http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6htxMJ4cfQs&feature=player_embedded

I stumbled upon this today, posted it to my blog, thinking it was so very sweet and moving, only all I got were horrible comments on how wrong and disgusting this was...

I was totally thrown and would like to post something in response, but I just don't know what to say... does anyone have any suggestions????

I think its a beautiful and wonderful thing. I really do. But, unfortunately, most people think it's gross. You wouldn't believe the looks I got and the comments I received when people found out I was bottle feeding my daughter donated breast milk. It's really quite sad that people think it's better for a baby to get formula, full of all sorts of crap, instead of breast milk, whether or not it comes from mom. Personally, I would have loved to have had my daughter wet nursed.

When I was pregnant, I read a story about a woman who was in car crash or something and was in a coma. She made her husband promise her - way before it ever happened - that he would make sure their child got breast milk. So he asked for donated milk. One woman came in and started pumping but the baby was really fussy and she finally said "just give me the baby" and nursed him. After reading that, it made me think, and I made DP promise to either do that, or have someone pump me every two hours or whatever.

Then there was that story in People a little while ago - maybe six months ago? - called "Feeding Moses". This woman died 12 hours or something after her son was born and her husband had at least 20 local women pumping for him so his son only had breast milk. I believe some women stayed there during the day, and possibly at night, so Moses could be nursed. It was really sweet.

Amazing how after that article came out, my daughter receiving donated breast milk wasn't so gross. :eyesroll

I have to agree with you! I have donated breast milk before and would give donated milk to my lo's if they needed it. I have never had the reason or opportunity to actually wet nurse, but I don't think I would have a problem with it... I feed other babies bottles all the time... really, what's the difference?? hehe. :)

I would totally donate and/or cross nurse and I would have no problem with someone (healthy and drug free) wetnursing my children especially if i was unable.

My friend's twins were bottle fed formula right from the beginning, (she's pro Babywise/WTEWYE etc) and the poor little guys had OBVIOUS dairy intolerances right from the beginning, but they woud not believe me. After months of slow weight gain, vomiting, eczema, etc the ped mentioned switching them to a dairy free formula. They did better... anyways, everytime I went to visit, I would look at these poor darlings, hanging out with the nanny in their bouncy seats, and just wished I could nurse them. or even just one. breaks my heart. I wish they had a wet nurse instead of a nanny.

what's so weird? My sister has had to breast feed my little one a few times for me and I thank God she could do it.

When I first gave birth my little one came out HUNGRy and would not sleep. At that time I only had my early milk and it just wasnt' cutting it with her. My sister came and wet nursed the baby and the baby finally calmed down and slept three hours straight. She was just hungry.

Another time I had to go to the hospital and didn't want to take my newborn with me. She came and wet nursed for me (thank you!!).

It's a baby and he/she need nourishment that is all there really is to it.

I think (but maybe I'm weird) that

43.2% Corn syrup solids1
4.6% soy protein isolate
11.5% high oleic safflower oil
10.3% sugar (sucrose), 8.4% soy oil
7.8% coconut oil
Less than 2% of: C. cohnii oil
M. alpina oil
calcium phosphate
potassium citrate
potassium chloride
magnesium chloride
sodium chloride
ascorbic acid
choline chloride
L-methionine, taurine
ascorbyl palmitate
ferrous sulfate
m-inositol, mixed tocopherols
zinc sulfate
d-alpha-tocopheryl acetate
L-carnitine, niacinamide
calcium pantothenate
cupric sulfate
thiamine chloride hydrochloride
vitamin A palmitate
riboflavin
pyridoxine hydrochloride
folic acid
potassium iodide
phylloquinone
biotin
sodium selenate
beta-carotene
vitamin D3
cyanocobalamin

mixed with water... is a weirder thing for an infant, who's mother is unable or unavailable to breastfeed, to eat than a nice soft, warm, comforting 'boo':D

In a perfect world all women would have breastmilk available to them (pumped or direct from the tap) when they can't supply it themsleves.

I think Bea said it perfectly :D.
The WHO state that another woman's milk is preferable to formula (option three out of four). And I'll bet that those who commented think that formula's OK...

I found that wet-nursing is a very emotional thing. Bonding with my newborn through nursing has always been one of the most special parts of having a baby. When my 4-week old developed thrush and I ended up with cracked, infected nipples because of it, I had to take about 3 or 4 days to rest my breasts and let them heal. I allowed my best friend at the time to wet nurse my son (since we were living in the same home). It was amazing and wonderful and I was so thankful - but it also hurt in a way much different than the thrush to see someone else feeding my beloved baby. Don't get me wrong, it was so awesome that I could do this and I was happy for my baby to be receiving breast milk... but I wanted to be the one nursing him, and I felt like a failure because my ""na-nas" were sick.

