A question about WIC and tetnus - Page 2

[Throkmorton]

Originally Posted by 3lilpunkins

If you're using a religious exemption, it's because it contradicts what you religiously believe.If I believe its a slap in God's face by injecting crap of all sorts into my child's body, then that's what I believe, and I can have a religious exemption, sorry if so many of you disagree.

Well, it's a darn good thing that there's nothing toxic that occurs naturally then! Especially not plants.
My kids are as unvaccinated as the next person's but you have to understand some basic information about the diseases you are not vaccinating against or you are going to freak out over every teeny little thing. Also, if you spell it tetanus you will have more success researching it online.

[milkybean]

Originally Posted by 3lilpunkins

I know the wound needs to bleed, I just get worried, purposely opening your skin and having a possibility of infection or tetnus.

Just in case it isn't clear, tetanus is an organism that cannot live in the presence of oxygen. So if a wound has bled, if it's been open to bleed (not just a bruise), then oxygen is there. So tetanus isn't going to live.

And tetanus isn't just out there, waiting to get in. It's in/on specific things, which is why the barnyard reference is made, b/c it can be found in things with poop on them. So when my brother fell from the garage roof into our old chicken coop onto the rolled bale of old barbed wire (rusty, even), YES I'm sure he got a tetanus shot, b/c that's NOT a good place to fall. (not sure if I would give a shot but my mom did and it's hard to argue with it, unlike when she was given a tetanus shot b/c a spider bit her, and they gave her the DTP shot to boot!)

Originally Posted by paquerette

I'd be more worried about MRSA than tetanus.

And OP that is the sort of infection you would be worried about, especially in a medical setting. Those serious, aerobic (thrive in oxygen, unlike the anaerobic organisms) bacteria and viruses that hang out in such settings are much more likely to cause a problem, b/c being exposed to oxygen isn't a problem for them.



Sorry your religious reasons don't seem to go along with others' religious reasons. Religious exemption is a funny. Conveniently, with church and state being separate, "they" can't legally ask you even what religion you are, let alone get into a debate with them! But as an example of the differences, hubby is Buddhist. To him, the teachings clearly show that vaccines are wrong. But the Dalai Lama doesn't feel the same, and you can clearly see his smallpox vaccination scar on his arm (I have mine on my BACK, right over my T4 and T5 vertebrae, yuck). We see the animals killed, the poisons in the vaccine, and we also do not fear illness. But he sees some "greater good" that I guess makes the deaths and poisons worth it and OK.

So even when you're inside a religion, different people can have different views.

And that's funny about the 666 thing. Math games are fun!

[MissRubyandKen]

I can not believe how unkind some responding posters have been to the OP. It certainly doesn't make any of you look better than if that's what you were going for.

To the OP, I wouldn't worry about tetanus or any other infection from a sterile needle finger prick at the WIC office.

[maxmama]

Originally Posted by 3lilpunkins

Well how else can anyone claim a religious exemption. Anyway, I try to use herbs and natural remedies, foreign yes, but toxic & polluting,no.
I mean, this is how I see it, It's good enough for the doctors.
Food, God intended for us to ingest. He designed food to sustain life. Vaccines are not the work of God. For if they were, they would be 100% effective, without containing aborted babies,monkey kidneys,heavy metals, and toxic chemicals.Did you know if you assign a multiple of 6 to every letter, (a=6,b=12,c=18,d=24.....) Apply that to the word "vaccination" add up all the numbers, the sum is 666. coinsidence?
Any way, I guess I should research my own questions instead of asking for opinions here. I thought this was a place where knowledge moms try to help each other out, not gang up on a newbie.

I'm confused, as I'm not a creationist, but didn't god create the aborted fetuses, monkey kidneys, etc., etc. that you're referencing? Am I missing something?

[llamalluv]

Originally Posted by 3lilpunkins

I didn't say it was the mark of the beast or anything. I was merely pointing out something I found interesting.
Which everyone who read that apparently missed my point and got side tracked by the #s.

What is interesting about 666 in and of itself? That is, outside of the book of Revelation citing it as "the mark"?

Originally Posted by 3lilpunkins

How is anyone supposed to claim a religious exemption, when everyone tears it up and dissects it? you all say,"its none of their business what religion you are...", I thought you just said that b/c the laws do not discriminate by naming certain religions, I didn't realize it was b/c you are really not religiously opposed, but rather morally opposed.

Some of us ARE religiously opposed to some of the vaccines. Or all of them. Or even medical procedures at all. And what is the difference between moral and religious, in your opinion? Aren't ones morals based upon their religious beliefs (even if their "religious" beliefs are strictly "secular humanism"?)

