Go see Wall-E. - Page 4

[BananaBreadGirl]

Originally Posted by A&A

Well, since we're talking "English class," I'll compare it to books. There should certainly be some overlap with what the author intended and what the reader gets out of it, but above and beyond that, what the reader finds in the book is just as important as what the author meant to put there. It's an interactive process. The same is true of movies.
And, just as importantly, creating anything is a subconscious as well as a conscious process; so sometimes a work of art (book, movie, etc.) has more of what the creator's subconscious mind wanted to put in there than what his/her conscious mind wanted to put there, and that's what viewers/readers pick up on.

In short, the message matters, even if it wasn't originally the intended message.

You're right, everyone notices/enjoys/learns different things from a book or movie. And while I guess I trust the director (I'm not feeling cynical today, else maybe I wouldn't) that the ecological message was at least not the main one he was going for, I think he may be exaggerating his "surprise" that so many people are taking that away from the movie. I don't really see how he could not see that coming.

[Princess ConsuelaB]

We took our girls to see this yesterday and we all loved it : My six year old had no problem sitting through or following it. We liked the love story, we liked the ecological message, we liked the resiliency of humankind theme, and (because we are a "stuck-barely-making-a-paycheck-from-Walmart" while trying to convince their patrons not to shop there family) we enjoyed the whole "Buy-N-Large" overtone. Besides, we also liked the cute lil' robots...because sometimes you just have to take things for what they are. It was an enjoyable movie

I agree about the message being lost in the merchandising but sadly while Pixar has creative control, Disney is still the "money" so I guess it's to be expected.

[Penelope]

I'm just skimming the posts here, but honestly - I won't recommend it to anyone because of the sizeist imagery. It made me really sad and angry that the laziness and herd mentality of the humans was depicted by making every one of them large. It's just cheap and nasty, imo.

The scene where the man falls out of his little scooter and flails around, unable to get up, was just cringeworthy. I get the more complicated message, but I'm not sure that most kids will be able to pick up on the nuances - there was only one brief scene where the zero-gravity environment was offered as an explanation for the body types, and it was played for laughs.

The other aspects of the movie were charming, and it was well-done, but I'd hate to be an overweight child, or a child with an overweight loved one, watching that movie.

[Alexe]

Originally Posted by mom2snugbugs

During about the first 30 min. of this movie I said to DH- "This is the worst movie EVER." But that changed to- "This is the BEST movie ever." I recommend you go and watch it again, and wait till the end. I think you will be pleasantly surprised.

I said that with Pixar's Cars, the first minutes of the film were amazing animation but I wondered where the heart was. I have never been disappointed with any of [Pixar's] movies in the end, and they remain some of our favourites

Can't wait to see Wall-E!

[A&A]

post contains spoilers

Originally Posted by Penelope

I'm just skimming the posts here, but honestly - I won't recommend it to anyone because of the sizeist imagery. It made me really sad and angry that the laziness and herd mentality of the humans was depicted by making every one of them large. It's just cheap and nasty, imo.

OBVIOUSLY not everyone who is large sits around all day, but pretty much everyone who sits around 24-7 (and eats processed food) WILL get large. It happens.

They were abused by the society/culture in which they live. FROM BABIES, they didn't know that they could get off the chair. BUT they broke free! And changed their lives!

[daisymama12]

I want to preface this by saying we liked the movie a lot.

But about the sizeist imagery; I don't think people who sit around all day would necessarily be fat. Think of all the thin people you see in wheelchairs. I know lots of people who eat processed food all the time and are thin/average.

It did make me feel uncomfortable. I try to explain to my kids that we try to eat well and use our bodies to stay strong and fit. Not to stay thin...

Interesting points...

[tanya1976]

Originally Posted by Penelope

I'm just skimming the posts here, but honestly - I won't recommend it to anyone because of the sizeist imagery. It made me really sad and angry that the laziness and herd mentality of the humans was depicted by making every one of them large. It's just cheap and nasty, imo.

The scene where the man falls out of his little scooter and flails around, unable to get up, was just cringeworthy. I get the more complicated message, but I'm not sure that most kids will be able to pick up on the nuances - there was only one brief scene where the zero-gravity environment was offered as an explanation for the body types, and it was played for laughs.

The other aspects of the movie were charming, and it was well-done, but I'd hate to be an overweight child, or a child with an overweight loved one, watching that movie.

