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Our nanny quit... (v. long post) - Page 2

post #21 of 90
It sounds like she did give notice.


I would just let her go.

Don't offer her more money. If you do that and she accepts, you'll always be wondering if she is going to quit again. If she doesn't accept, it will be even more awkward around her in the future.
post #22 of 90
Quote:
Originally Posted by mamasaurus View Post
OP - a thought about you being a reference for her...

I think that it is perfectly fine for you to tell anyone she might refer to you EXACTLY how she left. It was extremely unprofessional. A decent, professional, career nanny would have given you at least two weeks notice.

When I say that you should end on "good terms", I don't mean that you have to glow about her if anyone asks about her. You can tell the truth about her leaving in a very straight-forward, matter of fact way.
In some states (NC being one of them) you may not go on about how or why someone left your employment. This is against the law and pretty rude. You can respond to "Is this person eligible for rehire?" and confirm dates of employment. Other then that you may not say a word.

Also, until employers are required to give employees notice when they are terminated, employees should not have any responsibility to the employer for a notice.



OP- though the exit interview sounds nice, I don't think there is a way to enforce this. If your nanny is uncomfortable doing so. I would just let it go. For whatever reason she wasn't happy in her job and like anyone found something she believes will make her happy. Why should you or anyone expect anything less?

And, regarding the position of Professional Nanny. Not all nannyies are classified as professional and in fact most are not Professional Nannies. Most people who care for children in a nanny-like capacity are merely live-in or live-out high-paid babysitters.

Professional Nannies respect themselves and their profession. Though these nannies are often paid very well, they are in it for the joy of working with children. These nannies are educated in early child development and most have 2 or 4-year degrees. They know children inside and out and understand the effect their presence has on the children they care for and would not in a moments notice terminate their employment.

I am saddened that your child will feel the sting of losing a loved one and that this person apparently did not take this into consideration before being swept off her feet by another family. Separation if necessary should be a gradual process where old nanny is gradually faded out and new nanny is blended in with the family.

It is indeed a shame.
post #23 of 90
My apologies - the OP said the nanny did give notice. I just feel so badly for the OP, that I'm not reading things clearly.
post #24 of 90
And I feel the same way.
Many people who go into childcare just don't "get" that this is more than a job and affects more than just their own little world. These are little humans whose lives we are invading and caregivers need to think long and hard about the position and if they are ready to step outside of themselves and almost become their charges co-mother because we do become like part of the family when we become a nanny. You become privy to so many intimate details not only of the child's life, but of the parent's as well. Often mothers vent to the nanny about their ups and downs as a mother, wife, friend, professional and when nannies break that special bond that families nearly immediately develop (you pretty much have to trust this new person completely) it's tramatic and painful and it IS like finding out your partner has cheated on you. You feel the same emotions and have the same questions (what else has she been keeping from us? Was she ever really happy? What did I do/not do?) It sucks for everyone.
post #25 of 90
Thread Starter 
Thanks for all the replies! I have been feeling a little better about it the past few days. I am sure we will find another nanny who is just as good w/our DD or better! She has a friend who is looking for a new family so maybe that will work out. We'll at least interview several people though.

Yes, she did give notice so we are not totally left in the lurch. She was professional about it but it still hurt! I think that as LauraLoo mentioned maybe she wasn't feeling appreciated enough. We forgot her birthday in January and I could tell she seemed kind of irritated that day. We will have to try harder in that regard next time.

My mom is going to watch DD for a few weeks while we find the new nanny and get everything settled (I have some bad weeks at work coming up and it's best not to bring in someone totally new for that period). I think time with Grandma will help DD not miss the old nanny as badly. The old nanny still wants to hang out with the neighborhood nannies and kids so DD will see her. I think it'll be good to have my mom take her to some of their usual activities w/the other nannies and kids so that at the end of the activity, DD will be leaving with someone she knows and loves--maybe it won't be such a shock that the old nanny is now there and leaving with 2 new kids.

Not to hijack my own thread but my mom usually watches DD 1 afternoon a week anyway and I am thinking that the nanny finds this extra family relationship difficult, based on something the nanny said this week. She (nanny) had also mentioned that she thought my mom was too nosy and critical about 8-9 months ago. I can't ask my mom to stop coming to see my granddaughter but this might cause some stress for the new nanny as well. Any ideas to help with this situation?

thanks again!
Monica
-- for two years and counting! and (and )
post #26 of 90
Quote:
Originally Posted by chocolatefix View Post
Thanks for all the replies! I have been feeling a little better about it the past few days. I am sure we will find another nanny who is just as good w/our DD or better! She has a friend who is looking for a new family so maybe that will work out.
Just a thought on the nanny's friend - I would try to avoid hiring her, if possible. I can't put my finger on it - but something about that idea just rubs me the wrong way.

