Flu shots and kids with lung issues

[Ruthla]

I spent the last 5 days in the Children's Hospital with DS because he has pneumonia. He's doing much better now, but he's not at 100% and I expect he'll be extra-vulnerable all fall and winter.

In the E.R. on Wednesday (or maybe it was when he was first admitted Wed night?) a nurse asked me about giving him a flu shot, and I simply told her that I think this is a bad time for that since his immune system is already stressed to the max. It wasn't brought up again the whole hospital visit, but I'm sure it's going to come up with the ped at one (or more) of the follow-up visits.

I know the flu shot is a bad idea for anybody, with its high rate of reactions and low efficacy. I'm not going to let him get a flu shot this year (or any year until he turns 18 and starts making his own medical decisions.) But I also know that the ped is likely to pressure me to give it to him, especially now that he's got lung issues and the flu would be more dangerous than it would be for a "healthy" kid.

I want to be prepared when I take him in. Should I attempt to argue the science or claim religious opposition? (Remember this is the same ped that I take all of my kids to, including my Gardasil-aged DDs).

[kiara7]

I would claim religious exemption with him (not that a simple "no" shouldn't suffice, but we all know how doc's are) - imo it would be easier and save you some trouble for your dds).

[alegna]

Yep. I'd go religious. Especially given that you're in NY... you might need the school system again at some point.

-Angela

[Peony]

I have a child with lung issues and claim religious.

[mamaverdi]

I have a child with lung issues, and they don't press me about it.

[momofmine]

I would decide in your mind what you believe is right (which it sounds like no flu shot is your answer) and just believe it. And don't let it get to you. There is no discussion. Just say, thanks for your perspecitve, and I will consider it. Then move the discussion along.

[chambom]

Can I ask what kind of lung issues you guys are refering to?

My friend's baby has a gurggle in her lungs that the specialists can't figure out, I know she vaxes, but I don't know if she has done the flu shot...should I advise her against it?

[Mrsboyko]

My DD was DX with asthma at 14 months old due to her chronic lung issues. She was sick from basically Dec till March last year with NO healthy days at all. In all that time, probably the only thing she didn't get was the flu. Every time we took her in to be checked out (like every 2 weeks) they did a swab and she was clear, They were convinced she MUST have the flu because she wasn't vaccinated. Having lung issues (pneumonia, bronchitis, asthma, etc.) does not predispose you to getting the flu. Flu does not generally cause a cough or any lung problems, it tends to be more of a full body thing. We do have a nebulizer and inhaler at home for when she starts coughing (because every cold goes to her chest) but that is our precaution due to her asthma. We've only had to pull out the neb for 3 days so far this season.

Stay strong in your decisions. Do not let them sway you. Oh, and about the guardisil, that is scary stuff. I would very firmly tell them that your DD's will NOT be getting that vaccine till it has been tested further. THat should satisfy them.

[Ruthla]

Originally Posted by chambom

Can I ask what kind of lung issues you guys are refering to?

My friend's baby has a gurggle in her lungs that the specialists can't figure out, I know she vaxes, but I don't know if she has done the flu shot...should I advise her against it?

My specific concerns are that my son just got out of the hospital with pneumonia. Up until now he's been completely healthy- no history of asthma or anything. In fact, when I went to drop off his prescription for abx on the way home from the hospital, I realized that he's never had any prescriptions before! I've lived here and used this pharmacy for over 3 years and they didn't have his insurance information on file!

[Scribe]

They may suggest the pneoumonia vaccination as well, depending on how serious his case was, so whatever you decide to use as reasoning you may want to be prepared for that as well.

I get both, and have since I had my last bout of pneumonia at 10, every year except for two. Both of those years, I got pneumonia. No thanks.

[Ruthla]

Yup, you were right Grace. She recomended he get both the flu shot and the pneumonia shot, but she wouldn't have done them today even if I'd wanted to. He's doing a million times better than he was last Wednesday, but he's still got pneumonia and she won't vax him until he's better.

So where can I research this pneumonia vax and its efficacy on kids who've already had pneumonia?

