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WWYD...Head LICE!!! And Social Issues - Page 6

post #101 of 172
joeymama, I did read the OP's post. That's why I'm harping on about it- she didn't know, she didn't check and the neighbours didn't have enough sense to think that if they had passed them on to the little boy next door, then he's going to pass them back. Her vigilance could have saved that family, as well as her own, a lot of distress and discomfort. y'know?

Oh, and I use TV or music whilst combing out. To be honest, though, it's a nice chance for some 1-1 time and to talk quietly about our days, and the intimate contact seems to help relax them before bed. I normally follow it with a head massage for the older boys as well.
post #102 of 172
I had a dream, last night, that I had lice.

I kept combing and combing my hair and getting frustrated ds wouldn't give me some space because they were getting on him!

I think I should reread the ice cream float thread before I go to bed tonight. :
post #103 of 172
Quote:
Originally Posted by EFmom View Post
Maybe you like having bugs crawling all over you and gluing their eggs to your person. If so, that's terrific. Scratch away. Lots of people, however, find it completely disgusting, and have no desire to submit their loved ones to lice.
This just sounds so insulting; I didn't hear either of the British ladies say they "liked" lice, or that they'd ever just let their loved ones stay infested.

Again, it's comments like this that help me understand why a mother that's having a hard time getting rid of lice, might feel tempted to just quit saying anything to anyone.
post #104 of 172
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by flapjack View Post
joeymama, I did read the OP's post. That's why I'm harping on about it- she didn't know, she didn't check and the neighbours didn't have enough sense to think that if they had passed them on to the little boy next door, then he's going to pass them back. Her vigilance could have saved that family, as well as her own, a lot of distress and discomfort. y'know?

Oh, and I use TV or music whilst combing out. To be honest, though, it's a nice chance for some 1-1 time and to talk quietly about our days, and the intimate contact seems to help relax them before bed. I normally follow it with a head massage for the older boys as well.
I LOVE that you are making all of these assumptions.

We have only been playing with these neighbors for about 6 weeks. They have had it since BEFORE we started playing together. MY VIGILANCE could have saved the family that CHOSE NOT TO TELL ME THEY HAD LICE???? What are you even TALKING About???!!!!!!!!!
I know you might be so used to people having lice that you have to check your child's head daily, but it isn't like that where I live. My son is 5 yo and not in school. It is not common practice over here to daily comb for lice. We just don't have that big a problem with it.

My whole point in posting this thread was not to bash this family for giving us lice...it was trying to figure out how my son can be friends with them still yet NOT get lice over and over, because for me that just isn't acceptable, yk?

It seems like you are just trying to be argumentative, and you aren't really bringing anything productive or useful to this conversation. I am just not getting your point AT ALL.


.
post #105 of 172
Quote:
Originally Posted by limabean View Post
I meant that since the OP seems to be from a culture in which having lice is considered something highly unusual that must be swiftly dealt with, judging her from the perspective of someone living in a culture in which it's thought of as something that is just going to happen from time to time and it's not a big deal isn't totally relevant.
See, what I got from flapjack and orangefoot, was that they do see lice as something to be swiftly and proactively dealt with.

And, as an American, I think viewing lice as "highly unusual" is actually highly unrealistic. I'm not sure that our infestation-rates are much if any lower than the rates in England or Europe: It seems pretty darned common (as in, frequently occurring ) where I live. I mean, sure, there are a few kids who've never had it, but I think most families have had to deal with it at least once.

I think the British view is much more sensible -- where no one is ostracized but all the parents keep one another informed and do their treatments at the same time. I think this sensible view probably creates a climate where everyone feels comfortable speaking up if their child has lice, because they know their child can still continue with life as usual, as parents diligently work to solve the problem.

In contrast, a general perception of lice as "highly unusual" creates a climate where there's great shame in letting people know that your family has an infestation. Yes, I've stayed true to my conscience and let everyone know when we were dealing with it...

