Nurses!!

[GoodMomma]

Question..... I'll be going back to school for nursing next month and I've been wondering about the whole circ issue. When it's time to do maternity clinicals.....do you have to witness a circ? Any nurses can you tell me your experience with that? Thanks!

[glongley]

I am a nursery nurse, graduated in 1981. I know I watched circumcisions in nursing school (that's what made me decide not to circ my sons) but don't remember it being a requirement. I do not know how strict different programs would be about requiring it nowadays. But if you have an ethical objection to anything, you should have the right to opt out of it. I think that conscientious objector stance is pretty well accepted in other situations, like abortions, stopping life-support etc. As a practicing nurse, you should also have the right to be a conscientious objector. I have taken the stance that I will not assist with circumcisions, and have talked this over with my managers, and they are basically supportive, although they don't completely understand my position, and I have also gotten into some sticky situations with MDs who expect assistance.

Good luck! We need more conscious nurses out there! Remember, you will also be able to educate your fellow students and your colleagues too after you graduate. Nurses are in a great position to educate lots of people.

Gillian

[Nandi]

I think it may just depend on what nurse you're assigned to, and what day. It was not a requirement for my Labor and Delivery/Postpartum clinical. Here's what we did do: A full assessment for mom and baby, nurse shadowing, patient teaching, time with the lactation RN, and time in the NICU. Thankfully no circs because I would have been out of there and off to tell the parents they were making a mistake...probably would have been kicked out of nursing school. Also, you can join Nurses for the rights of the child. Feel free to message me any more questions.

[kate3]

As a student, you should not have to be part of/witness a circ if you do not want to.

My OB students spend time in the nursery but if they feel uncomfortable watching a circ then they certainly don't have to. They cannot refuse to care for a mom who had her baby circed or refuse to care for the infant, but they do not have to be part of the procedure.

[MoonJelly]

This makes me wonder, if you remove yourself from situations involving circs (which I can understand), is there still a way for you to have any opportunities to influence moms against it? Almost a catch-22 it seems... I am not a nurse or student, just wondering about this.

[GoodMomma]

Thanks everyone! I've asked here and elsewhere and have gotten the same input. I'm so glad that I won't have to assist!! I hope this is the way it is because I will definately refuse! I can't even stand watching 5 seconds of a video, so watching one in person I'd probably punch the Dr! Thanks all!

[spencerrn]

I am a NICU/PP nurse and I am an intactivist. I speak with moms about circumcision nearly every day that I work and it always amazes me how few have done any research on the subject. I have persuaded many parents not to circ just by educating them. I do not refuse to assist with circ's because I feel that SOMEONE needs to be there and comfort the baby. He really has no choice so the least I can do is swaddle his arms and keep giving him sweetease to help with the pain.

It nearly makes me sick everytime though!

Rachael

[Kylix]

What is sweetease?

Kylix

[Fellow Traveler]

Originally Posted by Kylix

What is sweetease?

Kylix

If I am not mistaken, sugar water.

Originally Posted by spencerrn

I am a NICU/PP nurse and I am an intactivist. I speak with moms about circumcision nearly every day that I work and it always amazes me how few have done any research on the subject. I have persuaded many parents not to circ just by educating them. I do not refuse to assist with circ's because I feel that SOMEONE needs to be there and comfort the baby. He really has no choice so the least I can do is swaddle his arms and keep giving him sweetease to help with the pain.

It nearly makes me sick everytime though!

Rachael

Spencerrn, so you are relatively successful when you have the opportunity to talk to parents? I must say that is encouraging. Also other nurses in positions similar to yours say they could/would catch flack for doing what you do; so do you? I suppose it is hospital dependent.

ETA: I see you're new to so welcome. Would you like to send a message to a soon to be father soliciting opinions about this decision?

[chumani]

I am getting ready to return to school and finish my RN, our hospital here (women and children's) will not authorize circs after birth. I fortunately live in a state where medicaid will not pay for circs and with so many moms here on medicaid they have done a complete hospital ban on circs, if the moms want it done it is done in their peds office, out of pocket (unless they have private ins, then it is still done in the peds office). Now, if only there was an easy answer to having to assist/administer vaccines as an RN.

Sarah

[Mandynee22]

I'm not a nurse and didn't circ anyway- but when I had my son and one of the nurses came in a day later she said to my son "Oh! You don't have to have any procedures today because your mommy loves you so much". It made me feel really good and really validated "my" choice (blah). Just wanted to add that since there was talk about discouraging it. Don't forget to encourage decisions already made :-)

[Fellow Traveler]

Originally Posted by Mandynee22

I'm not a nurse and didn't circ anyway- but when I had my son and one of the nurses came in a day later she said to my son "Oh! You don't have to have any procedures today because your mommy loves you so much". It made me feel really good and really validated "my" choice (blah). Just wanted to add that since there was talk about discouraging it. Don't forget to encourage decisions already made :-)

Every now and again when I hear stories like this I wonder if there is a sizable number of medical professionals who are against circumcision but can't really say anything about it, kind of always bitting their tongue.

[GoodMomma]

Originally Posted by chumani

I am getting ready to return to school and finish my RN, our hospital here (women and children's) will not authorize circs after birth. I fortunately live in a state where medicaid will not pay for circs and with so many moms here on medicaid they have done a complete hospital ban on circs, if the moms want it done it is done in their peds office, out of pocket (unless they have private ins, then it is still done in the peds office). Now, if only there was an easy answer to having to assist/administer vaccines as an RN.

