Please comment on Susun Weed letter titled "Candida is a helper. It is keeping you healthy!" - Page 13

[Koalamom]

I recently saw a dowser in desperation to get this yeast in balance. Oh and what we found...
We dowsed what would be benificial for me and detrimental for this yeast battle. I eat a whole food diet, and have been trying to follow Susun Weeds advice with not much sucess. I found from the dowser that for me personally, foodsI eat were feeding the yeast, such as:
potatoes
vinegars (even raw apple cider vinegar)
egg whites (not the yolks)
lentils
kidney beans
sprouted grain bread (sourdough was fine)
raw tomatoes
all winter squash (except spaghetti squash)
soft cheeses
unfermented soy
pasturized dairy (even in cultrured form. It must be raw and only cultured)
honey
sugar
maple syrup (I can only have blackstrap mollases)
corn
oranges
bananas
raw garlic (cooked was fine)...

The list goes on. Crazy thing is I eat lots of these things. We tested the good foods, so I still can eat . I was told that my body would prefer o be healed without supplements, drugs, and must be healed through diet change. It has been almost a week since I have cut these foods out of my diet, and what do you know, I feel really good! I was secretly hoping that I wouldn't get better so I could eat some of those "bad" foods. I can't remember the last time I felt this good down there.

[menomena]

Originally Posted by firefaery

there are tests you can do for parasites that will detect not only current infestations, but any infestations you've ever had via antibodies.

Really? Do you have a link or other information about them? We are ready to just test for everything over here...

Also, for everyone who has had good experiences with Threelac: what do you think about reviews like this one?

[Calm]

Menomena, I've already eaten that review alive, probably on this thread. But a mini version would be:

Because these bacteria are also lactic acid producing they raise the ph of the intestine. Ph is very important because good bacteria prefer an environment that is more alkaline and the oxygen it produces

to raise the ph of something, you make it more alkaline, not more acid. And good bacteria prefer an acid environ, not an alkaline one.

I posted a good amount of info on the bacteria strain they refer to that is in Threelac, including the fact that it is found in infant GI tracts.

It is sold by multilevel marketing, I believe. Or by "distributors", and there are many with issues about that. Anticandidiasis is a big market also, and each company is slaughtering the other out there so it's hard to find good info about anything.

I'm more aghast at dirt eating, personally, which is a new fad (or an old fad gone nuts). The amount of PARASITES in our soil compared to bacteria these days is way too high to be safe. All you'd do is end up with worms and flukes with nary any bacterial benefit. One of the problems with our modern food is that our soil is deplete of good bacterial strains which are necessary for certain chemical processes, rendering our food lacking. Getting so crude isn't the answer. There are better ways.

[menomena]

I guess the part about Threelac that worries me is the enterococcus faecalis.

The New England Journal of Medicine has this to say about enterococcus faecalis. "Although Enterococcus faecalis was once regarded as nonpathogenic, this opportunistic gram-positive coccus now ranks among the most troublesome hospital pathogens. It has intrinsic resistance to many antibiotics and a remarkable capacity for developing resistance to others (x17,160)." There is a picture at the above link if you care to see it.

The Doctors Guide confirms they have linked this bacteria to mortality due to enterococcal bacteremia and is the third largest cause of hospital infections. It also causes urinary tract, abdominal, pelvic, and neonatal infections.

On the positive side if you want to call it that. The Channing Laboratory, Brigham and Women's Hospital, Harvard Medical School, Boston, MA, USA say that; "Enterococcus faecalis is part of the normal gastrointestinal flora in humans".

And according to Division of Infectious Diseases, Dept. of Medicine, University Hospital Freiburg, Hugstetter Str. 55, 79106 Freiburg, Germany. "This species does not cause infections in otherwise healthy persons. Well guess what folks? If your suffering from chronic yeast your not a healthy person".