Unfortunately, childhood obesity is running rampant. Medical conditions isn't the culprit, primarily. Lack of exercise and a good diet are the reasons. It may make you uncomfortable. But, imagine how I feel when I have students much younger than me weighing much more than me, not due to illness or disorders, but not from an healthy lifestyle.

[channelofpeace]

Originally Posted by tanya1976

Unfortunately, childhood obesity is running rampant. Medical conditions isn't the culprit, primarily. Lack of exercise and a good diet are the reasons. It may make you uncomfortable. But, imagine how I feel when I have students much younger than me weighing much more than me, not due to illness or disorders, but not from an healthy lifestyle.

And the reasons you listed may be so, but that is primarily because they have grown up in an environment with poor eating habits and little exercise (which is mostly out of their control). Does that make it right to put stereotypical images of obese people in a kid's movie? Because honestly, they probably have low enough self-esteem if they are obese (not matter what the reason), so why not throw a jab in a make it a little worse? Not cool in my eyes. Adult movie, fine, they get the subtlety and nuaces. Kid's movie, poor choice.

[A&A]

Originally Posted by milkydoula

And the reasons you listed may be so, but that is primarily because they have grown up in an environment with poor eating habits and little exercise (which is mostly out of their control). Does that make it right to put stereotypical images of obese people in a kid's movie? Because honestly, they probably have low enough self-esteem if they are obese (not matter what the reason), so why not throw a jab in a make it a little worse? Not cool in my eyes. Adult movie, fine, they get the subtlety and nuaces. Kid's movie, poor choice.

Did you stay and watch the ending? Where they threw off the establishment, got out of their chairs, and changed their lives? Therefore, it isn't "stereotypical."

[BookGoddess]

I went because I heard the hype. While it was entertaining it's not one of those movies I'm going to add to our home DVD collection like we did with The Incredibles, Nemo, and Ratatouille. There's a strong political commentary in the film. Perhaps too strong of an environmental message. And this is coming from someone who thinks we are trashing the earth and our bodies. For me there was something lacking in the story. Wall-E is cute enough but I expected something more to the story than there was. There were too many chase scenes and the middle dragged on.

[Pinoikoi]

Originally Posted by daisymama12

I want to preface this by saying we liked the movie a lot.

But about the sizeist imagery; I don't think people who sit around all day would necessarily be fat. Think of all the thin people you see in wheelchairs. I know lots of people who eat processed food all the time and are thin/average.

It did make me feel uncomfortable. I try to explain to my kids that we try to eat well and use our bodies to stay strong and fit. Not to stay thin...

Interesting points...

I am not sure if there had been ANY average size people on board the ship that the plot would have been as believable as it was. I would have chalked an average person up to "token" average person plugged in just to make people happy with the film rather than anything that had to do remotely to the plot. My kids didn't really see them as being REALLY fat anyway- my adopted ds is shaped like that and he is NOT obese in anyway- his bones are short and thickly formed (dwarflike tendencies). So for us, the fact that there were many people shaped that way pushed forth the fact that these people did not exercise, whereas one or two people shaped like that would have made no impression on us at all- that's "normal". This society had been so FED a certain mindset by their "government" that certain changes were inevitable on them as a whole.

I did question the baby scene though. If the premise was that these people really lacked the ability to do anything for themselves then where did the babies come from? Artificial insemination? All of them?

That said, I really liked the film. I loved the anti-consumerism, "Where ARE those biologics, anyway?" themes- even if they weren't intentional. Sci-fi is about setting up a plausible, if different realm, and a coordinating society. I am brushing up on the genre this summer (in hopes of teaching it in the fall) and I would definitely buy the DVD (when IS it released, anyway?) with the intentions of sharing it with my class and having a discussion about the correlation between planet structure/society/government/ideals, etc.

My kids loved the film, my 5yo wanted to see it for his birthday and we are moving away from material based parties to more activity based (the theater didn't hand out any "crap" when we saw it, but we weren't there opening night- so who knows?). There were slow parts, but I also had a 3yo and 4yo with me that stayed awake the WHOLE TIME and that never happens with them in a movie theatre. I felt the little dialog was actually helpful for letting little people understand the overt and "covert?" themes. My little guys have trouble understanding why we buy less, redo and reuse as much as we do, but the movie SHOWED them in a way that I really couldn't have done on my own.:

[shaywyn]

Originally Posted by Penelope

there was only one brief scene where the zero-gravity environment was offered as an explanation for the body types

The whole "super size" everything brainwashing, food, drinks, etc. was part of the explanation. It started on earth, caused all that garbage, and then continued in space.

