Skagit Mamas it's Autumn! - Page 2

[aimlesslu]

Gosh, your grandparents are in my thoughts. I'm so sorry, so dreadfully sorry your family is going through this. Let me know if I can help - I can watch the kids for you if you need.

I don't know why talking about homeschooling/unschooling would be insulting. I've known some very succesfully homeschooled AND unschooled kids. I've also known personally some absolute train wrecks from the homeschool/unschool crowd. It is NOT the easy way out, but I think many groovy go-with-the-flow parents kind of gravitate to homeschooling/unschooling because they think it will be "easy" or "gentle" or "natural" or whatever expectation they have for it. To the contrary, it take ten times the effort and attention, in my opinion.

I recognize that involved parents by definition do homeschooling/unschooling. Misty's example of Robin's interest is great. Many many parents offer that level of homeschooling/unschooling without even thinking that's what they're doing! That group of ideas I'm comfortable with.

It's getting a reluctant child interested in calculus, or a poor problem solver to focus on the process when they'd rather do something else, or developing the writing skills those colleges find so important. Hard things are worth doing, I tell Sev, but sometimes they're HARD! My worry is that I'll not find the way to make the lesson (whatever it may be) learnable without being a drill sargent!

In the end I'll do homeschooling whether Sev attends public school or not; that is the way I am, that's what we do with his sister, that's our home philosophy anyway. I just don't know if I'll be a full-time homeschooler/unschooler or a part-time one. I have done a lot of research on the subject and above all else I recognize it is a huge undertaking and not the easy way out. I'm not worried that my kid can do it, I'm worried that I am up to the task!

[inthezoo]

Rachel, I'm sorry your family is going through this. I might be able to meet you today, if so I'll give you a call later.

Carrie, I wasn't really worried about offending you because I know if I say something stupid you would probably forgive me! I know there have to be lurkers here too and I was mostly concerned with people who dont know me well enough to know that I operate with my foot awfully close to my mouth most of the time.

When I first met my neighbor,they asked if we had kids because the school bus stopped in front of her house. I said that we did not yet but were looking forward to homeschooling and she instantly snapped back that kids need social interaction and if I homeschooled my kids they wouldn't know how to function in society. I have meet many public schooled kids who don't seem to be able to function in society and I would bet most child delinquents are not homeschooled. I was really surprised at the reaction, I guess I shared more than necessary but this person had just told me that her second child was an IUD failure and they had been done at one so I though personal information was acceptable .

Anyone interested in Frontier? I had thought I would have an order together this week but have not had time so if anyone else wants to join in lets put the order in next week. They sell Yummy Earth candies made with organic cane juice instead of refined sugar so I really want to get those here before Halloween events start. Here's the sales flyer for the month. You can right click and select "save link as" to put it on your computer if you have trouble getting it loaded on the internet.

[aimlesslu]

Originally Posted by inthezoo

she instantly snapped back that kids need social interaction and if I homeschooled my kids they wouldn't know how to function in society.

I guess family time, play groups, community meetings, etc. aren't social interaction. *sigh* Whatever will we do? We are so isolated in our little bubble of... society. HA!

[naturegirl]

I recognize that involved parents by definition do homeschooling/unschooling. Misty's example of Robin's interest is great. Many many parents offer that level of homeschooling/unschooling without even thinking that's what they're doing! That group of ideas I'm comfortable with.

I totally agree. We have been doing things similar with Ian but I guess I never really equated it to "schooling" of any sort but of just answering his questions and developing from his natural interests. I guess I am a closet unschooler. Lately with him it has been space and planets, tides and the ocean and geography. Whenever I mail a package from my store he asks where it is going. I really need to get him a map...

Like Amy, I just don't see how in depth mathematics and such come into normal day interests for children. Maybe I am wrong and it is just me...my hubby is great at using mathematical equations to build things so I guess it would come around one way or another.

Rachel So sorry about your grandpa. My dad had a heart attack about 3 years ago. We were home for a visit and if Rob and I hadn't been there and made him go to the hospital, he may not have made it. He had surgery and is doing much better now. I hope your grandpa recovers swiftly.

