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What would you do if CPS showed up at your door? - Page 2

post #21 of 50
I actually have asked them to leave. I took the baby outside with me so they could see that she was in great shape and then told them to get the hell out until they had talked to my doctor who could tell them what an outrageous claim they came for. (It always frustrates me that they come right out for bogus claims made by my crazy mom and sister but for kids that are really in danger they wait until the family has moved or tell me it's not abuse.)

They came and talked to my daughter at school about "cigarette burns" on her arms that were actually mosquito bites she had picked at. We had them treated by our pedi and by the Urgent care physician that week.
(Not because the bites were urgent, but because she had an asthma attack and he noticed they had become impetigo.)

Her teacher, whom I was taking a class with for educators, and could have just asked me about them, reported his suspicions.

They took both my children out of school bussed them to another location and interviewed them where they both said no one abused them. So they came to the house I guess to talk to me, see my 3rd child and see what else they could find. Now they've come a few times before because of my insane mother when I have refused to let her see my kids and they have caught me at bad times. LIke when my dad has been visiting and dropped a ton of laundry onto my living room sofa which they said was a health hazard. that time they had to come back in a week. So no way in hell am I letting ppl into my house to catch me cleaning up which I'm always doing to some degree.

Now another time I went to a house for a home visit and found 18 -24 inches of trash covering the living room floor and a child on braces with a disability lived in the home. They told me that the mother was disabled and the children were in no danger and that they were not finding on it. I was like wth, but clean laundry on a sofa is a health hazard? WTH?

So in our situation, I told the worker to contact our doctor and this could be cleared right up. The worker was very angry and tried to threaten me and did call and call for two days demanding to come in. I called my dr. and got the proof just in case she came back to my door. I also asked to speak to her supervisor. They did call back in a few days to say our doctor had confirmed that they were insect bites and we had sought treatment for them and the complaint was being dismissed.

I was very irritated with the whole complaint and investigation because from the get go my child told them they were mosquito bites and she got bitten at recess because they irrigate the danged fields. Duh. No one was investigating the school for stagnant water.
post #22 of 50
When CPS showed up at my door, I simply showed her the most recent paperwork from the district (showing that they'd received my paperwork and they found it satisfactory) and she was on her merry way.
post #23 of 50
Quote:
Originally Posted by applejuice View Post
How would you feel about a caseworker walking through your immaculate home, talking to your beautiful, healthy children in your absence, casting doubt on your venerable pediatrician, and outright lying? Do you think it does not happen?

It has happened to me and it has happened more than once.
I don't doubt it has happened. I don't doubt that it could possibly happen to me. I'm just not going to live my life in fear worrying about it when it's highly bloody unlikely.

How did they get into your house without you there?
post #24 of 50
Quote:
Originally Posted by lotusdebi View Post

I'm really bad with authority figures anyway, so I'm bound to be confrontational, and start spouting off my rights and yelling at them to get the hell off my property. Maybe I'd remember to get a business card from them first.
I'd definitely rather deal with court, where I (supposedly) have to be found guilty, than CPS where I have to be found innocent.
I'd probably do the same thing. If I know I'm right and someone wants to get all up in my business and argue about it, well, it ain't pretty.

I've actually been thinking about this a lot lately. I read mammal mama's thread and my heart sank. This sounds like something my sister would do and I feel like we aren't too far off from it either. Yesterday I was talking to my dad about it, maybe he can talk some sense into her. Otherwise I'm going to have to completely cut her off. At this point I wouldn't feel badly about it, she is more toxic than anything.
post #25 of 50
Quote:
Originally Posted by annakiss View Post
How did they get into your house without you there?
I was there. I never said I was not. I thought I was being co-operative with the sw from cps and believed I had nothing to hide, so I let them in. I co-operated with them, knowing I needed help with my teenage dd at a time my dh was undergoing cancer treatment.

I could not have been more wrong. I was in He77 for a year. That is the only way I can describe it.

Just as a person should prepare to protect their family in the event of a catastrophe as hurricane/earthquake/tornado/flood/fire, so should a person be prepared for the unlikely event that a government agent in the form of a CPS person would present themselves at their door. A person should know their rights in such a situation. If a person knows their rights, that person is likely to be more prepared in such a situation. I wish I had known. Things would have been more contentious, but more satisfactory FOR ME!
post #26 of 50
I wish I could give a nice tongue in cheek answer,"of course I'd let them in,have some nice adult conversation and a cup of tea" Unfortunately I've had to debate for a couple of weeks about calling them about a family I know.....and no I haven't called.
I wouldn't like it.Should definitely be a last resort.....
post #27 of 50
Quote:
I wish I could give a nice tongue in cheek answer,"of course I'd let them in,have some nice adult conversation and a cup of tea" Unfortunately I've had to debate for a couple of weeks about calling them about a family I know.....and no I haven't called.
I am a state credentialed teacher and am required by state law to report any suspected abuse case, and I do, but I know in reality, that doing so will not help the situation and may even make it worse.

I am a realist.
post #28 of 50
Quote:
Originally Posted by applejuice View Post
When CPS comes calling, there is no good answer.

