Prenatal drug/alcohol exposure and potty learning - Page 2

[pumpkingirl71]

This thread has really got me thinking Dd is four and three months. She is in diapers 100% of the time. Her potty issues come mostly from her medical issues, but we never thought about exposure and body awareness.

Dd is so amazing with her fine motor skills. She can write most of her letters and is quite the little artist But her gross motor skills and body awareness are pretty poor. She walks and runs into things and just can't keep track of her own body. I can only assume that is she didn't have the medical issues, this would make it harder for her to learn the potty.

[Sierra]

Originally Posted by pumpkingirl71

Dd is so amazing with her fine motor skills. She can write most of her letters and is quite the little artist But her gross motor skills and body awareness are pretty poor. She walks and runs into things and just can't keep track of her own body.

This describes dfd to a "T"!

[Sierra]

Originally Posted by mamarhu

You have mentioned that bodily awareness and cause and effect planning are neither one going to work, at least at this stage.

I think bodily awareness and cause and effect planning are two things I really want to work on. As much as I'd love to start working on toilet learning, I think it won't be worthwhile until we do some strengthening of those two areas.

The reason for this is because dfd can *not* sit still. We tried for a little while recently to do regular time on the potty, but she literally can't hold her body on there. She twists and turns and stands up, etc. etc., and there is just no way that she is going to be able to sit there unless she is really going to "go." You know? It's just way too much energy expenditure to keep her on the potty when most of the time nothing is going to happen, if that makes sense.

So I would ask, "What does work?" For other aspects of life, is this a kid who responds well to structured timetables?

Nope, we use timetables with my ds because of his needs, but with dfd, she is so much in the moment at all times that even a tangible reminder of what is happening in two minutes (or whatever) will not cause any anticipation for her. For her, everything exists only exactly as it happens.

She does seem to benefit from routine and rhythm in general though. Probably the most effective thing we have found so far is to have regular potty times before and after naps and meals and snacks, but basically to signal this to her by just saying, "Okay, potty time now," and setting her in front of the computer and letting her watch a potty video (a short potty video that helps her sit a still just a bit more and a bit longer).

I think I'll hold off on it for a while. I feel badly because ds is newly enough using the potty that dfd really wants to learn and be like her big brother. But it is so clear she still has a long way to go before she'll be really ready.

[PikkuMyy]

If your daughter were one of my cases (I do early intervention), I would probably suggest involving her in the routine of toileting even if she's not ready, so that by the time she is, she is already familiar with the rest of it. You go into the bathroom, pull down your clothes, sit on the toilet, (pee or poop), wipe, stand up, pull up clothes, flush, wash hands. And if you think she isn't familiar with the way it feels, you might try pouring some warm water on her privates and describing what it feels like when you pee (and the sound of the liquid hitting the water in the toilet or potty.) I have had several families do this with their children with autism and it helped.

If she is in the habit of doing this, she may be able to sit for longer and longer until you are able to help her go frequently enough (with good liquid intake) that she does have to pee some of the times.

[UUMom]

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[Sierra]

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[Polliwog]

Sierra, I e-mailed a friend of my who was a special education teacher in a inclusive program for 28 years. She's the most wonderful special education teacher I've ever met. Very Reggio-inspired and focuses all children as competent and capable people. I'll let you know when I hear back from her. I really respect her advice on other issues and I bet she's encountered this.

[SusanElizabeth]

Originally Posted by UUMom

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laughup

[Sierra]

Thanks BethNC!

[Polliwog]

I haven't heard back, but I should soon.

[mariaz]

I don't have any information but I do know what you're dealing with. My son just turned 3 and he will still sit in a poopy diaper until I small him or do a routine change (and he's in cloth so you would think that it would drive him crazy!)

He just doesn't seem to care much about using the potty. His older brother and younger sister are both potty trained and he isn't nervous around teh potty but when I suggest that he sit on the potty and try he just says "no."

I have just figured that when he is ready to train he will let me know. He still has two years of private pre-K ahead of him (where he is allowed to be in diapers) until we start public school so I am hoping that by the time he turns 5 we will have this potty thing under control (and if not we'll just hang out in Pre-K for an extra year)

[Aliviclo]

Anecdata...

My son, who came to us at age 23 months, was exposed to crack and marijuana in utero. He had significant sensory issues, the most noticeable of which was a difficulty feeling where his body was in space. This looked like hyperactivity and even autism at times -- running constantly, falling down, throwing himself into things, unnecessary and unprovoked roughness, banging his head. We got OT for him, which helped tremendously. His sensory issues didn't have any noticeable impact on his potty training. He was day-trained at 2.5 and fully trained at 3.