We loved it.

[Viola]

Originally Posted by KaraBoo

can I ask if there is a post-credits scene?

At the very end of the credits, past the Disney castle logo, they showed the BNL logo with the little jingle. So I think the real message of the movie is buy our Wall-E toys when they come out this Christmas.

My 4 year old actually sat through it, only got up from her chair once to go to the bathroom. She did seem just a tad bored at the end, but she was in love with my empty coffee cup at that point, pretending it was her special friend. She even brought it home with her. She didn't respond as well to the last 2 movies we took her to see, first running around and then falling asleep. So this was a nice change.

I thought the movie was very visually interesting and inventive, I enjoyed watching it, but it didn't touch me emotionally. I didn't really feel for any of the characters, which is odd because I did really identify with the cars in Cars. I suppose I did find Wall-E endearing to a degree, but I had a hard time with the personification of the robots, especially the ones on the ship. I'm not sure why, really, but I could buy Wall-E being unique and having developed artificial intelligence, but then EVE developing feelings...eh, not so sure on that one. Then their humanlike romance...the holding hands, the kiss. And of course one had to be a man and one a woman. Bah humbug. I kept finding myself thinking things like, "hmmm, wouldn't he melt, wouldn't he be ripped apart, how did the plant survive all that? Wouldn't the boneless people who can barely force themselves to stand in microgravity, be feeling crushed and have blood clot issues and who knows what else when they came back to Earth?" When all the humans got thrown out of their chairs and were rolling, people in the theater were laughing. I tended to see them as visually representating overconsumption as opposed to representing obese people of today. Anyone can overconsume, whether they are fat or not, but making them blobby and physically incapable was a way of representing it. So I didn't tend to take it personally, but who knows how others will take it. The humans weren't exactly characters you could respect, and then the whole idea that now that the Earth can sustain a plant meant they could live on the planet again was just so rushed and the whole ending was kind of weak to me. I figure the first dust storm will wipe them out.

Oh well, I still liked it better than Ratatouille for the most part. I'm glad I saw it, there were things about it I really liked, and I even was sort of feeling Eve by the end, when she wanted to get Wall-E back. It really made me want to see Hello Dolly now.

[Viola]

Originally Posted by tanya1976

But, imagine how I feel when I have students much younger than me weighing much more than me, not due to illness or disorders, but not from an healthy lifestyle.

How do you feel?

[Penelope]

Originally Posted by tanya1976

Unfortunately, childhood obesity is running rampant. Medical conditions isn't the culprit, primarily. Lack of exercise and a good diet are the reasons. It may make you uncomfortable. But, imagine how I feel when I have students much younger than me weighing much more than me, not due to illness or disorders, but not from an healthy lifestyle.

Depicting overweight people as stupid and lazy won't make children healthier. Of course, I want my kids to be healthy (which is why I encourage them to be active, limit TV, and feed them nutritious foods) but I also want them to be thoughtful and kind. Teaching them (or endorsing media that teaches them) that fat=stupid, or fat=lazy, does nothing but encourage them to think less of other people based on appearances.

There are threads in TAO pretty regularly about how MDC mamas who are over an "acceptable" weight are treated badly. IMO it's a serious social problem, and I'm not in favor of media images that reinforce the idea that it's ok to look down on people who are heavy.

[Pinoikoi]

Originally Posted by Penelope

Depicting overweight people as stupid and lazy won't make children healthier. Of course, I want my kids to be healthy (which is why I encourage them to be active, limit TV, and feed them nutritious foods) but I also want them to be thoughtful and kind. Teaching them (or endorsing media that teaches them) that fat=stupid, or fat=lazy, does nothing but encourage them to think less of other people based on appearances.

There are threads in TAO pretty regularly about how MDC mamas who are over an "acceptable" weight are treated badly. IMO it's a serious social problem, and I'm not in favor of media images that reinforce the idea that it's ok to look down on people who are heavy.

