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post #101 of 133
Quote:
Originally Posted by Garden~Lover View Post
interesting. I do think it is unfair to think everyone mom (or 1 parent) be a SAHP. I always call myself a sahm, even though im not. I work at night after dh gets home, I have done this for as long as ive been a mom. (which is a long time). I feel very lucky that I am able to be home for my babies and preschoolers, so they are not in day care not that we could afford that anyways. I have to work, I dont think I could be home everyday without ever leaving LOL. I know I get looked down on by my bils and sils, b.c they all work , their kids are all in day care, they all have $50K-$70K a year jobs, my measly little job pays a step up from min wage, but oh well, it pays the bills, I only have to work part time. This works for us, I cant tell you though how many times I get the "OMG how do you do that, your dh must be so deprived ? that sounds awful. " What ever.
No one is saying that everyone should be a stay at home parent. This thread is like a game of telephone, everyone is reading it and reading what applies to them even if it doesn't apply to them.
post #102 of 133
Quote:
Originally Posted by katheek77 View Post
There are families who have made significant "sacrifices" so one parent can stay at home.

There are families who are able to have one parent stay at home without significant sacrifice.

There are families who choose to have one parent stay at home for emotional/personal reasons.

There are families who have both parents work so that they can enjoy the "luxuries" of life.

There are families who have both parents working purely so that they can make ends meet.

There are families who choose to have both parents working for emotional/personal reasons.

There are families who do/have done a combo of all of the above to adapt to their particular station in life.

My needs are not your needs. My luxuries are not your luxuries. My sacrifices are not your sacrifices. My situation is not your situation. But, at the end of the day, we are probably doing what we feel is best, overall, for our family.

Very well said!! Now I know why you're one of my favorite coop particpants!
post #103 of 133
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sonnenwende View Post
That is where you are wrong:



You seem to believe that whatever it is that is stopping one parent from staying at home must be frivolous and easily done away with. Even if you have since reversed your stance on the issue, that flippant remark was fairly annoying to people who just can`t stop working. I really don`t know why you created this thread in the first place You are only one job loss away from being thrown back into the workplace.
Then why are you responding??

Instead of pointing fingers and telling the OP how wrong she is, can we support one another?? Maybe she needs a pat on the back or knowledge (for whatever reason) that she is doing the right thing. We all need that from time to time. If someone said to me, I wish I could stay home, I would try to do the same thing as the op. I would also add, it may not be possible.
And dont know how telling someone you're only one job loss away from being thrown into the workplace helps matters. We are all - working and non working employed parents as well as anyone one step away from being thrown in the fire. It could be a levee breaking near your home, your child getting sick, a spouse or someone close to you suddenly loosing their life. Get it?
post #104 of 133
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by hookahgirl View Post
So you wouldnt even be one of those people she would have said the quote too. So dont worry about it, the OP was saying she was trying to force eveyone to live her life style, just that if they thought she was lucky, they could always try to figure out a way to stay home.
Quote:
Originally Posted by monkey's mom View Post
Is anyone saying that, though? I thought she said that when people resond with, "You're so lucky....I wish I could do that." I wouldn't be at all offended if a working mama said that to me if I had expressed interest or envy for her situation. That seems like a logical response. What are ya gonna say, "Yeah, too bad you could never do what I'm doing. Sucks to be you."

And really, aren't we all one disaster away from huge life-altering changes. Why do we need to keep pointing that out? It seems so mean-spirited. I don't know...Can you imagine if someone posted that they saved and scrimped to buy a house and folks said, "Yeah, well....one flood or tornado and you can kiss that sucker goodbye."
Quote:
Originally Posted by SarahGuinn View Post
She is telling this to people who want to be able to do it too, she's not running wild eyed through corporate picnics and grabbing women with childbearing hips and telling them to get home to their mayun and their baybees because it's the right thing to do.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Amys1st View Post
Then why are you responding??