I just had my first bought of mastitis. It wasn't too bad because I caught it early and got a lot of rest and did all my "natural" remedies. It lasted about 24 hours and now I am feeling better. I had it about 3 times with Ian and was hoping to avoid it with Owen but no such luck. When I over do it my body sure lets me know!

[inthezoo]

As far as mathematics and writing go, I don't think even school programs can make a child learn if they really don't want to do it. Math has never been my thing, Doug tells me I try to make it harder than it is trying to see abstracts that are not there. He will be teaching higher math, I expect we will both be teaching writing since it is of interest for both of us. I try to write a blog everyday, it's one of the few things I can do and feel like and adult doing it without having to leave the house. It keeps me sane. Doug has aspirations to write a book. He writes articles here and there too. As far as reading goes, there isn't a window that would be missed if I didn't push for the kids to learn by, I believe they will come to it when they are ready and I also believe they will come to all things when they are ready too. When we hit a point that I can't teach what ever it is they need to know, we could hire a tutor or send them to classes in what ever subject it is they need.

I'm wondering do you use calculus on a regular basis? If you do then it must be something useful that you would likely end up teaching. If it's not, why teach it? Do you remember it and did you enjoy it? If you do and you did, there's a chance you can pass on your love of math as well, but if it's not helpful why does he need to learn it? If he doesn't lose his zest for learning and there comes a time he needs to know it, he will have the knowledge base to absorb information needed to retain it.

I fear that public school programs stomp out a lot of curiosity by instilling that rules, schedules and group structure is more important than a individuals interest. It's just a fact that groups as large as classes are with the teacher ratios as they are required some form of crowd control and seem to use a strong base of punishment and rewards I don't agree with. Alfie Cohn has some books on this subject that seem very interesting. Punished by Rewards is next on my reading list.

Then there is the matter of the WASL. I admit I'm always relieved to see how poorly our county schools do on this test. It shows what ever they are teaching they aren't just teaching to the test. I have a couple of friends who work in public school systems who admit that it is a real problem that teachers can't teach anymore because they are suppose to be getting kids to pass these tests. If the requirements get stricter then they are and kids to have to pass the tests then public school will be a waste of time, a lot of time.

How about the mass drugging of our children through medical evaluation programs that we may not even have a choice to decline. Ok, I'm sure now I'm coming off as a true conspiracy theorist but oddly there used to be many articles from varied reliable sources now I can only find a few at all. Anyway here's the link to one.

[inthezoo]

Originally Posted by aimlesslu

I'm not worried that my kid can do it, I'm worried that I am up to the task!

There is also no reason why you couldn't send them to highschool later on. Many homeschoolers choose to do that. By choosing to homeschool you are in no way making a life long decision. You can always choose to enroll if you find your not up to the task and you have lost nothing!

[aimlesslu]

Yes, Alfie Kohn is a great parenting philosopher and I've gotten a number of wonderful parenting ideas from him. He is also a highly educated man.

As far as calculus is concerned, yes, it was a requirement for my degree. I enjoyed it (as torturous as it was) and moved on. However, my dear friend the wetlands bioligist uses higher math every single day, doctors and naturopaths use higher math, nuclear engineers, research scientists, pilots, astronauts use higher math as part of their daily work. That I do not does not have any bearing on whether or not I feel it's a valuable tool.

There are good and bad parts of both homeschooling/unschooling and public group schooling. I'm still deeply considering which aspects of both would be a positive for my family and which aspects might detract from my family. There is no easy answer (true for any parenting issue).

The rabbit hole of life goes deep, and there are more things under heaven and earth than dreamed of in one person's philosophy (to butcher Shakespeare and the Matrix all at once). I only hope that the decisions I make for Sev now (or when he's 8, or 13, or 15) don't inadvertantly cripple his choices for the future.

Based on the previous discussion of unschooling, I was curious whether people in this thread had chosen to homeschool/unschool and what brought them to that decision. It seems there are a variety of philosophies!

