Where do you draw the line between prudent and overprepared/underprepared? - Page 2

[madskye]

Just my opinion--

--before the lights go out, they will go dim. This isn't going to happen overnight. Peak oil means peak production has been reached and we're on the other side, not that tomorrow we'll wake up to no oil. There will be a period of adjustment. Someone mentioned gas rationing as a sign that we're going into The Long Emergency and I think that is accurate--we will see a lot of changes, but they will not all happen overnight. And the first changes will impact luxuries, not necessities.

--what's the line between prudent and overprepared? I don't think I would argue against filling your furnace or keeping extra food and water on hand, that sounds prudent. But the big picture is, if you don't own the land you are living on and our economy totally collapses and you can't pay your mortgage, the bank will still take your house and you will be out on the street with your stockpile of brown rice and water and 200 tubes of toothpaste! So you might want be less micro, and think about the overall security of owning something free and clear first--an acre and a trailer somewhere that no one can take from you would be a beautiful thing.

Did that freak you out more?!

I just bought a bike last week--it's a little thing, but I want to make riding it a part of my life and get strong! So in five or ten years riding a few miles into town is no big deal for me or anyone in my family.

[amyamanda]

Originally Posted by madskye

I don't think I would argue against filling your furnace or keeping extra food and water on hand, that sounds prudent. But the big picture is, if you don't own the land you are living on and our economy totally collapses and you can't pay your mortgage, the bank will still take your house and you will be out on the street with your stockpile of brown rice and water and 200 tubes of toothpaste! So you might want be less micro, and think about the overall security of owning something free and clear first--an acre and a trailer somewhere that no one can take from you would be a beautiful thing.

Did that freak you out more?

No, you didn't freak me out - our plan (which we came up with about three years ago) is to buy land and build mortgage-free, but we will have to sell our current (mortgaged) house first, and to do that we have to come up with the money and time to make necessary repairs and some essential improvements before it will be market-ready. We're working on it and targeting next spring for selling, but the market is falling so it may not work out. Maybe that is where some of my anxiety is coming from - we aren't "there" (meaning on our land, out from under our mortgage) yet. I don't like feeling unsettled. But that is a separate issue, I guess.

But you have a good point about focusing on the big picture, not just cheap toothpaste. I guess toothpaste feels like something DOable (and I only have six tubes in storage :roflmao )

jennlyn, your points are all good, and I'm thinking hard on them. Thanks.

[mamamelia]

But he thinks I'm in crisis mode all the time, before there is any crisis. I don't know, maybe he is right.

you're a mama and the mama bear instinct is coming out. don't be hard on yourself. it's not like you're trying to cause uneccessary worry and anxiety for the heck of it.

jenlynn makes some very good points too - mental preparation is very important. that's what i've always feared about stockpiling actually... what if the house burnt down - what would we do then? what if a group of armed men came into our home and told us to get out or else - again, what would all that stockpiling have done except set up someone else? we can control our home, but we can't control the public and thats my greatest fear. so i think i too, will add a mental note to myself - that mental preparation should be of utmost concern right now.

that said, you asked about gold and silver. well, i have a new goal and part of that goal was to acquire about 1lb of gold and silver (copper may be included in this list) - i guess i'd be happy with that. my dh also believes that i shouldn't go nuts on silver (he works with electronics [design] and says that while it is getting expensive its still very cheap and in adundance. he says copper and gold are the way to go).

[A&A]

Originally Posted by madskye

But the big picture is, if you don't own the land you are living on and our economy totally collapses and you can't pay your mortgage, the bank will still take your house and you will be out on the street with your stockpile of brown rice and water and 200 tubes of toothpaste!

If the economy "totally collapses," there won't be a bank to take your house. The bigger problem in that case would be rioters/looters/robbers trying to take the food you have stockpiled.

[p.s]

Originally Posted by A&A

If the economy "totally collapses," there won't be a bank to take your house.

and there will probably be plenty of warning. Bear Sterns is a good example.

[neetling]

:

[velochic]

Originally Posted by madskye

But the big picture is, if you don't own the land you are living on and our economy totally collapses and you can't pay your mortgage, the bank will still take your house and you will be out on the street with your stockpile of brown rice and water and 200 tubes of toothpaste! So you might want be less micro, and think about the overall security of owning something free and clear first--an acre and a trailer somewhere that no one can take from you would be a beautiful thing.

