIC needs to know how we feel about things. Also, if they made the BF package more conducive to BF maybe more moms would try it and stick with it longer

I believe they offer those particular foods because they are trying to give adequate protein to women. But you're right, they can be "fuss" foods. The large majority of bfing women though can eat anything they want without it bothering baby. With my first I could eat/drink anything including caffeine and it never affected him. This baby is super allergic to everything so I haven't even bothered with WIC this time around...there's nothing they give that I could even eat except maybe the carrots but I hate carrots.

[prettymom]

Originally Posted by tbone_kneegrabber

PA gives farmer's market checks, but its $20 a YEAR! So yeah it's nice, but it's like one trip to the farmer's market a year, not like monthly or anything. They are also on a "first come..." basis so sometimes they run out... that sucks.

I wondering if I can hijack this thread for a moment and ask what you do when you think your bf lo has a milk allergy, green poop etc, will WIC give you anything else, (and not Lactaid as the issue is not lactose, naturally present in breastmilk, but cow milk protein)??? I have m y appointment tomorroww

I got nothing. Not even advice. They sent me off with my vouchers for cheese and milk.

[tanyam926]

I had to add a couple of things to this conversation since I am a former WIC Nutritionist (up until 3 wks ago when I quit to work from home), as well as a BF mom who nurses for several yrs. (My current nurslings are 5, and 2 1/2, and I am pg w/ # 3).

First of all, WIC is made up of people who have had good and bad experiences w/ BF. Just like in the general population there are those that are extremely educated and supportive of BF, those that aren't, and those that are down right against it. The WIC population is the same. In WIC ( I live in NM but I imagine it is the same in all states) we get extensive training in BF but there is a lot of room to wiggle when it comes to supporting it in each individual office. My supervisor and one of the clerks were IBCLCs, which is very rare. We were always trying to figure out how to best support/encourage the BF relationship because it was OUR top priority. However, we could only do so much w/in the rules and guidlines that were present.

The way the food package is put together has nothing to do w/us down in the trenches. That comes from the state office and it takes years for change to come through. The foods on the package were selected because they are easy and cheap sources of protein, calcium, etc.

Also, most importantly, and I say this having worked for WIC and having been on WIC before (and I too have had a very allergic baby) WIC was set up to help moms and babies/children who were not receiving the nutrition they desperately needed. A lot of my former clients do not feed their children veggies AT ALL, they drink way too much milk (which we discourage and yes we recognize the outrageous amount of milk we give contradicts that recommendation), and they are eating mainly processed unhealthy foods.

WIC was also set up because the moms that do not BF (for many complex societal reasons) will water down the formula to make it last longer, or worse give their babies whole cow's milk or evaporated milk.

So you great mamas that are doing everything in your power to give your children the best do get shafted. In a perfect world there would be enough money for WIC to offer a variety of organic and fresh foods, every mom would BF and this conversation would not need to be had. Unfortunately the reality is a lot of disparities and frustration, and believe me, the WIC people are at the top of the list of people who want to see change.

Hope that answers some Q's, sorry so long, I am a little long winded.

[kdubs_mom]

Originally Posted by tanyam926

Hope that answers some Q's, sorry so long, I am a little long winded.

Not long winded at all! That answers many questions for me. Now another:
How do BF moms in need of the assistance WIC provides get changes made for
the future?

[prettymom]

My cousin was a WIC nutritionist and she also expressed frustration at the discrepency between sound nutrition and the vouchers. For example, the amount of juice given exceeding the amount of juice recommended for a child. Also, I noticed in the last video I had to watch at WIC, that the video gave pretty decent eating advice (in my opinion) focusing on vegetables and reducing fat content in cooking, but didn't push children or mothers to be drinking all of the milk given out. So some progress is being made...

I know change takes forever, but this is a little much. WIC (at least in my state) still gives out hydrogenated peanut butter.

It is such a great program in theory, it just needs some changes.

But anyway, back to the milk issue. Is there any state that supports bfing beyond one year?

[CLoveMama]

WIC is changing, slowly...

I agree that WIC is imperfect, however there is at least a little hope on the horizon. I'm addicted to the Parents News Bulletins posted on the home page of mothering.com. On January 9th, there was one titled: WIC Program to Offer More Nutritious Foods.

Changes have been approved to start in 2008, however, the article makes this statement:

"State WIC agencies have through August 2009 to implement the changes, a USDA spokeswoman said. Each state's WIC program will determine exactly when the new food packages will be implemented and what specific food sizes, choices and types will be included, according to the USDA."


This says to me that there must be someone, somewhere, possibly right now, making decisions re: what is offered. I'd suggest finding out who that person is in your area and letting them know how you feel about what changes are needed! (my mother was an activist, it must run in the family!)

[tanyam926]

Right before I left WIC (a few weeks ago) everyone was excited about the changes being made. I am trying to remember what the list of changes were, some of them I remember were less juice, fresh fruits/veggies as an option, and soy milk. I know some states offer soy milk but in NM we haven't thus far. One of the higher ups at our mtg even told us that although we had till 2009 he was trying to push the changes into effect by the end of this year. I wish I still had that list of food...

I think the best way to get changes made would be to talk to your local office. If enough Nuts, (thats what they called us), clerks, etc. moved the info up the chain of command I think it would make a difference. They seemed to care what we thought, however as w/ all gov. programs it takes a million yrs and lots of red tape to get anything done. Plus, we are not allowed to give out any info that isn't preauthorized bc we are not health care professionals. I had to be very careful when I talked to my clients about BF when their drs had already told them something crazy. I had to figure out how to say "your drs an idiot" w/out actually saying that. I have heard some crazy stuff.

I have a personal pet peeve about drs Rx formula for children over 1 yr who are otherwise healthy and eating a variety of foods who just can't tolerate cow's milk. I don't know how many times I have said, "Humans do not need cow's milk!"

Keep on fighting the good fight gals!

[SumnerRain]

The change irked me as well, I had a supportive caseworker who at each visit proceeded to lecture me because DS was not drinking his cow's milk, I kept reminding her (sometimes 2-4 times a visit) that he is still BFing and gets more than enough milk from me. With that said we decided to drop WIC because we could ONLY get whole milk, and honestly, we are a 2% family and the less foods, more juice, was just a waste IMO, I would rather give up my spot and allow someone else to take it, even though it does not work that way, I know.

I kept asking if there was an alternative package for EBFing mamas who did not want to start cow's milk when we have baby humans, not baby cows.... and she kept saying no.