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Let's Talk About NOT Cutting The Cord - Page 3

post #41 of 66
Quote:
Originally Posted by sapphire_chan View Post
And a placenta to deal with.

Some people use the placenta being attached as a way to force themselves to slow down and take things easy after the birth. Which is perfectly valid. However, you can't just compare cord to cord in lotus vs non-lotus birth. There is a definite logistical difference.
Of course!! I was just trying to say that just by cutting the cord doesn't mean it goes away or gets reabsorbed... you still have to deal with it. I can imagine having a placenta and full cord still attached would make a HUGE difference. Any way you choose do it, you HAVE to let it come away on its own (unless you rip it off at the belly button at birth... ow).
post #42 of 66
Quote:
Originally Posted by BlessedOne View Post
thanks for the info....but I still think I will pass. I have never eaten it and thankfully have not had any of the issues that it can help fix or prevent.....so I will stick to my method.

Back to the subject.........
My idea is that if I am able to eat some, I will need to eat some. Like how I hate the taste of eggs normally but have been craving them this whole pregnancy--it's my body's way of saying "hey protein please!"

Back on topic though, I wonder how much attitude affects perceptions about cord cutting?

ETA:skolbut, thanks for clarifying! You're absolutely right. I've also heard that cord stumps can take like 2 weeks to fall off where things frequently fall off in a few days with lotus birth.
post #43 of 66
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by sapphire_chan View Post
Shouldn't that role be filled by the baby's mother after birth?
In terms of what she was saying; I would think she's implying allowing the transition between one comfort to another. Even a breast is a foreign thing to baby; but the placenta is really all they knew. I suppose it would be like transitioning a move. I think it's more of a peaceful ritual thing.

I'm liking the thought of burning instead of cutting too; for the whole preventing infection thing. Although, I kind of wonder that if you do delayed cord cutting; and the body naturally 'cuts off' the circulation to the cord; there would be minimal risk of infection anyways; because the 'door' to baby would be closed, so to speak. Right?

I do have a question though, about a full Lotus Birth.... don't you worry about the cord getting ripped out by accident because there's so much extra to deal with? Even in a bag nicely wrapped; I'd worry. Anyone?
post #44 of 66
Quote:
Originally Posted by sapphire_chan View Post
Shouldn't that role be filled by the baby's mother after birth?
I don't know why this hit me as funny. I don't know, like images of "Well, I chose lotus birth so that the baby had the placenta for comfort, and I could go have a bath." Um, in my defense I've not been eating well today...

Quote:
Originally Posted by sapphire_chan View Post
And a placenta to deal with.

Some people use the placenta being attached as a way to force themselves to slow down and take things easy after the birth. Which is perfectly valid. However, you can't just compare cord to cord in lotus vs non-lotus birth. There is a definite logistical difference.
It is not that hard to deal with. It's only left "raw and wet and out there" for the time that you'd be most likely just sitting/laying with the baby anyway. Then you clean it, rub it with your herbs and salt, and wrap it and sack it. It shrinks quickly. It lightens quickly. I think people envision this huge heavy wet thing, needing to be carried around attacxhed to the baby, like you wheel an I.V. pole around a hospital, an oxygen tank around with grandma, or what have you. It sits with baby. In the sling, while nursing, while grandma carries them to the kitchen. It really isn't awkward. I know it seems like it would be, but it's not.


Quote:
Originally Posted by BlessedOne View Post
the thought of concuming the placents makes me want to VOMIT!!!
But then again, I am a vegetarian...lol. But even if I was not....eating a part of my own body is still gross and morbid in my mind! (Everyone is entitled to their own opinion on the matter)
Ewwwwwwww beyond measure is my thought!! I would rather eat a raw dead animal then part of my and my baby's body!

Ok I have got to stop thinking about it, or I am going to have to clean off the keyboard.
Why? Explain that logic. I am a vegan. I would rather eat something of *my* body than another animal. Why is it gross? Do you know that according to science we are suppossed to be one of only two mammals that do NOT eat out placentas? (please, anyone correct me, that was what I read when I looked into it ages ago, us and camels I thought.) As you can imagine that includes a LOT of herbavores. Is your breastmilk gross? When your child gets cut on their finger and you suck on it, is that gross? Bodily milk, human blood, ew. I get why eating meat would disgust you, I'm just floored that you would rather eat animal meat, because you're disgusted by your own placenta. But then that is common isn't it? The country is full of meat eaters that think placentas and the eating of them is gross. They eat sushi, but ew, don't show me *my* placenta. I'm just saddened that you actually said you would rather eat raw dead animal than your placenta. It's a fascinating organ. If you don't eat meat, fine, don't eat it. But don't be repulsed by it! It should never be more discusting to you than a raw dead animal. You should read and learn more about it. The placenta is a beautiful thing.
post #45 of 66
Quote:
Originally Posted by Blu Razzberri View Post
In terms of what she was saying; I would think she's implying allowing the transition between one comfort to another. Even a breast is a foreign thing to baby; but the placenta is really all they knew. I suppose it would be like transitioning a move. I think it's more of a peaceful ritual thing.