Instead of pointing fingers and telling the OP how wrong she is, can we support one another?? Maybe she needs a pat on the back or knowledge (for whatever reason) that she is doing the right thing. We all need that from time to time. If someone said to me, I wish I could stay home, I would try to do the same thing as the op. I would also add, it may not be possible.
And dont know how telling someone you're only one job loss away from being thrown into the workplace helps matters. We are all - working and non working employed parents as well as anyone one step away from being thrown in the fire. It could be a levee breaking near your home, your child getting sick, a spouse or someone close to you suddenly loosing their life. Get it?
Thanks for the support ladies! It was getting exhausting repeating and over clarifying for 5 pages of comments!
Sarah Guinn, your's made me actually laugh out loud!
post #105 of 133
Quote:
Originally Posted by GoddessKristie View Post
Thanks for the support ladies! It was getting exhausting repeating and over clarifying for 5 pages of comments!
Sarah Guinn, your's made me actually laugh out loud!
And she made me LOL too!
post #106 of 133
Quote:
Originally Posted by tumblingstar View Post
What I think is funny about all that's going on this thread is that the OP just wanted to share some warm fuzzies about her particular situation and people started throwing stones! If you're not willing to share her warm fuzzies, just move on, no need to post. But I am willing to share in the warm fuzzies. I am SAHM too who also likes the F&F forum. We are extremely frugal in order to do this for our family. Good for you mama, keep up the good work!
: Although I wouldn't say we live on one income because my husband works more than one job to support us, but otherwise I agree totally.
post #107 of 133
Quote:
Originally Posted by GoddessKristie View Post
my whole family was around the table talking about the economy and how times have changed over the course of our lives. My dad says: "I don't know anyone who can make it with only one spouse working. You just can't do that anymore."
I don't know whether this was previously addressed, but this has bothered me about the original post. Why did her father say, "I don't know anyone who can make it with only one spouse working." He obviously knows that his daughter is doing that, and he can see what their lifestyle is like. What was he really trying to say and why would he say that? It seems bizarre to me. Is the OP asking her father for money? Or does he think they are living in some poverty-stricken way that he doesn't understand?
post #108 of 133
Quote:
Originally Posted by GoddessKristie View Post
(Caps for emphasis, not to indicate yelling or anger )
FOR THE THIRD TIME: I DID NOT SAY IT'S POSSIBLE FOR EVERYONE. MY HUSBAND SAID THAT AND I ONLY REPEATED IT TO SHOW THAT HE DOES NOT FEEL DEPRIVED.
PLEASE, check your feelings and be sure you understand the post, and have read everything before you get angry with me!





I did not think this off topic at all!
JMO: I think your OP was a little "off" from your intent which is why some posters are disagreeing.

However, you have clarified numerous times that you truly meant and you shouldn't worry about it anymore.
post #109 of 133
Way to go! Doesn't feel good to have your choices and sacrifices work out the way you want? I wish that everyone could have the blessing of choosing how they want to live. We do (with a lot of sacrifice) and I am immensely grateful and proud.
BTW, kudos to you for keeping cool as you clarified your original message. It's easy to get defensive. I'm impressed. Good luck!
post #110 of 133
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by SusanElizabeth View Post
I don't know whether this was previously addressed, but this has bothered me about the original post. Why did her father say, "I don't know anyone who can make it with only one spouse working." He obviously knows that his daughter is doing that, and he can see what their lifestyle is like. What was he really trying to say and why would he say that? It seems bizarre to me. Is the OP asking her father for money? Or does he think they are living in some poverty-stricken way that he doesn't understand?
I think I did adress this earlier, but I don't mind addressing again
My father simply forgot that we only had one income. It was obvious that he didn't think people could make it on one income and live a "decent" life. We most certainly have a wonderful life and look very average, I think. So, if you're imagining that people on one income must be poverty stricken, we don't fit that idea.
The conversation was just about the economy in general, cost of living type stuff and my entire family was sitting around the table. I am the only SAHP in my family, so with 10 of us around the table and me fitting right in with everyone else, it's probably easy to forget.
There was certainly no underlying meaning , and I most certainly wasn't asking him for money.
When I corrected him and said "Josh and I do it." He got a bit flustered, then said "well, I don't know anyone else who is doing it." Which may be right, I only know a few IRL.
post #111 of 133
Quote:
Originally Posted by SusanElizabeth View Post
I don't know whether this was previously addressed, but this has bothered me about the original post. Why did her father say, "I don't know anyone who can make it with only one spouse working." He obviously knows that his daughter is doing that, and he can see what their lifestyle is like. What was he really trying to say and why would he say that? It seems bizarre to me. Is the OP asking her father for money? Or does he think they are living in some poverty-stricken way that he doesn't understand?
My gosh, people are so nick picky on everything. He could just be refering to the rest of the people he know and just not thinking of his daughter. People say stuff even knowing what other situations is sometimes. People I meet - "do you SAH w/ him".
me: 'YES I do'.
Them: "People cannot afford that anymore, these days you need two income to survive'

