can we talk about guilt?

[songbird45]

I've been thinking more about guilt, which I think is a big issue for many of us. I tell myself it's not my fault, but I don't think it's really that simple. It's possible that this is caused by something in my diet (is this caused by being vegetarian? My friend who has PCOS started eating meat and it seemed to solve the problem - she got pregnant on her first try.) I am mostly over that idea, as I tried a much lower-carb diet and Metformin and it did nothing for me. I don't know if I didn't stick with it long enough or if I did it wrong, though, so I'm not entirely over the possibility that this is somehow my fault.

There's guilt for related stuff too.. for example, that I'm dragging dh through this. I guess technically I'm not dragging him, as he wants kids too, and we've made treatment decisions together. But if I hadn't wanted to go through this, he wouldn't have pushed the issue. And I have the final say as it's my body. So in that sense it's more my decision.

I'm guilty of not handling everything as well as I'd like. I inflict my bad moods on dh all the time. There are days when I can't muster more than jealousy for my pregnant friends. I'm not sure I'm going to attend the baby shower I'm invited to this weekend (where, including the person being showered, there will be *three* pregnant friends, one of whom is the aforementioned person with PCOS.) I give mothers with infants evil looks. And I am less able to cope with the rest of my life because of this.

Being infertile is arguably not personal failure, but these other issues definitely are. I tell myself I'm only human, that this is all normal, nobody's perfect, and my friends haven't dropped me yet. But I still wonder if I'm being overly self-indulgent and petty. It's not the worst problem in the world, and maybe I should just be counting my blessings. What's the correct amount of self-pity? What can I realistically expect from myself?

How do you all cope? What do you think?

[crystal-mommy]

I hear ya! I get so caught up in this whole TTC I sometimes find it hard to enjoy or focus on anything else. bottom line-infertility sucks. It makes you redefine who you are, what type of person you are going to be, and what type of family you are going to eventually be. It isn't a personal failure-but it sure does feel like it sometimes.

I can't imagine your pain, my sis had primary infertility for 6 yrs. She did all kinds of treatments (except for ivf). In the middle of all that I had my oops preg w/ my DD. I was very careful and tried to really protect her from a lot of the pain I am sure I caused her w/ my preg. Now, I see part of what she went thru. The tables got turned. She had an oops preg w/ her second pregnancy in the middle of all my infertility stuff. Ironic..

I think one of the things that helps me deal w/ the whole infertility issue is I think of this as my "disease". My step aunts sister (3 oops pregnacies in less than 5 yrs) is my age and has lymphoma, my best friends husband is a pathological liar and they just split up, my college friend has breast cancer, the girl that just had her 3rd baby w/ absolutely no effort TTC lost both of her parents w/in 15 days of each other unexpectedly when she was 5 months preg. Infertility is horrid, but it is way less in my eyes than those other things... therefore making it not as bad! (maybe not the best way to deal w/ it... but it works!) I guess I am trying to count my blessing-some days it works... others not so much.

Hang in there Songbird... I really think you are going to get your baby. For some reason our babies are really being difficult and haven't chosen to show yet!

Good luck! I hope your baby is starting to burrow its way into its home!!

[poetgirl]

These are good questions Songbird. I am also dealing w/ prim. IF and it's so hard. I remind myself every day that "I am not dying." But I have never dealt with so much loss on a daily basis and not had some experience with death. I try to dig myself out of the inward/downward spiral effect as I best I can. Yoga and meditation and being in nature are the things that make me feel most kind toward myself and my body, and at this point, kindness counts for a lot. These are my shields against total and complete
I still feel that way plenty, I esp. tend to get more sad than angry, but that's part of how I cope. Do you have any activities that always make you feel good, no matter what? I'll keep thinking about this...

[cristeen]

Guilt is a big part of this for many of us, I'd imagine. I'm in the same boat... did my dietary decisions over the last 30 years cause the PCOS? The answer is "probably", and I know it. So the only thing I can do now is make the best decisions IN THE MOMENT. I cannot change the past, and feeling guilty about those choices isn't going to resolve anything. I really try hard to take a forward-looking approach as much as possible.

I feel guilty that I haven't been able to give my DH the child he so wants. Yet he knew coming into the relationship that this would be a problem (I was diagnosed years before we met), and he accepted that we would have to go through IF treatments. Coming in I swore I wouldn't do IVF, yet he's pushing me to do it because he knows how much having a child means to me. So then I get to feel guilty about the amount of money we spend on this whole thing... not just the RE visits/RX, but also the chiropractic, the accupuncture, the herbs, the homeopathy, the diet, etc. For what we spend on the IF (just in one year), we could have easily taken a vacation in Hawaii and done some of the renovations we need on the house. So there's another level of guilt.

Again, I just do my best to look forward. Because if I don't, I will wallow, and for me wallowing=depression. Can't get out of bed depression. And I really prefer not to go there. In fact I wound up having to go back to work FT to deal with the depression, because there were days when I wouldn't get out of bed at all.

Hopefully some of my ramblings there help...

[songbird45]

Originally Posted by cristeen

Guilt is a big part of this for many of us, I'd imagine. I'm in the same boat... did my dietary decisions over the last 30 years cause the PCOS? The answer is "probably", and I know it.