I do have a question though, about a full Lotus Birth.... don't you worry about the cord getting ripped out by accident because there's so much extra to deal with? Even in a bag nicely wrapped; I'd worry. Anyone?

Yes, that is of course what I meant. Thank you.

Oh yes, you do worry the first time. But it just isn't that big of a deal. I think people feel concerned because much of the text talks of lotus birth allowing the mother and child to stay resting and still, etc, etc. Well, maybe for some. Not for me. I have a family to run. I'm up and about with my babies and their placenta hours after birth. Usually wrapped on me of course, and about we go. It is not a big deal when others handle the baby, and etc. Even little ones. Just like explaining the soft spot, you explain the cord, and they are great with it. See, you don't handle it seperately. It's not a two handed thing. You handle the placenta with the baby. In fact, most of the time it's tucked inside the infants clothes or blanket. You're not carrying it around like a hot water bottle. I mean, I'm sure some handle it seperately, because we all have our own way of doing things, don't we? But I'm familiar with many lotus birthers, and yes, the sack just hangs out with the baby usually inside the clothes.
post #46 of 66
Quote:
Originally Posted by coyotemist View Post
Also, in c-section birth I do not believe it is possible to leave the placenta attached. The baby must be moved out of the way for the surgeon to get in to extract the placenta, and the baby must be warmed right away to prevent hypothermia. Surgical suites are kept quite cold, and holding the baby near mom while the surgeon does his/her work would not be good for the baby.
I believe I've read about a c-section lotus birth...anyone else read this?

And I don't see why having a baby in a plastic warmer would be better than on the mother covered with blankets. From what I've read whisking a normal, breathing baby away in hospital births doesn't have sound medical logic behind it and in fact, can cause problems for the baby and the mother, both physical and emotional.
post #47 of 66
Quote:
Originally Posted by ayogurtsmearedsari View Post
Do you know that according to science we are suppossed to be one of only two mammals that do NOT eat out placentas? (please, anyone correct me, that was what I read when I looked into it ages ago, us and camels I thought.)
So, while I was just making us a couple of chocolate cakes, I was, of all things thinking about this discussion. And I was thinking how this just can't be right. I know I read it. But, women all over the world eat their placentas, and traditionally have throughout history, right? So, it isn't really fair to say "humans" don't partake. Sorry, I keep avoiding the proper term by the way, I can never remember how to spell it. I can say it though!
post #48 of 66
Quote:
Originally Posted by Blu Razzberri View Post
I talked to the midwife about delayed clamping and she explained that the cord cuts off the supply naturally (which is when the pulsing stops); and then you cut the cord; and she called it 'delayed cord clamping'. This is what I want to do. She also told me that I don't need any special permissions from the hospital for this
just wanted to make sure, your MW works at the hosp that she says is ok to do delayed clamping? i only ask because that's what we had planned to do at dd's homebirth, and when we had to transfer they gave me hell about it at the hosp. the doc tried to tell me "it could kill my baby." : i have no idea what that was all about, but that doc also had a chip on her shoulder the size of texas, so go figure. maybe the hosp your MW works out of is more liberal? just wanted to bring that point up though.
post #49 of 66
Quote:
Originally Posted by HerthElde View Post
Yep, lots of good reasons. Hemmorhage prevention or stopping, PPD prevention, etc. And there are a lot of vegans and vegetarians who choose to do it too
I am a vegan that intends upon drying and encapsulating my placenta when the time comes. I know two other vegan moms who did the same. Just throwing in my :.

On the other hand, this is the first I had ever heard of lotus birth. I like the idea of it, and may put some more thought into that...
post #50 of 66
Quote:
Originally Posted by coyotemist View Post
The thing about this discussion that leaves me wondering is this...both of my children had jaundice. Jaundice develops from the body breaking down the extra red blood cells needed for oxygen transport in the uterus. Once the baby is breathing room air (instead of depending on mom's arterial blood supply for oxygen) their livers start breaking down the extra unneeded cells, which results in bilirubin circulating in the blood. The baby needs to eat and poop to get rid of this.

