4 days into PS Kindy, and I'm not doing well

[kindacrunchy]

First off, our first choice was this great charter school. We are on the waiting list. So until then, it is the school down the street. The teacher seemed fine up until she brought up her behavior chart: This is how it goes:
Purple: exceptional behavior
Green: Great, on task behavior (everybody starts out the day with green).
Yellow: OOps, Warning 1
Orange: Oh my, Warning 2
Red: Uh Oh, Time out! Call home
The children are told to change their color card when "x" behavior is committed, they can earn back to green, and she reminds them that they make the choices for that behavior.
So, my son cmes home and is disappointed because he did everything he thought he needed to do to earn a purple card and didn't get it. Now I'm ::: because i feel that this is only to deal with the children who "misbehave". The kids get a prize if the earn so many purples but get donut (the big zero) for staying on task and having good behavior. I want my child to be internally motivated. I feel this is teaching him if he behaves this way he gets something. I also don't want him to be discouraged because he always stays on green. Staying on green sounds great to me! I am so upset right now. I could go on and on and on about why i think this is wrong.
Deep breath.
Thanks!
Karen

[mamatoady]

Originally Posted by kindacrunchy

First off, our first choice was this great charter school. We are on the waiting list. So until then, it is the school down the street. The teacher seemed fine up until she brought up her behavior chart: This is how it goes:
Purple: exceptional behavior
Green: Great, on task behavior (everybody starts out the day with green).
Yellow: OOps, Warning 1
Orange: Oh my, Warning 2
Red: Uh Oh, Time out! Call home
The children are told to change their color card when "x" behavior is committed, they can earn back to green, and she reminds them that they make the choices for that behavior.
So, my son cmes home and is disappointed because he did everything he thought he needed to do to earn a purple card and didn't get it. Now I'm ::: because i feel that this is only to deal with the children who "misbehave". The kids get a prize if the earn so many purples but get donut (the big zero) for staying on task and having good behavior. I want my child to be internally motivated. I feel this is teaching him if he behaves this way he gets something. I also don't want him to be discouraged because he always stays on green. Staying on green sounds great to me! I am so upset right now. I could go on and on and on about why i think this is wrong.
Deep breath.
Thanks!
Karen

your child isn't going to be internally motivated from this type of behavior modification

I would never in a million bazillion years put my child in this environment

any teacher worth her salt would not resort to running her classroom based on this unless maybe it was in a juvenile delinquint facility.

If there are any other options for ps for your child, I would jump on it...homeschool if necessary. basically, the teacher is saying if your child does anything besides sit still like a zombie/slave...in other words if your child acts her/his age, they will get demoted.

run..go....now...do it!

(JMHO)
sarah

[eepster]

How exactly do they define purple earning "exceptional behavior?" It seems kind vague when compared to the very clear green level. It reminds me of the old cliche of a guy on a cart with a long pole that he dangles a carrot from in front of his donkey.

[famousmockngbrd]

I started a discussion on this same topic in Gentle Discipline a few days ago.

http://www.mothering.com/discussions...d.php?t=950722

I feel the same way. Every afternoon when I ask DS how his day was, he starts off by telling me what everyone's card color was. I'm like, "So did ya learn anything??" Yeah, he learned how to work the system.

No advice for you, just telling you I feel your pain. For now I'm taking a wait and see attitude. We don't have the purple card thing though, at least. If their card was on blue (the eqivalent of your green) all week, at the end of the week they get to pick a prize out of the treasure box. They don't have to do extra stuff, just behave normally.

[Amylcd]

Originally Posted by famousmockngbrd

I started a discussion on this same topic in Gentle Discipline a few days ago.

http://www.mothering.com/discussions...d.php?t=950722

I feel the same way. Every afternoon when I ask DS how his day was, he starts off by telling me what everyone's card color was. I'm like, "So did ya learn anything??" Yeah, he learned how to work the system.

No advice for you, just telling you I feel your pain. For now I'm taking a wait and see attitude. We don't have the purple card thing though, at least. If their card was on blue (the eqivalent of your green) all week, at the end of the week they get to pick a prize out of the treasure box. They don't have to do extra stuff, just behave normally.

My daughter is the same way, the first thing she talks about is everyone's card color (especially the poor kids who had to change their card to red ) They don't have purple either...

[bobandjess99]

our locals schools ALL use this system, it isn't just one teacher..it is the school-wide way of doing things......makes me ill.....but just wanted to let you knwo it is very common, from what i understand....

[alegna]

Originally Posted by mamatoady

any teacher worth her salt would not resort to running her classroom based on this unless maybe it was in a juvenile delinquint facility.

Just had to speak to this... while I agree 110% -it well may not be up to the teacher. I've seen more than a couple of schools where a system like this was mandatory and school-wide...