Originally Posted by 3lilpunkins

I mean you could turn anyone's "religious views" around on them and say, well that's not really religious b/c....

This seems to be a non sequitur.

Originally Posted by 3lilpunkins

If you're using a religious exemption, it's because it contradicts what you religiously believe.If I believe its a slap in God's face by injecting crap of all sorts into my child's body, then that's what I believe, and I can have a religious exemption, sorry if so many of you disagree.

I don't recall anyone telling you otherwise. Just to be informed about your decisions.

[llamalluv]

Originally Posted by Throkmorton

Right you are. Also "Jesus" adds up to 666 is you assign each letter a multiplier of 9. Ooooh, spooky.

And, on your birthday, if you subtract your age from the current year, and then add 50 times 2, you'll get an answer that tells you what year you will turn 100!

[lirpasirhc]

OP, the archives on DTaP have a lot of info. i hope you continue your research and find answers that are helpful.

if a wound bleeds, it's not a tetanus risk. crushing and burning wounds seem to be associated w/ tetanus. poor circulation (age, diabetes) are also risk factors. there were less than 1,000 cases in the year before vaccinations for tetanus were started, so it's exceedingly rare.

[alegna]

Originally Posted by 3lilpunkins

I've used a religious exemption for vaxes, and I can honestly say, I am opposed to them on a religious level.
But how could you justify a religious exemption for testing blood for iron?
It never crossed my mind to opt out due to religion for that too...
I'm just curious, How could you explain to someone, I know its really none of their business, and the law still applies even if you dont belong to a church or group that supports that idea.
But I just like to have bullets to load up with, just in case

eh, I could formulate a religious objection pretty easily...

here we go:
The skin is a sacred vessel holding the human body together. To pierce it intentionally allows an opening where evil can enter or bits of the soul can escape.

Originally Posted by CorasMama

This is not meant to be snarky, but how exactly are you going to care for those VPDs without foreign substances? Is the difference between injecting and ingesting really that important? (food is a foreign substance)

Most of the vaccine available diseases are really not diseases we "treat" *with* anything....

-Angela

[MayBaby2007]

Originally Posted by paquerette

I'm pretty sure you can refuse the testing, though.

I didn't know that!

Originally Posted by Fruitful4Him

We refuse "for religious reasons". WIC is mandated to offer the screening but being a federal program they are not allowed to discrimate based on religious beliefs. We typed up our own waiver and they have copies for each child on file..we have used multiple WIC locations over the years and have only had minimal hassles. Know your rights and stand firm.

I'm bummed! I refused to let them prick dd's itty bitty finger to check for iron. If the doctor I chose for dd didn't find it neccessary to check for iron, I found it ridiculous that this place was going to FORCE me to do so.

They told me if I didn't get dd's iron checked, I could no longer benefit from the program. Fine. I've struggled (and continue to) but I thought it was complete BS that they could FORCE me to put dd through a needless (IMO) test. Damn. Wish I would have known about religious exemption before. I guess I can re-apply with this, yes? (FTR, I wasn't worried about tetanus--just didn't believe it was right for them to FORCE me to do that. I have a problem with people/places forcing me to do anything, specially something I (and her doctor) didn't feel the need to do).

Originally Posted by Throkmorton

Right you are. Also "Jesus" adds up to 666 is you assign each letter a multiplier of 9. Ooooh, spooky.

: *snort*

[CorasMama]

Originally Posted by alegna

Most of the vaccine available diseases are really not diseases we "treat" *with* anything....

-Angela

Really? Not anything? Really?

[alegna]

Originally Posted by CorasMama

Really? Not anything? Really?

I dunno- do oatmeal baths count for chicken pox?

Fluids and chicken soup?

Rest and tv?

-Angela

[maxmama]

Originally Posted by alegna

I dunno- do oatmeal baths count for chicken pox?

Fluids and chicken soup?

Rest and tv?

-Angela

What about antibiotics for pertussis, diphtheria and pneumococcus? It's not just all about the varicella.

[mysticmomma]

To Whom It May Concern:

My family’s religious beliefs prohibit us from using many modern medical tests such as blood tests, immunizations, x-rays, and most other invasive medical procedures. As such, we will be unable to provide you with an immunization record or iron level for our visits.


I am aware that according to WIC federal guidelines we may not qualify for WIC if our other medical and dietary factors are normal.


