Front-loading vs. Top-loading Washing Machines

[Tigerchild]

I've done cloth dipe washing in a standard machine, but I'm wondering if there's going to be a difference with our HE one!

For one thing, it uses a LOT less water. I don't believe the basket ever fills up completely. And since you use about half of the detergent that you normally would (since you're using so much less water), I'm wondering if I should also half the occasional vinegar rinse and/or washing soda?

Has anyone else played around with this, or am I on my own? I've been asking everywhere, and I've only met one other person who owns a HE machine! So, if anyone has any tips....

-Kitty

[wishful]

I have a front loader HE and dipes come out great! My first time washing cloth diapers was in a HE from Europe. I was working for a family and they used cloth. As for my frontloader, my friends washer broke so she used mine for 3 weeks. She loved it so much, she bought one too.:)
No problem with less water and less soap cuz the agitation is so much greater. All we did was dry pail, pre wash cold, wash hot, extra rinse. I use Lifekind liquid and vinegar in the fabric sofener thing. The big NO NO with front loaders is wet pail!:eek:
I hope this helps.

[Tigerchild]

Thank you! Our machine isn't a front loader (It's the Kenmore Calypso) but I was planning on dry-pailing too, and the only advice I've gotten involved wet-pail and dumping the water. Thanks for the tips!

I had a feeling things would be fine, but it's nice to get BTDT advice, you know? Now I have one less thing to obsess about while I'm waiting to pop! :)

[wishful]

Hey, ya know even if it is not a front loader I would suggest a soap made for HE washers. Like I said I use Lifekind liquid for dipes, but lifelind powder for every thing else.
www.lifekind.com
I think that is right.:D

Kendra

[Moooommy]

We also use a HE frontloader and do dry pail. We bought the Asko, since it was the only one that let us do a 200F wash (close the cover so baby doesn't burn his fingers!)

Cold prewash, hot wash, extra rinse. We use a grapefruit seed extract powder from the coop. Diapers look like new still!

(Looks like we live in the same neck of the woods too!)

[Mama Lion]

I use a front-loader, and my diapers come out great! I use Biokleen detergent, and you use about 1/3 less (says so on the box) for front-loaders. That is 1 TABLESPOON per load, wow! Biokleen works great, and I've been so happy with our new washer. We dry pail and have had no problems. It doesn't have a prewash feature, so I do a short cold wash, then a normal hot wash/cold rinse, and I'm done!

:)

Heather

[symbiosis]

Count me in on the HE front loader and dry pail method.

I've been switching detergents around lately since dd has developed a rash.

Anyone try 7th genteration laundry detergent? That's what I'm on now and it works fine.

[summermom]

I am so embarrassed! I strong-armed dh into getting an ASKO high efficiency front loader (which we couldn't affford and still haven't paid off :o ) by insisting we must have it because of the 200 degree wash capability and the claims that it uses so little water and gets all the soap out etc.

Well now I find that I rarely use the 200 degree wash because I don't want to ruin the water proofing on the fleece Fuzzibunz and our baby only has a poopy diaper about once every 2 or 3 washes, so there isn't much to disinfect.

And although I use only a smidgen of detergent (Biokleen or Biopac liquid), the clothes always come out smelling like soap and I can see bubbles in the rinse cycle. So I always set it to rinse multiple times and one little load of laundry becomes a 2-3 hour production! I find myself wishing it would not be so environmentally friendly and would just go ahead and use more water at least for the rinse cycle. :( Is there some way of getting it to do this?

Any other not so happy ASKO users out there? Or are we all too embarrassed to admit that we may have made a very costly mistake.... :o Or is it something I'm doing wrong? Help!!

[Moooommy]

summermom-

Hmm, we're using Biokleen too, we didn't change detergents when we got the asko, just the amount (about a tablespoon). Our clothes don't smell like much of anything with just one rinse. We use the 200F for all dipes, not just poopies, and for them we do the extra rinse (a button on ours).

You know this already: your clothes will last longer, you'll save $$$ on your power and water bill, and you'll have a bit of extra space in the laundry room. Hope you feel better about your decision--if not, the used market still commands a fairly high price!

