pushing teenagehood younger and younger - Page 2

[rightkindofme]

Originally Posted by Calidris

I see this quite differently. Why should a 2 or 3 year old (or even 5 year old) have to wear shorts under her skirt? The obsession with someone seeing their panties seems to me to be part of the early sexualization of children. What difference is there if a preschooler flashed her panties or flashes a pair of shorts? There is nothing sexual about the butt of a child that age. There is no curve to the hips, no rounded butt. There is no difference between a girl of that age in her undies and a boy.
I was in primary school in the early 70s, and I remember my school skirts being very short, with no shorts underneath.

Heh. My mom wouldn't let me leave the house without bike shorts under my skirt till I was 17 and I pitched a fit.

But I've always been very fond of climbing trees.

[Calidris]

well somewhere in the preteen years, I see the "don't show everyone your panties" thing. When the body starts to develop, when there are the beginnings of curves, the preteen body becomes "disturbing" because it is potentially attractive, because it begins to look like a female body, but still very wrong, because it is still a child.

[FondestBianca]

Originally Posted by Calidris

I see this quite differently. Why should a 2 or 3 year old (or even 5 year old) have to wear shorts under her skirt? The obsession with someone seeing their panties seems to me to be part of the early sexualization of children. What difference is there if a preschooler flashed her panties or flashes a pair of shorts? There is nothing sexual about the butt of a child that age. There is no curve to the hips, no rounded butt. There is no difference between a girl of that age in her undies and a boy.
I was in primary school in the early 70s, and I remember my school skirts being very short, with no shorts underneath.

for me I think it's a safegaurd. Something we have to think about now with society being so different. I've been able to hear gradeschool age playground conversation when they didn't think I was paying attention. I think little girls shouldn't have to pay attention to the skirts but, when little boys are doing naughty things and teaseing (not your oldschool "I see Paris, I see France") in a very sexually aggressive way and older boys are paying WAY too much attention I'd rather limit my daughter a bit in order for her to be lees likely a target to these aggressive boys. Right now there is no threat but, once in school I can't be there nor expect 2 recess teachers to overhear conversations of 100 different students spread around a playground all at once.

Just a minute ago I read a post here about a little boy who got in trouble for aggressive sexual behavior against a little girl... on the playground. We can't completely insure these things won't happen in our kid's lifetime but, I think we can give them tips to being less vournable.

I lock my doors at night. I don't think I should have to. My house, my life, my right.... but, I lock them anyway. I can have all hope for society to turn around and talk all I want about how we need to take our inocense back but... I'm still going to lock my doors. For me there is a line to be drawn. I personally don't want to wait until a magical age when girls should keep their skirts down (6,7,8,9,10,11,12... whatever) to inforce that my daughter do her best to keep it down in public places. To me, not doing so would be like waiting to lock the doors of my house until the magical number of violent crimes happens in my town.

IDK, just me. I'm sure there are things other parents are more strict or limiting about that I am not. None of us are bad parents for it. It's all out of love and care for our kids. We don't need to judge other parents for a measure that is intended for safety and well being... no matter how confusing it sounds to us.

[KaraBoo]

sub (to come back later cuz I don't have time right now)

[SusanElizabeth]

This forum is the perfect example of "pushing teenagehood younger". There are very few places on the internet where parents of teenagers can talk, and this is one of the few. Some of the topics posted here are not concerned with teens or preteens but with pre-pre-teens.

[1growingsprout]

ITA, we dress modestly, and i am not looking forward to the day when my kids realize there are more clothing options then what I bring home for them

[karne]

Originally Posted by SusanElizabeth

This forum is the perfect example of "pushing teenagehood younger". There are very few places on the internet where parents of teenagers can talk, and this is one of the few. Some of the topics posted here are not concerned with teens or preteens but with pre-pre-teens.

