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Playdates without mom  

post #1 of 13
Thread Starter 
The other day we had one of dd's friends over. When her mom picked her up she invited dd over to make cookies later that week. Of course the girls were excited.

I had to work that day so dd was with our nanny during the afternoon, the time of the proposed playdate. They just live down the street and we ended up telling nanny that it was okay to walk her over and drop her off for an hour or two

The problem is, there is an older boy in the home with whom dh and I aren't entirely comfortable. He's about 11 yo, and is a polite, well spoken boy. But we've gotten a creepy vibe off of him a couple of times.

One time we had the family over for dinner. At one point we were outside and the boy produced my wallet from his pocket, asking "Did anyone lose this?" I said "Well, it's mine, but I didn't lose it. It was on the kitchen counter where I always put it when I come home." His mom was shocked and embarrassed, and made him go put it back right away.

Then when we had the kids over swimming, they were diving for toys and I looked around for these 3 matching rockets that we always use. They're always just on the bottom of the pool and I asked the kids where they were, so that I could throw them for them. The girls were both saying 'They were just here, we were just using them." The boy acted like he had no idea what I was talking about, and kept asking me to describe them. Then he made a show of looking around with me. They never did show up and we used other toys instead.

After they left we looked and there all 3 rockets were on the bottom of the pool, in plain sight. Dh and I are both convinced that he had hidden them away to take home with him, and that after we made a fuss about them being missing he changed his mind and put them back before he left.

There have been some other examples, but these are the most obvious. So he seems to sort of a dishonest type of kid, for whatever reason.

Bottom line is, I'm really not comfortable with dd playing around him without MY adult supervision. His mom is very sweet and I trust her, but I don't believe that she would hold him under the same scrutiny that I would. For instance, I would never let them play alone in a room together, but I think she would see no harm in that.

So, is there a graceful way to handle this? What kind of reasons can I come up with to negotiate around dd playing at their house without me, especially since her dd plays at our house alone all the time?

TIA.
post #2 of 13
I don't think there is a graceful way to handle it. If you are uncomfortable, go with her or send the nanny with her.

The examples you give make me think the kid is dishonest - which means don't send your four year old over with allowance in her pocket or her favorite toy. But are you worried about something else?
post #3 of 13
I'm trying to understand why you're worried about the 11 yo too. Are you worried that he is going to take something of your DD's? If that is all, then yeah, just tell her not to take anything along. I don't think you can make a jump that a kid who takes 3 rockets from a pool and then puts them back is going to hurt your DD. Of course, I haven't been around him so maybe you have other concerns?

If you are uncomfortable about her going over there, just tell the other mom that you don't think your DD is really ready for playdates on her own yet. The mom could then either invite the nanny to stay (if that's okay with you and her) or you could say you could just do it one evening or on a weekend.
post #4 of 13
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kirsten View Post
But are you worried about something else?
In a generic sort of way. The way that I always worry about and try to protect dd. Not that I've seen anything sexual from him.

But there was an occurence in which dd cried and said he shut the door on her on purpose, while he said it was an accident and that he didn't see her. It was kind of fishy and I tended to believe her. The girls had been running and playing around the house, and he followed them into dd's room. The girls continued to run in and out, and at some point he slammed the door shut on dd as she started to run through. He didn't have any reason to shut the door, and it was obvious that the girls were running in and out. So it wasn't like he was just walking into the house and shut the door behind him, not realizing dd was there.

I just really don't trust him.
post #5 of 13
well, I'm very sensitive about older sibs. If I pick up a bad vibe then you can bet my dds won't be around them without me. I am more than willing to let an acquaintence or friendship wither by not being graceful about it (I would never say anything, I would just become unavailable.)
post #6 of 13
I'm hearing great big loud INSTINCTS - no matter what anyone else is saying, your instincts are telling you there's reason to be concerned. I think the only way to handle it is to always send the nanny along or go along yourself -- unless something more glaringly obvious happens that you can really talk to the mother about.
post #7 of 13
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by lindberg99 View Post
If you are uncomfortable about her going over there, just tell the other mom that you don't think your DD is really ready for playdates on her own yet. The mom could then either invite the nanny to stay (if that's okay with you and her) or you could say you could just do it one evening or on a weekend.
I think this is what we'll need to do.

It will probably be a bit awkward, because we have mutual friends at whose houses I do allow dd to play. So it's likely that she'll know that I do let dd go to playdates without me. But I'm guessing that she will probably have some inkling about my discomfort and just agree without challenging it.

