Advice With "Good Intentions"

[Cherry Alive]

In February we are expecting our first child.

The other day I was talking with my prenatal yoga teacher after class. She asked if I was planning a natural birth. When I excitedly said, yes. She said that she has some important advice—and that was not to let things go on too long. She said her labor was 24 hours long with 3 hours of pushing. If she had to do it over again, she'd have just asked to have the hospital to "cut it out."

Not sure what to think about this. While I don't care for unsolicited advice, I got the sense she was trying to be helpful (rather than scare me). I don't know the circumstances of her labor (and I wasn't going to ask), but I had from other things she mentioned (it was her first) appeared that she didn't know much about birthing going in—aside from the fact natural birth is *ideal*.

At the same time, I don't want to be overly confident, either. I'm doing everything I can to be ready—I chose a reputable birthing center, I'm getting lots of exercise, good nutrition, I'm reading up (dh & I are reading the Birthing Partner), and we're both going to take some classes (Hypnobabies and Bradley).

But what if things still don't work out the way I want them to?

I've been getting some negative vibes from women who haven't experienced it (especially certain relatives), and act like I'm super naive to even expect this. My yoga teacher didn't give me that vibe, but hearing her advice has sort of made me wonder.

[PassionateWriter]

just read and learn. thats really the only advice i can give anyone.

my labors are always long. always more then 36 hours. first 2 ended up being a c/s b/c well....it was too long for teh OB's. 3d was w/ a MW and was a VBAC and went wonderfully. same deal though...long. but sooo much better than the ones where they just "cut it out".

dont take anyone's advice is my advice.

here is a list of books (there are other great ones but these are the ones i read):

# Aromatherapy During Your Pregnancy, Fances R. Cliffford
# Unassisted Homebirth, An Act of Love, Lynn M. Griesemer
# The Thinking Woman’s Guide to a Better Birth, Henci Goer
# Birth Over Thirty-Five, Sheila Kitzinger
# The Natural Childbirth Book, Joyce Milburn & Lynnette Smith
# A Good Birth, A Safe Birth, Diane Korte & Roberta Scaer
# The Birth Partner, Penny Simkin
# Unassisted Childbirth, Laura Kaplan Shanley
# Water Birth Unplugged,Proceedings of the First International Water Birth Conference, Edited by Beverley A. Lawrence Beech
# Pushed,, Jennifer Block
# Taking Charge of Your Fertility, Toni Weschler
# Birthing From Within, Pam England & Rob Horowitz
# Hypnobirthing: A Celebration of Life, Marie F. Mongan (2 copies)
# Hypnobirthing, Marie Mongan
# Heart & Hands, A Midwife’s Guide to Pregnancy & Birth, Elizabeth Davis
# Ina May’s Guide to Childbirrth, Ina May Gaskin
# Emergency Childbirth, A Manual, Gregory J. White

[Cherry Alive]

Thank you! That is wonderful advice.

I will look up a bunch of those books (*love* the Birth Partner).

I'm thinking part of it could be a state-of-mind type of thing. I ran a marathon, but I know birthing will be nothing like it... Still, I hope to think I can use that "keep going" mentality that I had when I hit the wall (I felt like I was Homer in the episode of the "Simpsons" where he saw beds flying by as he was sleep-deprived and driving ).

I used to have horrendous menstrual cramps...the kinds that would buckle me over in so much pain it'd make me throw up sometimes. Then one day, I started using some relaxation techniques that I had been using at a Pilates/Yoga class. When the pain came on, I'd lay down. Then I'd imagine my uterus was a tight flower bud or fist. Then I'd imagine it gradually opening up. The cramps would go away or at least become tolerable.

I'm hoping I can maybe get into that same frame of mind with birthing, but I hear parts of it (particularly transition) can be quite a shocking experience.

I have to admit...I'm sort of a thrill seeker, and I'm intrigued as to what it's going to be like—especially as it seems to be different for each woman and each birth. There is something amazing to me about knowing our bodies and working through (and with) pain. Pain is scary...but it has to be there for a reason.

I just don't want to be cocky and end up feeling terrible if things don't work exactly as planned. I'm kind of a control freak so it's a major weakness of mine. I'm hoping when we start some of our classes, we can talk through those things with the teachers. One of my midwives has been getting me to open up a little about it.