Susan Weed in "The Childbearing Year" says to cut the cord "as soon as convenient" to prevent jaundice.
I respectfully disagree. My first was born in the hospital and the cord was clamped immediately. He had serious jaundice. My second was born at home and the cord was clamped at about 20min. after the birth. I saw him flinch and he cried really hard and for a long time after that. He had mild jaundice.
My third hb baby, I said I wanted to wait until the placenta was delivered before cutting the cord. MW thought I was crazy. Absolutely no jaundice. Fourth HB baby, same thing. I waited until the placenta was delivered before clamping and cutting it. He had no jaundice either. With my others we will do a lotus.
Quote:
Originally Posted by ayogurtsmearedsari View Post


Healthy. I've found that most things that stem from spirituality for me, are healthy. Circumcision for example. I simply find it to be violent. But now science says it's healthy too. I find formula violent to the dairy cows, who are horribly misused. But it is healthier too after all. I think cord cutting although, not anywhere near as violent as circumcision, is still a very rough and harsh act. I would not be suprised to hear some day that lotus birth babies did recieve some health benefits as a result of their strange parents choices!
.
Please tell me you're not serious. You don't actually believe circumcision is healthier do you? Science isn't saying its healthy. This idea comes from radical cultural conditioning. If you're referring to the Africa studies please understand that stuff is "junk science". Its been refuted.

When I first learned about cord banking (second pregnancy) I thought it was a scam. If its that good, it should go into the baby it belongs to.
Its strange that a doctor says, "clam the cord asap or it could kill the baby if you delay" yet they want to put that same blood back into a 'sick' baby.
post #51 of 66
I think we didn't cut the cord on DS until about 20 minutes or so had passed, and then DH mixed part of the placenta into a smoothie for me to drink. You bring meat home from the grocery and you don't worry about it taking 30-45 minutes to make it to the fridge.

Anyway, I guess this is off topic.
post #52 of 66
Quote:
Originally Posted by weliveintheforest View Post
I have heard this many times, and I did believe it, but at the births I have been at I never noticed this. I was only able to purposely watch for it at 2 births besides my own, and the babies did not flinch, fuss, or anything that made me think they noticed.
I had the opposite, I thought it was make-believe that babies notice when their cord is cut - women reading into things, perhaps... and then when we cut Aaden's cord, he very visibly jumped. He didn't cry, but he started very distinctly, as it was cut. It was weird.

We delay cord cutting until no longer pulsing and limp, and this last time I ate some of the placenta. Yay Placentophagy! I wish so much that I had just bitten the bullet (so to speak) and had a little bit after each birth.

For a pp who asked, I don't think there would be any problem with leaving the placenta attached for a couple/few hours before cutting the cord if you are wanting to consume some of it. I would think that having it out (room temperature) for, say, 12 hours would be pushing it - attached or not. I don't know the "safe" length of time, just going by what seems sensible to me.
post #53 of 66
Quote:
Originally Posted by ayogurtsmearedsari
Circumcision for example. I simply find it to be violent. But now science says it's healthy too. I find formula violent to the dairy cows, who are horribly misused. But it is healthier too after all.
Please, tell me you don't actually believe formula is healthier than breastmilk?!?!
And that circumcision is "healthy"??? You would prevent the violence of having baby's cord cut, but would actually strap him down and rip and tear and slice off one of his organs??? You're worried about a baby fussing or crying at birth but the bucking and screaming and shocked traumatized silence that follows circ. is "healthy"???

I'm sorry, you just struck a terrible nerve here with me. You were making an interesting argument up until that statement... now.... :

fruitful womb posted very good links! Please visit these sites and use google and learn more about human breastmilk and circ./genital mutilation!
post #54 of 66
Quote:
Originally Posted by fruitful womb View Post
Please tell me you're not serious. You don't actually believe circumcision is healthier do you? Science isn't saying its healthy. This idea comes from radical cultural conditioning. .
Just wanted to say that IMO the reason we see placentophagy as anything to bat an eyelash at (or hurl chunks) is due to cultural conditioning as well. Because it is not inherently gross, is not at all harmful, and is actually quite beneficial. The fact that many see it as a form of cannibalism, rather than a natural primal part of birth and postpartum, is a feature of our culture - not our biology.
post #55 of 66
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by ayogurtsmearedsari View Post
...I think people envision this huge heavy wet thing, needing to be carried around attacxhed to the baby, like you wheel an I.V. pole around a hospital...
Quote:
Originally Posted by ayogurtsmearedsari View Post
...You're not carrying it around like a hot water bottle...
Ok; I'll admit that these are exactly how I pictured it. : Heavy like a couple pounds of meat; awkward and difficult...trying to stuff the cord back in the bag until it came detached. I'm really glad you've taken the time to post about it. Thank you.

