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used to feel homebirth was best... but not anymore - Page 9

post #161 of 246
4/9/08 at 2:35pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by carriebft View Post
Ixcuina, of course you understand that I could insert "birth in the hospital" for all the places you put homebirth and homebirth for all the places you said hospital and it would ring just as true...
actually more true because the risks of being in a hospital are greater.

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post #162 of 246
4/9/08 at 2:38pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by almadianna View Post
actually more true because the risks of being in a hospital are greater.
This is absolutely NOT true. But, it is often the "truth" that gets spoken. It is unfortunate. Why are we so afraid of the truth?
post #163 of 246
4/9/08 at 2:40pm
Seriously, just look up Nosocomial infections....
post #164 of 246
4/9/08 at 2:42pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ixcuina View Post
This is absolutely NOT true. But, it is often the "truth" that gets spoken. It is unfortunate. Why are we so afraid of the truth?
It depends on the groups you are looking at and the hospitals in question.

Here we have a 50% Csection rate and a major infection problem...our NI rate is 9% 9%!!!!!!. For a healthy pregnancy, IMO, homebirth is safer where I live!
post #165 of 246
4/9/08 at 2:42pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by the_lissa View Post
Of course there are risks to home birth, but there are risks to hospital birth too. Going on and on about the risks of home birth while ignoring the risks of hospital birth is disingenuous at best.
:

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ixcuina View Post
This is absolutely NOT true. But, it is often the "truth" that gets spoken. It is unfortunate. Why are we so afraid of the truth?
Actually it is true. We have provided numerous studies. I suggest anyone who wants to argue against that point go and read them. So that begs the question-

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ixcuina View Post
Why are we so afraid of the truth?
About hospital births.
post #166 of 246
4/9/08 at 2:42pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ixcuina View Post
This is absolutely NOT true. But, it is often the "truth" that gets spoken. It is unfortunate. Why are we so afraid of the truth?
excuse me, how is this NOT true?

how many are harmed or die each year from errors that a doctor makes?
MRSA?
women forced into inductions or csections that are so risky for no reason?

how is this NOT true?
post #167 of 246
4/9/08 at 2:47pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by the_lissa View Post
Of course there are risks to home birth, but there are risks to hospital birth too. Going on and on about the risks of home birth while ignoring the risks of hospital birth is disingenuous at best.
If you are speaking to my post, I said that there are some true emergencies which, if they happen at home, are MORE LIKELY to end with a mother who does not survive, a baby that does not survive, or both.

That is simply the truth. There is no point in arguing it.

I did not "ignore" the risks that may be present in a hospital setting. But, the risks that can happen at home that are more difficult to deal with at home, are not something to be dismissed....and as far as I can tell from so many previous posts, they ARE dismissed or downplayed or outright ignored.

Bottom line, for ME, is that if someone chooses a homebirth I hope they are making that choice with a complete understanding of the risks involved and a complete understanding that those risk can become reality and it can happen to them. Someone is ok with that, great. More power to them.
post #168 of 246
4/9/08 at 2:48pm
Thank you for having the strength to share your story with us, pannacotta.
post #169 of 246
4/9/08 at 2:51pm
Right, homebirth has risks. If, for example, you have cord prolapse that requires transfer, you have travel time to the nearest hospital. This is one example of a risk associated with no being on hospital site.

However, what I believe people are saying here, is that there can be no real discussion of homebirth risks without looking at the flip side of the coin: hospital birth risks. Because one should not enter a hospital birth situation without realizing that there are life threatening risks as soon as you enter those doors as well.

The risk benefit analysis of where to give birth cannot only be about the risks of home. It must also look at the real and true risks of the hospitals in one's area as well.

For me, that means facing 50% Csection rates and 9% nosochomial infection rates.
post #170 of 246
4/9/08 at 2:51pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by kittywitty View Post
:



Actually it is true. We have provided numerous studies. I suggest anyone who wants to argue against that point go and read them. So that begs the question-

About hospital births.
I understand the studies. They don't "prove" what you want them to.

I am not interested in arguing with you about it. Seriously, I am not. And, I knew (though I was secretly hoping it would not be the case) that my post would cause an immediate backlash of "you don't know what you are talking about" retorts.
post #171 of 246
4/9/08 at 2:52pm
To the OP: Your opinion is completely valid. You've looked at the data and at your own personal experience, and weighed the risks and benefits, and decided during your risk analysis to opt for the hospital. I, too, have been aware of all of the hospital and home risks. I do have to disagree with you regarding AFE - it's my understanding that it's almost always fatal, whether at home or at the hospital. It's also extremely rare, fortunately, and associated with the use of pitocin during labor.