[summermom]

Thanks for the encouragement, mooomy! And no, we can't sell it -- I was so adamant about this that our laundry room actually won't accomodate a regular size washer & dryer!

[rocketmom]

:)

Hi there!

I am on my second front loader! I would never own a normal washer again, I love it. I think that they do a much better job of getting clothing and diapers clean. On your cloth diapers I would reccomend using less vinegar and/or baking soda in the wash because there isn't the same ratio of water to detergent/additives as ther was in your regular washer. You don't need to use vinegar/soda each time either.

Also, keep in mind that if the diapers have an odor more than just pee/poop that means you are using too much soap & that the soap isn't getting rinsed out all the way. The soap residue on the diapers will cause an awfull odor! Try doing an initial wash with your soaps etc.. and then run the diapers thru at least two more washing cycles with NO soap/additives to get all the residue out. (Remember to keep covers and diapers in different pails and wash them separetly) I also fro time to time I use Bio-Kleen's Bac-Out in the wash and/or Seventh Generations non-chlorine bleach, it is odorless and does a great job on diapers. On covers to get odors out I soak them in Bio-Kleen's Bac-Out and them rinse and hang dry.

I have found that the way in which I wash the diapers depends primarly on how long they have been sitting in the pail and how often my daughters has pooped, as well as if there is an oder more than pee/poop.

For more info on cloth diapering: washing tips etc..Check out the "diapering info" at www.rocketbabies.com. (There is also alot of really great things there.)

Good Luck!

[thundersweet]

We are getting a new washer and dryer and I cannot decide between the top loaders and front laoders. I want something that gets my diapers and clothes really clean. Anybody have any experience with front loaders and diapers? Good? Bad?

[lilyka]

Front loaders clean everything better.

The only down side with diapers is that you can't dump them in./ (if I am wrong and someone knows a way please let me know) You have t reach in and pull themout of the pail and then put them in the machine. i have stuck my fingers in more slimey poop than I really care to.

[SaveTheWild]

This is jst an idea, but could you pull the wet bag out of the diaper pail and stuff the open end in the washer and then push out the diapers like a push-up ice-cream pop (turning the bag inside-out in the process.) OK, I realize that a bag of dirty diapers and ice cream have little in common, but you get the idea.

I have a front loader and it gets stuff very clean and is very gentle on them. one down0side is tat you cant soak the way you do in a top loader. You can run a prewash and let it sit for a while on off, start it agai nso the stuff tumbles around and mixes up and then stop it again. not the same though.

One of the best things about it is how dry it spins the clothes, some things barely have to be dried at all after taking them out. I imagine this would be a huge benefit for diapers.

:hippie

[Kermit]

Can't you lift up the tote, push the opening end into the opening of the washer and then kinda push the contents out of the tote into the washer? There is a New Zeland washer that is a top loadable front loader.

I have questions about this as well. Does anyone have issues with build up?

Edit: LOL sfgal, I see we have the same idea! lol I like the push up pop analogy. More like push OUT in this case.

[USAmma]

I don't know how front loaders work, but I like to add things as the wash is going. For example I wait until the water is filled and agitating before adding tea tree oil. When using Oxyclean I wait until it's fully dissolved and agitating before dumping in dipes. I don't know how you'd do either of those things with a front loader.

Darshani

[Oceanone]

Ok, I'll chime in again about my front loader. Ours is big. I just turn the diaper inside out like SF Gal suggested and I never touch the dipes. Ours has a soak cycle. It also lets me add items for the first 20 mins or so.

The clothes get cleaner with much less wear and tear. It uses way less water and soap. It spins everything a lot dryer and saves you a bunch of drying money/time. The dispenser drawer has a space for prewash, powder or liquid soap, bleach and softener/ rinse cycle. I just load it up with all the vinegar/ tea tree etc (which I rarely use frankly) and turn it on.

We were travelling a lot between jobs last year and had two homes, one with a front and one with a top loader and using them both on alternate weeks basically and the front loader is better hands down. Your clothes and dipes will last a lot longer too.

A common mistake people do when using a front loader is using way too much soap. You really only need a little. This can cause build-up. My front loader was washing out all the residue the top loader left in. There's a huge difference to us.