I'm not sure whether you are thinking that this is good/bad or just an observation? My 2cents is that some of what I always thought would be pre-teen/teen behavior is happening a little earlier than expected. It's pretty different from what gets talked about on the early childhood boards. My pedi tells me that there are huge changes between 9-11, so I know this isn't all in my head. Rather I think I didn't know very much about the emotional development of kids at this age until I was in the thick of it. I'm not pushing it-it's here and I am so glad for the support here.

[UUMom]

Never mind. I feel like I live in a different planet. lol

[mommy68]

Originally Posted by FondestBianca

Heck, I'm even annoyed when I see skirts that don't have those built in shorts, in sizes for 2 to 6 year olds! Little girls don't know or aren't taught to keep their behinds out of public display and clothing companies must just think it's cute for 5 year old girls to be hanging upside down on the monkey bars at school showing their underwear to fellow students, recess aids, and passers by.

This is why I've always put shorts underneath a dress on my DD when she wears a dress. I get comments on this all the time about how smart I am for doing this.

ITA, we dress modestly, and i am not looking forward to the day when my kids realize there are more clothing options then what I bring home for them

I agree.

[BelovedK]

I am so freaking annoyed at the shorts under skirts rule because DD always loses the little shorts We have so many cute skirts that she can't wear.

I was just thinking the other day about how they do seem to be reaching adolescence earlier. I think it is partly due to the things they are exposed to, and partly because I have noticed that they are physically going through adolescence earlier.

The other day DD told me about a note a boy wrote about her, saying she was "hot and sexy" : she is 8!!!!! They are pairing up and some of them are kissing (?) DD loves Hannah Montana, and though she is a better role model, she is a teen, and DD acts like a little teen sometimes. I try to discourage that, but when I am not around and she is with her friends......

[the_lissa]

I agree with Calidris and Wonderwahine.

Just yesterday, my dd was wearing a dress and sometimes her underwear got flashed couple times on the monkey bars. No one batted an eye.

I don't think it has anything to do with sexual aggression or violence, and I am not going to be that responsibility on girls. That responsibility is squarely on those who are sexually violent or aggressive.

Anyways, I haven't found teenagedom being pushed younger since I was a teenager. While my kids are still young, I have cousins in grade 7 and 9, so I do have awareness of teenage culture currently.

[superstella]

Hmm, I remember getting in trouble in Kindergarten (at age 4) for kissing a boy during naptime! .

My kids vary in age from 18months to 16years. There are 5 of them, so I have a wide sample here. Just so you all know where I'm coming from.

As to the things in this forum being pre-pre-teen sometimes, well, sometimes they are but there really isn't a place where those things fit. Sometimes it's about an issue that doesn't pertain to "the childhood years" because it's more of a growing up problem. And yet, the child isn't a teen yet... so where does it belong? Where does that child belong?

My dd started developing breast buds at around age 9 (late) or 10 (early). She didn't want to wear a bra, but like Ruthla's dd was terribly terribly concerned that her nipples would show through her shirt. She still is (at 12). Now she wears a bra, tank, tee, and sweatshirt most days because she is mortified at the thought that someone might see her nipples through her shirt. And she hates it when I wear shirts without a padded bra, and she really, really hates it when I bf in public (well, not anymore but until very recently)!

I can also remember wanting the underoos because they were more "grown up" than the little girl bloomers and undershirts.

I can remember a particular picture I have of my little sister at about 8 in a midriff shirt and mini skirt, a la Madonna 80s lol.

I think perhaps the styles have changed but the underlying desire for children to grow up has not. I couldn't wait to grow up! My children are much the same. I agree with the pp who said that most kids could use a little more autonomy in regards to their lives and decision making. THere will be exceptions, of course, but most teens are capable of much more than we give them credit for.

[Arduinna]

8 and 9 year olds are 8 and 9 year olds. The issues are not the same as they are for teens. Or even 12 year olds for that matter. I think society has a freak out over the tiniest sign that a kid will become a teen and as a result pushes them into that group prematurely. The beginings of breast buds is easily addressed and is not inexplicably tied to the issues that teenagers have in life.

