lying okay to hospital?

[hpienkos]

A while back, my son fell down the steps, (9 mos old) and i took him to the ER just to make sure he was okay and they asked if he was all updated on his shots, I said yes, (Even though he has had no shots at all) because I wanted them to focus on him and his head and not his shots which are not needed! So anyway, they went on and he looked fine and they checked his head and all and sent him home. He has been fine since. But I have been thinking now, if I said yes, could the hospital ever check up on records and call CPS for lying or anything? Is it wrong to lie about this in a hospital?

[phathui5]

I would not lie about it. I'm comfortable with our vaccination decisions.

[theretohere]

I wouldn't lie about it. Everything that you say has the potential to make it into the chart. Lying about it makes it look like you think you should have done it, but didn't. That could be medical neglect.
I always am forthright- no. We don't vaccinate.
I've been challenged about it, and I've had some Drs be fine with it. Either way, I have nothing to hide.

[2boyzmama]

I've heard some parents say something like "he's up to date on the schedule that his dr and I agree on" or "his dr is managing his vaccination schedule" or something like "he's not right now, but will be soon" or "he was sick at his last appointment so he coudln't get them" None of those are LIES, really. (i.e. you don't specify when "soon" is, perhaps it's next month or next year. Then next year you can decide to put it off another year)

Honesty is always easier (no story or excuse to have to remember). In my experience, ERs are more likely to hassle you about vaccines if you are bringing your child in for an illness, not so much an injury (unless it's tetanus they're supposedly worried about)

If a dr ever does start to discuss it with you, wait until the first break in the converation and say something like "thank you for this information, you've given me a lot to think about, I'll be sure to discuss it with his dr." That *should* stop the conversation right there. ERs should not be giving vaccines (with the exception of tetanus) because none of them are for acute illness/injury (and I know tetanus vaccine is also not for acute injury, but they try to tell you it is) So by just saying that you are thankful for the information, they can't really do anything more, can they?

The more likely battle you might face is when a dr wants to run exhorbitant tests (like a spinal tap) when they discover your child isn't vaccinated, because suddenly they think he/she MUST have meningitis. That's when you'll have to be more firm in your questions (about the true chances of the illness, taking into account your child's symptoms) and decisions (agree to the test or not).

[bri276]

there are a lot of conflicting opinions on this and it's just that, opinions. personal preference.

I brought DD into the ER after a car accident and I did lie because it is in NO way relevant. I also lied right before her surgeries because I surely was not going to have some hysterical department cancel her or peg me as the crazy mother when I need to be working WITH them. And besides, "up to date" is not a legal term. My up to date and your up to date and their up to date could be several different things.

However- if I were bringing her in for what I believed to be a vax-preventable disease, I would be honest because it could change the course of treatment. For example, many MDs will not dx a fully vax'ed child with pertussis even if they have all the symptoms. Also, in that situation, they might review the chart and figure out you're lying anyways.

They cannot call CPS on you for not vaccinating. Or, they can, but CPS can't do a thing because it's not illegal. And technically, it's not lying because "up to date" could mean anything including no vaccines at all

[spero]

Originally Posted by phathui5

I would not lie about it. I'm comfortable with our vaccination decisions.

Originally Posted by theretohere

I wouldn't lie about it.

...

I have nothing to hide.

:

There are conflicting opinions on this subject here. Personally, I wouldn't lie/be vague. I simply say, "We don't vaccinate for religious reasons".

[AllyRae]

I don't lie because if someone else comes into that hospital with a VPD, I want to make sure that they know of our children's status so that our kids can be moved somewhere different if necessary. But, one child has a medical exemption and the other child we are on a delayed schedule because she was adopted at 4 months, and we are quite comfortable with the decision we made. I just always tell them what vaxes haven't been received and say "if there is a patient in the unit with one of those diseases, please ensure that the risk of transmission to my kids is minimized" or something that that extent.