Yes and no. I mean... most women don't have the reaction to carbs that us PCOS women have, so there's no good reason for you to have made different dietary decisions until you knew for sure that's what was causing the problem. And once you knew, you've changed, so that's something. In my case I've always eaten healthy, but I'm vegetarian. So dramatically reducing carbs is pretty impossible. I can make substitutions - brown rice for white, quinoa instead of rice or pasta - but unless I start eating meat (and the idea turns my stomach) I can't craft a truly low carb diet. I guess this is where the ongoing guilt comes from. I regret that my body doesn't work the way most people's bodies work - I don't blame anyone for that. I feel guilty that I am unwilling to change my diet very dramatically in response. In that I blame myself.

So then I get to feel guilty about the amount of money we spend on this whole thing... not just the RE visits/RX, but also the chiropractic, the accupuncture, the herbs, the homeopathy, the diet, etc. For what we spend on the IF (just in one year), we could have easily taken a vacation in Hawaii and done some of the renovations we need on the house. So there's another level of guilt.

I guess we all have our demons. This is one of the reasons I decided to go with just regular medicine. I'm hoping for a good outcome with normal western medicine and hoping I can save the money I could have spent on acupuncture, etc. for my future children.

Again, I just do my best to look forward. Because if I don't, I will wallow, and for me wallowing=depression.

This is a really good point. I guess part of my problem (at least as far as treatment is concerned) is that I'm generally naturally-minded, but I've abandoned all those principles and am going the medical route. Like you, I always swore I'd never do IVF, and now I'm seriously considering it. We're a ways off from it, but I never thought I'd even be in this position. So I have a lot of regrets about what could not happen (conceiving naturally) and a lot of guilt about what I'm not doing, going forward (more natural treatments like acupuncture or diet changes) even though I think it could help.

But I think you're right... I need to come to terms with my decisions and feel good about it, so I can look forward without guilt.

[crazyrunningmama]

I too, totally hear this. My dd was conceived thru IVF. With our first cycle I had a m/c, DD was the result of a FET. I went thru IVF in July and again had a m/c. I feel like maybe I wouldn't have m/c'ed if I had taken better care of myself, got my weight down, like I promised myself I would, stopped wheat, continued with the accupuncture, etc etc. Overall, our IF issues are MF, but I still totally feel like I could be doing better. I imagine everyone feels that way to some extent. I think all we can do is decide what we're gonna do (think: when I look back on this, what will I wish I had done, how do I want to look back at having dealt with this?) If that makes sense.

Coping? Choosing who to talk to, who to spend time with. Choosing carefully how I spend my free time and making sure I am nourished as much as possible. Finding the space to be grateful for what I do have. Key lime pie (yesterday, oh so good, but again with the weight thing... Finding things that I can complete so I get a sense of accomplishment.

take care and : everyone.

[songbird45]

Can I just say that you ladies are wonderful? And also, this is cheapter than therapy.

[Masel]

I wonder if it is really guilt. I'm thinking more like grief. Infertility is a loss and there is little in the modern world on how to deal with a loss. Look up the stages of grief. For one thing you'll see infertility listed with death of a loved, job loss, and divorce as major losses.

Is guilt and all of this "it's my fault, if only I had..." part of the barganing stage?

Infertility is not a little thing and I think you, (the OP and all of us TTC) should give yourself a break on however you choose to deal with it.

[Bena]

"There are days when I can't muster more than jealousy for my pregnant friends. "


I can completly relate to this...I was just struggling with this today, as a coworker came to work with her baby. I just didn't feel like doing the hooo-haa, your baby is so cute how are you doing thing, so I avoided them and stayed in my office. I guess I was jealous, or resentful, or some other awefull feeling. But then later in the afternoon, I felt soooo guilty about it. I still do, a bit, but knowing that I'm not the only one with these feelings is already making me feel much better!

[jasminewb]

Hi everyone...this one is really hitting home right now because I am still getting over what I call my first chemical/miscarraige...i don't even know what to call it. Anyway..I have so much guilt...from the diet, to life style to i wasn't giving the universe the right energy to all OF IT! We are unexplained IF which I have translated to mean...it must just be me. The worst thing is that now i'm reading all these books...the infertility cure, the fertility diet and they are giving me totally mixed signals...dairy, no dairy, whole grains, no whole grains....I know rationally I just have to whats right for me but I really wish I knew what that was. Good luck and sanity to all.

Jasmine

I am editing to say...whoever started this thread...kudos. Guilt is a tough one...and one of those that is mostly in our heads..I mean totally in our heads! Also, I am now realizing that the stress of IF is no good for concieving so we all need to leave it behind!

[songbird45]

Masel - Some parts of it are regret - regret that my body doesn't work correctly, for instance. But when I know for sure that there is some behavior of mine that is sub optimal (like giving mothers and infants evil looks) then I do feel actual guilt about it later. Also when I see people going through stuff that's so much harder I feel guilty for indulging in self-pity. I try to be a generally good person and cut myself some slack, but it's an ongoing struggle.

jasminewb - I'm so sorry to hear about your m/c. It's a real loss, and please give yourself space to grieve properly. It's not your fault. There's nothing you could have done to prevent it. Nothing you did caused it. I stopped with dietary and natural solutions for exactly the problem you mention - different practitioners have different recommendations, and aside from low-carb being related to insulin resistance being related to PCOS, I have no actual medical reason to think that any of it will work.