Did that freak you out more?!

I just bought a bike last week--it's a little thing, but I want to make riding it a part of my life and get strong! So in five or ten years riding a few miles into town is no big deal for me or anyone in my family.

You can own the land and still lose it through lack of paying property taxes... if the economy still has the infrastructure to follow through on something like that. I would worry less about losing a home and more about getting a family fed. That's not thinking "micro", it's thinking logically. A house isn't going to make a difference if you are hungry.

And I hate to tell you this, but being able to ride 5 or 10 miles into town isn't going to do you any good if the economy collapses because there won't BE anything in town. You'd be better off getting your back strong to till the land by hand. (Did that freak you out?)

[madskye]

Originally Posted by velochic

...

And I hate to tell you this, but being able to ride 5 or 10 miles into town isn't going to do you any good if the economy collapses because there won't BE anything in town. You'd be better off getting your back strong to till the land by hand. (Did that freak you out?)

Nah, not freaked out. I am getting my back strong by tending to my MASSIVE 7 x 20 garden this summer. :

I will work on implementing a specific LONG EMERGENCY workout for strength though. I'll post it once I work it up.

[velochic]

Originally Posted by madskye

Nah, not freaked out. I am getting my back strong by tending to my MASSIVE 7 x 20 garden this summer. :

I will work on implementing a specific LONG EMERGENCY workout for strength though. I'll post it once I work it up.

Make sure your work out includes working the calf muscles to run a trundle sewing machine, okay?

[bczmama]

For me, my prudent preparations for the future are as follows:

(1) Adequate life insurance, disability insurance, savings for college and retirement, appropriate wills and guardianship for kids. I think its important to plan first for the most likely scenario. Between the world as we know it ending versus dying in a car wreck, I'll choose preparing for the car wreck everytime.

(2) Easy access to cash -- I keep about $5,000 hidden in the freezer, at the bottom of a bag of frozen broccoli.

(3) Camping supplies -- we camp and those supplies also do double duty for us for possible emergency -- sleeping bags, lanterns, camping grill, etc.

(4) One month's supply of food, plus bottled water.

I'm definitely anti-hoarding. Maybe I don't know people who do it well, but it always seems so wasteful since things aren't used appropriately and then end up going bad or past their expiration date. My parents did a big buy of stuff in the aftermath of 9/11 and its still basically sitting in the basement. Not sure what you can really do with applesauce from '01....

[SAHDS]

Originally Posted by A&A

If the economy "totally collapses," there won't be a bank to take your house. The bigger problem in that case would be rioters/looters/robbers trying to take the food you have stockpiled.

That's my DH's thinking and he is more than prepared.

Will cash matter if the economy completely collapses? It's just useless paper, right?

[CameronsMama]

Originally Posted by bczmama

(2) Easy access to cash -- I keep about $5,000 hidden in the freezer, at the bottom of a bag of frozen broccoli.


.

Call me paranoid, but I wouldn't share this kind of thing on a public message board...

I'm definitely anti-hoarding. Maybe I don't know people who do it well, but it always seems so wasteful since things aren't used appropriately and then end up going bad or past their expiration date. My parents did a big buy of stuff in the aftermath of 9/11 and its still basically sitting in the basement. Not sure what you can really do with applesauce from '01...

Hoarding useless items is waasteful, but stockpiling items you will is not wasteful at all, and can actually help you save resources in the long run (ie if you buy on sale and stock up, you never run out and have to go pay full price so you save money in the long run, and if you always have food on hand, no gas wasting trips to the store last minute, etc). The key is stocking up on things you use. If you never eat canned tuna, buying 10 cans will be a total waste of money. If you use a can of tuna every week to eat tuna sandwiches, buying 10 or even more cans of tuna because it's on sale half off is a VERY wise move.

[Jilian]

I wasn't too freaked out until I read this thread. Now I'm nervous. I've just been stocking up on foods as they go on sale. We've been stocking our deep freezer with sale meats. Mainly because prices are so high that I want to take advantage of good deals. I don't usually buy more than a few weeks worth of food at a time. We are conserving gas by driving less and cutting bills. We're also paying off all debt and building a bigger emergency fund. I'd ideally like to become more green but we don't own our house so we aren't in a position to be installing solar panels or anything.