[strawberryfields08]

Hi All
Back from the hospital for today. I rushed there this morning so that someone would be there to understand the doctor and then he never showed. I waited for 8 hours with both of my kids and now I am so frazzled. It looks like he will meet with the family tomorrow morning. Things dont look good. Grandpa doesn't want the surgery (right now he is not even a candidate)(but I am not sure he completely understands what is going on) and NO ONE else in my family seems to understand that he is not going home to live the way he was until his heart gives out. He can't even sit up for a long time and it is looking like he will permanently be on oxygen. Not to mention his lungs filled back up with fluid in less than 24 hours once they dropped the lasiks he had(they didn't even stop giving it to him intraveniousy just dropped the dose)So that is not a good sign. They all think because he is talking that he is well. Grandma is begining to understand but she can't be alone and I am having such a hard time figuring out how to help everyone understand that we have to figure out how we are going to deal with this. I am all for him making the decision if he doesn't want surgery. I will stand by it, however we need to figure out how to deal with what that means for us. We are a close family so you would think it would be easy, but nothing in a family is easy. It is especailly hard because of my dad being gone already. He was always the voice of reason
Anyway not to be so sad I just need a little venting is all.

As for calculus...Jesse is a carpenter (an excellent one! I am very proud of him!) and he uses it every day. They have lots of calculations for the different things they have to figure out.

OK now I have to prepare my life to be back at the hospital before 8.

[naturegirl]

So sorry about your grandpa. You are being so strong and helpful for your family. Make sure you take care of yourself and those kiddos too.

[aimlesslu]

I'm home all day Thursday so if you want to drop the kids off here I'll be happy to help out - or if you want I can bring you lunch to the hospital, or come get them there and take them for a walk. Let me know, call me!

[nurnur]

I left out the part of my dad's heart troubles ending 2 years ago, I didn't know if it would be supportive or scary but after thinking about it I decided to share it. Birth and Death are so powerful and mysterious to me not to mention LIFE wich encompasses both of these! That must be why I am so drawn to do Birthwork. Anyway, the day after the twins turned 6 our car broke down, it was a long weekend and we decided to call my Father and see if he and his wife(of 3 years) could watch all 4 of the kiddos so we could go car shopping, they said sure and we drove up to b'ham to drop them off. You can never just drop and run with my very social Father, so we talked and shared and then said goodbye with a big Dutch kiss right on the lips (my father was an immigrant). 30 minutes after we left and after he had just been outside with my kids playing (they had since gone in to get a snack from Grandma) he fell over face first into the flowerbed in cardiac failure (we now say he died kissing the Earth he so loved!) Grandma went outside approx. 5 min after his heart stopped rolled him over and began some mouth to mouth and chest compressions but she new he was already gone. Lincoln (8.5 at the time) was asked to call 911, but he dialed 911911911911911 repeatedly and it did not work, he came out to tell grandma it wasn't working, and so she then asked him if he could do some of what she was doing (chest compressions) while she dialed, he did this, but Grandpa was already gone, the girls watching from the window. This story seems very tragic of course, especially in our culture where Death and Birth and anything of the sort is hidden away behind white sheets and closed doors, but to me this experience was a gift. My children saw Death as another normal aspect of life, (Grandma helped with this being the calm person that she is), and although we were all sad and I was in shock upon returning (they didn't have my #, because my Father had kept that in his head) from car shopping 4 hours after it was all over, it was still a very bonding and awe inspiring thing for us all to experience. I know some of this is on a Spiritual note, but I do not believe that it was by chance that we happened to go up there this day, that I was able to kiss my dad, or that my children witnessed Death. In a 2 year period they witnessed Birth (of Winter in the living room) and Death in a very special way. We discovered later that my Father had been taking beautiful pictures on his camera of sunrises and sunsets each day of the week leading up to his death, like he knew something. He had put new wall paper up and laid some hardwood flooring in the living room as his Valentine's gift to his sweet wife (he was a bachelor since my mom left when I was 6) he died Feb.19th, 2006. ....Rachel I hope that whatever happens with your Grandfather and whatever your family experiences in it's wake will be a gift, an opportunity to learn more about yourself and about Life. Keeping you in my prayers

[strawberryfields08]

