anyone awake? need help ASAP (re: ED prob)

[nalo]

This is day 3 of ED for my 9 month old DD. I noticed a slight rash on her chin is worse today, her bum is a bit redder than normal (not a ring around the anus - just all over redness like the beginning of a regular diaper rash) and she just woke from sleep screaming which ultimately resulted in very watery and somewhat mucousy poop. She was obviously having bad tummy cramps. Now here's the thing...she is also teething and has a cold (just snotty head/nose). How in the world am I supposed to know if she is sensitive to something in my ED or if it's the other things? I am also wondering if this might be normal during the beginning of an ED - something like a detox for her body or something?? Here is what I'm eating for the most part...brown and white rice, chicken, salmon, carrots, celery, lettuce, olive oil, sea salt, pepper, steel cut oats with brown sugar, fresh herbs, pears, apples, little bit of vitamin water mixed with my water, pear juice, have had a few peach fruit leathers (made of apples and a bit of peach and lemon juice). I am terrified to continue eating this diet if something is affecting her - especially if it's rice since I'm eating SO much of it - but I don't know how to tell or what to do. Should I stop eating rice tomorrow and eat potatoes instead? Should I continue as is for a few more days and see how she does? All of a sudden I am totally freaking out. I just want her to be better and figure out what in the world it is (FWIW we've been off cow dairy for about 3 weeks and off all other dairy for maybe 10-12 days). Any suggestions or thoughts? Please, please, please... TIA.

[tanyalynn]

I can't really help, just wanted to send s since I'm awake.

How much was rice a part of your diet before this? Seems like a pretty common food, and I would guess (emphasis on guess) that something worsening like this would be a food that you really didn't have before (or your guess about getting a bit worse before getting better)--though like you say, if it's suddenly a lot more than before, that's possible--how's that for unhelpful?!? But I'd say for tonight/tomorrow, just wait it out and see how your LO does. But that reaction sounds really sad and tough for both of you. It's possible she's just coming down with a stomach bug--horrible timing if that's the case, but I _usually_ didn't get the stomach bugs that the kids did, so I couldn't rule it out just because I felt fine.

Is that the normal type of reaction your LO has--the reason for the ED, I mean? Or is this new? Anyway, I should say that although I lurk here, our food issues are fairly straightforward and my detective work was pretty basic, so the only things I know about the nuances of all this has been from reading others' posts.

[nalo]

Thanks for posting. Yeah, mucous poop is pretty much her only/main symptom (well, aside from her horrific sleep) so the mucous itself isn't different, just that she was in so much pain and it was cleary not a "regular" mucousy poop - way more like diarrhea. But, like I said, she's teething and also has some of her head mucous making its way down to her belly and that could have been upsetting to her system. Aaahhh. Who knows. So the diet...since it's so limited of course I am eating way more of each of these things than normal - especially the rice because I have it for lunch, dinner and sometimes in between. I usually eat rice a few times a week and it is a very low allergen food but anything's possible. I just can't see it being anything else I'm eating. If I do assume that she is reacting to rice then I guess I just switch that out for potatoes and continue on for a bit. I am dying for some more/different food and it's only been 3 days. I don't know how other mamas do this for weeks on end. I sure hope I figure this out before too long.
Anyone else?
Edit to add: is it really possible that she would be sensitive to chicken? this seems SO unlikely to me but it is something I usually eat a few times per week.

[chlobo]

more hugs. It can be so hard. Some thoughts, although some more experienced moms will hopefully respond:

Most oats are x-con with wheat (gluten). Also, my dd hs problems with oats that are supposedly not xcontam. I believe that brown sugar somehow is contaminated with corn. Something about the processing. I would also be very leary of the vitamin water & fruit leather. Just b/c they are multi-ingredient items & who knows what's really in them.

Other than that I'd just wait a bit to see what's going on. It can be so frustrating (I've been on an ED for 2 mo & stilll have mucous).

[Chinese Pistache]

Originally Posted by chlobo

I believe that brown sugar somehow is contaminated with corn. Something about the processing.

C&H sugar is safe (thank goodness!).

OP, I'm wondering about the vitamin water and pear juice. I would be concerned about corn derivatives. Maybe doublecheck the ingredients.