So, the University Children's Hospital, University Hospital Schleswig-Holstein, Campus Kiel, Germany says; "Enterococcican cause serious and sometimes life-threatening systemic infections, especially in immunocompromised patients".

I guess it's like e. coli in that way, right? but i don't know if i'm going to willingly flood my wonky, yeasty gut with e. coli either. Just because it's found in a healthy gut - in balance with yeast and other bacteria - doesn't mean we should introduce it in large quantities to our gut... Is it the fact that it's found with the other two bacteria in Threelac that hack back that yeasties and then replace them with a better balance of bacteria?

I'm not being difficult, I'm honestly asking... I would love to be able to take something like Threelac with confidence (and give it to my 3.5yr old and my 16m old). We have lingering yeasty issues, even after doing BED for a few weeks (couldn't stick to it with nursing two small children). Our summer chock full of fruits and sugar hasn't helped, I'm sure.

[Panserbjorne]

Originally Posted by menomena

Really? Do you have a link or other information about them? We are ready to just test for everything over here...

Also, for everyone who has had good experiences with Threelac: what do you think about reviews like this one?

You would want a stool test for parasites that looks for antibodies *and* antigens. 'Round here it's on a standard panel, the doc just needs to check it. Let me know if you need more info.

[Calm]

Originally Posted by menomena

I guess the part about Threelac that worries me is the enterococcus faecalis.



I guess it's like e. coli in that way, right? but i don't know if i'm going to willingly flood my wonky, yeasty gut with e. coli either. Just because it's found in a healthy gut - in balance with yeast and other bacteria - doesn't mean we should introduce it in large quantities to our gut... Is it the fact that it's found with the other two bacteria in Threelac that hack back that yeasties and then replace them with a better balance of bacteria?

I'm not being difficult, I'm honestly asking... I would love to be able to take something like Threelac with confidence (and give it to my 3.5yr old and my 16m old). We have lingering yeasty issues, even after doing BED for a few weeks (couldn't stick to it with nursing two small children). Our summer chock full of fruits and sugar hasn't helped, I'm sure.

When I said:

I posted a good amount of info on the bacteria strain they refer to that is in Threelac, including the fact that it is found in infant GI tracts.

that's what I was referring to: E. Faecalis.

The bacteria you eat on a daily basis, and breathe, would make your skin crawl and your toes curl. You eat strep for breakfast and staph for lunch and wash it all down with an E Coli dinner with a Candida breeze blowing by. And if you like fermented goods, well, it's amazing you're not dead yet.

MANY microorganisms have the potential to cause harm that are already in you. Candida is the prime example of that. The acidity of the stomach is meant to kill most of these guys, hence why low stomach acid is such an overlooked cause of infection. Then if it gets by that acid wash, all the other factors are meant to keep it in check, whatever bug it may be.

Enterococcus faecalis is a Gram-positive , facultatively anaerobic, cocci which occurs singly, in pairs or short chains. It is a normal inhabitant of the intestinal tract and female genital tract... This bacterium lives peacefully in the human gut, but it also thrives on wounds and burns. Researchers have identified a group of genes that may contribute to the bacterium's transformation from being harmless in the gut to a menacing invader....Enterococcus faecalis is extremely hardy and can survive for weeks on environmental surfaces; cheese - 180 days; soil up to 77 days; soiled linen up to 90 days, cultures at -70 C for several years.

http://www.ebi.ac.uk/2can/genomes/ba..._faecalis.html

It is meant to be in the gut, which is where you put it when you eat it, whether that be on some cheese, in Threelac or whatever. That's not the problem. The problem is the SAME problem as Candida - opportunistic infection. This is not limited to this bacteria, nor yeast. It can happen to any number, if not all the microorganisms in our gut. Going into other places, such as the urinary tract, throat, or whatnot, is not where any of these guys are meant to be, and that's when the trouble starts.

The issue they've made of it to bag out Threelac is that it is antibiotic resistant to a large extent, causing problems in hospitals when they try to eradicate it. But this isn't due to the intentional ingestion of it, it is due to it already being there, which you cannot prevent anyway.