If you let them in, they consider you waiving your fourth amendment rights. Anything they see can be misconstrued to fit their expectations.

If you refuse to let them in, they will return with a police officer who will try to persuade you.

You can refuse to let BOTH of them in, in which case they will have to prove their case before a judge and obtain a search warrant. If they return with a warrant, it is now a criminal case and they probably lied and exaggerated the facts to get the warrant.

My personal experience is that you have more rights in a criminal proceeding than a "family court" hearing.

But most people on these forums think if you have nothing to hide, let them in.

I suggest that you video and audio tape them if you let them since they should have nothing to hide either. And make sure you have plenty of tough looking relatives to witness the situation. And no matter what they say, they do not have the right to talk to your children without you there.

You have not been convicted of anything.

You have the right to face your accuser.
I agree with this.

I wouldn't let them in and would call my rep from the HSLDA with them standing there.


I don't have anything to hide... I have everything to protect.
post #29 of 50
I'm curious...what does everyone think would happen if you just never answered the door? Never returned a call, never allowed them into the home? What if they just couldn't get hold of you somehow?
post #30 of 50
that: If you're ever questioned on it

"oh, I'm sorry. I thought you were the Jehovah's Witness. Lovely folks, but they throw off our schedule".
post #31 of 50
Hi, I'm the OP from the "We've been hotlined" thread. When it happened to me, I responded way differently than the way I thought I'd respond, and the way I've encouraged others to respond if it ever happened to them. The following comment is a good springboard for me to share what I've learned --

Quote:
Originally Posted by applejuice View Post
Just as a person should prepare to protect their family in the event of a catastrophe as hurricane/earthquake/tornado/flood/fire, so should a person be prepared for the unlikely event that a government agent in the form of a CPS person would present themselves at their door.
Yes, we should learn everything we can ahead of time and be prepared. But, in the event of any catastrophe, we should also have the flexibility to respond to the actual situation at hand -- which may or may not totally fit with the "protocol" we've learned.

When it happened to me, although I'd always heard (and advised others to) "Never let them in without a warrant, never sign anything" -- all I can say is my gut told me that letting her come in and do her assessment felt like the best thing in that particular situation.

I guess I won't know for sure 'til it's all over, but in my case it looks like not letting her in would have caused her to send the report of suspected educational neglect to the school board, who would have sent it on to the prosecuting attorney. This may still happen, but I'm hopeful that maybe her assessment gave her the assurance that this was unnecessary.

And if I'd refused to sign her assessment-finding, I wouldn't now have the copy of this paper stating that our home is safe for our children.

Quote:
A person should know their rights in such a situation. If a person knows their rights, that person is likely to be more prepared in such a situation. I wish I had known. Things would have been more contentious, but more satisfactory FOR ME!
Yes, I totally agree that we all need to know our rights!

I knew I had a right to refuse the assessment -- but I'm glad I followed my gut-instinct to go along with it this time.

I don't know for sure, but I'm guessing that if one of my relatives made another bogus call tomorrow, with this social worker having just assessed me and found no concern, they'd be more likely to disregard that call.

My friend who refused to let the social worker in, did eventually get a case-closed letter -- but it took about 6 months, during which time she had to meet with CPS about 3 times, and jump through numerous paperwork-hoops.

It looks like I should expect my case-closed letter within about 1 1/2 months -- and by that time if I still haven't heard anything from the school board or prosecuting attorney, I'll feel pretty safe in assuming that they were never contacted.

But I can't say for sure what I'd do if this happened again. I now think each case is different, and, as I've just said, we should all arm ourselves with the facts and know our rights -- but then allow ourselves room to be flexible and assess the situation at hand.

applejuice -- I know I've said this before, but I am so sorry about all you've been through!
post #32 of 50
Quote:
Originally Posted by mama in the forest View Post
I'm curious...what does everyone think would happen if you just never answered the door? Never returned a call, never allowed them into the home? What if they just couldn't get hold of you somehow?
Good idea. Try it.

Ask yourselves: how do you think you would be treated?

If you think you will be treated as well as the Ramsey family whose own dd was found dead in their own home and another child having died years before, think again. I have no opinion as to their guilt or innocence, but I have a huge problem with the way they were treated versus the way the ordinary middle class person would be treated in the same situation. They were able to pack up and move to another state shortly thereafter without even selling the house, indicted, or being on trial. Do you think seriously that you could do that if your child was found dead in your home after being reported missing?
post #33 of 50
apple juice, I don't know what family you're speaking of, but I was just honestly curious what people thought.
post #34 of 50
Quote:
Originally Posted by mama in the forest View Post
I'm curious...what does everyone think would happen if you just never answered the door? Never returned a call, never allowed them into the home? What if they just couldn't get hold of you somehow?
My guess would be that if the call was not about serious abuse, they might just let it go, or it might get lost in the shuffle of all the more urgent stuff they were dealing with.