[dinan6]

I also had long labors my first was 20 hours, second was looking to be the same but ended up c/s because like posted before it was to long for the ob and my last was a vbac 34 hours completely natural and wonderful....so, I have really long labors but it's not all really intense or crazy hard usually for me the last couple of hours are the hardest to pull through. I read a lot and educated myself as much as possible... hired a doula...that all helped a lot. Good advice I got was to rest when I could while in early labor so I didn't tire out... I hope this helps you.... Good advice is to not take others advice...everyone's births are different so you really just have to prepare yourself the best you can, you may go really fast or really slow..good luck..

[superfastreader]

Originally Posted by Red_Lil_Mamma

I'm thinking part of it could be a state-of-mind type of thing. I ran a marathon, but I know birthing will be nothing like it... Still, I hope to think I can use that "keep going" mentality that I had when I hit the wall (I felt like I was Homer in the episode of the "Simpsons" where he saw beds flying by as he was sleep-deprived and driving ).

I used racing imagery to prep for my birth & I think that a marathon is actually the *best* comparison out there. You are working hard, you know there is a finish line but you stay in the moment. "I am doing this now." Your marathon headspace is just where you want to be for labor.

I used to have horrendous menstrual cramps...the kinds that would buckle me over in so much pain it'd make me throw up sometimes.

This was me for 12 years. Labor was easier, at least mine was b/c it was only 8hrs. I've also had a root canal w/o novacaine & transition was a zillion times easier.

[mntnmom]

Accept that it probably won't be like you "expect". Form the very beginning our kids have a way of reminding us to be flexible.

It sounds to me like you are doing everything right. Short of a genuine medical emergency I have no doubt you will get your natural birth. Just remember, you can work towards transcendence, but you can't schedule your epiphany.

[purplemoon]

Originally Posted by Red_Lil_Mamma

Thank you! That is wonderful advice.

I will look up a bunch of those books (*love* the Birth Partner).

I'm thinking part of it could be a state-of-mind type of thing. I ran a marathon, but I know birthing will be nothing like it... Still, I hope to think I can use that "keep going" mentality that I had when I hit the wall (I felt like I was Homer in the episode of the "Simpsons" where he saw beds flying by as he was sleep-deprived and driving ).

I used to have horrendous menstrual cramps...the kinds that would buckle me over in so much pain it'd make me throw up sometimes. Then one day, I started using some relaxation techniques that I had been using at a Pilates/Yoga class. When the pain came on, I'd lay down. Then I'd imagine my uterus was a tight flower bud or fist. Then I'd imagine it gradually opening up. The cramps would go away or at least become tolerable.

I'm hoping I can maybe get into that same frame of mind with birthing, but I hear parts of it (particularly transition) can be quite a shocking experience.

I have to admit...I'm sort of a thrill seeker, and I'm intrigued as to what it's going to be like—especially as it seems to be different for each woman and each birth. There is something amazing to me about knowing our bodies and working through (and with) pain. Pain is scary...but it has to be there for a reason.

I just don't want to be cocky and end up feeling terrible if things don't work exactly as planned. I'm kind of a control freak so it's a major weakness of mine. I'm hoping when we start some of our classes, we can talk through those things with the teachers. One of my midwives has been getting me to open up a little about it.

Don't let other women scare you, labor is different for everyone. To me the contractions felt just like a charlie horse from below the breast to my thigh. So tight, uncomfortable, and eventually in transition, very painful.

At the same time, relaxation techniques, marathon experience and the thrill seeking personality will help you a lot. Learning how to focus, use of counter techniques, massage and visualization will help you achieve your goal.

I found transition, or the beginnings of it, to be an enterance into laborland. A land where I was in deep meditation and deep pain. The rewards of the endorphins, the high, the other wordly aspect was facinating and enriching for me. However, to get there, I wasn't seperated from the pain, the pain was what got me there.

I also learned in my labors that the moment I think to myself, honestly and undebatable, that I cannot do this anymore, it only becomes easier. Both times as this thought came into my head I was 30 minutes from pushing. The break from contractions until pushing gives a second wind and the pushing can feel so good.

You can do it, it has been done before, think of all the women that came before you, know that this too shall pass, and the second the baby is out you will have no pain.

Good luck to you!

[meganmarie]

She said that she has some important advice—and that was not to let things go on too long. She said her labor was 24 hours long with 3 hours of pushing. If she had to do it over again, she'd have just asked to have the hospital to "cut it out."