-Angela

[kmeyrick]

Originally Posted by alegna

Just had to speak to this... while I agree 110% -it well may not be up to the teacher. I've seen more than a couple of schools where a system like this was mandatory and school-wide...

-Angela

It's mandatory in our school as well. I've had to sit through professional developments about this.

[kindacrunchy]

Thank you, everybody! Apparently it is a statewide mandatory thing so that parents can't say they were unaware of their children's behavior. I just feel it focuses on misbehavior, stresses out kids (like mine), teaches them to be materialistic, etc, etc. I do feel, though, that if you are going to have a reward system, then reward the kids that can stay on task and have general, overall good behavior. Also reward the kids that go above and beyond, too. But if your kid doesn't rock the boat either way, that is desirable as well. I don't want it to be a thing, but if it is important to DS, i guess we will make a big deal when he comes home with all green. I don't know. I all just pisses me off. I don't want to get into this and hopefully he won't be all consumed with it. I guess it is just such a new thing and he SO wants to get a "treasure". UUGGHH!
Thank you, all. I guess the only way around itis to home school and I'm not sure I am up for that task yet We will wait and see!

[famousmockngbrd]

I was actually going to suggest that you give him some kind of reward for being on green yourself, but then I realized that would just support the whole paradigm you are trying to avoid in the first place.

DS's teacher sent home a letter explaining the disciplinary procedure. Every night we have to sign a notebook with a colored mark in it, corresponding to the kid's behavior card. She said we should "provide a consequence" at home if the color isn't blue, to reinforce what they are telling them in school. Now, I want DS to behave at school. But, I am not crazy about what that directive implies. For me, I would have a talk with DS about his school responsibilities. For someone else, they might beat their DC with a belt. They give no suggestions for what an appropriate consequence might be.

And, besides that, I feel like they are telling me to support their efforts to intimidate my child by intimidating him in the same manner at home. I'm not on board with that, at all. So, by the same token I wouldn't want to reward my DC according to their guidelines, either.

I don't have any good ideas about how to reconcile my disapproval of their system with my desire for DS to be happy and succeed at school. If I come up with any, I'll LYK.

[Ellien C]

My school does this, too, but no purple either. It certainly isn't my choice on how to work at home (I was never into stickers for leaving on-time or M&Ms for potty training) but I can't say what my choice would be if I had 17+ children for 6.5 hours a day.

I'm a big Alfie Kohn fan and I really do get the idea of "Punished by Rewards." But on the other hand, my school is in a state where Corporal Punishment is legal and I don't see ANY of that going on. I'll take the tickets, and prizes and Hi-5 rewards over the paddling any day.

The times change slowly. It isn't my choice but I'm not in the school. It's just one of those things that happens differently at home than at school.

We've not been asked to provide any kind of reinforcement consequence at home and I certainly wouldn't do that. But I would have talk with my daugther about being respectful and working together as part of a team.

At our school they also get these Hi-5 tickets which go into a drawing for prizes. My neighbor's son was so enthused by them that he took 5 of them home to give each to a family member. Now that's a nice way of subverting the system!

Yes, I'd like to see a new paradigm where we all understand that we need to work together because it makes the system work not because of what we get for ourselves. And I guess I'm just into BEING that change and allowing the rest of the world to BE where it's at. It's a behavior management system plain and simple. It's an improvement over beatings and perhaps it's back to the "demerit" system. Times change slowly and all I can do is live my little bit and allow other people the space to live theirs.

[dillonandmarasmom]

Originally Posted by kindacrunchy

Thank you, everybody! Apparently it is a statewide mandatory thing so that parents can't say they were unaware of their children's behavior. I just feel it focuses on misbehavior, stresses out kids (like mine), teaches them to be materialistic, etc, etc. I do feel, though, that if you are going to have a reward system, then reward the kids that can stay on task and have general, overall good behavior. Also reward the kids that go above and beyond, too. But if your kid doesn't rock the boat either way, that is desirable as well. I don't want it to be a thing, but if it is important to DS, i guess we will make a big deal when he comes home with all green. I don't know. I all just pisses me off. I don't want to get into this and hopefully he won't be all consumed with it. I guess it is just such a new thing and he SO wants to get a "treasure". UUGGHH!
Thank you, all. I guess the only way around itis to home school and I'm not sure I am up for that task yet We will wait and see!

Actually, this is not true. It s not mandatory (at least not in CA), nor is it something a teacher has to do in order to inform parents of behavior. When I taught in ps, we had a card system (not schoolwide, but by grade level), and I never used them. I had them on the child's desk so it was not as public (and to keep my teaching team off my back about being consistent with them), but I really didn't use it unless a child seemed to only respond to them. Our Kindies did not uyse this system, either.