ALL of this before I tell them I WAH PT(then they like, ohhh that's why). I WAH PT but live on one DH income because I don't know how long my job will last. People sometimes say stuff even though they know you are doing it, it is just a general statement at times.
post #112 of 133
Quote:
Originally Posted by GoddessKristie View Post
When did "you can do it!" become a bad thing to say to people??
: :


Quote:
Originally Posted by Belleweather View Post
It's not the "You can do it!", it's saying "you can do it!" here. Let's be honest with ourselves -- people who are on MDC have really all thought this one through and arrived at where they are on the SAH/WOH spectrum because it's the best place for their family at this point in time. If your justification for starting this sort of thread is to get people to take an honest look at their situations, you're really preaching to the choir. Which isn't wrong per se, but you picked an unspeakably touchy subject to start preaching about.

Also, as far as smug SAHMs talking about how much they've sacrificed so they can stay home and how "worth it" it all is, I'm going to put in for a medal -- we don't have cable, cell phones, new cars, eating out or spontaneous trips, and I STILL work outside the home because that's what it takes to make ends meet. I pump BM to feed the littlest ones, earn a paycheck for the groceries and garden for the veggies, so if you want to talk about the "sacrifice-for-the-family" olympics, perhaps you're not such a shoo-in for the gold after all? (Honestly, I believe every mother deserves the gold, and it's not a race. But the smugness gets to me sometimes, you know?)
isee you addressed this already but the op was not going around telling this to other mdc-ers, but to people irl. people who i assume she knows to some extent.
post #113 of 133
It seems clear to me that the heated responses are the result of some posters feeling that they *already* make the sacrifices the OP detailed in her original post, and are yet still unable to make it on one income. I know, because I fall into that same boat - my family does all the things the OP described (except that we currently do not have a LO in diapers, and we NEVER take vacations, except ones that are free, i.e., to my parents' lake house where everything but the gas money to get there is paid for), and then some.

We still could not make it on my DH's salary alone. Even subtracting the portion of my salary that results from working (child care, one extra car, the occasional need to purchase additional convenience foods, etc.), my salary goes partly to cover things like groceries and our (modest) mortgage. It also covers our health insurance, except for $250 per month which we pay out of pocket. I can't imagine having to live on his salary alone (we could not - it is not enough to cover basics like mortgage, taxes, food) and then have to find a way to pay for health insurance on top of it.

It's really hard to hear how others are making ends meet on one income, when you want that for yourself so badly, and then not to feel defensive.

That said, I love this forum - a source of wonderful ideas and inspiration! - and I am delighted for the OP that she is able to scale back, derive pleasure from her lifestyle, find support from her DH, not feel deprived, and most of all, be content in her frugality. I was not offended by the post, but admit that it made me feel a little defensive in regard to my own situation. I think that same defensiveness accounts for a good number of the posts we saw in this thread. I'm hoping the OP can take that into account (and kudos, OP to you for remaining calm and for not getting too defensive!) in thinking about why some posters may have seemed hostile or judgmental.

