TF with food allergies?

[changingseasons]

I lurk a lot in this forum.... because I really like the idea of TF, and I think that the little TF eating I've done in the past really makes me feel better, lose weight, etc.

That said- DD has some pretty severe food allergies (and it turns out so do I), so we're really limited on what we can eat (she's still almost exclusively BF.) So no: dairy, eggs, beef, along with about a million more foods. And before you suggest it- NO, not even raw dairy, and not even 100% grassfed beef. We just finished a trial of beef, and it failed miserably.

So what are my other TF options? I am making & drinking kombucha. I just got some water kefir grains, but I haven't started that yet. I tried the NT fermented beets recipe, and it was WAY too salty to eat. (I just got a notice that my copy of Wild Fermentation is ready to pick up at the library, so I should have that in a couple days.)

Oh- and I've been making chicken bone broths for months and months, and eating it every day.... but there is now a chance that DD is also allergic to chicken (we haven't done an official trial yet, but the food journal is starting to show a pattern with my chicken eating), so that might be out too.

I'm hoping to trial some HVCLO soon (I think it's third on my list of things to trial, so probably in a week or 2, depending how the other trials go), but there's a pretty good chance that DD will react to it because she's reacted every time I've eaten fish or tried a fish oil (haven't tried straight CLO yet.)

Any suggestions for how I can do more TF with all these restrictions? Here's what we're eating right now (I am slooooowly trying to add more foods, but it's a really long process): 100% grassfed lamb, broccoli, zucchini, safflower oil, buckwheat flour (which I was soaking, but I think DD was reacting to the vinegar [corn]... so I'm planning on making some kombucha vinegar and using that, but haven't started yet.)

(I better just type out the list of 'bad' foods, to save people time from suggesting them.... dairy, beef, soy, eggs, green peas (we're off all legumes), yellow/winter squash, peanuts, almonds (we're off all tree nuts), lemon, apple, apricot, canteloupe, cranberry, grape, honeydew, lime, orange, peach, pear, raspberry, tomato, potato (we're off all nightshades), carrot, celery, sweet potato, gluten, oat, malt, corn, fish, sunflower seed (we're off all seeds), kidney bean (we're off all beans), stevia, psyllium, brewer's yeast, cinnamon. I'm sure I forgot a few....)

[MyLilPwny]

Do you have any idea what is causing the allergies? The problem with chicken and eggs seems to be that most of them are fed soy, which is a major allergen. I think that chickens should be eating insects and worms to be healthy instead of soy. Someone mentioned to me before that she was allergic to chicken eggs, but not duck eggs. Would that be an option? And maybe duck meat--my local Whole Foods Market sells whole frozen ducks. I also suggest sauerkraut. I get Rejuvenative Foods brand: http://www.rejuvenative.com/catalog_ss.htm
I'd also suggest trying ghee--apparently, people should not be allergic to ghee since its 100% fat. I didn't see coconut oil and cod liver oil on the list, are those okay? What about fish? I order from Vital Choice, since the fish is tested and is supposed to be toxin-free. My 11-month old especially loves the halibut.

[changingseasons]

We tried ghee- failed miserably to the point of blood in DD's stool. Fish is out too.

I haven't tried duck or duck eggs- maybe I will add that to my list of things to trial.

I have theories about why the food allergies suddenly appeared (you can check out my blog for the long version), but short story is leaky gut. So we're working on getting both our guts healthier, and I'm really really really hoping that she will grow out of most of the allergies.

I did think about the chicken's diets because corn and soy are both on our bad list... I have yet to find any 100% pastured chickens though. Even the pastured chickens I found at the farmer's market are grain-finished. I'm still on the hunt, but I have a feeling if I do find some, we won't be able to afford them.