I am sorry. I agree, this is the least effective method of instilling intrinsic motivation in a child. It sucks. It is so preoccupying to the younger children. Lame.

[kindacrunchy]

Thanks dillonandmarasmom, it is lame and it is preoccupying, and it doesn't intill intrinsic motivation, and it does foster competetion and judgement, BUT I did decide that I would accept it and try to use it as a teaching tool for my son. Fortunately, he did not come home and give me the behavior report for everyone like he did on Wednesday. I think it is so new to him that he is very interested. I was upset that he came home and told me he did everything he thought he needed to do to get a purple and he didn't so he was really disappointed. I did e-mail his teacher asking questions about it and oddly he received purple the next day for being a "super worker". whatever. he was so excited and I don't want to squash that but later on I did tell him why I was not excited about the behavior chart.
thank you, to everyone. this has been very helpful!

[skybluepink02]

An interesting alternative they taught us in my Managing Classrooms course is to have an item you pass to a child who is behaving well. For example, in a science based classroom, you might have 4 or 5 stuffed spaceships. If you catch, for example, a reluctent reader offering to read, you toss him a spaceship as recognition of his good work. Or if you catch a normally distractable kid really working well, pass him a spaceship. It turns around the whole dynamic. Instead of recognising bad behavior in front of the class, you recognise the good. The kids generally think it's cool to get a spaceship and try to work on their behavior in order to get one.

I've heard a lot of my classmates who graduated last year have a lot of success with this approach.

Now in GD terms, this isn't quite ideal either, but in a classroom of 36 kids, you've just got to give on some things. At least this way it's positive, rather than negative reinforcement.

[Nicole's Mom]

((Hugs))

I understand your pain as I'm going to send my daughter to her first "meet and great" an hour later.

I guess it takes some time for a kid to understand the system, since he can change it, he will very quickly to adapt it. Be patient and give him a lots of supports, he will get there.

[mistymama]

They have something similar in ds's K class. They have a board that says "we are keen on green!" and it's got green, yellow and then red circles. Everyone starts the day off fresh, but if you get to yellow, you sit out 5 mins of recess, red is miss recess.

I hate it. But it's school-wide and the one good thing I can say is that the teacher does not use it very heavily. Yeah, if someone is totally not listening after several reminders, they will go to yellow. But it's a last resort kind of thing.

I asked about it last night at back to school night, and really liked the teacher's response. She says she motivates the kids MUCH BETTER by pointing out good behavior in other kids, like "Oh, everyone look at how well Katie is standing in line!" and then everyone rushes to stand in line like her. I much prefer that approach.

I know it sucks, but I expected some of this from Public K. I know our school is excellent and considered very nurturing and gentle, but they still have guidelines to follow that are not ideal, IMO.

[MommaCrystal]

Oy, this card flip system! I nearly lost my job over my refusal to use it. It WAS manadatory at my school.

I quit eventually.

[cosmos]

Schools in our area use this minus the purple. I think the purple level sounds like green with an added brown nosing element. I'd ask the teacher if they could nixx that part of it. Seems over the top to me.

[wildmonkeys]

Our school has a color system (minus the purple) thing. In three years my son has never had a formal warning so it hasn't been a big deal for him, but it doesn't sound like a good fit for a chatty kid or the like...

They do have a "respect" program where they get a bonus if they are caught being respectful to either themselves, learning, or others. That is done in a pretty positive way where they get to call home on the respect phone if the teacher sees they are having a great moment.

[mata]

Originally Posted by kindacrunchy

Thank you, everybody! Apparently it is a statewide mandatory thing so that parents can't say they were unaware of their children's behavior. I just feel it focuses on misbehavior, stresses out kids (like mine), teaches them to be materialistic, etc, etc. I do feel, though, that if you are going to have a reward system, then reward the kids that can stay on task and have general, overall good behavior. Also reward the kids that go above and beyond, too. But if your kid doesn't rock the boat either way, that is desirable as well. I don't want it to be a thing, but if it is important to DS, i guess we will make a big deal when he comes home with all green. I don't know. I all just pisses me off. I don't want to get into this and hopefully he won't be all consumed with it. I guess it is just such a new thing and he SO wants to get a "treasure". UUGGHH!
Thank you, all. I guess the only way around itis to home school and I'm not sure I am up for that task yet We will wait and see!

my oldest is in third grade and has gone through this similar system-in first grade she was saying "no thank you" to the candies offered for good behavior. it's a learning opportunity-one of many in this world where we as parents can teach them to challenge the norm.

I always told my dd when she was in kindergarten that this was a way to keep a big group of kids behaving so they could get their work done, but that she didn't need to get wrapped up in what the teacher thought of her behavior, and to conduct herself well for her own satisfaction. Seems to have worked fine.