8 and 9 is 3rd and 4th grade for heavens sake. Yea to me that is definately still children and not preteen. Kids that age have very different needs than preteens and teens do and their should be different expectations but unfortunately for many parents their aren't which is why I started the thread.

[wonderwahine]

so when an 8 or 9yr ol starts talking about her freinds having sex or a whole host of other things we think of as only teen issues, what are you supposed to do, hang around with the moms of 6 and 7yr olds and ask their advice?

I dont think anyone is pushing anything, kids are just dealing with things at an earlier age now, and thats just reality.

[Arduinna]

I talked to my kid about puberty and sex, I certainly didn't wait till her friends were talking about it.

What did you do when it happened to you as a parent wonderwahine ?

[holyhelianthus]

Originally Posted by rhubarbarin

Personally I believe this extended childhood we force upon people in our society is what's unnatural. In the old days you were a woman once you got your period.. still in many societies girls are married and having babies at 13. While I don't think there's anything positive about that, I believe people over the age of 12 should have a LOT more autonomy then they are allowed.

I think teenagers today would be a lot less frustrated and rebellious if they had some control over their lives, instead of having no options until they are out of high school, and being called 'kids' until they were 25 years old.

Children that are even younger than that are capable of managing a lot of their own affairs if they are given the option. Not to say we should be shoving our kids out into the world to fend for themselves.. I'm just saying a lot of things need to change, and I think if they did, teens would step up and make important choices for themselves.

Of course I think most pop culture stuff is just awful, and no, pre-teens shouldn't be sexualized and spend all their time obessing about their looks.

ITA!

I am not a mom of teens but I have a little sister I am helping (14) and this has all been on my mind lately because of it. But I did want to talk about the bras- I was a C cup at 12 and could not find bras for myself anywhere! Now I see A cup 10 year old girls wearing majorly padded bras they found in the kids section

I know that's totally not the issue here but it popped into my head. Back to lurking I go!

[wonderwahine]

Originally Posted by Arduinna

I talked to my kid about puberty and sex, I certainly didn't wait till her friends were talking about it.

What did you do when it happened to you as a parent wonderwahine ?

where did i ever say anything about NOT teaching them? they are still going to talk to you (hopefully if they have a good realtionship with you that is) about their freinds, and those arnt exactly situations you can ask for advice from a mom of a 5 yr old. Or when your 9yr old has her period and developing breastbuds, moms of 7yr olds arnt going to have advice for you.

Parents of preteens and teens who have already been through that stage will.

I dont understand all this animosity towards parents of kids going through real issues coming in here and asking advice of moms who have BDTD. How are people ever going to learn and change their perspectives if people who have been through it already arnt willing to have them ask questions in "their area".

Plenty of moms who are pregnant come into the LWAB forum for advice, moms of babies come into the toddler forum, moms who arnt homeschooling yet ask for advice in the homeschooling forum, children progress at different paces and moms need help.

I find it rude for you to be discussing this topic, if you are so worried and annoyed at moms of 8/9/10yr olds coming in here, go find your own forum where you can control it with your own rules. I would much rather continue to make an atmoshpere where moms feel comfortable asking advice and comiseration if they need it.

[Arduinna]

Not sure where you are getting that, since that wasn't the purpose of the thread, if you read the OP. Someone else brought it up here.

[wonderwahine]

Originally Posted by Arduinna

Not sure where you are getting that, since that wasn't the purpose of the thread, if you read the OP. Someone else brought it up here.

and you agreed with it and carryed on the conversation, but should we just pretend that never happened?

[Arduinna]

I didn't say a thing about posting anywhere.

I talked about how IMO the issues of 8 year olds are different than preteens and teens. I think you need to reread exactly what I posted.