If it freaks you out, try nystatin instead or oil of oregano (rub on the feet of babies), or herbal stuff and just use run of the mill lacto and bifidus probiotics to fill the spaces left behind when the yeast die.

[Calm]

I suggest Lactobacillus Rhamnosus GG. It is the bacteria responsible for the mending of the gut specific to eczema. Here in Australia it is even sold as a probiotic called "Eczema Shield" and only contains that one bacteria. Best taken while pregnant and lactating, as it causes the breast milk to be rich in anti-inflammatory factors amongst other things. It has also shown less of a great response the older the child gets.

Be sure to get THAT strain (GG or LGG). If you research it, you will be mighty impressed with it and rush out and get some, guaranteed. It's a great little guy. It's even showing candida killing properties and it's a human strain, to boot. I have heard it isn't as easy to get in the U.S, but maybe it is becoming more so.

They have shown that 20 billion units in pregnant/nursing mothers and half that for infants is the required therapeutic dose - which is quite high. So not only do you have to find the right strain, it must be a high dose product. It is one you must take indefinitely as although it sticks to the wall of the gut, it doesn't stay. Back in the day of fermented goods and soils that were replete in bacteria, this wouldn't be an issue, but these days, we have to supplement.

[menomena]

Janine, Thanks so much for taking the time to answer. What you say makes sense. I just get scared when I hear abx-resistant, ya know?

We did the spit test this morning, my 3.5yr old & I. Hers was beautiful, dissolving completely into the cup. Mine was grody, however. Spindly legs; sediment; you name it. Now, she has definite food allergies with skin, gut & behavior components. We're on an extended ED, etc. She has for sure yeast spots that come & go behind her ears and in her privates. Why would her mouth come up clear then? Me, on the other hand, I don't doubt have remaining yeast issues.

Thanks for the probiotic recommendation. She does have persistent eczema and I would love to get an "eczema-specific" probiotic.

[JaneS]

Finally found an interesting passage this thread made me think of... as to the possible benefits of yeast in the body. From Dr. Tom Cowan's The Fourfold Path to Healing, chapter on Diabetes talking of a patient with diabetes and hypothyroidism:

Her blood sugar still runs high and when it goes higher she tends to get yeast infections. We let these run their course because the yeast seems to "biodegrade" the sugar and after every course of yeast "infection" her blood sugar declines to normal.

Not that high blood sugar, and consequently yeast, is desirable but its interesting to me how complex these issues are and how the body attempts to deal with a high carb diet.

[JaneS]

Originally Posted by Calm

Be sure to get THAT strain (GG or LGG). If you research it, you will be mighty impressed with it and rush out and get some, guaranteed. It's a great little guy. It's even showing candida killing properties and it's a human strain, to boot. I have heard it isn't as easy to get in the U.S, but maybe it is becoming more so.

They have shown that 20 billion units in pregnant/nursing mothers and half that for infants is the required therapeutic dose - which is quite high. So not only do you have to find the right strain, it must be a high dose product. It is one you must take indefinitely as although it sticks to the wall of the gut, it doesn't stay.

It's www.culturelle.com here in the U.S. which is very easy to get in most drugstores.

It's 10 billion/capsule. The regular version is the same as the kids version, the latter is just more expensive with a diferent package so don't fall for buying the kids. It is availabe with and without FOS. Usually I have seen the FOS free version in drugstores and the one with FOS in health food stores and online. It does have trace amounts of dairy as it is grown on whey if that is a concern.

I'm surprised at that advertising claim. My impression that the eczema studies on children were not that conclusive? I thought it only showed some benefit (eczema prevented in half) when taken by pg women before and infants after birth? My concern is that it is lactobacillus only. I wonder whether the reason for the limited benefits shown in babies are because bifidobacteria is what is supposed to be the dominant gut flora in healthy infants?