My daughter, who came to us as a newborn, was heroin exposed during the first trimester only. She has sensory issues, but they are auditory and visual only. She has received no therapy, and is doing fine in school...she seems to be growing out of the majority of areas of concern. She was day-trained at 22 months, and is still wearing Pull-ups at night at age 4, although she hasn't had a wet one in almost 6 months.

[azedazobollis]

I do try so hard to keep up with the Adopt/ Foster Forum. I often browse and dont have much time to respond. I do not like being the lurker.

This post hits home. My Anna will be four years old in January. She has Fetal Alcohol Spectrum Disorder. Nearly everything I have learned about her diagnosis has been from sitting at the computer. Sometimes I wish that I didn't have a label for her because in my opinion it makes everything more complicated. Most of her behaviors are
normal for her age range.” Most of her behaviors are “just Anna’s way of doing things.” Everything that I list as something “not quite right” or “odd” is overlooked by those whom I look for guidance.

Potty training is one of those things. Anna is potty trained part time. I cloth diapered her. Honestly, she likes the wet heaviness of a cloth diaper- the snugness. For vacation, I bought some pull -ups not knowing there were different kinds, I accidentally bought “cooling” pull-ups. Well, she liked those. Anna can go for a couple weeks with no daytime accidents then if she gets the slightest bit sick, she has no idea when she pees. She pees and poops separeatly, always has. She will go poop on the potty, then 10 minutes later go to pee. Never together. She was poop trained months before pee trained. I count this as a blessing. It is one of her many “abilities” within her “disabilities.” Anna can hear a dog bark, a train horn, a chainsaw, a siren, the refrigerator motor from miles away. Sometimes this is bothersome. When she was younger, she was overwhelmed with all this input, now she seems to have long cycles of dealing with sensory overload. When she is not dealing, nothing works, from eating, sleeping, pottying, her every function is mixed and disruptive.

My Anna has some soothing behaviors. In the high chair and car seat she clenches on with her hands and tenses up her whole body, she then rhythmically thrusts her hips and circles her extended legs. I have seen one other child do this. A dear friend of mine has a daughter- not exposed but she also has sensory integration issues. I call this “soothies.” I have kept the high chair out just for this. Anna needs to do this to coordinate herself. No one explains any of this to me, I dont even have a real medical name for this behavior. When she is having a difficult time with the pottying, I know she needs more time doing “soothies.” Her proprioceptive function controls her entire disposition. If she can regulate this, everything is more manageable including pottying. I want to find a bigger high chair for her since she is growing and still needs this. She plays with play dough and listens to an ipod in the high chair to give her something to do while in there. Anna has many other issues related to her FASD, but I wanted to focus in on the potty stuff to try and give you some ideas that have worked for our family.I also wanted to respond because I feel like no one really understands this label. There are a couple books that are helpful on sensory processing.

Personally, talking about her diagnosis to anyone gets sidetracked to the fact that she was adopted because who would want to claim they drank during their pregnancy. I contacted a local FAS support group. Would you believe that the woman answered the phone from a bar! No kidding, she was drunk! She called back and was still drunk! She told me she parented her child for 15 years and it was now her ex-husbands turn. I was shocked. I never called back. There is no support, there is no follow through of children whom have had real therapy. There is not much out there to help a family dealing with young children removed from their toxic environments. My child is not an animal killer, fire started, lier..... She’s three. A child with some special needs and different behaviors. Misunderstood.... sometimes I get very frustrated. Sometimes I feel empowered with my desire to make a difference and her desire to teach me about life.

[lauren]

Originally Posted by azedazobollis

My Anna has some soothing behaviors. In the high chair and car seat she clenches on with her hands and tenses up her whole body, she then rhythmically thrusts her hips and circles her extended legs. I have seen one other child do this. A dear friend of mine has a daughter- not exposed but she also has sensory integration issues. I call this “soothies.” I have kept the high chair out just for this. Anna needs to do this to coordinate herself. No one explains any of this to me, I dont even have a real medical name for this behavior.

My youngest did this (not adopted or foster or with any neurological challenges whatsoever) and I never asked anyone about it because it was such a weird thing to describe! I'd be curious if you ever find out more about this.

[mamarhu]

Originally Posted by azedazobollis

My Anna has some soothing behaviors. In the high chair and car seat she clenches on with her hands and tenses up her whole body, she then rhythmically thrusts her hips and circles her extended legs.

Sounds to me like this child is a pro at finding how to meet her own needs. And so cool she has a Mom who can support her & see how her "weird" behavior is soothing and healthy for her, not a habit to be broken. She will do well.