[tanyalynn]

I think the most fundamental thing of TF and Price's ideas is preparing food properly to maximize nutrition and to work on a high intake of minerals and a really high intake of fat soluble vitamins. Beyond that--all the groups Price looked at ate different things. I doubt you can copy any of them exactly, given your restrictions, but for each food you can eat, you can prepare it well and supplement as needed (if you have any safe supplements). Honestly, it sounds like you're already there, it just doesn't much resemble what any other TF folks eat, but that's inherent to your restrictions for now.

Soup is very digestible and very traditional (I got my kids to partake using a combo of a deep spoon and a straw). And ferments--not sure if cabbage has already failed, but there's a lot of cabbage in the stores now and a basic (not very spiced) version of sauerkraut may work. Kimchi probably has too many ingredients, something would fail and ruin the batch, but my kids like that. And I don't double the salt like SF suggests (for whey-less ferments) and they turn out.

[WuWei]

For folks who are highly allergenic, my understanding is that the repeated exposure can increase reactions. However, the nutrients that you provide with a TF diet are essential to gut healing. Sometimes, you take a bit of 'two steps forward, one step backwards', to not slide down the hole of malnutrition. The gut needs nutrients, minerals, enzymes, fats, proteins for rebuilding the cell walls, for cell growth and healing. Those are most bio-available from whole foods.

I totally agree with Wugmama on the other thread. For starters, just add the most nutrient dense foods that you can, rotate, and make progress toward healing. No gut is "perfect". Even with a restricted diet, the limited food options can exacerbate nutritional deficiencies. And increased exposure to those food proteins in a larger quantity on a daily basis becomes problematic, itself. (step two, is dealing with the individual (more) allergenic foods, once your nutritional status is maximized-from whole foods). Of course, avoid those which are life threatening. The list of foods that don't cause difficulty will change.

Have you researched "rotation diets". That is what helped my friend with gut issues while nursing. She could have a food that she knew they were "intolerant" of for 3-4 days, and then not again for 2 weeks. The foods were not all paired up, they were rotated in a staggered manner. (does that make sense? don't eat same four foods on day 1 and day 15.)

There are many TF methods of preparation which will enhance tolerance, raw, soaking, sprouting, fermenting, etc. But, adding the saur krat, kombucha (homemade) and kefir (homemade) and the fats (even on occasion, rather than daily dosing) will help the body to do the many digestion and rebuilding processes.

There are so many hidden variables in foods and supplements, in addition to the many unknown environmental variables, that we can not control everything. Add nutrition, even a bit of 100% grass-fed beef on an every two week basis will help, IMO.

And I can not recommend classical homeopathy strongly enough. Ds can eat so many things that he couldn't as an infant, it is amazing. And dh had severe asthma and allergies which have been resolved with homeopathy. I don't understand it. It doesn't make sense to my Western mind. But, I've seen *miracles*-inexplicable benefits which defy my medical or scientific understanding. And I was a cardio-pulmonary intensive nurse. Homeopathy heals.

I have been there, we had a list of food intolerances like yours. We avoided for 3 years. After starting homeopathy, ds could eat wheat, dairy, corn, soy, etc. Wish I had started homeopathy earlier. The emotional component that homeopathy addresses is an intangible that "medicine" doesn't address, neither does elimination and avoidance.

Life is a leap of faith. Trust.


HTH, Pat

[Ruthla]

I would start with a list of foods you CAN eat and then prepare them in traditional ways. IF you find yourself moving to a more "paleolithic" diet (not hard if you can't have dairy, legumes, or nightshades- cut out the rest of the GF grains and you're there) then no special preparations are needed- meats, fruits, and veggies can be eaten raw or simply roasted or stewed.

Primarily, I think the focus should be on "how can I stick to the list of safe foods and have enough to eat" rather than worrying about it being "traditional" enough in preparation techniques. Later you can add in "how do I make food less boring" but for now, stick to making sure you get enough to feel satisfied. If lamb is a safe food, get some lamb bones and make lamb stock. Use rendered lamb fat to prepare the zuchinni and broccoli, to get more flavor and nutrion than from the safflower oil.