The mucus poop, imo, takes some time to clear up. It should start improving at least, but it might take a little while. If you suspect rice, you might switch your grain to a less common grain like quinoa for the term of the TED. But like you say, her illness could definitely be causing her upset stomach. I hope she's feeling better today

[nalo]

Well C and H is the brown sugar I use so that's good. Here are the ingredients for the fruit leather (whole foods brand): organic apples, organic natural flavor, fruit juice concentrate (peach and lemon). The vitamin water (I'd cut it out but it's the only way I end up drinking enough water. I spike a big glass of water with a bit of vit. water): vapor distilled, deionized and/or reverse osmosis water, crystalline fructose, citric acid, ascorbic acid (vit.c), natural flavor,dragonfruit extract, vegetable juice (color), magnesium lactate (electrolyte), taurine, zinc picolinate, calcium lactate (electrolyte), niacin (B3), monopotassium phosphate (electrolyte), pantothenic acid (B5), pyridoxine hydrochloride (B6), cyanococbalamin (B12), chromiun polynicotinate. THe pear juice is: juice from organic pears, ascorbic acid. Are any of these corn related? I know there's a lot of stuff in the vit. water but it's mostly vitamins and electrolytes so I thought it would be fine.
Also, can anyone answer one of my original ?'s about the possibility of the body doing some sort of detox.

(I've been on an ED for 2 mo & stilll have mucous).

Oh, so sorry. Here's what I don't understand. Being genuine here, hope it doesn't come off weird. If someone is doing an ED for that long, it is certainly long enough for all the offending food to exit the babies body (from what I understand, dairy takes the longest) and for the body to heal, no? Maybe I just really don't understand how this all works. DD's ND said I should see some degree of results after maybe 5 days if I truly have eliminated the offending food(s). Well, this seems awfully soon to me, but 2 months seems awfully long to me. After doing this for 2 months what have you changed along the way, how did you decide to make changes, etc. I guess I wish there was an "Idiot's Guide to Elimination Diet for Sensitive EBF Baby". That's what I need. I started this on Monday, her DD said that if nothing was better by Friday she was probably reacting to the rice and we should switch it up - that just seems like totally jumping the gun to me and not giving her system enough time.
I also think I'm going to get her allergy tested. I know all about how unreliable these tests are for babes but I feel like I really want this done. I would be very careful about how I respond to the results and certainly not take them as "the" information I've been looking for. I know others who have done this in conjunction with ED and it has helped them figure things out. I don't think her ND will be too keen on allergy testing so I'm wondering if I can just call a local hospital outpatient clinic or something and just make an appointment. York Laboratories has what's supposed to be the most reliable ELISA test out there but you have to order a testing kit from them and I don't think our insurance will cover it because they're not a preffered provider. It also takes 2-4 weeks just to receive the test and I want her tested, like tomorrow! Maybe I'll make some calls today.
Any more thoughts? Thank you, thank you.

[Chinese Pistache]

I think testing is a good tool and it sounds like you understand the limitations of it, so that's good. I hope it gives you some useful information. We figured out corn through scratch testing and I don't know that I would have identified without it (partly because I didn't know corn was something to worry about and partly because it's so pervasive).

Sorry to say that you're consuming a few corn ingredients in the juice and water. Citric and ascorbic acids are made with corn. Also, anything that says "natural flavor" is highly suspect to contain corn. Calcium lactate is another one. Take a look at this list for alternate corn names: http://www.cornallergens.com/list/co...ergen-list.php

[nalo]

Oh, well...crap. Thanks SO much for that link - very helpful. I don't have a juicer...any suggestions for safe juice? I don't drink tons but I just can't do water alone - I know I won't get enough liquids into me.

What is the turn around time for allergy testing and should I have multiple types done? I do not suspect any immediate, anaphylactic (sp?) allergies in DD, just sensitivities - does this mean just do the ELISA? I think it would kill us both to have her get injected multiple times under the skin - but I guess I don't really know which is worse. Or better...man I feel ignorant. SO much reading to do.

Edit: just read the whole corn list. what the hell? it's in EVERYTHING??? how is this the case? i'm just about to buy spry dental cleanser for DD which is xylitol. hmm.