I, too, am still giggling at the comment about the corporate picnics and grabbing women by their childbearing hips.
post #114 of 133
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by PennyRoo View Post
It seems clear to me that the heated responses are the result of some posters feeling that they *already* make the sacrifices the OP detailed in her original post, and are yet still unable to make it on one income. I know, because I fall into that same boat - my family does all the things the OP described (except that we currently do not have a LO in diapers, and we NEVER take vacations, except ones that are free, i.e., to my parents' lake house where everything but the gas money to get there is paid for), and then some.

We still could not make it on my DH's salary alone. Even subtracting the portion of my salary that results from working (child care, one extra car, the occasional need to purchase additional convenience foods, etc.), my salary goes partly to cover things like groceries and our (modest) mortgage. It also covers our health insurance, except for $250 per month which we pay out of pocket. I can't imagine having to live on his salary alone (we could not - it is not enough to cover basics like mortgage, taxes, food) and then have to find a way to pay for health insurance on top of it.

It's really hard to hear how others are making ends meet on one income, when you want that for yourself so badly, and then not to feel defensive.

That said, I love this forum - a source of wonderful ideas and inspiration! - and I am delighted for the OP that she is able to scale back, derive pleasure from her lifestyle, find support from her DH, not feel deprived, and most of all, be content in her frugality. I was not offended by the post, but admit that it made me feel a little defensive in regard to my own situation. I think that same defensiveness accounts for a good number of the posts we saw in this thread. I'm hoping the OP can take that into account (and kudos, OP to you for remaining calm and for not getting too defensive!) in thinking about why some posters may have seemed hostile or judgmental.

I, too, am still giggling at the comment about the corporate picnics and grabbing women by their childbearing hips.
I really appreciate this comment. Thank you for giving some insight into your situation and what might be going on with the others who've taken so much offense to my post. I realize I may have come off as gloating, and if someone were wishing they were in my position, but unable to be for some reason I understand that could be upsetting to read. I know everyones situation is different and I hope everyone who's gotten upset at my post understands that I am very thankful for our situation and that I know it could change at any moment. We don't take a minute of it for granted.
post #115 of 133
hmm... it's been interesting reading what everyone has to say. I had read the first couple of posts and didn't plan to look again, but then saw WOW 6 pages, so thought I'd have another looksee.
Quote:
Originally Posted by GoddessKristie View Post
I guess it's time to update my stats! Hamilton county's median income is around $82,000 putting it closer to 14th according to Forbes.com
I guess the median income for a household was around $71k and for a family $80-82k (dep on where in the wiki article you look). It looks like the median male income is about $56k.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hamilton_County,_Indiana

I was curious about COL since I'd never heard of Hamilton County, and it looks like in '99 that COL was very average, or actually cheaper than average.. 99.9. http://allcountries.org/uscensus/771...ropolitan.html
Housing is usually the biggest expense monthly. But since you could buy a house with less than a year's salary in Noblesville, better to just save for one year and pay cash.
(check out NYC!)

I don't know if COL has changed much, but looking on realtor.com (in the past 30 min), looks like the cheapest property you can buy is a house... for $34,900!
Here is a cute house for just a bit more, in Noblesville, the county seat:
http://www.realtor.com/search/listin...cnt=763#Detail
Which means the median household could buy a house and pay if off in a year... if they were frugal.