Okay, this is just absurd. This woman has never had a surgical birth - but she's suggesting that this would have been a better choice. Really? How does she know? Perhaps her particular birth was traumatic. Perhaps she didn't feel the positive rush that many of us natural, vaginal birthers seem to feel when we push our baby into the world. But how can she legitimately say that surgery would be better? She's talking about serious anesthesia, surgery in an O/R, longer separation from baby, painful recovery, abdominal scarring, and possible complications or infection, plus a future of pressure to do repeat c/s. Maybe that seems better to her personally for some reason, given whatever she went through - but without having experienced the alternative, this seems pretty irresponsible advice. I say, put it from your mind.

Your preparations, mindset and attitude seem perfect to me. I believe, if no medical complications arise, you'll have the great natural childbirth you're hoping for. And if those true emergencies do arise, thank goodness for life-saving technology right? The trick is knowing the difference between true emergencies and hospital's defensive medicine. If you do your research, you'll be fine.

[MegBoz]

Great post, Meganmarie!
(To add to CS complications - possible painful adhesions & future risks to fertility from placenta complications)

Red_Lil_Mamma,
You sound just like me! I’m an athlete too & I like pushing myself – for me, it’s weightlifting, but it has many parallels with marathon running, I think, in that you push through pain & get high on endorphins. I too am a bit of a control freak.

While I think it’s smart to be prepared for things to not turn out as you’d like, I personally think the opposite is ideal--> EXPECT THE BEST! Expect labor to be difficult, long & painful… but successful! (i.e you can cope with the pain and you & baby are healthy & un-medicated in the end.)

I'm certified as a fitness instructor & personal trainer. I remember reading that studies show athletes perform better when they VISUALIZE succeeding in their mind - like basketball players picturing throwing free throws. I think birth must be the same way. I spent time throughout the last months of pregnancy imagining myself in labor & feeling the pains, but breathing through them, coping with them, being relaxed. That's a big part of Bradley training too - practicing your relaxation techniques with your DH/DP/Coach.

So many people talk about “surrendering” to labor. “Giving up & letting go of control.” I never felt like it was like that. How can I “surrender” to myself?! That just doesn’t make sense to me. “Give in & surrender” to me means to let go of something outside myself. Giving in to my uterus (in order to “get out of the way” & let the uterus do it’s job of opening the cervix) is not a “surrender” in my view. That is just working with my body… just like in any athletic event.

I think my Bradley teacher thought my desire to be in control of my own body would be detrimental. But I didn’t find it to be conflicting with labor at all- both philosophically and while I was in labor. My “job” was to stay as physically and mentally relaxed as possible during 1st stage. I had a job to do while my uterus did it’s job. There was no ‘surrendering' - it was cooperative.

I did quite a bit of reading, but I think the best books are “The Thinking Woman’s Guide to a Better Birth” & “Ina May’s Guide to Childbirth.” I recommend steering clear of nay-sayers. They will only poison your positive mental image of an un-medicated labor that you can handle. In order to do that, you probably will HAVE TO not tell people you plan a natural birth. It’s difficult to avoid otherwise!

I suppose it’s true that it will not be like you expect. For me, it was no where near as bad or painful as I expected. Also a lot shorter than I expected.

[barefootpoetry]

Originally Posted by meganmarie

Okay, this is just absurd. This woman has never had a surgical birth - but she's suggesting that this would have been a better choice. Really? How does she know? Perhaps her particular birth was traumatic. Perhaps she didn't feel the positive rush that many of us natural, vaginal birthers seem to feel when we push our baby into the world. But how can she legitimately say that surgery would be better? She's talking about serious anesthesia, surgery in an O/R, longer separation from baby, painful recovery, abdominal scarring, and possible complications or infection, plus a future of pressure to do repeat c/s. Maybe that seems better to her personally for some reason, given whatever she went through - but without having experienced the alternative, this seems pretty irresponsible advice. I say, put it from your mind.

This is pretty much exactly what I was going to say. I would hesitate to take the advice of someone who would prefer major surgery over a 24-hour labor and vaginal birth.

[Turquesa]

Your yoga instructor was expressing her reality, not yours. Remember this when you encounter other nay-sayers.

[inkedmamajama]

everyone has their own journey, simply put.

read that book list-its a good one, and put to use your relaxation techniques, youll do wonderfully.

