OK, so I've read a lot of the recommended books and authors, including Alfie Kohn, and have read a lot on here.
I like the idea of avoiding the use of punishments and rewards whenever possible. I love the concept of having a child's behavior motivated internally rather than being motivated by punishments or rewards. In theory, I like the idea of respecting everyone's needs and opinions and finding a balance that satisfies everyone.
But it seems that in giving up the use of consequences for behavior, there is very little motivation for a small child to actually do what they are asked to do, or even what has supposedly been agreed upon.
My 2-year-old doesn't really understand or care that sometimes she has to compromise and give up something she wants in order to find a solution that is mutually agreeable to everyone or takes someone else's needs into account. She is intrinsically egocentric by virtue of her age. She's not interested in sharing, and doesn't really care that hitting hurts people.
All three of my kids feel that they should be able to climb on the back of the couch and jump on the couch. Besides the safety issues, it's not even our couch. We're borrowing it from someone else, and it's important that we take good care of it.
We can talk about how "couches are for sitting and floors are for running and jumping" all day, but that doesn't convince the kids that they shouldn't run and jump on the couch. I can ask them to get down, and the older kids will get down, but the moment I'm not looking they're doing it again. The almost-3yo won't even get down when I ask her to, unless I physically make her. Then she'll be right back up again.
They simply feel that my request that they refrain from jumping and climbing on the couch is unreasonable.
I've explained why it's important to me, but they really don't care. They really don't believe me or care that it's not good for the couch. I have suggested other alternatives. We've talked about balancing everyone's needs and have tried to come up with ways to meet their needs in other ways besides using the couch as a jungle gym. We have a playset outside that they can climb on all they want. I helped them build a beautiful big blanket fort in the playroom so they don't have to use the couch cushions for a fort. I'm trying to find a way to meet their jumping needs in a reasonable way.
Even working out a solution that THEY agree to doesn't seem to work in the long term; they just decide that they don't like it or it no longer applies, and revert back to doing whatever they want.
The problem is that they aren't really willing to give weight to someone else's ideas or opinions. It doesn't matter whether it's my answering a question about how to pronouce a word or trying to explain why pushing someone off a stool is not ok; they just don't respect my word on things unless there is a reason that seems to make sense to them or a consequence they care about. I can use the dictionary to empirically prove to them that a word is pronounced the way I say it is, but I can't empirically prove to them that it's wrong to push someone off a stool.
They'll wear a helmet because they have to do it in order to ride bikes, not because they actually believe they could get seriously injured if they don't or because they agree it's a good idea. It's certainly not consensual. The consequence of refusing to wear a helmet is that that the bike gets put away.
It seems that giving up the use of rewards and consequences (or, even more, trying to do things consensually with small children) would just lead to kids with uncontrollable behavior, and who don't respect anyone else's needs or desires.
If there are no consequences for not respecting others' needs, and they are young enough that their own desires and opinions are more important to them than anyone else's, then how can they be kept from trampling all over someone else's boundaries unless there are consistent, clear consequences?
I like the idea of avoiding the use of punishments and rewards whenever possible. I love the concept of having a child's behavior motivated internally rather than being motivated by punishments or rewards. In theory, I like the idea of respecting everyone's needs and opinions and finding a balance that satisfies everyone.
But it seems that in giving up the use of consequences for behavior, there is very little motivation for a small child to actually do what they are asked to do, or even what has supposedly been agreed upon.
My 2-year-old doesn't really understand or care that sometimes she has to compromise and give up something she wants in order to find a solution that is mutually agreeable to everyone or takes someone else's needs into account. She is intrinsically egocentric by virtue of her age. She's not interested in sharing, and doesn't really care that hitting hurts people.
All three of my kids feel that they should be able to climb on the back of the couch and jump on the couch. Besides the safety issues, it's not even our couch. We're borrowing it from someone else, and it's important that we take good care of it.
We can talk about how "couches are for sitting and floors are for running and jumping" all day, but that doesn't convince the kids that they shouldn't run and jump on the couch. I can ask them to get down, and the older kids will get down, but the moment I'm not looking they're doing it again. The almost-3yo won't even get down when I ask her to, unless I physically make her. Then she'll be right back up again.
They simply feel that my request that they refrain from jumping and climbing on the couch is unreasonable.
I've explained why it's important to me, but they really don't care. They really don't believe me or care that it's not good for the couch. I have suggested other alternatives. We've talked about balancing everyone's needs and have tried to come up with ways to meet their needs in other ways besides using the couch as a jungle gym. We have a playset outside that they can climb on all they want. I helped them build a beautiful big blanket fort in the playroom so they don't have to use the couch cushions for a fort. I'm trying to find a way to meet their jumping needs in a reasonable way.
Even working out a solution that THEY agree to doesn't seem to work in the long term; they just decide that they don't like it or it no longer applies, and revert back to doing whatever they want.
The problem is that they aren't really willing to give weight to someone else's ideas or opinions. It doesn't matter whether it's my answering a question about how to pronouce a word or trying to explain why pushing someone off a stool is not ok; they just don't respect my word on things unless there is a reason that seems to make sense to them or a consequence they care about. I can use the dictionary to empirically prove to them that a word is pronounced the way I say it is, but I can't empirically prove to them that it's wrong to push someone off a stool.
They'll wear a helmet because they have to do it in order to ride bikes, not because they actually believe they could get seriously injured if they don't or because they agree it's a good idea. It's certainly not consensual. The consequence of refusing to wear a helmet is that that the bike gets put away.
It seems that giving up the use of rewards and consequences (or, even more, trying to do things consensually with small children) would just lead to kids with uncontrollable behavior, and who don't respect anyone else's needs or desires.
If there are no consequences for not respecting others' needs, and they are young enough that their own desires and opinions are more important to them than anyone else's, then how can they be kept from trampling all over someone else's boundaries unless there are consistent, clear consequences?
: to pretty much everything The4OfUs said.
I kind of think that, especially with young kids, they might possibly need to learn to stop hitting or jumping or whatever when asked to, first, and then understand the reasons later?
She was generally very rational, though...
and say matter of factly, "We need to take good care of this couch so no more jumping on it." And follow up with, "Come on, let's go jump on (whatever is acceptable)." or "how about playing in the yard instead?" or "Let's sit on the couch instead and we can have a story." or even, "dinner's almost ready anyway, so come on into the dining room." You know, the old redirect plan. And, if your two oldest jump down and wander off but the little one is paying you no heed, then this is where the pp's recommendation of 'enforce' comes into play. You take her hand and say, "Come on, you, that's bad for the couch so let's do something else instead," and take her to do something else.
Follow Mothering