For all of that, when the thrush recurred a few weeks later, my friend and I were no longer getting along as well. I could not hand him over to her when she was refusing to speak to me, even though she later said that naturally her animosity would not have extended to the baby and she'd have been willing to wet-nurse again. It just hurt too much, though. So I gave him formula for a few days. He had some gas and he hated the silicone nipple, but luckily it was only for a couple of days. I went back to nursing just as soon as I could.

I don't think it's gross, weird or unnatural. I do think it's very emotional, though. It's not just a matter of handing your baby over (at least it wasn't to me). I was practically immobilized during that time - all I wanted to do was hold him and rock him because of the time that I could not spend nursing him. It takes a vast amount of trust to allow someone else to nurse your baby... again, this was just me.

Lil'Man is nearly 16 months old now, and I still nurse him. :love He hasn't had to have formula since that awful experience over a year ago. I nurse on one side because the thrush eventually caused me to lose the milk on one side, but he thrives and loves his na-na.

I don't think it's weird, although I think a woman should never breastfeed a child without asking its mother's permission (aside from survival scenarios or what-have-you, obviously). My sister and I talked about it once and said we'd be OK with each other breastfeeding our babies (not that she has a baby yet, so it was theoretical) if necessary, but we both agreed it would seem odd to do it just for the heck of it. Mum breastfed a friend's baby once when she was babysitting and the kidling was screaming her head off. They both survived. :lol

The "wetnursing is weird" thing is just a spinoff from the "breastfeeding is sexual" thing, I think. If we got rid of the latter opinion people would probably be far more pragmatic about it.

The "wetnursing is weird" thing is just a spinoff from the "breastfeeding is sexual" thing, I think. If we got rid of the latter opinion people would probably be far more pragmatic about it.

THis exactly. I don't have anything to prove it, but I bet in cultures where breasts are less sexualised, cross nursing is no big deal.

My friend and I have a standing agreement that either of us will nurse the others kid if that one's mama isn't available. Several times in public one or the other of us has nursed the other's kid.

I know people get weird about wet-nursing, but I've never even noticed anyone giving us strange looks. And it's been obvious that the kid nursing does not belong to the mom she's attached too. Usually we'll say something like "Do you want to come nurse her or do you want me to?"

I've been surprised not to get any negative reactions.

When a friend of mine had her baby a couple of years ago I volunteered to nurse her baby one day when she was just at her wit's end with the cracked nipples, pain, etc. She was all for it, but her dh stepped in and said no because it was "gross." SIGH. Here I was, a healthy intelligent woman who he trusted with the healthcare of his child (I was their PNP), and he couldn't get past the ick factor in his mind and trust me to help her with feeding. She was given formula that day and that was the end of their bfing relationship.
I think it's horribly sad that the vast majority of people cannot look past the sexualization of our breasts and see that God gave them to us to nourish our children.

I'm down for it! I wanted to take my doula course but wanted to make sure dh was set for b/m so I got some from dh's cousins wife. Sadly she had offered her b/m to her own twin sister and she wouldn't take it :( I also nursed her baby when I was preggers w dd. I was babysitting while they were in a wedding, and at that point was leaking a touch nothing to fill her up, but the poor little girl was so upset/throwing up and dh said...I CAN'T TAKE THE SCREAMING JUST NURSE HER!!! And it was like a light bulb..she jsut "nursed" contently until she drifted off. Sure she didn't get much if anything but atleast she wasn't throwing up and looking like she was going to black out. But dh's cousin doesn't know I did that, the mommy knows the daddy would lose his mind

I've nursed my sister's toddler (ds) and baby(dd2) on a few occasions (she lives a few states away and when she visits, she and her dh take advantage of having a sitter :love). I see nothing wrong with it, tho my dh would FREAK if he knew (especially regarding the toddler who was 3/3.5 at the time - he thinks it's wrong and disgusting that he still nurses at all :eyesroll). But he had no problem when I fed dd2 from my bm freezer stash. So it is absolutely a "breast as sexual objects" thing in his case.

And the only reason I would not want sis to nurse my lo (barring a survival situation, of course :wink) is because she consumes dairy and we are vegan.

Nice to know that I am not the only one who doesn't see anything wrong with it! :) But I still don't know what to reply on my blog...