I'm just saying that I'd prefer a climate where it was easier to communicate about this, because I think the shame does cause some parents to cringe away from full honesty, which, as some here have pointed out, is likely to contribute to a situation where kids keep passing it back and forth, because no one's saying anything, and the kids aren't getting treated at the same time.

The British attitude seems a lot more proactive in the long run.
post #106 of 172
Quote:
Originally Posted by 4evermom View Post
I had a dream, last night, that I had lice.

I kept combing and combing my hair and getting frustrated ds wouldn't give me some space because they were getting on him!

I think I should reread the ice cream float thread before I go to bed tonight. :
:
post #107 of 172
I'm not being argumentative, you just refuse to see my point. At this point, all I can do is wish you well. Cheers.
post #108 of 172
Quote:
Originally Posted by dubfam View Post
It seems like you are just trying to be argumentative, and you aren't really bringing anything productive or useful to this conversation. I am just not getting your point AT ALL.
Well, I've certainly found her perspective helpful, and I think some others have, too. I'm sorry that you, the OP, haven't felt this way, but it is a public forum, and others come here for help, too, so if anyone else reading the thread is helped by flapjack, it's not a total waste for her to participate.

dubfam, I do hope things are quickly resolved for you guys, and that your little one doesn't have to to go through this again!
post #109 of 172
Thread Starter 
No flapjack, I am not GETTING your point.

It seems that you are really intent on pinning the blame for the lice on my family. It is really strange and I am not understanding WHY you are doing that.

I TOTALLY understand that a kid can keep re-infesting a family with lice, but that WASN'T the case this time.
Even the other family is admitting that they have had lice and WEREN'T TREATING IT. The Never Got Rid Of It. How can my son give lice to a family that already has it???

So It is not that I am unwilling to see your point...I am just baffled as to where you are even coming from.
I understand how lice are spread, and I don;t have judgment for people who get lice. Obviously now that my son has gotten it I will check his head more often. But I had NO IDEA he had been exposed. Had the other family acted responsibly we never would have gotten it. And I still caught it pretty darn early on and I DID save myself a lot of hassle by being vigilant and getting rid of it. Also by letting everyone know that DS had lice.


.
post #110 of 172
OT but when I take my DS to get his haircut they sell anti-lice products and it says on the sign that if they find lice that you are obligated to buy the products!

I'm kind of with limabean on the cultural differences. I grew up in the U.S. but all of my adult life I've lived in Europe.
No way would I send my DS to play at someone's house if I knew the kids had lice and no, I wouldn't have them over my house. I wouldn't take my DS to play at a playspace either if he had lice but I'm sure plenty of people do.

I doubt the parents would actually tell me if their kids had lice though, or think it necessary to do so. Just like my SIL doesn't think it's necessary to tell me that her son has conjunctivitis before we go over there.
post #111 of 172
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by mammal_mama View Post
Well, I've certainly found her perspective helpful, and I think some others have, too. I'm sorry that you, the OP, haven't felt this way, but it is a public forum, and others come here for help, too, so if anyone else reading the thread is helped by flapjack, it's not a total waste for her to participate.

dubfam, I do hope things are quickly resolved for you guys, and that your little one doesn't have to to go through this again!
She keeps telling me that it is my fault my son got lice and that we gave it to the neighbors. She has implied that I am a negligent parent because I wasn't checking my son;s head constantly for lice. I do not see how that has been helpful.

It seems like sometimes people want to throw flames...
post #112 of 172
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Needle in the Hay View Post
Just like my SIL doesn't think it's necessary to tell me that her son has conjunctivitis before we go over there.
post #113 of 172
Quote:
Originally Posted by mammal_mama View Post
See, what I got from flapjack and orangefoot, was that they do see lice as something to be swiftly and proactively dealt with.

And, as an American, I think viewing lice as "highly unusual" is actually highly unrealistic. I'm not sure that our infestation-rates are much if any lower than the rates in England or Europe: It seems pretty darned common (as in, frequently occurring ) where I live. I mean, sure, there are a few kids who've never had it, but I think most families have had to deal with it at least once.