[changingseasons]

Thanks- those are all great ideas. My main goal in going more TF right now is just to get myself more healthy, my nutrient stores built back up after pregnancy, and do some gut healing.

WuWei- I have done a rotation diet in the past, and it really helped me pinpoint some of our elusive triggers. But DD was still reacting to so many things, I eventually gave up on the rotation and decided to start with a fresh TED. Now I'm at the point of really slowly reintroducing food. When we have a bigger list of 'safe(r)' foods, I will start rotating again. But we absolutely cannot do beef- it causes blood in DD's stool. And I don't care how nutritious and healthy it is for me, internal bleeding in my babe just isn't worth it. Also- even in small doses, anything that I eat that causes her to react will set back our gut healing. So even though I know my restricted diet is not ideal, I feel that I am doing everything in my power to get us healed. Once our guts seem a little better able to handle foods, I certainly will make my diet more well rounded.

I'm eating a huge amount of lamb and veggies right now, and I do some plain buckwheat pancakes just to get some more calories in my diet. Glad to know that I'm at least kind of on the right track with things.

[crunchy_mama]

Originally Posted by Ruthla

I would start with a list of foods you CAN eat and then prepare them in traditional ways. IF you find yourself moving to a more "paleolithic" diet (not hard if you can't have dairy, legumes, or nightshades- cut out the rest of the GF grains and you're there) then no special preparations are needed- meats, fruits, and veggies can be eaten raw or simply roasted or stewed.

Primarily, I think the focus should be on "how can I stick to the list of safe foods and have enough to eat" rather than worrying about it being "traditional" enough in preparation techniques. Later you can add in "how do I make food less boring" but for now, stick to making sure you get enough to feel satisfied. If lamb is a safe food, get some lamb bones and make lamb stock. Use rendered lamb fat to prepare the zuchinni and broccoli, to get more flavor and nutrion than from the safflower oil.

That is what we do here. We started TF before we realized we had food issues. And as various foods were taken out we have still focused on trying to get the good quality when we can . The meat we eat I try for it to be wild or grassfed. We take clo and make bone broth.

[Junegoddess]

I wonder if fermented CLO would be more-tolerable? I just read through your story on your blog... and I wish I had great ideas for you.

[Theloose]

Hi, I'm right there with you. It feels like our 'no' list is longer than our safe list.

One thing that I read about Price's research is that all the groups he studied consumed either: dairy, and lots of it; seafood including fish and shellfish; or meat, including organ meats, plus a source if iodine. When I think about it, it makes sense - if you want to support your whole body, then you need to eat 'complete' food. Milk is a complete food. With fish and shellfish, you're consuming the whole organism. Organ meats in addition to muscle meats gives you a much broader spectrum of nutrients. Other superfoods are eggs and roe - both whole organisms again.

So on our path to healing, I'm looking for causes (nutritional deficiencies, adrenal fatigue and overstressing are winners right now, and I'm going to start researching metal toxicity soon) and I'm wanting to heal through nutrition. To me, 'traditional foods' is about using foods as the nutritional building blocks to allow the body to heal itself. Which means I'm suddenly willing to eat things that I never would have considered before. I have two lamb's heads in the freezer, and just tried raw oysters for the first time last week, tongue for the first time on saturday, and tripe is on the menu tonight.

[changingseasons]

Originally Posted by whoMe

Hi, I'm right there with you. It feels like our 'no' list is longer than our safe list.

One thing that I read about Price's research is that all the groups he studied consumed either: dairy, and lots of it; seafood including fish and shellfish; or meat, including organ meats, plus a source if iodine. When I think about it, it makes sense - if you want to support your whole body, then you need to eat 'complete' food. Milk is a complete food. With fish and shellfish, you're consuming the whole organism. Organ meats in addition to muscle meats gives you a much broader spectrum of nutrients. Other superfoods are eggs and roe - both whole organisms again.

