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for those of you who despise political correctness...here's a football game for you!  

post #1 of 17
10/1/03 at 3:38am
Thread Starter 
seems like a lot of people take issue with political correctness....

You may have enjoyed this game very much.

http://www.newsday.com/news/nationwo...tion-headlines

Texas Band Chief Apologizes for Nazi Flag




By Associated Press

September 30, 2003, 5:49 PM EDT


DALLAS -- A high school band director has apologized for a halftime performance that included "Deutschland Uber Alles," the anthem closely associated with Adolf Hitler, and a student running across the field with a Nazi flag.

Charles Grissom, Paris High School's band director, said his intention was to have a historical performance featuring the flags and music of the nations that fought during World War II.

The show, titled "Visions of World War II," nearly caused a melee at Friday night's football game at Dallas' Hillcrest High School.

"We were booed," Grissom said Monday. "We had things thrown at us. We were cursed."

Paris' assistant coaches were even targeted as they made their way through the bleachers to a press box after halftime.

"The assistant coaches ... got blasted, cursed," said Brent Southworth, Paris' head football coach.

Grissom said he never intended to offend anyone, and he apologized repeatedly.

"We had an error in judgment," Grissom told The Dallas Morning News in an interview published Tuesday. "Our intent was never to cause any harm."



it goes on... personally I don't care about being PC or Not being PC... seems people take pride being one or the other. whatever.
post #2 of 17
10/1/03 at 6:42am
Hm,

I would have to have seen the performance to make a call on that one. I was really involved in marching band/drum corps in my younger days and some groups put on very dramatic representations of events that are stunning and really bring a powerful message.

I have performed to a lot of different pieces in my time and I really don't think from my experience that they were passing Nazi propaganda but that the sections dealing with that were a part of a theme on WWII.

Do they really think marching bands just play Sousa? Sousa for the record, is **NOT** fun to play. It might be crowd pleasing but most musicians do not like playing it. Band students are students as well and they are MUSIC students not "play for the football team" students.

It is an art form that only has moments in the spotlight during a game but there are also competitions that a group making a powerful statement is appreciated by their peers. It stated in the article they have a competition on Oct 15th. They created thier show with competition in mind. Football games are just practice.

I guess random people at a football game are unlikely to appreciate that aspect but should they really be limited in their art by what a football parent likes? I would rather hear what the football players think.

I am annoyed he was forced to apologize. They had flags of the US, Japan, France and the Nazi flag, it was a historical representation. Nazi flags appear in movies about WWII what is the difference?
post #3 of 17
10/1/03 at 6:55am
Well I can see that the Nazi flag could cause ructions but "Deutschland Uber Alles" is the current national anthem of Germany and is played whenever a German athlete wins anything (it is played a lot at at F1 Grand Prix for example) and I don't know how that could offend anyone.

I suspect the line "Deutschland Uber Alles," the anthem closely associated with Adolf Hitler" in that article would be pretty offensive to modern day Germans.

For further info on the anthem see here.
post #4 of 17
10/1/03 at 9:21am
Quote:
DALLAS -- A high school band director has apologized for a halftime performance that included "Deutschland Uber Alles," the anthem closely associated with Adolf Hitler, and a student running across the field with a Nazi flag.

Charles Grissom, Paris High School's band director, said his intention was to have a historical performance featuring the flags and music of the nations that fought during World War II.

The show, titled "Visions of World War II," nearly caused a melee at Friday night's football game at Dallas' Hillcrest High School.
Ooh my GAWD, I am rolling on the floor!!! That is HYSTERICAL!!! I can just see the band director: "Uh, gee... *scratching head* ... I didn't realize this might not come off so great... *scratching crotch*... uh....hmm...."

Holy cr@p, I may even have to send this guy a prize.
post #5 of 17
10/1/03 at 10:43am
that's pretty funny. i imagine most of the folks in attendance didn't even recognize it as the german national anthem unless it was announced. it's a Hadyn composition from the 1700s called the "emperor's hymn", probably most familiar to protestants in the stands as the hymn, "Glorious Things of Thee Are Spoken". my dh and i walked down the aisle to it, but had no nazi flags in the church !
post #6 of 17
10/1/03 at 5:56pm
Quote:
Originally posted by PinkSunfish
I suspect the line "Deutschland Uber Alles," the anthem closely associated with Adolf Hitler" in that article would be pretty offensive to modern day Germans.