I grew up in Fairfax County, and am familiar with its high cost of living. here are two starter homes in the cities my parents chose to locate:
http://www.realtor.com/search/search...id=13985&typ=7 (the first property listed)
the first houses:
http://www.realtor.com/search/listin...cnt=819#Detail
http://www.realtor.com/search/listin...cnt=333#Detail

So if someone said, my dh makes $40k/y and we live on one income in McLean, VA, I would be interested in how they did it.
If someone said, my dh makes $100k, and we live on one income, no big whoop (Hamilton County or Fairfax). If you lived anywhere in the US, and lived on $20k, I've be interested in your story. The numbers really matter (but really shouldn't be disclosed on public forums).
post #116 of 133
Thread Starter 
I will say that my husband doesn't make anywhere near the meadian male income you posted. Not even close!! I guess that doesn't make us the average American family I thought we were.
We also do not live in Hamilton county (DH doesn't work there either), as I said earlier we moved to a neighboring county where the cost of a home is lower (our home would have cost 2.5 times what we paid if we lived 10 miles from here). The only reason I referenced it was to say that we moved from there so that we could live more easily on one income.

My intentions with this post were also not to say that we are better than the average person or that we have done something miraculous. We decided our values early and have lived by them, there's nothing magical about that. I don't even find our position impressive which is why I was so surprised that other people do.

ETA: That home looks cute in the picture, but I guarantee it is not cute in person. There is something seriously wrong with that home or it would not be selling for such a low price. We shopped for homes for almost a year in Hamilton County, so I feel a bit experienced in that department. Notice there are no pictures of the inside, that the railing on the porch is falling off indicating delapidation. It's also in the worst part of town very near a factory that I can't even stand to drive by because of the horrible stench. It's bank owned and has been split into a duplex. It's not even on one fifth of an acre. Not such a good deal when you know all the facts.
post #117 of 133
Quote:
Originally Posted by GoddessKristie View Post
I will say that my husband doesn't make anywhere near the meadian male income you posted. Not even close!! I guess that doesn't make us the average American family I thought we were.
dunno, I quoted the median male income for Hamilton County. Hamilton being the most affluent ( and fastest growing), would presumably have a higher median than any other county in IN. If you don't live in Hamilton, then your dh may very well have a close to median income.
Also average is different from median.
Median American household income looks like about $48k in '06. Significantly, the mean income per American household member in '06 was approx $26k. i don't see on there what is the median household income of one income only families.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Househo..._United_States

I don't doubt your assessment of the cute yellow house in Noblesville. My point was, in McLean, VA $51k wouldn't even buy you a parking lot space. eh, I actually know the area of that $279k home in Falls Church too. In a not too great part of town. pretty ugly pic too. But there you pay $279k vs. $51k. A "decent" home will cost you probably $500k, just as $150k could probably get you a decent home in Noblesville.
post #118 of 133
Thread Starter 
I really do not want this to turn into Hamilton County, IN vs McLean, VA. I never said it was the most expensive place to live, why are you trying to turn that into a discussion? There are certainly more expensive places to live and certainly cheaper. This is not the point of this thread!

By the way median income for males in McLean VA is $93,065 according to wikipedia. That's a vast difference from the $56 you quoted for Hamilton County and may put some perspective on it.
post #119 of 133
Quote:
Originally Posted by GoddessKristie View Post
I really do not want this to turn into Hamilton County, IN vs McLean, VA. I never said it was the most expensive place to live, why are you trying to turn that into a discussion?
Hmmm? i was in no way trying to derail your OP into a place A vs. place B?
Just making another point in the SAH discussion. Relevant I thought, but forgive me if not or if i did not make the relevance clear, as this is your thread.
I thought this was a thread for discussion on a forum,
but if only for self congratulatory posts, I'll politely bid my leave.
post #120 of 133
Thread Starter 
I don't mean to be snarky, but the intention of the thread was general discussion about perception of a one income family and the real needs of a family vs the elevated standard of living many people have.
We could spend all week comparing different locations and the cost of living and median incomes etc and never get anywhere. I just didn't want things to get too specific about any location in particular. I'm sure there are places that it's easier to make it on one income than others, and I believe that's been addressed here. In fact, as I said previously, that's why we moved one county over it's easier here.
Please don't have any hard feelings and I'm truly sorry if I stepped on your toes.
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