non-vax and daycare...

[thatblondegirl]

i keep reading that "if baby is breastfed and not in daycare" that it's basically ok to not vax. i breastfeed and my son IS in daycare, should i worry? he isn't vaxed past 6 months. if there is MORE reason to worry about VPD's, which ones? i just want to be as informed as possible. i still won't vax, but what "could" he get in daycare?

Thanks!

[nummies]

How old is your son?

For younger babies in daycare I would worry about Pertussis. (Not really worry per se, but I would be cautious). For younger and older children, rotavirus is very common in daycare centers due to workers not washing hands between diaper changes. Obviously the risk of flu is higher in that setting as well.

[thatblondegirl]

my son is 17mths old. he had the first 3 shots, not sure if that matters.

where do i find how to treat each disease if he were to contract it? i saw in the other thread how you laid everything out and it's awesome!! thanks! now how do i find how to treat each thing if he were to get it?

[JamieBrewHa]

I have this question too... well not for me - but my sister who is having a baby, will be breastfeeding but will be in day care (granted not real daycare - at her MIL's house with the baby's two cousins) as of 10-11 weeks old.

But I also really get frustrated by the implication that if you dont vax, it's ok if you avoid contact with other kids. Ok no daycare - what about playgroups? family gatherings? etc etc?

Anyone else - thoughts?

[nummies]

Originally Posted by thatblondegirl

my son is 17mths old. he had the first 3 shots, not sure if that matters.

where do i find how to treat each disease if he were to contract it? i saw in the other thread how you laid everything out and it's awesome!! thanks! now how do i find how to treat each thing if he were to get it?

HIB- IV antibiotics
PC- IV antibiotics for serious cases/ oral antibiotics for minor cases
Diptheria- Antitoxin and IV antiobiotics
Tetanus- Runs its course/ life support while paralysis wears off
Pertussis- Antibiotics/ comfort measures for cough
Hepatitis B (STD)- Not treatable
Rotavirus- Plenty of fluids/ nursing, probiotics/ allow it to run its course
Measles- Allow rash to run its course
mumps- allow rash to run its course
rubella- allow to run its course
chicken pox- allow to run its course
Hep A- allow to run its course
flu- antivirals can make it milder

Originally Posted by JamieBrewHa

I have this question too... well not for me - but my sister who is having a baby, will be breastfeeding but will be in day care (granted not real daycare - at her MIL's house with the baby's two cousins) as of 10-11 weeks old.

But I also really get frustrated by the implication that if you dont vax, it's ok if you avoid contact with other kids. Ok no daycare - what about playgroups? family gatherings? etc etc?

Anyone else - thoughts?

We don't vax and don't avoid any social situations. I think that stastically babies in daycare are sick more often therefore more likely to contract diseases. I honestly would worry more about the vax than the actual disease.

[Ophelia]

I've seen several posts here where doctors recommend the HiB vaccine when a child is going to be in daycare. Here is some good info on HiB and breastfeeding:

http://www.mothering.com/discussions...d.php?t=845418

[MsGrizzle]

My child has been in a home daycare since 4 months old and is not vaccinated. He is the healthiest one there. We do not avoid any social situations at all. He is 2 now.

[readytobedone]

DD is 16 months and completely unvaxed. she's been in small daycare since 11 months and just started at 'real' daycare 3 weeks ago. she's doing great health-wise; i don't worry a bit about her being unvaxed. she does have the sniffles, but so does every other kid in the place. it's that nasty green snot that i call "daycare nose."

[alegna]

Originally Posted by nummies

HIB- IV antibiotics
PC- IV antibiotics for serious cases/ oral antibiotics for minor cases
Diptheria- Antitoxin and IV antiobiotics
Tetanus- Runs its course/ life support while paralysis wears off
Pertussis- Antibiotics/ comfort measures for cough
Hepatitis B (STD)- Not treatable
Rotavirus- Plenty of fluids/ nursing, probiotics/ allow it to run its course
Measles- Allow rash to run its course
mumps- allow rash to run its course
rubella- allow to run its course
chicken pox- allow to run its course
Hep A- allow to run its course
flu- antivirals can make it milder

Tetanus- TIG



-Angela

[thatblondegirl]

thank you guys! every once in a while i start to second guess myself in my decision to stop vaxing. but then i just come back here, inform/empower myself and i feel better!

thanks!