“Bloodwork Exemptions

Certain participants may be granted an exemption from the bloodwork requirement:

• Individuals whose religious beliefs prohibit the taking of blood (i.e., Jehovah’s Witnesses, Christian Scientists, etc.)

• Applicants with chronic medical conditions such as hemophilia or AIDS, if their doctor documents that they are getting medical care, requests that you not do
additional blood tests, and provides bloodwork information periodically.

These cases must be documented and dealt with as follows:

• Explain to the applicant/participant the purpose of bloodwork and its use as a reason for certification. Let them know that they may not qualify for WIC if other medical and dietary factors are normal, since Hct,Hgb/FEP results will not be available. Document in the chart that you have provided this information.

• Document the reason for the absence of bloodwork in the participant chart.

• Assess anthropometric, dietary and medical information for nutritional risk
and conduct all other steps appropriate for certification”

Codes 99/99.9 – Allowable reasons for waiving bloodwork include the following and must be documented in the client’s chart:
1. Infant is 6 months and blood work is waived to comply with CDC guidelines.
2. Applicants whose religious beliefs shall not allow them to have blood drawn.
3. Applicants with “life long” medical conditions such as hemophilia.
4. Applicants with a treatable skin disease or with a serious skin condition.

[kriket]

Originally Posted by llamalluv

I have done the research on the disease, the causes, and the likelihood of contracting it in my day to day life, and combined with that information and the fact that I have a strong negative reaction to the vax, I have made the decision to no longer vaccinate myself against Tetanus.

Me too.

Originally Posted by 3lilpunkins

The body is the temple of God, so to pollute it, is defiling the temple of God.

Can you refuse the prick on these grounds?

Originally Posted by MissRubyandKen

I can not believe how unkind some responding posters have been to the OP. It certainly doesn't make any of you look better than if that's what you were going for.

To the OP, I wouldn't worry about tetanus or any other infection from a sterile needle finger prick at the WIC office.

Totally.

Plus, it really is a sterile prick. Just like when you test blood sugar for diabetes. I don't worry about getting tetnus every morning and evening from my test kit! plus I reuse lancetts, tell me who doesn't!! Its not like I share.

[alegna]

Originally Posted by maxmama

What about antibiotics for pertussis, diphtheria and pneumococcus? It's not just all about the varicella.

I would not use antibiotics for pertussis. Chance of my kids getting diphtheria is about nil, so honestly I've not researched treatments. Pneumococcus chances of them getting the vax strains are close to nil.

-Angela

[maxmama]

Originally Posted by alegna

I would not use antibiotics for pertussis. Chance of my kids getting diphtheria is about nil, so honestly I've not researched treatments. Pneumococcus chances of them getting the vax strains are close to nil.

-Angela

The question wasn't about what you would do. The question was whether there are, in fact, treatments beyond supportive measures for most VPD, and the answer is that yes, there are.

[Emmeline II]

Originally Posted by milkybean

And tetanus isn't just out there, waiting to get in. It's in/on specific things, which is why the barnyard reference is made, b/c it can be found in things with poop on them.

The increased risk to farmers is so small I'm not sure that it would be statistically significant. Tetanus spores are everywhere (even in dust) but you are more likely to be struck by lightening than to contract it. The case studies I've happened to read concerning tetanus were elderly gardeners, and middle aged men of indifferent health, none of which were on farms.

[Emmeline II]

Originally Posted by CorasMama

Really? Not anything? Really?

I think she is referring to pharmaceuticals.

For pertussis, antibiotics are to prevent pnumonia in infants and to prevent the spread of the disease to the patient's contacts. The patient can be treated with sodium ascorbate and what ever makes them comfortable.

Measles? High doses of vitamin A, rest, fluids. There is nothing to do for a typical case.

For childhood illnesses comfort measures and increases in certain vitamins are pretty much all you do. I do have Romm's book for treatment ideas.

[Emmeline II]

I'm all for helping out with religious exemptions, but discussions of religious issues in general can get snarky. How about we all play nice and be helpful to one another.

[peainthepod]

Wow, this thread got really nasty for some reason. I didn't realize people here are expected to defend their religious beliefs when deciding not to vaccinate.

Instead of derisively snarking at someone who is seeking help and information, maybe some of you could actually, you know...help her.

3lilpunkins, you've gotten some good responses in here despite the rudeness, especially mysticmomma's letter of explanation. The DTaP archives here and all of the information at Inside Vaccines might also help you out.

And yeah, you're not going to get tetanus from a sterile needle prick in a modern medical office. Other infections, maybe, but almost certainly not tetanus.