Expired car seats on Freecycle - Page 4

[Ironica]

Originally Posted by BelovedBird

None of the cheaper seats have a chest clip. Isn't that unsafe?

Not necessarily. European seats don't have chest clips, due to EU requirements that a seat be able to be unbuckled with one hand or under a certain amount of time (I forget which). So they're designed completely differently. The chest clip (and this is the one thing about that second link that isn't quite useful/accurate) is only for positioning the straps on the child's body; it doesn't serve a purpose in restraining the child against crash forces.

It may just be that seats manufactured in the EU are cheaper to import to Israel.

The bottom line, though, is that the physics of car crashes are no different in Israel than in the US; the differences are all about the circumstances around and cultural attitudes toward car travel. I don't personally believe that Israeli children are less important or more difficult to injure than American children, so I would never argue that an expired seat is "good enough" in Israel if it's not here in the States.

[BelovedBird]

Originally Posted by Ironica

I would never argue that an expired seat is "good enough" in Israel if it's not here in the States.

Good point, except the arguments that people are using as why its never necessary to use an expired car seat are not as relevant in Israel. It is possible to get one to use a car seat who wouldn't otherwise by giving them mine. It isn't going to work to try and convince them to shell out 400 shekel for a seat that only use in taxis once in a while. (The person who has my seat has adopted and fostered down syndrome children and babies.) The fact is also the laws just aren't in place. Noone gets stopped for having babied improperly restrained or unrestrained.

[Smalls181]

Originally Posted by BelovedBird

The kid would still be in the vehicle. That right there is an advantage over this:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=giYQE1Hskjc

How is it an advantage to be strangled by the harness? You are either strangled by a harness, or thrown through a windshield.

[chickabiddy]

Originally Posted by BelovedBird

None of the cheaper seats have a chest clip. Isn't that unsafe?

No, it is not. The chest clip is a pre-crash positioner designed to make sure the straps are in the proper position. It provides no restraint in and of itself. Seats made without chest clips (many European and Asian models) are designed to work properly without chest clips.

[Ironica]

Originally Posted by BelovedBird

The fact is also the laws just aren't in place. Noone gets stopped for having babied improperly restrained or unrestrained.

According to the English language version of the SafeKids Israel site, the law IS in place, and it requires children up to age 9 to be in at least a booster. What's not in place is the enforcement, and that needs to change.

I know you're already planning on contacting Beterem; see if you can get info on a car restraint training and info session and get your friend to go with you to it. Hopefully they can help her find an affordable solution to keeping the kids in her care safe.

[bmcneal]

In response to the OP about expired car seats being offered on Freecycle. (Don't want to join the debate, I don't like tomatoes):

My friend got a used one from Freecycle. (don't know if it was expired or not, but for the purpose she was using it, I don't *think* it would matter?) She used it so her DD could sit up in the living room while they were watching a movie, or she could feed her, or in case she had to run to the bathroom for a safe place for DD to sit. (DD had three older brothers, very rambunctious.) I don't know if it would be as big a deal (if one at all) that the seat be expired if you were using it for something like that? Feel free to correct me if I'm wrong.

[BelovedBird]

Originally Posted by Ironica

Hopefully they can help her find an affordable solution to keeping the kids in her care safe.

Wow. talk about being talked at. She doesn't have a car.

AFA the rest of your post. Having laws on the books is useless if no one knows (there is 0 education) the laws and no one enforces them.
I've cared about car restraint since day one with my kids and the only thing I know about laws is that recently it became law that taxi drivers have to wear a seat belt as well as back seat passengers.

[queenjane]

Originally Posted by BelovedBird

Wow. talk about being talked at. She doesn't have a car.

What does that have to do w/ her post? She didnt say the kids in her caR safe, she said the kids in her caRE.

Having laws on the books is useless if no one knows (there is 0 education) the laws and no one enforces them.
I've cared about car restraint since day one with my kids and the only thing I know about laws is that recently it became law that taxi drivers have to wear a seat belt as well as back seat passengers.

So whats the solution? Maybe you could help start an education campaign? Maybe, as someone suggested, you could contact the safekids organization and volunteer. Maybe you could pass on the links (such as the video of the expired seat and the videos of what happens w/ no seats) to your friends who arent educated on the subject. What are *you* going to do to "be the change you want to see"?


Katherine

[BelovedBird]

Originally Posted by queenjane

What does that have to do w/ her post? She didnt say the kids in her caR safe, she said the kids in her caRE.

You are right. I misread. My bad.

So whats the solution? Maybe you could help start an education campaign? Maybe, as someone suggested, you could contact the safekids organization and volunteer.

First I have to get home. Then unpack, and make sure Dh stays healthy. Then we'll see if safe kids needs American religious women or if no one will listen to me. (Most car owners I would encounter would be non American, non religious, you'd have to understand the cultural divide to get it).

Maybe you could pass on the links (such as the video of the expired seat and the videos of what happens w/ no seats) to your friends who arent educated on the subject.