I thought the movie portrayed them as having poor physical ability which resulted in their clumsiness, but I am not sure where they were portrayed as lazy or stupid. I do think the film portrayed those people as being lead around by the machinery/corporation, but certainly that could be said about people today in this world who may or may not be fat. When the characters needed to catch the babies, they figured out how to do it. I am not sure I could have figured out how to overcome an autopilot by myself.. yet they did.. I think they were portrayed as people that were overweight that didn't get much exercise "we have a jogging track?" "There's a pool?" (which actually implies to me that they would have used them had they known they were available), but I am not sure where they were portrayed as lazy or as stupid.

[Moon Faerie]

Originally Posted by alaskanteach

I thought the movie portrayed them as having poor physical ability which resulted in their clumsiness, but I am not sure where they were portrayed as lazy or stupid. I do think the film portrayed those people as being lead around by the machinery/corporation, but certainly that could be said about people today in this world who may or may not be fat. When the characters needed to catch the babies, they figured out how to do it. I am not sure I could have figured out how to overcome an autopilot by myself.. yet they did.. I think they were portrayed as people that were overweight that didn't get much exercise "we have a jogging track?" "There's a pool?" (which actually implies to me that they would have used them had they known they were available), but I am not sure where they were portrayed as lazy or as stupid.

I agree. They might have been undereducated and mislead (by "big brother"), but I don't see how it was implied that they were lazy or stupid. Heck, the captain was completely enthralled and absorbed by all the information he was finding once he knew it was there to look for it. And after the humans interacted with Wall-E (the captain, and the man and woman especially), they sort of woke up from the brainwashing. I definitely felt that any lack of education (not intelligence, as I didn't get the impression that they were lacking there) or lack of activity was through no fault of their own. Humans had been on that ship for 700 years. The people there at the present time had been born into this environment. They didn't know any different. However once they were made aware of other ways, they changed.

[tanya1976]

Originally Posted by Viola

How do you feel?

I feel bad. I had one student who could barely run during recess. He's barely 5'0 (I'm barely 5'2), 115 lbs and 10 years old. I was concerned about his breathing on a daily basis. Despite not having asthma, he would breathe hard as though he ran a mile each day. I would remind the kids to bring to school healthy snacks (my district's pretty affluent, so the parents can afford organic or healthy foods overall), but his mother constantly gave him Little Debbie's and Hi-C.

I don't allow teasing at all. I don't respect it. But, I don't respect ignoring childhood obesity either. Change the behavior, change the outcome.

As a nation, we have become lazy and big (not just in size, but in technological dependence) and WALL-E showcases aspects of it. I thought it was a good chance to discuss the topics.

[SAHDS]

They weren't portrayed as stupid, but as ignorant. There is a huge difference. They simply didn't know any better because they always had their faces in those mobile screens, were fed a horrid in-a-cup diet and never had to do anything for themselves. I thought it showed a decline in society in an easy to understand way. As for their obesity, that was explained by their complete lack of movement, atrocious diet and lack of bone density (due to being in space for 700+ years, it steadily declined). With all of those combined, you are going to have overweight people.

As for the movie, I liked it. Did anyone else tear up when Wall-E went to 'sleep' and started rocking himself? UGH, that part was torture, I wanted to hold him! I also thought it showed my LOs a good example of "what-if", a lesson DH and I are teaching them on a daily basis - don't take the Earth for granted, less trash/waste, less consumerism, good exercise, healthy diet, actual interaction w/ people, less plugged-in.

[Viola]

Originally Posted by tanya1976

I feel bad. I had one student who could barely run during recess. He's barely 5'0 (I'm barely 5'2), 115 lbs and 10 years old. I was concerned about his breathing on a daily basis. Despite not having asthma, he would breathe hard as though he ran a mile each day.

Are you sure he doesn't have asthma? A 5' 115 lb adult would be in the normal BMI range. For a child, I guess it means he is at the higher end of things, but I don't think his breathing problems should be assumed to be because of his weight.

I do notice that some children can be resistant to physical activity, or have a difficult time with it. My daughter's school has a jog-a-thon every year, and children can walk or jog laps. I did laps for one of the children in my daughter's class who was absent, and I did more than a number of the children, some of whom were standing at the table drinking water so they didn't have to walk laps, and some who were just walking really slowly. It disturbed me a bit, given my own size and physical problems.

Did anyone else tear up when Wall-E went to 'sleep' and started rocking himself? UGH, that part was torture, I wanted to hold him!

No, I think there was a disconnect there for me. My first thought was, Oh, how cute, followed immediately by the question of why he would need to do that to go to sleep, what would he really get out of it. Maybe I just needed to suspend disbelief a little more.