5 yo Ds slapped me on the face tonight

[lexbeach]

I am beside myself. I feel like we need major help with discipline. I don't know why my kids act out in the ways that they do (physically aggressive, verbally abusive, yelling, etc.). They are angelic when they are at school and/or in the care of other grown-ups. But for dw and I they can really be horrible. I feel like I've failed them somehow. And I really don't want them to grow up to be men who act like this. So demanding and demeaning and rude.

Help, please.

Lex

[Viola]

I don't have any help, but I wanted to offer commiseration. My almost 5 year old daughter can be very combative, rude, demeaning. She orders me around in harsh tones and calls me names (lately it's been fat bitch, fat stupid bitch). She's pretty good in school, though. There are times I'm convinced she just doesn't like me as a person, and it's very demoralizing. I try and be firm with my limit about the name calling and how she can treat me, but I'm also trying to not blow up about it because I feel like she is trying to get me to react.

[brendaziz]

My ds is very similar and what gets through to him more so than simply saying how he needs to treat people is just to try to over emphasize when how we are treating eachother around him. Obviously I'm sure that no one in the house is slapping each other in the face- but when those in my family try very hard to be extra extra overly kind and helpful in front of him (like we all should be all the time but it is hard to act like ALL the time!) :-) He tends to respond positively and want to treat everyone the same when he sees how wonderfully everyone responds to being treated nicely and it makes everyone want to treat everyone better. That being said I don't think you have failed him at all and all you can do is try to lead by example and hope/know that he WILL learn at some point.

[chfriend]

Did he just start kindergarten? That transition can be really really hard!

[mama*pisces]

Originally Posted by Viola

She orders me around in harsh tones and calls me names (lately it's been fat bitch, fat stupid bitch).

for you mama, and for the OP.

But I have to say Wow. Here I was worrying about the upcoming age 3 and thinking that I would be in the clear after that. Please oh please let ds never say anything like that, especially not in front of DH! We have enough conflicts over discipline; I'm pretty sure that hearing something like this directed towards one of us would send him over the edge. Eeek.

[lexbeach]

Originally Posted by chfriend

Did he just start kindergarten? That transition can be really really hard!

Yes, he did. He is having a bit of a rough time of the transition. And we just moved, and he's separated from his twin brother in school. I know there are lots of reasons for him to be acting out/regressing/etc., but I just can't fathom why he'd act out so violently.

It helps to know that some other kids act this way too. We don't have any friends with kids as old as ours, so I don't really have anyone IRL who I can bounce this kind of thing off of. I used to teach kindergarten, so I'm very familiar with this age, but of course it's so different when it's your own kids.

We were a very anti-punishment family until recently, when we've started having the kids take some "alone time" in their room as a consequence for really poor behavior (hitting, being destructive to the house). I'm not sure that it's working, but I don't know what else to try. I worry that my kids think they can walk all over me (is that the right saying?). I feel like I ask them nicely to stop doing something/think of a better way to express what they're feeling/etc. and they give me this look like, "what are you gonna do about it?" and then ignore me completely. It's so enraging. So we've started doing something, but I don't know that we're doing the "right" thing.

Lex

[lexbeach]

Originally Posted by mama*pisces

But I have to say Wow. Here I was worrying about the upcoming age 3 and thinking that I would be in the clear after that.

I don't think we're ever going to be in the clear, mama! In my experience it's continued to get more challenging as the kids get older, but for my dw it's getting easier. Babies and toddlers are easy for me. I worry about adolescence big time.

Lex

[Twinklefae]

I think that violence is a reasonable response. I follow your blog and you guys have had a LOT of changes lately. Violence is the last refuge of someone who's life is completely out of control. (Or so it feels to a child who has had everything change.)

The only thing I would suggest (and I don't have 5 yo twins, so you'll have to take this with a grain of salt.) is to make everything as STABLE as possible for awhile. Have a very predictable schedule, predictable consequences to behanviours if that's what you choose, and just do your best to have everything be exactly the same for awhile. No new furniture, rules, routines, activities, vacations, etc. Just focus on finding the new routine.

I bet if you do that, the acting out will drop off (it may not go completely) within a month of so. I had a little guy in daycare once who had a lot of changes, and we (at home and daycare) really focussed on stable routines, and we really found it helped. YMMV.

I totally get how enraging it is to have a child hurt you. Hope things are better soon!