For further info on the anthem see here.
post #7 of 17
10/2/03 at 1:13am
Geesh. It was a dramatic representation of events in history.

Most competitive marching bands choose peices or themes to tell a story, it is a lot more than fight songs and pep rallies.

I will say maybe they should not have used the nazi flag at the football game and saved it for competition but good grief.

There are so many threads here against censoring art and students.

They are telling a story.

I have seen National flags used several times and someone probably just ran across the field with that flag to indicate that that was the section of the peice dealing with the German role in the war. Other bands have done something similar when working with music from or about different nations.

Hunt For Red October is a damn cool peice of music and when one group began that peice the Russian flag was ran across the field. During the 1812 Overture another group ran the French flag across the field course the French flag was battered and bruised at the end.

It is a common practice that helps the audience with a visual representaion of the piece and what they are trying to portray. The Japanese flag was ran across as well as the French and American flags. It wasn't just the Nazi flag.

Yes, it is a horrifying image to see a Nazi flag but it was a peice about that part of history.
post #8 of 17
10/2/03 at 1:23am
Thread Starter 
So, is it too PC?
post #9 of 17
10/2/03 at 1:36am
Yes, they were being too PC IMO.

No one is offended by Nazi flags in plays, movies or anything else about that time period and there is no difference IMO.

Or was someone offended by the Nazi symbols in Schindler's List? Do you think they should not have had them anywhere in the movie?
post #10 of 17
10/2/03 at 2:31am
Yes, it is.

and no, it wasn't overly bright to use it at a football game.

I just think he might have not used it at the game and used it at the competition where it's use would be more understood not exactly appreciated but understood.
post #11 of 17
10/3/03 at 3:37am
Thread Starter 
I wonder what Rush would have said if he covered this football game?

And based on the new report on Arnold Schwartzeneggar..he would have also enjoyed the game.

I guess the music director was ahead of the curve.
post #12 of 17
10/7/03 at 9:09pm
Ah...did anyone else notice that this football game took place on Rosh Hashanah? I'll bet the band director didn't.
post #13 of 17
10/8/03 at 11:12am
Ok I'm certianlly not PC but to me it is pretty obvious that someone will be offended by this, or perhaps everyone. Maybe that was his point?!

First of all it is insensitive to Jews to stage this on Rosh Hashanah!

Not to mention the horror of memories that this could invoke in those that lived through the Nazi invasion.

I also suspect modern day Germans would be offended by the constant Nazi reminders and association of their National Athem with the Nazis.

I don't know, is the historical dramatization and artistic expression really worth it?
post #14 of 17
10/8/03 at 3:24pm
Thread Starter 
I don't know if I'm PC or not. And I don't have a loaded opinion about it one way or another...it just seems to me a lot of people go out of their way to be anti-PC because, well, I don't know...it might just have to remain a mystery to me. A lot like why people collect beanie babies is lost on me.

Anyway, for me there is something to be said about just good manners. I guess some people might say I'm too PC because I don't use the "N" word. well, then let me be PC and let them raise their children in an enviroment that celebrates free speech no matter what the words.

Anyway, I think this football entertainment was lacking in many, many ways. Certainly good taste.
post #15 of 17
10/8/03 at 10:22pm
I heard about that on the radio. I think the guy is just guilty of having poor taste.
post #16 of 17
10/8/03 at 10:57pm
Quote:
Originally posted by jeca
I heard about that on the radio. I think the guy is just guilty of having poor taste.
Bingo. And really, incredibly awful judgment.

I doubt he was even aware that a Jewish holiday was taking place, let alone which one it might have been.
post #17 of 17
10/10/03 at 1:08pm
Quote:
...it just seems to me a lot of people go out of their way to be anti-PC because, well, I don't know...it might just have to remain a mystery to me. A lot like why people collect beanie babies is lost on me.
me too!
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