I posted about the WHO saying that another mother's bm was the next best thing to your own bm if baby can't feed your lo for some reason. To which the answer was, "Yeah, your milk, not your boob". I suppose some people will just never come around to my way of thinking... oh well. Thanks so much for the replies!

Nice to know that I am not the only one who doesn't see anything wrong with it! :) But I still don't know what to reply on my blog...

I posted about the WHO saying that another mother's bm was the next best thing to your own bm if baby can't feed your lo for some reason. To which the answer was, "Yeah, your milk, not your boob". I suppose some people will just never come around to my way of thinking... oh well. Thanks so much for the replies!

I would say it might be helpful to point out the fact that they only think it's gross because they're considering the breast in a sexual light. Might not change the hard core dissenters, but could make others think.

Natural and generous. I know that would be my natural response to a hungry baby... :thumb

I have been nursing for the better part of six years now, though. Not sure how I would have felt in my pre-breastfeeding life. :o

Have you asked them about the cows the milk in their coffee is "donated" by? Seriously, i wonder how many people would still think of cows milk as perfectly natural for humans to drink if they'd stood in the concrete bay of a milking parlour wiping teats with antiseptic, fastening machines onto huge swollen udders and dodging the pee and poo as it streams hot and steaming from source!

People are just crazy i think. I would cross-nurse with relatives or friends, and have already told a bunch of pregnant and nursing friends that if i'm carrying twins this time (due in June) then they are on standby for extra nursing/milk! I do think crossnursing is a really intimate thing to do - feeding a baby is definitely an emotional act as well as a physical one - but to me that makes it a lovely close bond to share with another woman and her children when you're in need, and ancient kind of sisterhood. If other people feel that's too gross for them, well, that's their problem!

Wet nursing used to not only be totally normal, but the cool thing to do! It's all about cultural expectations.

And I like what GoBecGo said about cow milk being natural. :P It really puts things into perspective.

You know, my baby is supplemented with milk from three other generous moms. I am very, very grateful for it. But I really don't think I would want another mom to nurse my baby. There are situations where I would be OK with it (like if I were incapacitated and unable to be a comforting presence to my baby at all) but it just seems like such an intimate bond between mom and baby.

That said, if someone else wants to do it, I don't think it's weird!

Have you asked them about the cows the milk in their coffee is "donated" by? Seriously, i wonder how many people would still think of cows milk as perfectly natural for humans to drink if they'd stood in the concrete bay of a milking parlour wiping teats with antiseptic, fastening machines onto huge swollen udders and dodging the pee and poo as it streams hot and steaming from source

:thumb

I wish I had known someone to give me donated b/m or nurse all of my kids. I wasn't able to get much even taking herbs, pumping every 2 hrs, etc. It's something I had really wanted to do, but couldn't. Unfortunately we only had formula. My last ds is 14 months and had severe throwing up issues with formula, it sucked.

My daughter drank pumped milk from some of my wonderful friends when I was battling supply issues. And when it got to where there was not a drop of milk left and nothing was helping my supply--we drove right over to the home of my best friend, and she nursed my baby. I don't think a friend has ever or could ever do a more wonderful thing or give a more beautiful gift.

On another forum, I was called selfish for taking the milk from other women (my dear friends who didn't want to see my baby drink formula, either), told that I was reckless for accepting it from people who were not screened, and told it's less weird to give formula (hello, altered milk from another species? No, thank you.)

just posted the link to my facebook and wondering how many comments im going to get :wink

... told that I was reckless for accepting it from people who were not screened, and told it's less weird to give formula...

This was another problem I had when faced with possibly having my friend wet-nurse my son the second time I had thrush/cracked nipple issues last year. She likes to indulge in a little... err, smoking... every day, and the first time she nursed my baby, she abstained. The second time it became an issue, she wasn't talking to me so she didn't know I was having problems nursing. I could have gone to her and asked her to nurse the baby, but I knew she'd been smoking more than usual that weekend, it being a holiday (and holiday weekends are one big party between them and their neighbors). While a lot of people are perfectly okay with nursing while partaking of the herb, including this friend - who has always nursed her children while smoking - I don't like it. It's a personal opinion and I was just uncomfortable with it.

That being said, the biggest problem I had was the emotional thing. Had we been on speaking terms, I may have still asked her to help out before I gave the formula, because even mama-milk laced with MJ is better than formula, I think. But the entire emotional-rift thing just made it too difficult to consider.