Quote:
Originally Posted by chocolatefix View Post
Not to hijack my own thread but my mom usually watches DD 1 afternoon a week anyway and I am thinking that the nanny finds this extra family relationship difficult, based on something the nanny said this week. She (nanny) had also mentioned that she thought my mom was too nosy and critical about 8-9 months ago. I can't ask my mom to stop coming to see my granddaughter but this might cause some stress for the new nanny as well. Any ideas to help with this situation?
Do *you* think your mom is "too nosy and critical"? Do you like having your mom interacting with your DD? If you do, then find a nanny who likes your mom, too.
post #27 of 90
Or how about ensuring your nanny's boundaries and comfort level will be respected by all family members.
post #28 of 90
[QUOTE=Potty Diva;10643690]In some states (NC being one of them) you may not go on about how or why someone left your employment. This is against the law and pretty rude. You can respond to "Is this person eligible for rehire?" and confirm dates of employment. Other then that you may not say a word.

Also, until employers are required to give employees notice when they are terminated, employees should not have any responsibility to the employer for a notice.


I don't think that this is true or against state law; i could be wrong though. I think it's usually just a policy decision by individual corporations to avoid being sued. Also, I totally disagree on the notice thing; it is really awful to show up and say "bye" - the employer can't necessarily cover that easily! Being fired for cause is different.
post #29 of 90
Oh no it is indeed a state law.
Former employers are not allowed to share information about previous employees other than to confirm employment dates and confirm whether or not they are eligibl for rehire.

The problem is, it would be pretty hard to prove you did not get a job because a previous employer badmouthed you.

This is the statute and it prohibits a former emploer from purposely trying to prevent you from gaining employment:

§ 14‑355. Blacklisting employees.

If any person, agent, company or corporation, after having discharged any employee from his or its service, shall prevent or attempt to prevent, by word or writing of any kind, such discharged employee from obtaining employment with any other person, company or corporation, such person, agent or corporation shall be guilty of a Class 3 misdemeanor and shall be punished by a fine not exceeding five hundred dollars ($500.00); and such person, agent, company or corporation shall be liable in penal damages to such discharged person, to be recovered by civil action. This section shall not be construed as prohibiting any person or agent of any company or corporation from furnishing in writing, upon request, any other person, company or corporation to whom such discharged person or employee has applied for employment, a truthful statement of the reason for such discharge. (1909, c. 858, s. 1; C.S., s. 4477; 1993, c. 539, s. 235; 1994, Ex. Sess., c. 24, s. 14(c).)
post #30 of 90
the plain language of the statute seems to suggest that it is just fine to be truthful and tell the reasons the employee was discharged. there's a difference from being blacklisted "preventing" employment and telling the truth about someone's poor behavior at work.
post #31 of 90
Quote:
Originally Posted by therdogg View Post
the plain language of the statute seems to suggest that it is just fine to be truthful and tell the reasons the employee was discharged. there's a difference from being blacklisted "preventing" employment and telling the truth about someone's poor behavior at work.
therdogg,
Technically you are correct. In practice, however, many employers err on the side of caution and give the bare facts when a prospective employer calls for confirmation of employment. While truth is a defense no one wants to be put in the position of having to prove the truth, which is difficult to do in "employer said / employee said" type situations. Especially with small employers where there is little or no record keeping.

One other point, depending upon this state's legal definition of "discharged", this may only apply to employers that fired an employee. But the wiser practice for an employer is still to keep it simple when confirming employment for a prospective employer.

~Cath
post #32 of 90
Quote:
Originally Posted by Potty Diva View Post

§ 14‑355. Blacklisting employees.

If any person, agent, company or corporation, after having discharged any employee from his or its service, shall prevent or attempt to prevent, by word or writing of any kind, such discharged employee from obtaining employment with any other person, company or corporation, such person, agent or corporation shall be guilty of a Class 3 misdemeanor and shall be punished by a fine not exceeding five hundred dollars ($500.00); and such person, agent, company or corporation shall be liable in penal damages to such discharged person, to be recovered by civil action. This section shall not be construed as prohibiting any person or agent of any company or corporation from furnishing in writing, upon request, any other person, company or corporation to whom such discharged person or employee has applied for employment, a truthful statement of the reason for such discharge. (1909, c. 858, s. 1; C.S., s. 4477; 1993, c. 539, s. 235; 1994, Ex. Sess., c. 24, s. 14(c).)
PottyDiva - this is all I was trying to say in my previous post. I know the law.

I'm a nanny-employer, and I've been in a situation where I've had someone call me for references on a former nanny who wasn't as great as I would have liked. It's a big dance giving a reference on a person like that.
post #33 of 90
You can always take the high road and give only the facts.

Because although YOU may not have liked their performance doesn't mean they will not be a good nanny for someone else, and in this situation the nanny was NOT a poor nanny and having someone like you fly off the handle to a perspective employer who just be downright dirty.
post #34 of 90
And also, that North Caroline statute does not apply at all if the ex-employer has been asked directly about the employee (only if they give info unsolicited) which is how similar statutes are written in other states. You can be perfectly frank if you are called and even give assessments of character etc.
post #35 of 90
therdog, actually it DOES apply. I called the ESC this afternoon to verify. Their response:

"A former employer may ONLY confirm dates of employment and rehire status."

and,

"Yes, the statute you have just read does include previous employers who are directly asked about job performance, and personal character."