[Kermit]

Oceanone~ What brand/make do you have? What's the price range of a model that has those good features?

[Francy]

we got a kenmore front loader about 6 months ago when our top loader died. i have found pros and cons to each.

top loader pros:

-soak cycle
-easy to dump contents of pail in
-agitation seems--in my mind--to work better at cleaning
-no bending/squatting to move clothes from washer to dryer
-cheaper
-easier to tinker with settings to do an extra rinse, or prewash, or extra spin

and my favorite/most missed feature:

-i never toilet dunked b/c i would just take a poopy diaper, remove any obvious solids from it, then put it in the washer alone with a teeny water setting, and let the machine preclean it for me. of course, this was probably very wasteful of water and energy, but i didn't care!!! poopy diapers were never a hassle, like they are now. this was probably my main reason for NOT wanting a front loader


front loader pros:

-less water usage (ours has dropped almost in half, but this is not entirely due to the machine, but to slightly less usage)
-lower water bills
-gentler on clothing
-spins things really dry
-we got a 150$ rebate from the water company


hmmmm. as i read this, the top loader sounds a lot better. i guess the primary reason we went with a front loader was for environmental reasons. but i think i preferred the top loader. i just don't see how that tumbling in such a small amt. of water is really getting things clean (though they DO look and smell clean). mine uses so little water, there is no "water line" like in the front loaders at the laundry mat. i can open it any time during a cycle. no water will come out. basically all the clothes inside are soaking/saturated, and if i pulled an item out, it would drip. but there isn't really any "leftover" water.

what i really want is a machine that lets me heat the water hotten than my water heater. the miele can heat to 190 degrees. i would loooooove that. but we couldn't spend a gazillion bucks on a machine. ours was a discontinued model from a kenmore outlet. then, with the rebate, it was less than the top of the line top loaders.

[HeatherSanders]

I'm a top loader gal.
I've tried a front loader, but didn't buy one b/c I didn't like it.

I'm sure that there are some brands that are better.
I'm sure that they are more energy effective, water savers and the like.

BUT, there is nothing as wonderful as a top loader for a good long overnight soak.

AND . . . I KNOW my diapers get really clean in my wash and yet I have a good amount of front loader mommas e-mailing me with problems with their diapers having build-up, retaining stains, not cleaning all the way.

BUT . . . I say this too . . . it might just be a percentage of the whole. I might not have any top loader mommas and this is just 'some' of the front loader mommas.

I haven't taken an official poll.
No 'control group' to work from! :LOL :LOL

[lilyka]

I don't have liners but I must get some. That would also solve my problem of standing by my changing table with a poopy dipe in hand wondering why my pail is still down in the laundry room.

As for which brand is best. I think the Kenmore/wgirpool one is the best. The guy who sold it to us said it was better even than the maytag Neptune because the neptune is slightly reclined making it sorta a hybrid between front and top loaders. So you clothes still spend a considerable amount of time sitting in the water which is one of the benifits of a top loader that your clothes don't sit in a bunch of dirty water. Anywya iI know you can never fulklly triust a sales guy but since he was loosing commission by telling us this I tend to think he was being honest.

[kaje62]

we have the calypso which is a top loader with front loader qualities. using 1/5 of the water compared to other top loaders and 1/2 the electricity. love it.

[JesseMomme]

One of the best things about it is how dry it spins the clothes, some things barely have to be dried at all after taking them out.
:nod

I thought I would chime in since in my laundry room there are top loaders and one front loader. I eventually stopped using the front loader for initial washing of diapers because I could not soak them and because it was so "gentle" some breastfed poo would be stuck to the diapers when the wash was done. Yummy.

So I like the soaking/agitation features of the older top loaders. Then I take out the diapers that are thick and have slow drying times, usually all the fitteds, and put those in the front loader for a full plain hot water cycle. They come out feeling just damp-ish (while my other diaper can feel near to dripping) and it has saved on my drying costs immensly.