This was another problem I had when faced with possibly having my friend wet-nurse my son the second time I had thrush/cracked nipple issues last year. She likes to indulge in a little... err, smoking... every day, and the first time she nursed my baby, she abstained. The second time it became an issue, she wasn't talking to me so she didn't know I was having problems nursing. I could have gone to her and asked her to nurse the baby, but I knew she'd been smoking more than usual that weekend, it being a holiday (and holiday weekends are one big party between them and their neighbors). While a lot of people are perfectly okay with nursing while partaking of the herb, including this friend - who has always nursed her children while smoking - I don't like it. It's a personal opinion and I was just uncomfortable with it.

That being said, the biggest problem I had was the emotional thing. Had we been on speaking terms, I may have still asked her to help out before I gave the formula, because even mama-milk laced with MJ is better than formula, I think. But the entire emotional-rift thing just made it too difficult to consider.

Oh, I understand. You do the best with what you have, you know? I would have had no option but formula if I didn't have friends I trusted to give us milk or nurse my baby.

I have no icky-issues with it but it's not dissimilar to giving blood in terms of disease transmission, so I would want to make good and sure the donor was screened.

Not just "I know her and she eats right," but a printout from a blood lab showing her seronegative for HIV, HBV, and HCV.

And there's always the issue of transmissible things they haven't found yet (a lot of people got HIV and HCV from blood transfusions before those viruses had been discovered).

I don't know what the HIV transmission is from blood donation but in milk given to babies who only have breast milk (no solids or formula, just breastmilk) it's 6% (that is the main reason the WHO say "no solids before 6 months" - it's not about allergies, it's about HIV transmission) if they are also having formula or solids it's about 20-40% depending on the health of their gut (which might be more damaged if they're having solids at 3months than if they're having them at 5.5months). I *think* it's more like 80% from transfer of blood products (but could definitely be wrong on that one!).

The WHO's 6 months exclusive recommendation that we all refer to ("...and continued breastfeeding until at least 2 years of age") is not based on HIV transmission, but on studies showing increased risk of harm to baby's health if exclusively breastfed for a shorter time.

They actually have separate guidelines for breastfeeding when mom is HIV positive. They do recommend exclusive until (at least?) 6 months for HIV positive moms in countries where there is not the access to a safe reliable supply of donor milk or formula, but when baby weans it must be abrupt.

I'll post the reference when I have time to find them. The HIV guidelines seem to be changing all the time too as the WHO realizes that you can't write guidelines for something as culturally specific as breastfeeding with HIV for an entire continent.

Hmmm, i got that idea from a WHO website which had it's recommendations listed with the references to the studies it had used in formulating them, i also cannot find them now....

I would happily nurse someone elses baby in a heartbeat if the momma was unable.
And I would let DS nurse off another momma (that I knew) if I was unable.

I believe I read somewhere that even giving a baby milk from a smoker is still better than formula. I understand the aversion, I would hesitate too, but I also really really hate formula.

Also, I believe I heard that wet nursing, like surrogacy, in many areas is actually illegal. I don't understand why and I think it's completely ridiculous, but I wonder what the problem is?

In the adoption forum, I was reading a thread where a woman was saying she wasn't allowed to breastfeed a baby she was fostering (with the intention of adopting) because the baby might have HIV. That doesn't make any sense to me. If she doesn't have it, how exactly would the baby give it to her? And of course it would be better for the baby - if the baby is indeed positive - to have breastmilk! (I believe she is planning to bottle feed breast milk, but still)

i would love to be able to wet nurse my neice instead of watching her eat formula. my brother and sil know that all they have to do is call and i'll bring them some milk, but no call yet :( . at least they accepted a little bit to help her get over pink eye...and they were amazed at how quickly it worked!

I would gladly nurse for someone, or donate milk if I was still lactating.

I think it's weird to feed human babies milk forcibly taken from another animal over milk lovingly donated by a human momma, but what do I know?

i left ds with a friend for a few hours (his first time being left with someone whos not dh or my parents) and when i came back for him, she was nursing him. i was a little surprised, but she kept saying, i hope you're not mad! i wasn't upset, actually i was glad that she was lactating and able to comfort my little guy!

My sil & I were preggers at the same time w/ our boys. I had enough milk to feed 3, and she hardly had any. But she would not even take my pumped milk, so I donated to Mothers milk bank of austin. Some people are weirded out by breasts and milk, I certainly don't get it. I would happily take milk for dd (as long as the donator was also dairy and abx free) if I did not have enough.

I would love to be a wet nurse. If someone ever asked me I would do it in a heart beat.