[WildIris]

Ceres brand juice is on the corn-safe list. I just found some this week, trialed some of their apricot juice and it's quite good. (Of course, with the corn allergy I'm just happy to find ANYTHING safe! Because it is in everything, like you said.)

About your rice question, it sounds like it would be wise to switch to something else if you're eating a lot of it. Right now I'm trying to rotate between brown rice, quinoa, white potatoes, and sweet potatoes as my starches/grain replacement foods. I'm also trying to get used to meals without a "starchy" element, and eat more veggies. It's very challenging.

[Chinese Pistache]

Originally Posted by DoulaMary

What is the turn around time for allergy testing and should I have multiple types done? I do not suspect any immediate, anaphylactic (sp?) allergies in DD, just sensitivities - does this mean just do the ELISA? I think it would kill us both to have her get injected multiple times under the skin - but I guess I don't really know which is worse. Or better...man I feel ignorant. SO much reading to do.

The scratch test gives results in 10-15 min. It depends on the allergist if they will do it on a baby (my dd was 15 mths). They don't inject anything with this particular test. Just little scratches that didn't hurt my dd at all. The worst part was trying to entertain her and keep her relatively still for 10 minutes to see the results on her skin. The RAST is a blood test that took a couple weeks to get the lab results (it was a very busy lab, though). I haven't looked into the ELISA for a long time, so I don't know about that. The rast and scratch are just for IgE allergies, but it's hard to distinguish them the other kinds. For example, digestive problems can be either type of allergy.

Originally Posted by DoulaMary

Edit: just read the whole corn list. what the hell? it's in EVERYTHING??? how is this the case? i'm just about to buy spry dental cleanser for DD which is xylitol. hmm.

You really have to call companies to find out the source of their ingredients. Xylitol can be made from birch or corn (I don't know about anything else). I've emailed/called so many companies. I'm very distrustful of labels. It really makes life more difficult. Anyway, here's another link with safe products. These people are great and have done a lot of the legwork for us: http://corn-freefoods.blogspot.com/

[nalo]

Ceres brand juice is on the corn-safe list.

Fab! Thanks. Will look into it.

[chlobo]

Well, I guess you could call me an ED failure. I would have expected to see results by now. I know I have to switch things up but I've had poor guidance in that department. When I first started I was doing TED but I felt awful so I had to expand the diet. I finally settled what I'm eating now and I was hoping for some change. Maybe some delayed healing. But nothing. As I said my naturopath was a dud. Believe me, I am frustrated since I don't know where to turn next. But I can't exactly just eat everything. I think that would be disasterous.

I am also thinking of allergy testing. The wait here for an appt is 2-3 months. So I was thinking *I* would get IgG tested in the hopes that I might uncover what bothers me, which I might be passing on.

If anyone has other advice for me I'd love to hear it.

ETA: If anyone knows a good naturopath in Mass. I'd love to know.

[kjbrown92]

First of all, if the symptoms are diarrhea and fussiness/sleep problems, I really doubt anything is going to show up as an IgE response (RAST, skin test).

Second, if you use York labs, do NOT use www.yorkallergyusa.com!!! I have a Better Business Bureau complaint in with them, trying to get my money back, since it's been over 2 months, and I still haven't received the test kit. Apparently they have an F rating with the BBB because they don't follow through on anything. Go to the real York Allergy test from the UK. It's more expensive, but at least you might really get the test. I'm waiting for my money to come back (hopefully, since I have disputed it with the credit card company) then I'm going to get tested through the real York.

I am doing an ED right now as well. I am having: sea salt, black pepper, all meat, olive oil, sweet potatoes, bananas, grapes, spinach, lettuce, carrots, celery, onions, garlic, avocado, GF oats, flaxseed, tapioca flour, baking soda, cream of tarter, palm shortening, coconut, brown sugar, nutmeg, rice.

That, however, is based on the fact that I know that my DD can have all of those things (I already did the ED with her). I took wheat out from mine, even though she can have it, because it's a common allergen.

That's just to give you perspective that I've been there with my child, and I'm here now with me!! As for water, I put ice in it, and drink a lot of it as long as it's cold. Since I'm having grapes, I'm also doing grape juice. And since I'm doing carrots, I'm doing carrot juice (I make a smoothie -- bananas, coconut milk yogurt, carrot juice, powdered probiotics, ice). I make rice milk for DD to drink, and I use it in baking, but I'm not so fond of drinking it.