[Scribe]

Sorry, all I've got is anecdotal evidence. I have heard, though, that there are different pneumonia vaxs for adults and kids, and the kids' is supposed to be the more effective of the two in combating drug-resistant pneumonia.

[Ruthla]

Urgh, this is hard stuff to find info about! First, I see that the ped gave me info about pneumococcal conjugate vaccine, and the info states that it's only for kids 0-5; and that older kids and adults should be getting pneumococcal polysaccharide vaccine. Since he'll be 7 by the time he goes back for follow-up, I think she gave me the wrong vaccine info sheet.

What I'm trying to find is specific information about efficacy in kids who've already had pneumonia- but since so many American kids get the full conjugate vaccine series as infants and toddlers, it's hard to find a group of sick kids to study.

And if we want to go with anecdotes, I'd be absolutely terrified to get this vaccine! All the other kids we met in the hospital with pneumonia already had this vaccine "on time" and were much sicker than DS was.

[Scribe]

Originally Posted by Ruthla

And if we want to go with anecdotes, I'd be absolutely terrified to get this vaccine! All the other kids we met in the hospital with pneumonia already had this vaccine "on time" and were much sicker than DS was.

Well, you don't have to do it, right? I mean, I'd do it, b/c of my personal experience with it, but if you don't feel right about it, don't do it. Your son may or may not get pneumonia again, but even if he does, the overwhelming odds are it will be like this time--sucky, but fine in the end. He's healthy in general and you are taking good care of him. He'll be fine.

[Ruthla]

Oh, apparently the Prevnar vaccine IS liscenced for kids up to age 9, although it's efficacy hasn't been studied in older kids and it's not routinely recomended for this age group. This just might be the one she wants to give him after all. :

What I've discovered so far is that I don't think he ever had pneumococcal illness, as his symptoms don't match up. So he won't have any immunity to this, and this vaccine wouldn't have prevented this illness anyway. The whole point is to prevent him from catching this particular virus, thinking he's weaker and less likely to be able to fight it off effectively. I think I'd rather strengthen his immune system so he can fight off ANY bacteria or viruses he encounters, and limit his exposure to foreign germs in the meantime.

[Deborah]

in case someone is thinking that flu-mist might be a good alternative to the injected shot:

http://www.ageofautism.com/2008/09/f...ment-138733980

[k9sarchik]

After winding up in ICU after coming down with the flu I still would not get the flu shot. It really affected my asthmatic lungs and was super scary.
At the time my immune system was fairly week and my allergies were causing me all sorts of problems.
After that I really worked on improving my health so that if I should get the flu again I will be healthier.

[Ruthla]

That's a scary link Deborah!

I did a ton of research yesterday and digested it last night and today. It looks like the vaccines wouldn't have prevented what he currently has, but are simply a precaution because, if he did get influenza or pneumococcis, it could turn very serious for him as his immune system is weaker right now. But I think that he'll be healthier in the long run by strengthening his immune system rather than giving him shots that might protect him from a handful of specific pathogens, and could further weaken his immune system in the process.

[Peony]

Originally Posted by Mrsboyko

My DD was DX with asthma at 14 months old due to her chronic lung issues. She was sick from basically Dec till March last year with NO healthy days at all. In all that time, probably the only thing she didn't get was the flu. Every time we took her in to be checked out (like every 2 weeks) they did a swab and she was clear, They were convinced she MUST have the flu because she wasn't vaccinated. Having lung issues (pneumonia, bronchitis, asthma, etc.) does not predispose you to getting the flu. Flu does not generally cause a cough or any lung problems, it tends to be more of a full body thing. We do have a nebulizer and inhaler at home for when she starts coughing (because every cold goes to her chest) but that is our precaution due to her asthma. We've only had to pull out the neb for 3 days so far this season.

Stay strong in your decisions. Do not let them sway you. Oh, and about the guardisil, that is scary stuff. I would very firmly tell them that your DD's will NOT be getting that vaccine till it has been tested further. THat should satisfy them.

This is exactly my DD2 as well, she was O2 dependent as well until 7 months of age. She is always, always sick. We got August off this year with no illnesses and that was it.

[Ruthla]

It was hard enough having DS 02 dependent for 5 days!