[JamieBrewHa]

Originally Posted by nummies

HIB- IV antibiotics
PC- IV antibiotics for serious cases/ oral antibiotics for minor cases
Diptheria- Antitoxin and IV antiobiotics
Tetanus- Runs its course/ life support while paralysis wears off
Pertussis- Antibiotics/ comfort measures for cough
Hepatitis B (STD)- Not treatable
Rotavirus- Plenty of fluids/ nursing, probiotics/ allow it to run its course
Measles- Allow rash to run its course
mumps- allow rash to run its course
rubella- allow to run its course
chicken pox- allow to run its course
Hep A- allow to run its course
flu- antivirals can make it milder

WHen we dealt with pertussis, I leanred after the fact that antibiotics are not effective at all. That said, we also had oral steroids as treatment. Steroid breathing treatments were next on the list but we never ended up with them thankfully.

[EVC]

My 3 year old unvax'ed dd has been in daycare since she was 10 months old. She's as healthy as they come, and her vax status has never been a worry for us

[poppysmom]

My daughter was breatfed till 4m and then some soy formula was introduced (long story please don't jdge). Breastfed and soy formula till till 10m. She had the first soup of vaxes (DTap) and I totally regret it. She started at a mainstream daycare at 12m...i switched to a wonderful small home daycare at 13m. She is now 3 yrs and going back to the mainstream daycare which I do like but wanted to wait until she was older. She has never been vaxed since that first DTaP at 3m qnd I don't intend to ever do more. I have to believe that it's not a worry to be around other kids who are sick and vaxed and shedding and all that junk. I have to believe that the choices I've made are the right ones and that we can handle what comes along with the help of our liberal doctor and naturopath. Yes I worry but I will always worry more about the junk in those shots...overwhelming gut instinct that I have to go with...always.

[organicmommy05]

I bf'd for two years and my child is in daycare and has never been vaxed. Aside from a stomach virus here or there, she's never caught anything going around daycare.

[anewmama]

My Dd is 17 months and has been in daycare since she was 4 months old. Since then, she has had a bad diahhrea (possibly rota, not tested), possible staph infection, possible pneumonia, several fevers that lasted no more than 24 hours. She was once sick for 4 days before antibiotics (staph and pneumonia incident). She has had a constant runny nose (though less lately but it's summer) and an infrequent cough.

The daycare has posted the following health warnings in the past year (daycare has upwards of 70 kids from the infant room to the pre-school room): staph infection (throat but happened after my daughter's incident), lice, stomach bug and coaxsackie virus.

That being said, there is no proof that all of my daugther's illnesses originated from daycare.

My dd has been breastfed the entire time.


I would like to add some to the list since some of these do mean something else:



HIB- IV antibiotics
PC- IV antibiotics for serious cases/ oral antibiotics for minor cases
Diptheria- Antitoxin and IV antiobiotics
Tetanus- Runs its course/ life support while paralysis wears off
Pertussis- Antibiotics/ comfort measures for cough (antibiotics not particularly effective but if used early, might help)
Hepatitis B (STD)- Not treatable
Rotavirus- Plenty of fluids/ nursing, probiotics/ allow it to run its course
Measles- Allow rash to run its course (in other words, no treatment)
mumps- allow rash to run its course (in other words, no treatment)
rubella- allow to run its course (in other words, no treatment)
chicken pox- allow to run its course (in other words, no treatment)
Hep A- allow to run its course (in other words, no treatment)
flu- antivirals can make it milder (rest and plenty of fluids, but in other words, no treatment)


Letting something run it's course really means that there is nothing you can do to lessen the disease or speed it's passing. So if things really start to go haywire, you can't do anything about it. This is where the risk comes in. This is where people who vaccinate do so as they do not want that helpless feeling of standing by and just watching something that they cannot control and that could get out of control. If they believe in vaccines, this is doing something in their control. As some vaccines do work to a degree, this is something someone can do stop a runaway train. EVEN if it [vaccines] has it's own inherent risks that could spiral out of control.