[TzippityDoulah]

always beward unsolicited advice like that. think about it - it was likely a tramatic situation in her mind for who knows why, and all the facts don't apply to you. in her mind she wants to save people from her pain, and that is kind. but truthfully, it seems more was going on there than what she has said. and you will likely never know. maybe the OB made her feel insecure. maybe her husband wasn't supportive... you reallty can't say. but it's very odd for a mom who has had a vaginal birth to say "I wish it were a section". that would throw off alarms for me.

its like when first time moms are told by formula feeding mothers that you shouldnt even bother with the bottle b/c you'll jus get mastitic ect. I've never gotten that advice from someone who stuck it through the hard times, only people who gave up during the hard times and wish to justify it to themselves.

be very careful who you take advice from!

[kiwiva]

Originally Posted by MegBoz

I did quite a bit of reading, but I think the best books are “The Thinking Woman’s Guide to a Better Birth” & “Ina May’s Guide to Childbirth.” I recommend steering clear of nay-sayers. They will only poison your positive mental image of an un-medicated labor that you can handle. In order to do that, you probably will HAVE TO not tell people you plan a natural birth. It’s difficult to avoid otherwise!

ITA! One of the best lessons in the HypnoBabies program is to not allow people to tell you their bad birth stories and to literally put up your hand (to say stop) so they won't. I actually did this to a friend at my shower who started to tell me that her sister planned a natural birth but... I put up my hand, explained to her all the research and preparation I was doing and asked her to be supportive. She actually did think she was being helpful because at her birth (16 yrs earlier) she felt she was totally unprepared. So yes, some of these people do think they are being helpful, but you don't want their negative energy bringing you down.

Sounds like you are doing it all right. Overly confident? You have to trust in your own abilities and really know you can do it. You can! But it is much easier if you only discuss your plans for natural birth with like-minded people.

[_betsy_]

I had the naysayers, too. I had the people telling me that I was naive, that I'd never be able to do it, that I'd be screaming for "my" epidural the second the first contraction hit, that I'm too short too birth naturally, that it would take days and days, that no modern woman should "put herself through *that*" ("You don't get a medal for going natural, you know...") well, screw 'em. Eventually I stopped telling anyone our plans.

And you know what? All those hours and hours and days and days of labor and pain that Susie's-sister's-best-friend's-cousin went through that I was surely going to have to endure as well? With DD I was in labor for under two hours from first contaction to baby.

You just can't listen to them. Even the well meaning "advice" is generally inflated, outrageously embellished, made up, or just plain unbelievable.

You've made your birthing choices and you're comfortable with them. Hopefully, everything will work out wonderfully and you'll have just the birth you've planned. Sure, you have to be prepared for the worst case scenerio, but why can't you also be prepared (and longing for!) the BEST case scenerio?

[herbanmama]

Originally Posted by Red_Lil_Mamma

In February we are expecting our first child.

The other day I was talking with my prenatal yoga teacher after class. She asked if I was planning a natural birth. When I excitedly said, yes. She said that she has some important advice—and that was not to let things go on too long. She said her labor was 24 hours long with 3 hours of pushing. If she had to do it over again, she'd have just asked to have the hospital to "cut it out."

Wow. As a yoga teacher, I'd never impose my experience on a student that way. I can't imagine what she was thinking.

That said, I labored for 30 hours at home and I'm pregnant and doing it again. Of course, I hope it will be faster this time, but if I knew it would be just as long, I'd do it the same way again. I have accompanied my doula clients through c/s and the aftermath and let me tell you - I'll take the 30 hour homebirth any day.

I second the recommendations of “The Thinking Woman’s Guide to a Better Birth” & “Ina May’s Guide to Childbirth.”

Stay positive!

[Cherry Alive]

Everyone, thank you for the awesome positive stories (keep them coming—I *like* them)!

This whole pregnancy and birthing processs is very fascinating to me. I used to be so scared of the idea of being pregnant...even mildly disgusted (silly, I know), but I'm finding the further along I get the more exciting it is.

I love learning how everything works, and I am very curious to find out what kind of birth path I'm going to experience in 4-5 months.

Our bodies (and the little lives growing inside them) are AMAZING! Even though I'm gaining a little more weight than I should (and have been sick as a dog with m/s and heartburn), I feel beautiful right now. I am blessed to have a good birthing team, a very supportive husband and this great community at my fingertips.

Originally Posted by herbanmama

Wow. As a yoga teacher, I'd never impose my experience on a student that way. I can't imagine what she was thinking.

That said, I labored for 30 hours at home and I'm pregnant and doing it again. Of course, I hope it will be faster this time, but if I knew it would be just as long, I'd do it the same way again. I have accompanied my doula clients through c/s and the aftermath and let me tell you - I'll take the 30 hour homebirth any day.