I think the British view is much more sensible -- where no one is ostracized but all the parents keep one another informed and do their treatments at the same time. I think this sensible view probably creates a climate where everyone feels comfortable speaking up if their child has lice, because they know their child can still continue with life as usual, as parents diligently work to solve the problem.

In contrast, a general perception of lice as "highly unusual" creates a climate where there's great shame in letting people know that your family has an infestation. Yes, I've stayed true to my conscience and let everyone know when we were dealing with it...

I'm just saying that I'd prefer a climate where it was easier to communicate about this, because I think the shame does cause some parents to cringe away from full honesty, which, as some here have pointed out, is likely to contribute to a situation where kids keep passing it back and forth, because no one's saying anything, and the kids aren't getting treated at the same time.

The British attitude seems a lot more proactive in the long run.
:

that's what I was trying to say about my experiences in Holland in my PP.
post #114 of 172
Quote:
Originally Posted by orangefoot View Post
I offered him a severe haircut down to 3mm. He decided he would rather cut and be done with it in one go so off came the hair. His brother went under the clippers out of solidarity and they were both unrecognisable the next day when they went to school.
That is an easier option for moms of boys than for moms of girls.

Quote:
Originally Posted by orangefoot
Can I politely suggest to the pp who intimated that those of us from other cultures shouldn't judge US citizens that she might like to pop over to the tribal areas and see just how many of us here are not on US soil or have ever been. If you don't want culturally different perspectives then you might be on a very slippery slope. Being British does not exclude me from this forum any more than any other minority I might come from so please think before you say things like that.
I didn't get the impression anyone wanted to exclude non-US moms from any forum - just that we may have different perspectives based on location. I think culturally different perspectives are great, and often quite the learning experience for those of us who have done little to no international travel.

I can understand not calling everyone you know to broadcast the info; it isn't exactly joyful news. But you don't send your child to school or church or someone else's home while infected. You don't allow other kids to come over for playdates without first informing that child's parents. Making the default "the other mom should have been checking her kid's head every day" isn't fair IMO.

I absolutely have SO much sympathy for the kid and parents who have to go through the incessant hair combing/washing process and washing of everything from sheets to clothes to stuffed animals. And I'm not going to sign up for it by sending my kid there for a playdate before it is resolved.

When the OP's kid showed up (unknowing of the lice issue) on the neighbor's front porch, if the neighbor mom didn't want to be up front about the lice issue, the very least she should have done is tell the OP's kid "Sorry, Joey - my kids can't play today."
post #115 of 172
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kirsten View Post
I didn't get the impression anyone wanted to exclude non-US moms from any forum - just that we may have different perspectives based on location.
Well, when one poster was saying things like, "Maybe you like having lice crawl all over you ... if so, then scratch away, but some of us think it's gross" ... that's going way beyond just saying, "We have different perspectives based on location."

Quote:
I absolutely have SO much sympathy for the kid and parents who have to go through the incessant hair combing/washing process and washing of everything from sheets to clothes to stuffed animals.
Many of us have got rid of it without doing all that stuff. My family got rid of it (3 years with no recurrence) by treating our hair, hair brushes and accessories, and washing merely pillow-cases (doing nothing to pillows), and of course we washed our clothes -- we do that from time to time anyway.
post #116 of 172
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kirsten View Post
That is an easier option for moms of boys than for moms of girls.
Yes but it IS an option

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kirsten View Post
I didn't get the impression anyone wanted to exclude non-US moms from any forum - just that we may have different perspectives based on location.
Um depends on if they are saying it to you or not I suppose. I get the feeling that if flapjack and I weren't European then more people might be jumping up and down on our behalf.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kirsten View Post
Making the default "the other mom should have been checking her kid's head every day" isn't fair IMO.
Perhaps only once a week if you aren't aware of the problem is OUR default and is just one of those things like making sure your child is dressed appropriately for the weather or has shoes that fit properly.