White potatoes is allergenic (all the nightshade plants are), as is citrus. Also, in the vitamin water, you have "vegetable extract" as coloring. What vegetable is it? I'd also like to know where they get their "fructose" - is that corn? Corn is a big hidden allergen.

If the symptoms are diarrhea and fussiness at night.... I would say that 5-7 days should give you something, the ND is right. Granted, it takes longer than that to heal the gut, but you should get some relief within that time. And then start swapping things out. I've been on mine for a week and a half. It's difficult but not impossible. I'm making roasted chicken, then chicken soup. Turkey meatballs (I figure chicken and turkey are related) in the chicken soup (that's additional liquid as well). Saute the spinach in some olive oil, and add some chicken broth on that. I'm also drinking rooibas tea (guess that wasn't on my list) with sugar. That's additional liquid too. That would probably be good iced. It's not caffeinated and if you haven't been having it before, maybe that would work, but with less ingredients for you.

Also, I highly recommend Gripe Water by Wellements. It's ginger, baking soda, fennel, and chamomile. It's really helped my DD sleep better (not perfectly).

Kathy

[nalo]

Is it true that sensitivities will only exist for foods I eat/ate on a regular basis? I mean, I rarely ever eat potatoes (of any kind - white or sweet) and even though that can be an allergen it is also commonly prescribed for ED diets (?). Even though I almost never ate potatoes in the last few months could she still be sensitive to them? I was so excited because I just bought some organic potato chips (which I normally hate) - ingredients: potatoes, safflower oil, sea salt - and that totally helped my craving for snacky food. Just thinking out loud I guess. Given that I know she has dairy sensitivity how likely is it that she has other things as well? I know that 50% of dairy intollerant people also can't do soy but other than that how likely is it really that she'll be reactive to one more food, none, or 12? Any way to predict that?

[kjbrown92]

Well I read (and there's a link somewhere on this forum) that if the baby is c-section, they're 8 times more likely to have food sensitivites. All I know is that my DD#1 has no food issues. My DS is intolerant to milk, soy (all legumes), white potato, and cocoa. And DD#2 (csection) is intolerant to all those plus about 20 other foods. Now I'm doing the ED to see if I have food sensitivies that I didn't know about where I passed my antigens to the kids. My back pain isn't any better and I can't tell about the chronic UTIs because I'm always on antibiotics, BUT my menstrual migraines have disappeared completely AND I have no more IBS stuff AT ALL, AND I haven't caught any of the viruses that are running around my family (the diarrhea virus, the cold/fever virus, and just plain colds) - I have stayed healthy the whole time. So I must have some food issues that I never realized. Interesting to me, but I wish I'd known it sooner!! Also, DH and I both have environmental allergies so the ped GI said that we were an atopic family which meant our kids were more prone to allergies of any kind (food or environmental).
K

[nalo]

kjbrown - thanks for your post. DD was born vaginally, drug free, no interventions. She is not vaxed. We have no pets. I am thin and very healthy - both mentally and physically. As a child I had bad excema for 2 years but food was not even looked at as a cause then. I outgrew it with no diet change and have no food sensitivities now. I know that many people have intollerances and don't know it but I am just quite healthy with no symptoms of anything, good energy (despite no sleep), etc. The only thing I have is some hayfever that developed about 5 years ago (I am 30 now).

Also...WildIris. I went to Whole Foods in search of Ceres and they said that juice is only available in California - is that where you live? They use to carry it (very recently) but I guess Cal. is the only place where it is sold now and they questioned whether or not it's actually still being produced. I bought some Looza pear nectar to spike my water with (I bought talking rain sparkling water and the combo is DELICIOUS) but one of the ingredients is "sugar" and now I'm scared that might mean corn. Why is this so hard to keep straight? I mean, I know what I'm supposed to be looking for (kind of) yet I still come home with 5 bottles of Looza with "sugar" and don't realize until I'm home that that could mean corn. I feel like my brain just can't process all of this information and actually put it to use. I'm trying to find out what they use for sugar but am having a hell of a time figuring out who to contact for this brand.

Edit: wow, I actually got an answer! Looza is sweetened with German beet sugar so it's safe. It's so tasty - I recommend it for flavoring water!