Bottom line, we all have to make our own risk analysis. You can read all the studies you want all day long, and have 14 births in home or hospital to influence your opinion, but at the end of the day, it comes down to the individual's risk analysis. What risks are you more comfortable with? Where do you draw the line? Because the incidence of the severe conditions you're describing are so rare (placenta accreta w/no prior c/s; AFE; etc.), it really is not logical to apply to all people a general hospital birth prescription. Yes, you may have died at a homebirth. But how likely is that to happen to anyone else? It's so small that, when studied scientifically, you're equally likely statistically to die at home as at the hospital and less likely to be injured at home during birth. So an individual has to make her own judgment, based on fact and experience, on which risks she feels are acceptable or more acceptable than others.

I'm glad you felt like you could post your thoughts, experience, and decision here. Not everyone on MDC has homebirths or UCs! Really! I feel the hospital choice is completely valid, especially if you can find a supportive HCP who understands what you want and listens to you and respects you during birth. There are many different risks and situations during birth. It's important for each woman to understand those and choose according to what is right for her, and will be acceptable to her later.
post #172 of 246
4/9/08 at 2:53pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ixcuina View Post
I understand the studies. They don't "prove" what you want them to.

I am not interested in arguing with you about it. Seriously, I am not. And, I knew (though I was secretly hoping it would not be the case) that my post would cause an immediate backlash of "you don't know what you are talking about" retorts.
Tell us what they do not prove. What do you feel people want them to prove that they do not prove?
post #173 of 246
4/9/08 at 2:55pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ixcuina View Post
Bottom line, for ME, is that if someone chooses a homebirth I hope they are making that choice with a complete understanding of the risks involved and a complete understanding that those risk can become reality and it can happen to them. Someone is ok with that, great. More power to them.
And bottom line for ME is that if someone chooses hospital birth, I hope they are making that choice with a complete understanding of the risks involved and a complete understanding that those risks can become reality and it can happen to them. If someone is educated on that and okay with that- fabulous.

IME homebirthers are MUCH more educated on the risks on BOTH sides than hospital birthers.

-Angela
post #174 of 246
4/9/08 at 2:56pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by carriebft View Post
Tell us what they do not prove. What do you feel people want them to prove that they do not prove?
The are no studies that "prove" homebirth is safer than hospital birth.
post #175 of 246
4/9/08 at 2:58pm
in 2004, the infection rate in well baby nurseries was 2.56. Nearly 20,000 infections reported in the well-baby nurseries in our country.

http://www.cdc.gov/ncidod/dhqp/pdf/h...ons_deaths.pdf
post #176 of 246
4/9/08 at 2:59pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ixcuina View Post
The are no studies that "prove" homebirth is safer than hospital birth.
studies actually cant prove anything like that, either way actually... studies can however show us who has a great mortality rate, infection rate, csection rate, and other things like that.
post #177 of 246
4/9/08 at 3:00pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ixcuina View Post
The are no studies that "prove" homebirth is safer than hospital birth.
I'm sure you have responses to this, but the BMJ study is the one generally relied upon these days. Mortality, for mother and baby, was equal in home and hospital for low-risk mothers. Morbidity was lower at home.

I don't want to get into a big debate of study methods, arguing how data was parsed, etc.
post #178 of 246
4/9/08 at 3:02pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ixcuina View Post
The are no studies that "prove" homebirth is safer than hospital birth.
Are there studies that "prove" hospital birth is safer than home birth?
post #179 of 246
4/9/08 at 3:04pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ixcuina View Post
The are no studies that "prove" homebirth is safer than hospital birth.
People are showing studies and saying they demonstrate the increased risks of a hospital birth in certain important categories. Taken together, for many people, that can definitely prove that, for them, homebirth is safer.


_____

But alsom we must understand, for example, that some things we would consider to be death related to birthing are not considered to be so by our hospital system. If your epidural falls out and is reinserted without proper infection prevention and you die from an infection due to this....that would not be included in the numbers for mortality resulting from birth.
post #180 of 246
4/9/08 at 3:07pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ixcuina View Post
Bottom line, for ME, is that if someone chooses a homebirth I hope they are making that choice with a complete understanding of the risks involved and a complete understanding that those risk can become reality and it can happen to them. Someone is ok with that, great. More power to them.
I feel the same about someone having a hospital birth.

I do understand why the OP (and others) feel so biased against home birth. Our experiences definitely shape us and our opinions.
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Mothering › Mothering Discussion Forums › Pregnancy and Birth › Birth and Beyond › used to feel homebirth was best... but not anymore