I'm not going to post on this thread again lest I upset even more national sensitivities.
post #117 of 172
Quote:
Originally Posted by orangefoot View Post
Perhaps only once a week if you aren't aware of the problem is OUR default and is just one of those things like making sure your child is dressed appropriately for the weather or has shoes that fit properly.
I think this is at the heart of a lot of the cultural difference here. It would seem the in the UK a "good mother" is vigalent and deals with lice swiftly and efficiently if they should arise. In the USA a child of a "good mother" should never ever be allowed to be in the possition of having been exposed to lice in the first place, therefore checking ones child is already an admision of failure.

Now, we here (US MDC moms) know perfectly well that this is just hogwash, but it can be hard to move beyond our cultural baggage. We intellectually know that at somepoint or another our LOs may be exposed to lice, but emotionally we still would like to think that we have choosen the best school where this kind of thing just doesn't happen, or that b/c our LOs are clean they can't get infested. It's just kind of a bitter pill to swallow.

In the UK the reality that it can happen in any school, summer camp, or sports team seem to be less of a disconnect.

It's something I myself am not totally immune from. DS goes to a fairly large preschool with students from several surrounding towns. They recently sent home a flier about lice in a few of the public grade schools. I have to admit I was surpised that the cases happened to be in the wealthier towns and not in the more middleclass ones (happy though since we live in the less wealthy town.) I know that it was a silly reaction, but it is very ingrained into US culture that lice don't happen to clean wealthy people, so looking feels like an admission that you aren't clean.

So, I think the UK people should get a for living in reality, and us US moms need to admit to our cultural baggage and move past it. (Though if the UK moms could just accept that US moms come with the baggage and give up trying to understand it, b/c somethings just are hard to explain.)
post #118 of 172
Quote:
Originally Posted by eepster View Post
So, I think the UK people should get a for living in reality, and us US moms need to admit to our cultural baggage and move past it.
Yeah that! And your whole post made me : inside!
post #119 of 172
Quote:
Originally Posted by orangefoot View Post
Yes but it IS an option
not for a girl, it really isn't. I have seen what this technique can do to the soul and the self esteem of a young lady and it is abusive. There are many ways to get rid of lice without shaving your head, and yes I knwo this because I have battled them myself. Shaving a girls head is comitting social homicide on behalf o your daughter. not cool.
post #120 of 172
Quote:
Originally Posted by eepster View Post
I think this is at the heart of a lot of the cultural difference here. It would seem the in the UK a "good mother" is vigalent and deals with lice swiftly and efficiently if they should arise. In the USA a child of a "good mother" should never ever be allowed to be in the possition of having been exposed to lice in the first place, therefore checking ones child is already an admision of failure.

Now, we here (US MDC moms) know perfectly well that this is just hogwash, but it can be hard to move beyond our cultural baggage. We intellectually know that at somepoint or another our LOs may be exposed to lice, but emotionally we still would like to think that we have choosen the best school where this kind of thing just doesn't happen, or that b/c our LOs are clean they can't get infested. It's just kind of a bitter pill to swallow.

In the UK the reality that it can happen in any school, summer camp, or sports team seem to be less of a disconnect.

It's something I myself am not totally immune from. DS goes to a fairly large preschool with students from several surrounding towns. They recently sent home a flier about lice in a few of the public grade schools. I have to admit I was surpised that the cases happened to be in the wealthier towns and not in the more middleclass ones (happy though since we live in the less wealthy town.) I know that it was a silly reaction, but it is very ingrained into US culture that lice don't happen to clean wealthy people, so looking feels like an admission that you aren't clean.

So, I think the UK people should get a for living in reality, and us US moms need to admit to our cultural baggage and move past it. (Though if the UK moms could just accept that US moms come with the baggage and give up trying to understand it, b/c somethings just are hard to explain.)
great post.

As I've mentioned before, in Holland where I live, it's kind of yucky, but a normal part of childhood. "good" school in good neighborhoods get them, poorer gets get them. It's a fact of life, but not a social stigma. Thankfully!
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