Quote:
Originally Posted by pazerific View Post
...just wanted to make sure, your MW works at the hosp that she says is ok to do delayed clamping?...
Thanks for mentioning just in case! Yes, my midwife has hospital privileges and we're good to do this 'my way'.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Andee View Post
...:...
WHAT? We have a two-cents emoticon!!?? SWEET!

Quote:
Originally Posted by fruitful womb View Post
...You don't actually believe circumcision is healthier do you?...
I had to read that line twice too. I think she meant that intact foreskin is healthier. The 'circumcision is healthier' argument just didn't seem to fit right with her posts about being non-violent. I really hope that's what she meant anyways!!
post #56 of 66
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sioko View Post
Please, tell me you don't actually believe formula is healthier than breastmilk?!?!
And that circumcision is "healthy"??? You would prevent the violence of having baby's cord cut, but would actually strap him down and rip and tear and slice off one of his organs??? You're worried about a baby fussing or crying at birth but the bucking and screaming and shocked traumatized silence that follows circ. is "healthy"???

I'm sorry, you just struck a terrible nerve here with me. You were making an interesting argument up until that statement... now.... :

fruitful womb posted very good links! Please visit these sites and use google and learn more about human breastmilk and circ./genital mutilation!
I kind of chalked this up to a typo, a mis-speak. I thought she was trying to say that circumcision is violent, and while cord-cutting isn't the same degree, it is still violent. Maybe I just read it that way because that was what made sense to me.
post #57 of 66
Yes, I interepreted more of a "while modern science has said XYZ is healthier at certain times, they turn out not to be when they're violent" or something to that effect (think back to the 60s or 70s when formula was "supposed" to be healthier)
At any rate, this'll be removed when that tangent gets pulled, I'm guessing
post #58 of 66
Quote:
Originally Posted by fruitful womb View Post
Please tell me you're not serious. You don't actually believe circumcision is healthier do you? Science isn't saying its healthy. This idea comes from radical cultural conditioning. If you're referring to the Africa studies please understand that stuff is "junk science". Its been refuted.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sioko View Post
Please, tell me you don't actually believe formula is healthier than breastmilk?!?!
And that circumcision is "healthy"??? You would prevent the violence of having baby's cord cut, but would actually strap him down and rip and tear and slice off one of his organs??? You're worried about a baby fussing or crying at birth but the bucking and screaming and shocked traumatized silence that follows circ. is "healthy"???

I'm sorry, you just struck a terrible nerve here with me. You were making an interesting argument up until that statement... now.... :

fruitful womb posted very good links! Please visit these sites and use google and learn more about human breastmilk and circ./genital mutilation!
Of course not! I sometimes am not clear on how I word myself. I of course do not cut my children. Buddhists do not circumcise boys or girls. And yes, I breastfeed! "CLW" actually. I'll go add a note to that post...

ETA: I though I should be a little more clear about the Buddhist and not cutting. A Buddhist is sworn to Ahimsa, so, circumcision is an act of violence. Well, I know nothing of Zen Buddhism, though, I should point out.

Oh, and it's not just my choice. My husband is actually very hands off and natural. So for those reasons he would never circucise or etc. He's a complete "lactivist" too. Actually, he gets all the credit for our children not being vaccinated and such. I would have been esily convinced about the health benefits of them, but he is very anti-vaccinations. And now that I've learned more about them, I am so very thankful to his convictions. It's scary to think I could have allowed that stuff to have been put in my babies! I was upset about the shots hurting, but I had never thought of what was *in* them very deeply. With a third world background, you can easily fall into the trap of trusting all miracle vaccines.

Anyway, we were talking about placentas, right?

ETATA: I put the biggest no circ sign in my signature.
post #59 of 66
Just out of curiosity...
So would nature be considered 'violent' by it naturally separating the cord? I guess I do not see the difference in cutting it verses letting it naturally come off. Either way it is coming off. I would prefer to go at it the less combersome way. Honestly I feel that it would hinder me bonding with the baby if I had the cord and placenta hanging around for a while. I have a hard enough time cuddling with the stump still attached. I get nervous about bumping it and I tend to keep the baby's belly turned away from me more. Outside of that....that type of thing grosses me out (not good with stuff like that..it is amazing that I can even homebirth...lol). I have no problem with people doing the lotus birth thing if they feel it is right for them. It is just not right for me.

TO ME....if anything seems 'violent' to me then it is eating the placenta. Especially if it is put in a blender and chopped to bits! THAT to me is violent and against nature! But hey...that is my opinion.

P.S.
I likewise do not circumcise.....



so whats everyones feelings on cutting hair and nails?
post #60 of 66
Quote:
Originally Posted by BlessedOne View Post
so whats everyones feelings on cutting hair and nails?
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