Any friends I have who aren't educated on the subject don't have internet

What are *you* going to do to "be the change you want to see"?

Right now I am trying to learn as much as I can and keep my own family safe and healthy, and get us all home. After that is all taken care of for awhile we'll see.

[Blucactus]

I've seen this on my Freecycle too. Once a woman was asking for carseats for a friend and I took the time to email her privately and tell her why they are unsafe & possibly (? NY state?) illegal to use one they are expired. She emailed me back saying she'd had NO IDEA & was glad I'd contacted her.

<patting myself on the back>

[juliana25]

Expired car seats on Freecycle

n fact, most car seats have an expiration date on one of the

manufacturer labels that can be found on the sides or bottom of

the car seat. To find out if a car seat is expired, you should

look for that expiration date label first. If there's no

expiration date listed, use the date of manufacture and consult

the car seat owners' manual. Many manufacturers give a maximum

car seat life in the manual. If not, call the manufacturer and

ask.
-------------------------------------------------
juliana

Iowa Drug Addiction "] Iowa Drug Addiction [/URL]

[hipmummy]

Someone on my Freecycle group keeps posting two Britax Super Elites that are old (they were recalled as well). It is so annoying. I feel like emailing her but yet the three times I have done this in the past I got harrassed. Thankfully all of the people who have looked at the seats have noticed their age.

[hipmummy]

I just emailed her asking all the usual questions pretending to be an interested party. I could just take them and like someone else said in a previous thread donate them to a training center.

[hipmummy]

I emailed the mods and I got back the standard response
[quote]FREECYCLE MEMBERS USE THIS LIST AT THEIR OWN RISK. Please take reasonable measures to protect your safety and privacy when posting to the list or participating in an exchange. By joining the list, you agree to hold neither the list owners and moderators nor anyone affiliated with The Freecycle Network responsible or liable for any circumstance resulting from a Freecycle exchange or communication. Transactions are between Offerer and Recipient and will not be mediated or arbitrated by Freecycle administrators, moderators, or representatives. [quote]

[MommyJoia]

If you can get them, I would and either destroy them or donate them for training like you said.

A mom I've freecycled with before had posted a 'wanted' and 'received' for a car seat. I sent her a simple e-mail just reminding her to check the expiration date to be sure it was still safe for use. She wrote me back saying that she didn't know that car seats expired and she thanked me. It's the best I can do short of going to her house and checking myself, which I can't do because she's moved since the last time I picked something up from her.

[UberMama]

I know it's not as easy on FreeCycle since you have to join the Yahoo Group. But for CraigsList, I have another email address I use to email people about car seats. I see expired ones THAT often that I signed up for another Yahoo email acct just to email people (that way they don't have my main CraigsList/FreeCycle address I use).

I've received about 4-5 harassing replies from people out of probably 200+ emails I've sent in the past two years or so. I am very nice, including a link or two and keeping it brief about expired seats and the dangers/risks. I've even offered to pick up seats near me.

[BelovedBird]

So, I contacted B'terem (even though I am not unpacked yet and dh was in the hospital last week). There is no course currently to train as a carseat safety tech.
They do not give away car seats.
They provided me with a number which is a fax and directed me to an organisation which lends medical equiptment for 1-3 months. The last car seat I borrowed from them was 11years ago and it was about 10 years old (thus expired). The branch in my city does not have car seats.

[Astrogirl]

Gee, just when I thought we couldn't have any more swords in the battle of the Mommy Wars - the car seat issue with all of its hysteria and exaggerations come flying out. Nothing gets my blood pressure up higher than mothers usurping other mothers judgement (i.e. calling people lazy or accusing them of not caring about their baby as much as you do) - how sad. (I'm referring to the earlier portion of this thread)

Originally Posted by BelovedBird

Interesting.
Maybe in your world, your reality. Try to keep in mind your reality is not the only one.

Pretty much sums up my feelings.

Back to the freecycle debate, I know plenty of people in theatre and maybe one person in window dressing that looks for things like these as props.

[BelovedBird]

When I asked for more info because the numbr was a fax,theresponse I got:

The organization`s name is אב"י- אביזרי בטיחות ילדים
Unfortunatly I do not have any further information on the subject.
BETEREM organization is not lending or giving away safety seats.

[reece19]

Originally Posted by tapmilkmom

I'm gonna be the voice of the minority here, but the moms who post the used carseasts are probably thinking,"better a used carseat than no carseat at all" and may not know that there are places you can get free carseats.

They probably are thinking that. I'm a social worker and I've worked with children and families for years. The charity and free/reduced cost car seat resources are almost always tapped out in my community. I have spent years dealing with the 'better in an expired car seat or no car seat at all' delimma. I can't tell you how many days I have spent driving all over town trying to find a carseat for a client, just to eventually tell them to hold their baby on their lap. An expired carseat from craigslist would be preferable to that, IMO.

It's best, of course, to get the word out that carseats do expire. I'm sure there are pleny of people using 15 year old carseats because it seemed safe, not because it was a last resort.