[ctdoula]

Hi, I just wanted to add my 2 cents. I have a Maytag Neptune set. I never touch dirty diapers (use a bummis bag & dump them in ala ice-cream style, ;)LOL). I use the presoak option to soak my diapers, prior to washing them in hot. The neat thing about these types of washers is they only use a little water, and tumble the clothes through the water. HOWEVER, unlike a top loading washer, they don't sit in the same water for the entire cycle. The water changes a bunch of times throughout the wash cycle, so they actually get MUCH cleaner, without using a ton of water! You can fiddle with things as they cycle progresses (you can open the door & check for suds, etc). My washer as a metal inside, and I see no build-up after washing diapers for 10months (plus all our clothes, we've had the set for about 2 years).

so, if I had to do it all again, I'd do the front loader again. I think it's better for the clothes, and great for using less waters.

HTH
Amy

[kaje62]

here it is and it is the BEST for stain removal too!!


http://www.epinions.com/content_57763991172?sp=irev

[abigailvr]

I have a Bosch:

http://www.epinions.com/hmgd-Washing_Machines-Bosch-Bosch_WFK24_Series_Washers/display_~reviews

The features it has that I like are:
soak cycle
added rinses and prewashes
hand wash cycle

Darshani, on mine there are several cups in the drawer for adding detergent, etc. There are three cups, prewash, wash and rinse, so I can set it to do a hot wash with prewash and extra rinse and add baking soda to the prewash, the detergent and tto to the rinse all at the same time! (Not that I always use all of that, that was just an example.)

I do have a hard time using little enough detergent not to get a build up. I'm not sure why. :rolleyes:

[Ilaria]

I LOVE our front-loader!
Being from Italy, I grew up with them, and I just couldn't believe how bad the top loaders were when I moved here! They just didn't get stuff as clean, it seemed like they got stuff WET , not CLEAN.

We got rid of our (actually pretty nice) Whirlpool Ultimate Care Set and got a Whirlpool Duet set and it's wonderful. It uses somthing like 68% less water and electricity, and 1/2 as much soap. Stuff is 100% clean, no stains.
Consumer Reports also recommends the front loaders, if you can afford them.

Darshani, with mine, you can add things up to 10 mins after you start the load. And you have all sorts of compartments for adding stuff...

I have to agree with the others, the only drawback is no start was/stop/soak option, which I did ALL THE TIME ...in fact, my washer was my diaper pail! But, it's a small price to pay for cleaner dipes and less impact on the earth! :)


This is what we have (5/5 stars:
http://www.epinions.com/Whirlpool_Duet_Fabric_Care_System_Washing_Machines

[JustineSam&Nina]

Yeah, I've heard they clean everything better. I had a friend in college from Denmark who was always bemoaning our lack of front-loading washers.

[georgia]

Hi!

Frontloader question.....I'm having a detergent dilemma....my never-ending science experiment is growing tiresome. What amounts and what detergents/extras are you washing your diapers with? I've having a tough time getting my hemp clean without doing two full washes w/extra rinses.

I was doing Sports Wash and baking soda, until Holly helpfully pointed out SW might not be strong enough for hemp. I ran to the store to get some Tide Free...but still, no diaper love. What are your amounts? 1/2 cap, 1/4?? what??? I starting to think my frontloader is getting the better of me.....we used to be so in love.......

I am doing 1 tbsp baking soda pre-rinse
then 3/4 cap of sportswash in the pre-wash
rinse
rinse again (often w/more baking soda)

still smelling pee---repeat above---then they're clean....any insight appreciated :love


Amy :lady

[punky]

-i do a cold pre-rinse with nothing in it

-then a hot wash with about 1/2 cup baking soda and about 2 tablespoons of all free and clear (with the extra rinse setting)

-then i do another rinse, and if i still see bubbles, i'll do even one more rinse after that

-about once every 2 weeks i skip the baking soda and put about 1/2 cup of vinegar in the first rinse

i've never had pee odors, but once in a while i'll get stinky hemp. usually the vinegar fixes that..

good luck!

-krista

[JesseMomme]

When I use the front loader to actually wash diapers, I use a mere dribble of detergent (all free clear). A front loader is highly efficient and you don't need much detergent in reality anyways. HTH!

[Quirky]

Here's my wash routine with my frontloader:

1) Cold wash & cold rinse, extra rinse and extra spin, with 1/4 cup baking soda and 1 tbsp of Allen's Naturally detergent

2) Hot wash & cold rinse, extra rinse and extra spin, with 1 tbsp of Allen's Naturally detergent.