I guess part of me just believes that worrying is just praying for what you don't want. I feel that if the S*** does hit the fan we will work through it and find a way. We are gardening and learning to make most things from scratch - like bread. I'm stoking up on baking supplies before the prices get too ridiculous. We're also looking to trade in our minivan for a smaller, more fuel efficient vehicle with lower payments.

[A&A]

Originally Posted by SAHDS

That's my DH's thinking and he is more than prepared.

Will cash matter if the economy completely collapses? It's just useless paper, right?

Depends on the extent of the collapse. In the Great Depression, for example, 1/2 of the banks in the US. failed but cash was still very useful.

I expect that silver and gold will hold their value longer than cash.

Also some people are currently choosing to turn dollars into useful goods--whether that is a wood stove, gardening tools, food storage, etc.

[A&A]

Originally Posted by CameronsMama

Call me paranoid, but I wouldn't share this kind of thing on a public message board...

Totally. Plus I think the extreme temperature of the freezer would wear down dollar bills.

[A&A]

Originally Posted by Jilian

I guess part of me just believes that worrying is just praying for what you don't want.

Sounds like you've been reading The Secret.


Don't worry, stress, or obsess, but prepare.

"Hope for the best but prepare for the worst."

Example..........you go on a road trip. Is bringing along a tire jack and a spare tire just "praying for what you don't want," or is it merely being prudent and prepared?

[WeasleyMum]

Originally Posted by bczmama

(2) Easy access to cash -- I keep about $5,000 hidden in the freezer, at the bottom of a bag of frozen broccoli.
..

See, now you'll have to move it somewhere else, since we all know about the Mad Broccoli Stash.

[Jilian]

Originally Posted by A&A

Sounds like you've been reading The Secret.

I heard it from the author of "Crazy sexy cancer" on Oprah the other day and it really rang true for me. I get what you're saying about being prepared and I will prepare a little bit but I'm working at not stressing about things that I cannot control.

[zoe196]

Learning how to grow (and preserve) food and live as self sufficently as possible-- I'm spending a lot of time researching all aspects of that on the internet while there still is an internet!

learning about raising livestock/ spinning wool/ knitting

Learning to live with less, stepping away from the consumerist mentality and becoming more frugal and innovative.

I hope before things get too bad to be living off the grid with like-minded people; somewhere rural and have plently of knowledge and resources/supplies.

Strenghtening my body so that I can work the land/ build a cob house/ walk long distances

One thing that concerns me is the looting mentality-- Katerina shed light on how humans can act when law and order go out the window--I will seriously consider getting and learning to use a firearm. (can't believe I just typed
that!)

My feeling at the moment is that it's not going to change overnight but I think things will get steadily worse. It is my deepest wish to be able to provide my son and any future children I may have with a quality of life that is thriving and not just surviving--no matter what changes are around the corner-- I definantly feel I have to do the above and more to prepare myself for that.

Thanks OP and all-- interesting thread!

Zoe, mama to Thomas 01-06

[Bad Horse]

Originally Posted by velochic

And I hate to tell you this, but being able to ride 5 or 10 miles into town isn't going to do you any good if the economy collapses because there won't BE anything in town. You'd be better off getting your back strong to till the land by hand. (Did that freak you out?)

What are your thoughts on this, in a little more detail if you don't mind? Interested in different perspectives regarding outcomes of economic collapse.

My thoughts are that after the bottom fall out with PO and the economy we will see micro communities whether it be in the city, suburb, or rural areas. I think each community will be much more self sufficient, and will have a variation of those who can contribute in different ways. Sizes of what small villages were way back when. The type where there was the every so often a run into the larger towns for certain supplies, done by someone for the entire village. But you know, in an old diesel converted to biofuel pick up rather than a carriage in most instances. Or perhaps even just carpooling once a month with other in the community depending on the severity of where things are.

I personally think there will be still be some infrastructure to larger cities and towns, and that in all likelihood something will still exist like a big box store that will act as a general store for many of those things. It may very well still be Wal Mart, but not as filled with cheap imports from China and plastics, but providing fabrics and notions, home improvement items like nails and what not, some clothing, like socks and underwear.

I don't see the absolute downfall of the industrial revolution, though I think things will be vastly different.

What's your take on it?

(GOSH! I LOVE these types of conversations!! <3 MDC!)