We have a similar situation in which we are on the other end of that spectrum, and we understand. Our neighbors don't allow their kids to play unsupervised at our house, because they view our gentle parenting as sort of heathen. They think yelling, spanking, time outs, and rules, rules, rules are the only way to parent effectively. Our house is just too unstructured for them. We don't mind - we just send dd to play at their house when she likes and always have an open invitation for their kids to visit.
post #8 of 13
I totally agree with Mata and Lima Bean If you have a bad vibe around this kid there is most likely a good reason. Kids who are sneaky about possessions are often sneaky about other stuff as well. The fact that he closed the door on your DD shows that he may be trying to engage in some sort of power play with her.

Even if you have not seen any overt inappropriate sexual behavior you would be wise to be very cautious. The door thing just seems like an intimidation type behavior. And for a young child even a situation where an older child is intimidating can be very upsetting. Follow your mama bear instincts.
post #9 of 13
Quote:
Originally Posted by blessed View Post
In a generic sort of way. The way that I always worry about and try to protect dd.
This makes it hard for me to say you should trust the "maybe he's not ok" feeling. Because if you have that feeling a lot, it might be too much worry/fear/whatever to determine when it is valid and when it isn't. In Gavin de Becker's book The Gift of Fear, he says that if you are hypersensitive to every little thing, you will miss the actual subtle clues when there really is danger.

I have three girls. I can't remember the last time I worried about them in any specific situation.
post #10 of 13
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kirsten View Post
..Because if you have that feeling a lot...
I can't say that I've ever had 'that feeling' before. Or if I have it now. I just don't want my 4.5 yo to hang around unsupervised with an 11 yo who lies, steals and hurts her.

I don't think it's anything more than that.
post #11 of 13
Hmmm.... This *is* a hard situation. It doesn't appear to be a sexual thing, but it does sound as if you are saying:

1. You don't like the example he sets
2. He treats your DD disrespectfully

Have you thought about telling the other mom that you've noticed that her DS seems to put your DD "on edge" and that your DD really wants to spend some time with her DD, while her DS is otherwise occupied. It wouldn't bother me if someone said this about either of my kids.

My kiddos are only 18mos apart ~ and we've had interactions with other families where certain of the kids don't "mix" well. For example, good friends of ours ~ their DS is 6mos younger than our DS & their DD is 6mo younger than our DD. Our DS & their DS get along fine. Our DD and their DS get along. Our DS and their DD get along. However, the two DDs just seem to "bang heads" and it's even escalated into physical altercations (they're 3.5 & 3). We just know that and try to structure things so that it is either a big group or the DDs have their own seperate activities. If the DD's play together we CLOSELY supervise.

I think that it's OK to set "groundrules" for a playdate. Just b/c families have more than one child doesn't mean that they always have to be a "package set" ~ especially with such a distinct age difference.

Good luck!
post #12 of 13
I agree that there is probably not a lot to worry about, based on what you've said so far, but that there is enough to worry about that you'd either want to be there or have your nanny there, or talk to the mom if you can. I might say something like "my dd is a little nervous around your son, so if he's going to be there, I'll come along, (or nanny) but if he's not, she's comfortable at your house on her own." It's not an accusation, it alerts the other mom to a potential issue, and it makes it ok for you to ask if he'll be home or not.

We had very close friends whose son constantly did power moves on our kids, but they were all close in age and young, so it wasn't too much of an issue. I knew, though, that I wasn't crazy about the idea of them all hanging out as young teens, and as it turned out, they got all fired up about my son defending himself against their son, so they left the friendship and we haven't really tried to fix it. sometimes you have to just let things fall away when they aren't working...
post #13 of 13
Quote:
Originally Posted by 2shy2post View Post
Have you thought about telling the other mom that you've noticed that her DS seems to put your DD "on edge" and that your DD really wants to spend some time with her DD, while her DS is otherwise occupied. It wouldn't bother me if someone said this about either of my kids.
If someone said their child could only come play at my house while one of my children was "otherwise occupied," I'd feel kind of offended. And what does "otherwise occupied" mean -- that he can't be in the house? Or that he has to stay confined to another part of the house while the cookies are being made?

I like Lindberg99's idea of just explaining that she's not ready to go on her own yet, and sending Nanny with her. This doesn't force them to change their plans at all ...

It might have forced a change of plans if Mom was just planning on letting the girls play while she blogged or something (but now felt she had to be sociable because another adult was coming), but she's already planning to make cookies with the girls, so Nanny can just join in the project, and be an extra pair of hands, which will make it easier.
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