Studies are on PubMed or maybe at the Culturelle website if anyone has time or inclination to dig.

The L. Reuteri strain also has positive eczema studies (and regow intestinal villi in animals) as well if I can recall.

There are some studies being done on atopy and bifidobacteria supplements from birth but I think they are several years away from being published.

[Panserbjorne]

Originally Posted by JaneS

Finally found an interesting passage this thread made me think of... as to the possible benefits of yeast in the body. From Dr. Tom Cowan's The Fourfold Path to Healing, chapter on Diabetes talking of a patient with diabetes and hypothyroidism:



Not that high blood sugar, and consequently yeast, is desirable but its interesting to me how complex these issues are and how the body attempts to deal with a high carb diet.

Dr Doug Graham says something similar. He feels that the yeast flares in an attempt to deal with blood sugar issues. He's had great success actually by having people NOT eat fat with sugar. The fat prevents the sugar from going directly into the cell and so hangs out in the bloodstream where yeast then basically freaks out trying to go to task to eliminate it. If you eat a ton of fruit with no fat that will not be the case. I dunno if you were around when I tested his theory, but he's 100% right. I just couldn't afford to eat as much as he wants you to! Plus, I don't think it's sustainable, but it did prove a point.

[JaneS]

No, I didn't see this earlier discussion, where is it?

I'm confused, wouldn't eating a lot of fruit raise blood sugar quickly? But you are saying eating fruit alone raises blood sugar but then it quickly leaves the bloodstream? But if there is fat it somehow stays longer by raising the fat level of the blood?

[crunchy_mama]

Originally Posted by JaneS

No, I didn't see this earlier discussion, where is it?

I'm confused, wouldn't eating a lot of fruit raise blood sugar quickly? But you are saying eating fruit alone raises blood sugar but then it quickly leaves the bloodstream? But if there is fat it somehow stays longer by raising the fat level of the blood?

I am curious about this as well. I have a major yeast overgrowth and also a big issue w/ my blood sugar staying regulated. I am trying to do the yeast diet , but even w/ min carbs I am having a hard time regulating things w/o trying to balance my meals. If there is some info on this is I am interested.

[BeingMe]

I wonder if this is why at a recent food seminar I went to they said to eat fruit alone and not with other food. Hmmm

[Panserbjorne]

IF you google Doug Graham you'll get a ton of info. Yes, eating fruit with fat slows the release into the cells (prolonging the time it's in the bloodstream) and allows yeast to have more to feed on. Without fat there will be a rapid uptake into the cells and you will not experience discomfort. I did it for a few weeks (again, I don't think the diet the way he advocates it is sustainable-but I think short-term it can allow a pretty impressive shift) and was shocked as I am rather prone to blood sugar issues. I had great results. I absolutely cannot afford to do it any longer and as I said, there are things that I feel are missing if you were to follow it long term. He does design diets for professional and Olympic levels athletes and they have great results under intense physical pressure. I'm not sure how-but they do.

[Brisen]

Originally Posted by firefaery

Yes, eating fruit with fat slows the release into the cells (prolonging the time it's in the bloodstream) and allows yeast to have more to feed on. Without fat there will be a rapid uptake into the cells and you will not experience discomfort.

Do you eat fat at a different time from eating fruit, or is it an overall low-fat, high-fruit diet?

Originally Posted by JaneS

It is availabe with and without FOS.

What is FOS?

[Panserbjorne]

IN general it's a lowfat diet. You can eat some fat (avocados, seeds, olives, etc.) but he feels that our natural diets should be low in fat. So it's a lowfat vegan diet that is fruit based. Again, not sustainable in my mind, but it did create an interesting shift done short-term. His book is called 80/10/10 if you want to peruse it. Most every bookstore has it that I have seen. He does talk quite a bit about Candida IIRC which is what intrigued me. His info made sense on a few levels so I decided to check it out.

[WuWei]

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[vbactivist]

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[WuWei]

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