Off the record:

It isn't a former employers job to "warn" a potential new employer about the character or job performance of an individual. If a person has a poor work ethic it will show in all jobs."

He also said (and something I knew before): former employers do not have to say anything negative to get the point across to someone making an inquiry. It is in the way you say, "yes, this person has been employed with us." The tone of voice let's the potential employer know if the person they are calling about is a waste of time or not.
post #36 of 90
On the employment issue... When a reference check call for a person who left the employment of the agency I managed came in, I would offer up different reponses depending on the reason that the person left.

If the person was dischgarged for being late or other minor infractions I would merely confirm dates of hire and rehire status.

If the person was terminated for a major infraction I would eloborate to the prespective employer if it was a job that was in a relatable industry. (We cared for physically and/or mentally disabled adults and children). But if they were applying at say a store at the mall I would not elaborate.

I would also give letters of reccomendation to truly wonderful employees.

We have a similar statute in Washington state and while it complicates things for employers it does not tie their hand completely.

So honestly if it were poor employee preformance, but she still interacted well with your child I would leave it alone.
post #37 of 90
Marcee-

But the only thing this employee did was leave. From what the OP has posted there is nothing negative about her employment, other than finding the OP's mother negative and nosey.

As for the mother, how stressfull and uncomfortable for the nanny to have the mother of her boss being nosey and putting her in a position to feel icky.
post #38 of 90
Quote:
Originally Posted by Potty Diva View Post
As for the mother, how stressfull and uncomfortable for the nanny to have the mother of her boss being nosey and putting her in a position to feel icky.

I didn't see any details about that in the thread. Just that the nanny mentioned a concern once, months ago. Seems like you are jumping to some sinister conclusion out of nowhere...
post #39 of 90
Quote:
Originally Posted by Potty Diva View Post
Marcee-

But the only thing this employee did was leave. From what the OP has posted there is nothing negative about her employment, other than finding the OP's mother negative and nosey.

As for the mother, how stressfull and uncomfortable for the nanny to have the mother of her boss being nosey and putting her in a position to feel icky.
Oh I know I was just stating what I would do if the nanny had a poor performance or did not give "proper 2 week notice" or such. I was just saying that in my opinion the only time to give a bad reference is for something truly horrid. Not just poor performance kwim? I was mostly speaking in "in generals" since that was the turn the thread seemed to be taking with the reference issue.
post #40 of 90
Quote:
Originally Posted by karina5 View Post
Former nanny here!!!!!
And possibly like your nanny, I was really young and didn't handle my quitting in the most honest and graceful way. I look back and think that was kind of schmucky of me, but to be honest, a nanny job is so different than others (you're obviously an employee, but also a part of the family, and it's so weird!) and I just felt so nervous about being honest about why I wanted to leave.
This is why I don't hire nannies anymore, and even try to limit babysitter use. Around here, they're all very young -- college age, or just out of school -- and I have to say that they're really not responsible people yet. I need regular childcare. My deadlines don't go away when the nanny/sitter gets a party invitation or a more attractive gig. I find that the flake rate for babysitters is about 50%, and the most reliable we've gotten has shown up about 80% of the time. There's the usual stream of lies about why they don't show most of the rest of the time. It's particularly rotten when I've got a conference to attend, I've hired a sitter, we're all set, and she emails me the night before I'm supposed to leave and starts a dance about how maybe she can, maybe she can't, something's come up. At that point, of course, I'm stuck scrambling for childcare, begging friends, and sometimes attempting to cancel plane tickets.

When they leave, my daughter's hurt, and will sometimes wait for months for the nanny or sitter to come back.

What shocks me is the lack of responsibility. I was young too, but when I wasn't going to show up for work, I understood that it was my responsibility to find a replacement -- or find a way to show up. In four years of hiring nannies and sitters, I've found exactly one girl who offers to try to find a replacement if she can't make it.

You know, if I had 16 of me, I'd set one to studying how often nannies and sitters flake. There's this great myth in the working world that women can just "get a sitter" and come to meetings, conferences, work late, work early. It'd be nice to do a study of sitter/nanny reliability and turnover, and put an end to that kind of talk. Because I bet that across the board, reliability isn't much better than 65%, and that the average tenure can be measured in months.

Also, if the OP's nanny has just signed a new contract, then I don't understand why she's not liable for breach of contract. It's binding on her just as surely as it's binding on the employers. I would be tempted to say, "Well, I'm willing to tear up the contract and negotiate a 2-month contract with you, to give me time to advertise properly and find someone else. Otherwise you can go, but I'd have to recover my income losses from you, at least till I could replace you."
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