And as for the cod liver oil and Sodium Ascorbate, that's a crap shoot. A) will your child take them when sick? My daughter didn't want to drink or eat anything let alone down cod liver oil. So this is probably really only an option for older children that you can reason with and communicate with and convince them to take... unless you want to force your baby to drink something B) it isn't going to always work or even work at all. I can't tell you how many times I have downed massive Vit C or SA or other type of herbal remedies to try to combat an illness to no avail and only got better when I took antibiotics. Even for things that I am told were viral; antibiotics ended up turning it around.... always. So I wonder how many more bacterial things are out there that act absolutely like viral illnesses. But every individual is different so this kind of treatment might work. But just don't count on it I guess.

I just feel you need to really know what the risks are. It's so easy to read the following: just take sodium ascorbate and that's an effective treatment. LIke all treatments, they don't always work and some are not even proven or have ever been studied. Just like some vaccines, they don't always work but many of them do work to some degree or another.

[nummies]

Originally Posted by anewmama

Letting something run it's course really means that there is nothing you can do to lessen the disease or speed it's passing. So if things really start to go haywire, you can't do anything about it. This is where the risk comes in. This is where people who vaccinate do so as they do not want that helpless feeling of standing by and just watching something that they cannot control and that could get out of control. If they believe in vaccines, this is doing something in their control. As some vaccines do work to a degree, this is something someone can do stop a runaway train. EVEN if it [vaccines] has it's own inherent risks that could spiral out of control.

And as for the cod liver oil and Sodium Ascorbate, that's a crap shoot. A) will your child take them when sick? My daughter didn't want to drink or eat anything let alone down cod liver oil. So this is probably really only an option for older children that you can reason with and communicate with and convince them to take... unless you want to force your baby to drink something B) it isn't going to always work or even work at all. I can't tell you how many times I have downed massive Vit C or SA or other type of herbal remedies to try to combat an illness to no avail and only got better when I took antibiotics. Even for things that I am told were viral; antibiotics ended up turning it around.... always. So I wonder how many more bacterial things are out there that act absolutely like viral illnesses. But every individual is different so this kind of treatment might work. But just don't count on it I guess.

I just feel you need to really know what the risks are. It's so easy to read the following: just take sodium ascorbate and that's an effective treatment. LIke all treatments, they don't always work and some are not even proven or have ever been studied. Just like some vaccines, they don't always work but many of them do work to some degree or another.

Yep, but I would still rather the disease "run its course" than deal with the issues that the vax will bring about. Adverse reactions and such.

[anewmama]

Yes, that's most definitely a choice. It's one I have made so far in regards to vaccines. But two vaccines stay in my mind and I don't know if is from so many years 4 decades of hearing about how dreaded the diseases are (tetanus and measles), but they are ones I am not sure I do want to watch run it's course. Of course, with tetanus, there is TIG but still. But still, haven't done them other than 1 DTaP when DD was 4 months. It scared me so much, I almost got ill afterwards. So I don't know what make me feel more in control.... possibly having to let a VPD run it's course or deal with the fear/terror and give the vaccine.

[nummies]

That is a choice that only you can make. But I really don't see the measles as deadly. I had it growing up as well as my entire family. For the two that you mentioned, I think it is important to focus on the fact that they are so rare. I mean, really rare. Adverse reactions to the vaxes are more common that the actual disease itself.

[Twinklefae]

My LO isn't in daycare full time, but I wouldn't vax even if he was. I worked in one, and while runny noses are epidenmic (and ear infections sometimes) I didn't really see a lot of other VPD's.

I also took DS to visit at two weeks old and let all the 3 year olds touch him. I don't worry about it.

ETA: So far as I know, it's the Dr. Sears book that really pushes the no-daycare view (although I don't know for sure, I haven't read it) I read "How to raise a healthy child in spite of your doctor" and the Aviva Romm book, and neither one mention it.