So on our path to healing, I'm looking for causes (nutritional deficiencies, adrenal fatigue and overstressing are winners right now, and I'm going to start researching metal toxicity soon) and I'm wanting to heal through nutrition. To me, 'traditional foods' is about using foods as the nutritional building blocks to allow the body to heal itself. Which means I'm suddenly willing to eat things that I never would have considered before. I have two lamb's heads in the freezer, and just tried raw oysters for the first time last week, tongue for the first time on saturday, and tripe is on the menu tonight.

Well, first I have to say eeeewwwwww.... I have definitely come a long way in my eating, but I'm not quite at the point where I feel brave enough to eat tripe. But I do totally agree with you about healing through nutrition. That's where my focus is right now. I'm tired of trying one 'healing' supplement after another, only to have DD react to them because there are hidden allergens in them. Plus, it really makes sense to me that the body can utilize the nutrients in whole foods much easier than in supplement/synthetic forms.

[Theloose]

Originally Posted by changingseasons

Well, first I have to say eeeewwwwww.... I have definitely come a long way in my eating, but I'm not quite at the point where I feel brave enough to eat tripe.

Yeah, my eats everything, isn't grossed out by anything dh says the same thing. I haven't tried tripe before, so I'm not saying ew yet

So I'd suggest looking at your supplements/packaged foods and replacing them with the homemade food version. With the disclaimer that I'm taking synthetic vitamins right now because I haven't found any way around it yet

probiotics come from fermented veggies
soda is made with water kefir grains
glutamine comes from bone broth, meat and cabbage

what are you taking?

[changingseasons]

Only Vitamin C (derived from sago palm) right now, no other supplements. Wait- that's not true. I just started taking a digestive enzyme complex that my ND gave me. And if that goes ok I will try the adrenal support supp she gave me. I don't remember the last time I had a packaged food.... so no need to switch anything there.

I know that I need more calcium. I was doing nettle infusions, then my ND told me that you won't really get much calcium unless you're actually eating the nettle- and infusion will only get so much out of the leaves. So then I was going to start taking some nettle caps, but it turns out I just can't have any type of capsules.... (it's really hard to find one without beef or corn.)

[Theloose]

I've been doing bone meal for calcium, but that would obviously be hard without beef. Try significantly upping your bone broth? And do a search here for ideas, there were some threads on calcium and herbal infusions.

Maybe you could mix into applesauce or the like, but I bet it'd be REALLY hard to actually eat enough that way (or in caps).

[Pookietooth]

I would say, if you can do lamb, you can probably do goat, so try to find that (middle eastern stores or Indian stores often sell it -- the middle eastern stores will have halal goat, which is pastured, and goat in general tends to be pastured, although I'm not sure it's 100% grass fed). I would also suggest duck and duck eggs, but go carefully since they are poultry. What about turkey? And wild game like deer and elk? Also, coconut?
A paleo diet might be hard if you can't do fruits (which from your list it looks like you might be able to do nothing but a few tropical fruits), just in terms of the lack of carbs for a bfing mama -- or is ketosis ok with bfing?

[guestmama9904]

not that beef is the be all end all of meats, but what in beef would a person be allergic to? have any practitioners been able to help you discern what specific foods are causing the allergies? i have many food sensivities but can eat any meat as long as it doesnt have added nitrates or sulfites. i didn't know people could even become allergic to meat. the bloody stools sound scary. best luck.

[WuWei]

Originally Posted by Pookietooth

just in terms of the lack of carbs for a bfing mama -- or is ketosis ok with bfing?

LLL recommends adequate carbohydrate intake to avoid ketosis while nursing, as rapid weight loss increases the toxins excreted from the body. http://www.llli.org/FAQ/lowcarb.html

Basically, no more than 0.5 lbs weight loss per week. Lack of hunger, on a high protein diet is a sign of ketosis. http://women.webmd.com/guide/high-pr...ohydrate-diets

Additionally, as excess protein is excreted, fluid is excreted concurrently, in order to protect the kidneys. Thus, milk production could be decreased.

I'd add fruits and vegetables for the vitamins and minerals, as these are essential to baby for simple carbohydrates, which are easy on the gut.