[LuckyMommaToo]

You know, I've found that when things are changing in DS's world (he just turned five), he really needs me to hold those boundaries tight for him. He's challenging, but he doesn't really want me to let him go, KWIM? So even though I consider myself GD, we do have consequences. It's almost like DS wants to know that I'm the adult and I'll help him when he's out of control. He doesn't have to worry about flailing around out there by himself.

Anyway, don't know if this fits with your situation or not.

When I first came to this conclusion (with the help of DS's preschool teacher; he had just turned four and was having a hard time), we wrote a contract, signed it, and then as soon as the contract was breached, straight to consequence, no warnings. (I was endlessly warning and wheedling, never really doing anything.) We saw a change within a week. I was very careful to be calm and strong. "We don't hit, time to go to your room." And whisk him away.

Hope you can find the right path!
-e

[PikkuMyy]

I don't have any practical advice for the moment but I will say,

OMG, I CAN'T BELIEVE THE TWINS ARE 5!!!!

They were 1 when I joined MDC and I just think of them that way when I see any of your posts.

[daniellebluetoo]

HI mama!

Mom of one 6yr ds, AND a holistic nanny here.

I've been thru hell with my kid, concerning his paternal genetic donor, physical and psychological abuse of me and my ds.

I can tell you that I agree with some of the other mamas, about change causing aggression. I've seen it, not only in my own, but in other children i've helped raise.

CONSISTENCY is key!!!!! Not just with his routine, but with your discipline.
You don't have to use violence, not at all, nor do I advocate it.

BUT, IMO, you SHOULD make known that sort of behavior is ABSOLUTELY not exceptable. Use your big mad mama voice, a stern look, catch her hand mid swing, hold it tight and tell her, HANDS ARE NOT FOR HITTING!!!!!

AND MEAN IT!

you can use a consequence if you choose, personally, I would, only because violence is a BIG issue with me due to what I've been thru. I've been thru this with my Ds, as a consequence, I would put him in another room/bedroom, and I mean physically escort him! Tell him that his behavior is unexcebtable and that he can join you, the group, the activity, when he's gotten himself under control. Then leave.
again, IMO, this allows them to center themselves, regroup, and it puts them in control of their behavior. at 5yrs old, this is definatley do-able!

Once ds/dd comes out after calming down. Ask for an apology, now's a good time to talk about what happened, WHY we don't hit, ect ect ect....
I always use phrases like... OUR family does/does not..... Hitting hurts and is unkind, and I KNOW you are a good boy/girl who cares about people, ect ect.... positive enforcement. I tell my kids that mistakes are for learning and you should ALWAYS try to fix a mistake you have made. I also REALLY encourage kids to use their words to express their emotions, help them describe them, I feel that helping them to give a voice to it REALLY helps, it's like when they are toddlers and they tantrum because they can't verbally express themselves they way they want to, it's the same thing.

Again this is just my opinion, and i've found works for me and mine.

Hugs to you mama, i KNOW how hard it is when our babies hurt us, it makes us feel SO sad and mad!!!

p.s. I would do this also for the mama with the daughter thats cussing at her!!! WORDS ARE NOT FOR HURTING.........

and all of this is just MHO...

blessings mamas!:

[musikat]

I don't have any advice, but I just wanted to say we are also two moms raising three boys. I am finding the aggression thing puzzling and difficult at times. My oldest is 6 1/2 and his attitude and mouth have been awful lately. He, too, gets physical when mad. It's very rough sometimes.

Karyn

[Jamie19]

Not much help buy my 5 year old told my DP that she hates me tonight. I spent two hours in bed crying (I've had a bad week) ((

[mamademateo]

i would respond to his behavior with compassion and empathy. he is screaming that his needs are not met. once he can figure out how to meet them i bet the violent behavior will go away. please also try to remember that young children do not percieve things the same way as adults. at 5 he is still learning about what his physical boundaries are. young children learn from experience. while i totally agree that a slap in the face for anyone can be a bit jarring,( i have very physical reactions when something is coming for my face including my ds(4.5) hands etc.) he is telling you he needs help meeting his needs. so i would gently take his hand off your face and gently tell him hands are not for hitting and that it hurts you. and when his is in a calmer place talk with him. try to figure out together what he may be feeling and needing. responding with compassion connects people and once yoiu are connected it is much easier to come up with a solution.
also , it is important for our children to know we love and accept them no matter what big feeling they are having( anger etc..) and how they choose to express it ( whether we "approve" of it or not) and one more thing, iwould give him space to work through the feelings that came from all the recent changes.
i hope this didn't come across preachy. i am also dealing with these same issues and and learning non-violent communication has been the one thing that has worked for me. hope this helps. hang in there.