[Purple Cat]

I really wouldn't worry about it either way. VPD is so rare that I don't think you are at any real risk of contracting polio from teh kid in the next bed. KWIM? If you feel more comfortable in ER situations just saying "yes," even though its, um, not quite truthful, do it. If the situation ever developed where you felt correcting the info was important, you could have just said you were nervous and misunderstood teh question, but he actually hasn't been vaccinated. Even if your child had been fully vaccinated, I cannot imagine any dr. saying, "gee, this kid has all the symptoms of meningitis (sp?), but it cannot possibly be meningitis because he was vaccinated so we dont' need to test for that." Can you imagine the glaring malpractice suit and license censure that dr. would face? Vaccines just lessen the probability of developing a VPD. Don't worry. As far as calling CPS for "lying," I cannot imagine that happening. If they did say they were calling CPS for lying, just try to calmly say you misunderstood the question or they must have misunderstood what you said, but that you were nervous from being in the ER. I cannot even imagine it getting to that point, and I cannot imagine CPS doing anything except being annoyed at a nuisance call.

[Gitti]

Originally Posted by hpienkos

He has been fine since. But I have been thinking now, if I said yes, could the hospital ever check up on records and call CPS for lying or anything? Is it wrong to lie about this in a hospital?

imo what you did was justified and you did the right thing. If you would have told them that your child had no vaccines they would have wasted so much time to berate you at a time when you did not need that.

I am secure with my decision also, but I am not going to spend precious time to try to convince some brain washed doctor who might bring out the big guns when my child has a scratch just because he is so scared of germs.

And what you said about CPS, don't give it one moments thought. There is no law that you must vaccinate. And you are allowed to lie to whoever you want except the court under oath. There is no law against lying.

[mama_ani]

When my son went into the hospital at 11 months I was ready for them to freak about his non-vaxxed status. I had my responses all ready, I was ready for them. They never asked. I was almost disappointed. The only one they asked about was whether he had the flu shot or not (because he was admitted for influenza) - they didn't even ask about any of the others.
What was kind of funny was the morning we were being discharged I overheard the doctor recording his notes and it went like this "11 month old male, fully vaccinated except for the flu shot, admitted three days ago..."
I guess they just assumed he was vaccinated?

I wouldn't lie about my child's vaccination status in a case of an unknown illness but for a fall maybe. I'm really not sure. Like you (OP) said, I'd want them to focus on his potential injury from a fall not what injections they want him to have.

[emaye_to_2]

We've been at random Urgent Care and ER visits for accidents and such and they always ask the quick question: Is she up-to-date on all of her shots. As a selective vaxer, I just say yes. It's way easier. And I never felt it was a relevant question. If I brought my child in to the ER with a serious unknown illness I would give them the info.

[goodygumdrops]

No, I don't think it's ok to lie about your childs vax status. I think it puts your child at a disadvantage.

[chaoticzenmom]

I have lied before in the heat of the moment. I wanted them to work on the issues and not put my son through unnessesary things that had nothing to do with what we were there for. We went in for a broken arm and I asked if they could also patch up his scratched arm. They looked at it and said "He's up to date on Vaccines, right?" and I said "yep, I believe so." I wasn't about to fight about a tetnus shot at that moment for a scratch on his elbow. When my youngest son was in the hospital for an operation and it was a calmer situation, I did say "we don't vaccinate."

If I've got an eager looking dr. Asking as if it's a big deal, I'm going to lie so that I don't have to fight for something dumb while my child is in the hospital. I've heard horror stories of dr's putting children through hell with all kinds of unnessesary tests because of their non-vax status. I consider it another part of protecting my child to protect them from the ignorance that might be inflicted upon them in a hospital where I'm likely to not have as many rights to decline treatment.

[just_lily]

I understand where you are coming from. I am completely comfortable with our current decision (to delay, most likely indefinitely), but I am really bad at confrontation. It is hard enough to try to make these decisions without hearing "Your baby is going to DIE!!!!!!" from every HCP that crosses your path.

If I were taking my child to the ER due to an injury, and it wasn't a hospital that I would regularly go to (like we were on vacation or something) I would probably just say yes, they are up to date. Not worth the hassle, imo. If it is the local hospital that I am likely to visit more than once, I would be more inclined to be honest.