I second the recommendations of “The Thinking Woman’s Guide to a Better Birth” & “Ina May’s Guide to Childbirth.”

Stay positive!

Thank you!

Yes, I was kind of surprised she even went there, but not completely. She's a nice lady (and teaches Yoga very well), but she strikes me more as a stereotypical aerobics teacher than a typical yoga teacher. She's much more mainstream than into natural things, but at the same time she strikes me as someone who is also very open-minded.

I would have liked my PY teacher to stop with the story, but it happened too fast. She didn't go into tons of details (which I appreciated), and I could tell she was really holding back and trying to be tasteful. What I'm taking from it is the positive part of her advice. I considered it a warning—from one athlete to another—to pay attention to my body. That is something that can *help* me birth.

For what it's worth, too, she seems very supportive of me pursuing natural birth. She just didn't want me to end up exhausted or suffering like her. She went on to have a second child. I don't know if it was a C/S or not, but I have the feeling it was easier (for her) than her first birth. I can't judge her. If things go well for me, though, I have a feeling she'll be picking my brain for what I did to get there.

That said, I'm still not sure how to handle things when people blindside me like that (especially when it is deliberately manipulative or rude). I'm not always the fastest reactor to when people are pushing boundaries or being flat-out obnoxious. When I try to assert myself (something I've been trying to do a lot more lately), people tell me I am being nasty or rude (well, at least people do in my family—maybe they're the rude ones ). I do admit I can be blunt as an old axe and not the greatest person to speak confidently with a smile.

I am trying to learn the art of changing the subject (DH has been helping me learn this). It seems to work for me, but I've yet to master it.

[peainthepod]

I have told this story before, but one of DH's cousins blindsided me at our baby shower with her own birth horror story when she heard we were doing the Bradley Method instead of planning for medication right off the bat. I can't imagine how she would have reacted if she'd heard our plans for a homebirth!

Some women have horribly traumatic births and may believe, in a very misguided way, that they're helping you by sharing their story. Really though it seems that sharing their story with a pregnant woman is more cathartic for them than for you. You aren't their therapist and there's no way of knowing what your birth will be like, so why are they trying to share the misery? The road to hell and all that...

When someone attempts to color your experience with their own trauma, remind yourself of their possible motives and then brush it off as well as you can. I hope you won't be chatting with your yoga teacher about birth anymore.

[christinespurlock]

Hi I've had two homebirths. First one lasted 4 hours, 2nd was about an hour and forty five minutes from the moment I knew I was in labor till baby got here. So I'm lucky to have fast labors. For me though with both labors there was about 20 minutes of transition (which is right before you get the strong urge to push) where I felt their had to be something wrong. The pain was so intence that during both labors I told my midwife 'this is all wrong', 'and I can't do this'. Both time the midwife said, 'your in transition' and the 'this means your baby is almost here'. I want you to know that I loved my labors. I was so proud and both times the pushing felt good. ( I mean really good) But just know when you get to transition that it will be incredibily intense and that is just how it's suppose to feel like. And instead of being worried know that this means the finish line is in sight. I had the view before I ever went into labor that it was just a state of mind and you could somehow get over the intense part with the right state of mind. Now I feel it's important thing that you must walk through and come out the other end stronger than you ever were.

This is the advise I wish I would have gotten before my first labor.

[MegBoz]

Originally Posted by Red_Lil_Mamma

That said, I'm still not sure how to handle things when people blindside me like that (especially when it is deliberately manipulative or rude).

If they are being rude about it (i.e. statements like, "Yeah, I was cocky too!") I suggest humor. MOCK THEM! I'd say in a shocked tone of voice, "Childbrith is PAINFUL!? GET OOOOUUUUT! No way?!" Making fun of them might shut them down a little bit. At very least, it lets them know you don't welcome their comments.

If you don't think they're being rude, just thinking they're helping you by warning you, you can always just be polite, but direct. But cut them off quicly before it gets nasty!

"I appreciate you wanting to forewarn me. I'm sorry you had such a bad experience. I'm currently trying to prepare myself for birth by being well-educated and staying healthy to reduce my risk of adverse outcomes. Part of my preparation includes staying positive about birth. I know I can't control the outcome, but I think a positive state of mind is important."

(Note, I didn't explicitly say "Don't put your S#%* on me!" But it is implied...)
Of course, as Ina May's book states, a positive state of mind actually DOES have a significant impact on a positive physiological outcome! But I wouldn't waste my time explaining that to a nay-sayer.