Sarah

Awesome! If I knew there was a hospital like that around here, I'd actually consider working in L&D! Formula feeders bother me, but circ'ing parents would drive me to drink on the job.... So if I could find a local hospital that doesn't circ that would be a dream!

[GoodMomma]

Originally Posted by jwhispers

Every now and again when I hear stories like this I wonder if there is a sizable number of medical professionals who are against circumcision but can't really say anything about it, kind of always bitting their tongue.

I wonder this too! I love hearing stories like this but they're rare unfortunately. Then there's the dumb nurses like one my sister had back in March. My sister is an intactivist thanks to me, and she had made out a sign for her sons hospital bed saying "I'm intact so don't retract!" Well the nurse brought him back to her after he was born and one of the first things she said to her was you have to retract the foreskin and the Dr. will be in to talk to her about it. So my sister told her that no you don't retract it and she has her own info etc etc. The nurse was really rude and said "technically you do have to retract it" She was a major moron. I was right there when this happened and I was honestly shocked and a loss for words! I was just amazed at the stupidity....by a MATERNITY NURSE! I wish the education was out there....it's scary! I ended up sending letters to the hospital and all the Drs. offices from the hospital, lol. Hope it did something!

[Night_Nurse]

Originally Posted by spencerrn

I am a NICU/PP nurse and I am an intactivist. I speak with moms about circumcision nearly every day that I work and it always amazes me how few have done any research on the subject.
Rachael

This makes me happy but also confuses me a bit. How are you able to talk to them about it? Is it during your NICU shifts or post-partum shifts? I work post-partum (all women's services but mostly p/p). We're not "allowed" to talk about circ or anything baby related. I know this is because they dept. manager doesn't want conflicting info given (nursery nurses can talk to mom a bit about breastfeeding, but not about post-partum care, p/p nurses aren't supposed to talk about any newborn assessment, procedures, etc). If circ ever comes up, which it rarely does b/t mom & p/p nurse, we are supposed to remain unemotional, neutral, and refer the mom to the nursery nurse.
I have congratulated a few moms (and a dad) when I found out they were leaving their sons intact but if I ever went in the room and tried to convince someone not to circ I'd be fired on the spot.
Once congratulating some parents who declined all vaxs, vit K, & circ, it backfired. They were very earthy and I figured they wouldn't circ at all. I told them how happy I was and that I felt the same way and my son was intact, mostly non-vaxed, etc. They looked at me disgustingly and said baby would be circed in a religious ceremony in 8 days. Mom's chart said "Christian" under religious preference. I later found out she was Messianic. I felt so embarrassed that I'd said anything and was thankful they weren't offended.

So, at least at my facility, we're not supposed to discuss circ at all.

[Night_Nurse]

Originally Posted by GoodMomma

Question..... When it's time to do maternity clinicals.....do you have to witness a circ? Any nurses can you tell me your experience with that? Thanks!

While we weren't required to observe circs in school, I can say with most certainty that I wouldn't be the intactivist that I am today had I not seen them. Because of witnessing them, I know that when "they" say they don't hurt or that they don't cry if pain relief is used that it's a load of BS.
If I only based my opinion on what I read in my OB textbooks, I'd still belief that it's a "minor procedure with minor discomfort" and that it's "quick" and that intact babies "should be retracted at bath and changing times". And nursing school for me was back in the 90's. I'm doubting the textbooks have changed all that much.
Even if you don't want to observe a circ you should still have some opportunities to discuss circ either after a clinical in group time or during an ethics class or something. My OB instructor was also a nurse-midwife and very knowledgeable. But you might find you know a whole lot more about circ and current recommendations than your instructor, especially if he or she has been out of floor nursing for a while.

Good luck to you in your nursing career!

[BugMacGee]

I watched one in nursing school 10 years ago. It was awful.

I'm a NICU nurse and only a few of our parents request them. If they do, before dc, they go to the nursery and have them done (by the nursery staff). Our peds do use lidocaine (local anesthetic) and Sweetease. But blech nonetheless. Doesn't help the pain of a fresh circ when pee hits it.

I have no problem voicing my opinion about them. Many of our staff feels the same way, but not many people speak up. I think a lot of people, parents and staff, don't think twice about it.

In my old NICU, the docs wouldn't do it at all inpatient. I miss my old unit!

[Fellow Traveler]

Originally Posted by Night_Nurse

This makes me happy but also confuses me a bit. ... If circ ever comes up, which it rarely does b/t mom & p/p nurse, we are supposed to remain unemotional, neutral, and refer the mom to the nursery nurse. .... tried to convince someone not to circ I'd be fired on the spot.

So, at least at my facility, we're not supposed to discuss circ at all.

I bet the amount you're allowed to discuss it just varies from hospital to hospital.

Originally Posted by BugMacGee

I watched one in nursing school 10 years ago. It was awful.

I have no problem voicing my opinion about them. Many of our staff feels the same way, but not many people speak up. I think a lot of people, parents and staff, don't think twice about it.

In my old NICU, the docs wouldn't do it at all inpatient. I miss my old unit!

See here it is again, I wonder how many are against this if the cone of silence was lifted. Hear no evil, See no evil, Say no evil.

BTW, OP I think you should go for it. We need more nurses and medical professionals like you. Perhaps you could even do L & D under the right circumstances. You could help a lot of boys.

[Nathan1097]

: Me too! Just got financial aid all finalized today.

[Fellow Traveler]

Originally Posted by Nathan1097

: Me too! Just got financial aid all finalized today.

You too! Excellent.