But if they thought there were any likelihood of children being seriously harmed, they'd probably eventually get a warrant and the police would break the door down.
post #35 of 50
Mammal mama: I definitely think listening to your gut is very important too.

applejuice: the Ramseys had another child who died?
post #36 of 50
Yes; ten years before in an auto accident.

Interesting how $ and power makes a difference in the justice system and CPS.
post #37 of 50
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sasha_girl View Post
We had CPS show up at our door once (my son, who was 3 at the time, was running around outside with no pants on and that offended someone driving by). I walked her through our house--in the front door and out the back door, so that she could see that our house wasn't a pit of squalor or something.
Exact same thing happened to me here after only living in this damn state 3 months: Dd got out naked and the next day they showed up at our door. I did let him in, I was in shock and didn't know what to do. He asked questions, wrote stuff down, peeked around downstairs (I told him no to upstairs, he was fine w/ that) and he left. One week later a woman sw came by to follow up and had all this wrong info that the male sw wrote down. Sheesh. (things like I'm single and dp is in nearby state...when I said we aren't married but have been together 8 years, all his family is in nearby state. this was an answer to why we moved here from west coast) She corrected wrong info, didn't even ask to come in, did ask about ds who is 6 (hs age is 6 here) and I told her we would send letter in eventually and she said fine. She left and the next week we got a closed case letter (but says we are on permanet record in this state ) Luckily it went okay and was easy and done. But I do fear that some nosey person will call again eventually b/c I homeschool and the school is 2 doors down. Luckily we are moving back west and out of this state for good (!) in May. But then there is the homebirth in December to worry about. Dp thinks someone will call for that and he may be right.

I hate that it happened. I hate that I live in fear that it could happen again. I hate that my children saw this person snooping around our house and asking me questions. It's not fair and I hate that i'm on permanent record here for good.
post #38 of 50
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lemon Juice View Post
But then there is the homebirth in December to worry about. Dp thinks someone will call for that and he may be right.
You're not telling your neighbors you're having a homebirth, are you? We had our 2nd at home, while living in a duplex, and the people in the other duplex said they didn't even hear me. I thought I'd been pretty loud, but I guess not that loud. So it seems likely that if you haven't told people about the homebirth, they likely won't even notice.

Quote:
I hate that it happened. I hate that I live in fear that it could happen again. I hate that my children saw this person snooping around our house and asking me questions. It's not fair and I hate that i'm on permanent record here for good.


You mean it actually said in the letter that you're on permanent record? When I got my letter stating that no case was being opened, it said nothing at all about there being a permanent record -- though I've pretty much assumed that there is a permanent record of the call, and also of the social worker's visit.

I mean, don't government agencies have to keep permanent records of everything? I think they must even keep records of all the reports they choose not to investigate, 'cause when a child died in our neighborhood due to starvation , the newspaper report mentioned the CPS calls on that family that were never investigated. So either those calls were on record -- or else maybe all the people who'd made calls came forward and said, "I called, and they never did anything."

While it doesn't feel great, knowing that if someone else happens to call (because of homeschooling or our other non-mainstream living practices), the person who takes the call can and probably will pull up the previous record ...

I don't know if it would be all that awful ... I mean, it's hard to know how things "work" in these cases, you know? I think if I, as a social worker, got a report of suspected abuse or neglect on a family, and I checked records and found that a worker'd already been to the home and found no concerns -- or, as they put it, "no need for further services at this time" ...

Well, I'd like to think that this would work in my favor, since I'd cooperated and obviously had nothing to hide. But who really knows? For all I know, they could be thinking of all the cases where the social worker "found nothing" and didn't open a case -- and then the child got murdered.

But if I'm right, and there's a record kept of every report whether it's investigated or not (and I think there must be) -- then that means lots of other folks are "on permanent record" and don't even know it.

The scary thing about CPS is it seems we can never really be proven "innocent" -- and our cooperation provides no guarantee that they won't show up at our door again. I guess it has to be that way to protect children -- it just seems so unfair to all the children and families who aren't asking to be "serviced" in this way.
post #39 of 50
Quote:
Originally Posted by applejuice View Post
I was there. I never said I was not. I thought I was being co-operative with the sw from cps and believed I had nothing to hide, so I let them in. I co-operated with them, knowing I needed help with my teenage dd at a time my dh was undergoing cancer treatment.

I could not have been more wrong. I was in He77 for a year. That is the only way I can describe it.

Just as a person should prepare to protect their family in the event of a catastrophe as hurricane/earthquake/tornado/flood/fire, so should a person be prepared for the unlikely event that a government agent in the form of a CPS person would present themselves at their door. A person should know their rights in such a situation. If a person knows their rights, that person is likely to be more prepared in such a situation. I wish I had known. Things would have been more contentious, but more satisfactory FOR ME!
Applejuice,
I am afraid of CPS. I have nothing to be afraid of in that I'm doing nothing wrong. But we are poor. We live in a good area but we're on welfare and homeschool and don't vax. My dd is happy and thriving but I'm afraid my conservative neighbors or wacko mom will call or my in-laws in don't approve of homeschooling.
What would you do if you had to do it again?
post #40 of 50
If CPS showed up at our door, I would call my lawyer.
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