You can test your urine for ketones, to see if you are in ketosis. It could vary day to day.

Significantly *increasing* fluid intake would be essential, such that you are urinating frequently.

HTH, Pat

[WuWei]

Originally Posted by whoMe

I've been doing bone meal for calcium,

Many bonemeal products contain high, even dangerous, levels of lead. Labels should be read carefully to make sure the product has been tested. http://www.answers.com/topic/bone-meal


Pat

[Theloose]

Neat article, and thanks for the heads up. The stuff I've been using claims to be tested and safe.
http://www.nowfoods.com/index.php?ac...l&item_id=3353

[changingseasons]

Originally Posted by Pookietooth

I would say, if you can do lamb, you can probably do goat, so try to find that (middle eastern stores or Indian stores often sell it -- the middle eastern stores will have halal goat, which is pastured, and goat in general tends to be pastured, although I'm not sure it's 100% grass fed). I would also suggest duck and duck eggs, but go carefully since they are poultry. What about turkey? And wild game like deer and elk? Also, coconut?
A paleo diet might be hard if you can't do fruits (which from your list it looks like you might be able to do nothing but a few tropical fruits), just in terms of the lack of carbs for a bfing mama -- or is ketosis ok with bfing?

I haven't tried goat- thanks for that suggestion. I think turkey is ok, but anything other than the standard (non-organic) grocery store stuff is hard to find for a decent price. I haven't tried duck or duck eggs... but I would love to have some eggs back in my diet, so maybe in a couple months I will try it out. I'm thinking about asking my best friend in MT to send me some of their deer or elk this year, but I'm not sure if she even got a tag for either...

Originally Posted by arismama!

not that beef is the be all end all of meats, but what in beef would a person be allergic to? have any practitioners been able to help you discern what specific foods are causing the allergies? i have many food sensivities but can eat any meat as long as it doesnt have added nitrates or sulfites. i didn't know people could even become allergic to meat. the bloody stools sound scary. best luck.

Um, maybe you missed the list of foods that DD is allergic too. You can be allergic to ANYTHING. Sorry if I sound short... I'm just REALLY tired of hearing things like that from family, friends, doctors, you name it. Like, "I've never heard of someone being allergic to stevia. ..... Are you sure she's allergic? ..... I'm sure a little won't hurt. ..... Did the doctor tell you she's allergic? ..... Why are you limiting her diet like that? ..... 'The' tests said that she's fine and not allergic to anything."

Oh- to answer your question: If you have a food allergy, you are normally allergic to the protein in the food. Which is why some people can tolerate something like peanut oil (in which the proteins have been processed out) even if they're allergic to peanuts. If you have a food intolerance/sensitivity/delayed-reaction allergy, you can basically react to the whole food- not just the protein.

Originally Posted by WuWei

LLL recommends adequate carbohydrate intake to avoid ketosis while nursing, as rapid weight loss increases the toxins excreted from the body. http://www.llli.org/FAQ/lowcarb.html

Basically, no more than 0.5 lbs weight loss per week. Lack of hunger, on a high protein diet is a sign of ketosis. http://women.webmd.com/guide/high-pr...ohydrate-diets

Additionally, as excess protein is excreted, fluid is excreted concurrently, in order to protect the kidneys. Thus, milk production could be decreased.

I'd add fruits and vegetables for the vitamins and minerals, as these are essential to baby for simple carbohydrates, which are easy on the gut.

You can test your urine for ketones, to see if you are in ketosis. It could vary day to day.

Significantly *increasing* fluid intake would be essential, such that you are urinating frequently.

HTH, Pat

Oh crap- I've definitely lost my feeling of hunger... But I'm not sure if that's just because I've been eating such a limited diet for so long. I eat about 1 cup of buckwheat flour every day (in pancake/waffle form), so I shouldn't be in ketosis, right? Maybe I should check my urine tomorrow morning. I have some of the pH strips around here somewhere. Thanks for that info.