I've gone back to read some of the threads and several times we have agreed on things, but it wasn't apparent.
DD is only one, so everything I say is still theory to me. I don't plan to go around all day saying do x before y, not that anyone implied that--just making an extreme example because I think we are somewhat jumping on each other assuming that we are all in the opposite corners of extremes.
I suspect we are all sort of in the middle somewhere.
For example, like stickey, I don't plan to use a lot of rewards like a toy for you if you behave in the restaurant. My thought is that if my dd can't behave in the rest. then we leave--not as a punishment, but as a consequence. Just like if I don't feel like being quiet, I won't go to an art museum--I'll go to the zoo instead.
Also, I think we all got mixed up in age appropriate stuff. We were all using different examples with different ages and I couldn't process it very well.
In my op I was talking about how I was raised. I remember being about 8 or 9 and getting up every Saturday morning and doing my chores as fast as I could so that I could go outside. Saturday was chore day for the whole family. I also got an allowance for it. Mom taught us to make our bed and do our dishes and I don't remember it being a struggle (from a kid's pointdon't know about my mom--I'll have to ask her). It was just what we did. We could watch a few cartoons after school, but then it was homework time. After homework we could watch tv again or play Atari (can you tell how old I am?).
When I was a toddler, mom said the first time I had a meltdown in the grocery she just left...basket and everything and took me home. She had to do that two times and then I never did that again.
Mom never yelled, but she did a whole lot of reminding...'that doesn't belong there, it goes in your room'.
Now I am an adult and being neat is not easy for me, I really struggle with it. I can't imagine how I would be if mom didn't work with me. My mom is my hero and I hope to be as gentle and loving as she was and is.
I just can't bring myself to view her as manipulating me into doing chores. I guess in the LITERAL sense of the word one could say that it is manipulation. But the way it came across to me as a kid was, gotta do this first and then I can have fun and mom was a gentle leader reminding and encouraging us to take care of our responsibilities in a timely fashion.
I hope North of 60 is still here! If not I thought that was a cute way to exit! Maybe she's still at the park?