I don't think it's creepy at all :)

It is funny that this is coming up now, as I am bringing about 25 oz of pumped breastmilk to a friend with supply issues tomorrow. I would have no problem breastfeeding someone else's child if it ever came up, and would absolutely want my son to recieve breastmilk rather than formula if I was unable to feed him.

My Mom was telling a story the other day about how she nearly offered to feed a stranger's child at Sea World once when she heard them talking about how their formula smelled "off" but it was all they had. Unfortunately the kid was at least 6 months, so may not have known how to breastfeed even if she had offered :-(

I think being a wet nurse would be great. My mother always made a massive amount of milk and has never 100% completely dried up though her youngest is 15, she says that she thinks she was a wet nurse in a past life ;)

i think its odd, that they think it odd... :shrug:

i actually don't tell people that my neighbour & i cross nursed on a regular basis, because they find it so odd. i agree that it's an extension of the breastfeeding as sexual act fear.

in zambia i remember seeing a grandmother dry nursing a baby while the mother was in the fields.



In the adoption forum, I was reading a thread where a woman was saying she wasn't allowed to breastfeed a baby she was fostering (with the intention of adopting) because the baby might have HIV. That doesn't make any sense to me. If she doesn't have it, how exactly would the baby give it to her? And of course it would be better for the baby - if the baby is indeed positive - to have breastmilk! (I believe she is planning to bottle feed breast milk, but still)

well, hiv is passed through the transmission of bodily fluids. so say the woman had a cut or a sore on the nipple, & the baby had a cut or a sore in the mouth, the infection could possibly be passed between them. it's a bit of a stretch. similarly, the passing of hiv through breastmilk is more concerned with wounds to the skin that would allow the virus to enter the system rather than the consumption of hiv+ breastmilk, if you see what i mean.

i actually don't tell people that my neighbour & i cross nursed on a regular basis, because they find it so odd. i agree that it's an extension of the breastfeeding as sexual act fear.

in zambia i remember seeing a grandmother dry nursing a baby while the mother was in the fields.


Grandma might actually have been nursing the baby. Many people do not realize it, but it is common in many places for grandmothers to co-nurse a baby. Simply putting the baby to the breast regularly induces lactation.

We make it very complicated here in the West.

Grandma might actually have been nursing the baby. Many people do not realize it, but it is common in many places for grandmothers to co-nurse a baby. Simply putting the baby to the breast regularly induces lactation.

hmm, possibly. i lived with her though & only saw her nurse the baby once or twice. maybe she was lactating though!

i firmly believe that there should be about 3 lactating women raising each child for everyone to be happy :wink

I think (but maybe I'm weird) that

43.2% Corn syrup solids1
4.6% soy protein isolate
11.5% high oleic safflower oil
10.3% sugar (sucrose), 8.4% soy oil
7.8% coconut oil
Less than 2% of: C. cohnii oil
M. alpina oil
calcium phosphate
potassium citrate
potassium chloride
magnesium chloride
sodium chloride
ascorbic acid
choline chloride
L-methionine, taurine
ascorbyl palmitate
ferrous sulfate
m-inositol, mixed tocopherols
zinc sulfate
d-alpha-tocopheryl acetate
L-carnitine, niacinamide
calcium pantothenate
cupric sulfate
thiamine chloride hydrochloride
vitamin A palmitate
riboflavin
pyridoxine hydrochloride
folic acid
potassium iodide
phylloquinone
biotin
sodium selenate
beta-carotene
vitamin D3
cyanocobalamin

mixed with water... is a weirder thing for an infant, who's mother is unable or unavailable to breastfeed, to eat than a nice soft, warm, comforting 'boo':D

In a perfect world all women would have breastmilk available to them (pumped or direct from the tap) when they can't supply it themsleves.

Wow, I never actually looked at the ingredients before. So it's mostly corn and sugar, huh? How weird. It's reads very similar to a Dorito bag.

Back on topic--
I don't think cross-nursing is weird, and I would definitely prefer donated milk/wetnursing to giving my daughter formula any day. My sis and I nursed each other's babes a few times as she and I had infants at the same time. My sis was a bit...possessive? about it which is understandable, as PP said. She did in general provide formula for the girl when she was away, and I gave it to her because that was what the mom preferred. But I would've been okay with nursing her when she was in my care. Another baby I nannied was given formula from day one and would literally poop blood sometimes. I hated giving him formula, and really wished he could have breastmilk instead but would never have presumed to latch him on as the adults would've probably flipped.