Update

Thanks Carrie for your story.
My grandpa refused the surgery and asked to sign a DNR order. Shortly after that they released him from the hospital. I assume they figured there was no sense keeping him there. The problem was that my grandma thought that meant he was fine. He already today is short of breath and has pains in his chest. It won't be long. But I think he has a peace with dying and he knows he is lucky to have this time with us to say goodbye.
Now I don't mean to be a complete downer.....Last night Jesse's older brother was in a car accident in Idaho and he broke his neck. He is paralyzed from the chest down and they say it is permanent. They care flighted him to Boise and they are going to do surgery to fix the vertabrae that is broken in half, but they said that would not repair the paralysis. He is only 25 and has 5 small children. My wonderful FIL won't even drive 5 hours to be with him. So Jesse is going to try and be there soon. He doesn't get time off and they are laying off right now so he can't miss work. He is going to wait until next weekend since he is currently sedated and will be after his surgery as well. But he is afraid of being gone when Grandpa dies. It is a mess right now. Thanks ladies for being a group of support for me. I really appreciate it.
I hope you all are having better weeks than we are. How was Lucy?

[naturegirl]

Oh my goodness Rachel. My thoughts and prayers are with you and your family. What a tragic week you have had. I am glad your grandpa has come to terms with things and you had this time to say good bye. How sad about your brother-in-law. It is always so shocking when someone so young has such a horrible thing happen. Hopefully he can prove them wrong and get some function back.

I am thinking about you and your family.

[inthezoo]

Oh Rachel, I'm crying for your family. It's so sad I don't even know what to say. s is all I can come up with. Your in my thoughts.

We didn't go to see Lucy yet. We are planning on going either next Thursday or Saturday, I'm not sure which, maybe both.

Did anyone try the farm tours this year? We made a slight effort. The kids were sleeping when we got to Hedlin for the pony ride and the line was long, it just started raining and huge dust clouds were floating by on the gusts of wind so we decided to skip it. We went to Gordon Farm for hot apple cider and walked around while the kids slept cozy in the stroller covered by the rain guard. I couldn't take the wind so we left and decide that was enough so came home.

[nurnur]

The weather deterred us from the Farms. Winter is begging for a horse ride and I was thinking of setting something up at Lang's pony farm, we did a bit of pony riding when the twins were younger there and it was a lot of fun, a bit muddy, but fun! Would you all like to make a field trip out of it? There is a trail that the kids ride along and mamas/dadas walk along side.

[aimlesslu]

Oh, Rachel. I'm so sorry. My thoughts are with your family. If there is anything I can do to help - I can make you a meal and bring it over, I can do your dishes, I can fold laundry for you. Anything, I would love to help.

Take gentle care of yourself.

[Doula Dani]

Ooooh! The Mt Vernon Halloween Bash might be fun. Has anyone done that before?

Cheryl (or anyone else interested), I'm taking submissions for articles for my doula site regarding childbirth. If you're interested in writing any (or have any written already) that you'd like to have me post, let me know! I thought you might have something regarding the importance of chiro care during pregnancy...


I'm providing a link back to whoever's site (up's your google rank and brings you up higher on search engines- I've really been neglecting mine lately!).

There's a link to it at the top of my blog (in siggy).

[inthezoo]

Playgroup today? How about at the mall, I'm not sure what it looks like in town but out here everything is still wet and really cold today :

[naturegirl]

Hey Dani,

Here is a link to an article I wrote for Earth Mama Angel Baby. I am on their expert panel and have a couple of articles there. You are welcome to link to that. Let me know if you need/want a different article. My computer at work that I write articles on crashed and we are still recovering data so it may take a while to get a good article to you.

I won't make it to play group today but wanted to remind everyone of our meet and chat at Commonground on Wednesday. We will meet at 5-5:30 and hang out as long as you can stay or until they kick us out...I think they close at 7. Kiddos are welcome but if you want to really relax and chat with the ladies I would recommend bringing wee little ones only as there isn't a whole lot to keep the older ones occupied other than ourselves. I plan on having Ian at gma and gpa's but will definitely have Owen there.

We are trying to make this outing kind of a moms night out once a month if we can. You all know a couple of hours to ourselves can be bliss after a hectic day. Of course if you want to bring your little one we would be more than happy to see them too.

Oh and I am officially back in the office starting tomorrow so feel free so send all your pregnant friends for chiropractic care.

[anemos]

What time are folks meeting up at Common Grounds tonight??