But even if you lie once, it is easy enough to retract that statement later. I know women that suffered from pre-eclampsia in pregnancy, and then requested their health records after the fact. In almost every instance the records contained notes from conversations that didn't occur, and results from tests that were never performed. I am not saying that every doctor lies in their charts, but it seems to happen.... a lot. So it would be easy to say "oh, I don't remember being asked that" and nobody would question it... even if it was in the chart.

Do you ever watch the show House? Everybody lies.

[Disclaimer: I don't generally advocate lying, but in this instance I can see how it might be in the best interest of your child to do so.]

[the_lissa]

I wouldn't lie, but it has never come up at the ER, dentist, or anywhere else like I have read on mdc. I can't fathom why the topic of vaccinations would come up for something like a fall.

[CarrieMF]

I don't consider what you did lying. Your child is up to date on the shots you are or aren't allowing. so saying yes he's up to date is not a lie.

[AllyRae]

Originally Posted by the_lissa

I wouldn't lie, but it has never come up at the ER, dentist, or anywhere else like I have read on mdc. I can't fathom why the topic of vaccinations would come up for something like a fall.

It's a fairly routine question. It's actually one of the triage questions I get asked when my kids go to the ER, before they even ask what he's there for. But we've had mumps and pertussis outbreaks in my area recently, and so it helps them to know whether to offer a mask in case one of those cases was in the ER. Plus, they keep the vaccine status in the hospital records just in case it's needed. They don't really discriminate against cases--around here every parent is asked as one of the first questions.

[triscuitsmom]

When my DS was hospitalized I was very open about the fact he hadn't had any... the doctor was very passive agressive about the whole thing. He made such comments as "Some people vaccinate for rotovirus... but that doesn't matter because *I* am *only* his doctor, I don't really know anything" :

I responded "Yep, you are, and we wouldn't have gotten it even if it was available as I feel it has the potential to do more damage than good for his already compromised immune system" (The interesting thing about this was that he did NOT have rotovirus, but this ped was convinced at that point he did, and that it was MY fault my son was in the hospital unable to digest any food because I hadn't gotten him a vaccine that isn't even offered here )

I was annoyed because we spent a bunch of time in the ER with him lecturing me about vaccines and didn't I know kids died from not getting them... while my son lay unmoving from illness/dehydration with an IV in his arm... all related to his genetic malabsorbtion issues (which the ped didn't believe he really had, as soon as he was unvaxed he just couldn't believe that it could be anything else ).

I could see reason to lie based on this, because it definitely affected the care my son got... but no, I havn't, and wouldn't... because like others have said I have nothing to hide, I am confident in our choices, and I'd just rather not lie unless I felt it was *really* necessary.

[the_lissa]

Originally Posted by AllyRae

It's a fairly routine question. It's actually one of the triage questions I get asked when my kids go to the ER, before they even ask what he's there for. But we've had mumps and pertussis outbreaks in my area recently, and so it helps them to know whether to offer a mask in case one of those cases was in the ER. Plus, they keep the vaccine status in the hospital records just in case it's needed. They don't really discriminate against cases--around here every parent is asked as one of the first questions.

I still don't think there is any point. I've never been asked about my vax status or my children's, even when there was a rubella outbreak here.

[JamesMama]

I personally don't lie. And I've had my son in the ER 3 times for fairly (gushing blood) frantic emergencies. I've only had a dr give me any guff one time...and I think knowing the nurse personally (and having known her for my whole life) is what kept CPS from beating down my door.

Every other time the conversation has gone like this "Are his immunizations up to date?" "No, we do not vaccinate for religious reasons." "Oh, okay." moving on...I ALWAYS say 'religious' because that is the exemption I plan on getting in 3 years when it is time to put forth the paperwork for school...that way if they try to call me on it I have 6 years of 'Religious objection" paperwork.

Ugh, adding, I have had to (on numerous occasions) remind doctors that I object to VACCINES not that I would decline necessary medical treatment for my child...there was a family at church that MIGHT have had TB and exposed my children (they ended up not having TB) but I called my dr to ask about what to do about poss TB exposure and the nurse asked about vaccines and when I said we don't vaccinate she made some noise about "Well, even if it WAS TB you'd probably refuse treatment since you don't vaccinate." Um...no, if my child is sick I'm going to get him treatment...