No stains, no smells. I figure since it's a front loader I'm saving on water so I don't mind running two cycles.

edited to show quantity of detergent

[Charmie981]

Originally posted by georgiamilk
I starting to think my frontloader is getting the better of me.....we used to be so in love.......

:nod I know this feeling! However, having seen the wear on my friend's diapers after a year of washing in a top loader, I'm still glad I have my front loader!

Here's what I've found works for us: first, use the correct kinda and amount of detergent for your washer/water type. I use the HE detergent that comes in the large bucket at Sears. You just can't beat $21 for 275 loads!! However, I recently discovered that I wasn't using enough. I was having that same pee smell problem that you're talking about. I had tried EVERYTHING and found that the only thing to get rid of the smell completely was either washing something like 6 times or hanging on the line to dry. So I started paying attention to the line on the detergent cup and realized that I was using about 1/4 the suggested amount, which is a really small amount as it is. I upped the amount to their suggestion and things are working better.

So here's what I do now:
1) cold prewash (pausing to soak for an hour or overnight during agitation) with 1/2 cup baking soda. I don't dunk, so this is a necessity to get the poop out of the diapers and the baking soda has helped with the smell immensely.

2) cold "heavy wash" with an extra rinse. This is the one the HE detergent goes into.

3) hot "light wash" with an extra rinse and about 1/2t sportwash in the detergent dispenser (I like to think I do this to remove any leftover detergent residue, but that may just be in my head)

[LynnE73]

I don't use hemp diapers, but I do have some hemp doublers on their way in the mail...hopefully we won't start getting odors!
We have a Miele front loader machine...we do a rinse with nothing in it, then we do a HOT wash with about a tablespoon of Tide HE powder. Then we do an extra rinse when that's all done. We don't have any odors on the diapers.
We do (actually my husband does) the diaper wash everyday so maybe that helps too.
I guess I don't have any advice for you...only my experience to share...but good luck getting those odors out! :)
-Lynn

[georgia]

Thanks so far! I'm furiously writing all of this down...you wouldn't believe how much time I've spent working on this----wait, yes you would:p!!!

Jane, how much time does two complete washes take your machine???? It would probably take mine 2.5 hrs. It's so energy and water-friendly, but gee, it isn't all that family-time-friendly! Unless I do a quickie, light load, I'm looking at over an hour for all of my pre/washing, rinsing and spinning--but then, I thank goodness it's not me with a load of dipes, scrubbing them with rock while wading in the middle of a cold stream. Ah, my frontloader is one of the very few times a day I adore technology.

My conspiracy theory for the day:

Does anyone else ever wonder if the H/e detergents are really just regular detergents that have been watered down so you still have to spend a LOT of $$$?

Amy :lady

[blessed2bamommie]

I'm going to get a front loader and I was wondering about that. I know they have the He detergents; but, I use Seventh Gen. I wanna stick to the nontoxics. Anyone else using a front loader and using nontoxics?

[teagan]

One of the things I've found is that you have to use the detergent in the cold wash. This has been the only way I've been able to prevent detergent build-up. I use both fleece and hemp diapers, and this routine so far has gotten everything fresh and clean. I don't usually sun bleach b/c I'm in Seattle so there's not much sun.

Cold/Cold wash with Allens Naturally/ a little less than the line on the front load recommendation on the provided scoop.

Cold/Cold wash with just a dribble of sports wash

Hot/Cold wash no detergent.

So far so good!


Colette
Sydney 3 months

[punky]

hmmm, and you find that the detergent cleans well enough in the cold wash?

i might have to try that.

-krista

[teagan]

So far everything has been clean. The Allens Naturally has no scent, so it's pretty easy to tell if there is anything unclean. The cold water I think helps keep the suds down, and then the hot wash gives it a good clean. I also found doing a little smaller loads has helped.

Colette

[AuntNi]

Edited to add: I have a Kenmore front-loader (the basic version, not the Kenmore Elite) that I bought in '99.

My stash is half Sugar Peas (hemp) and half Mother-Ease (cotton/polyester). Here's my latest wash routine for my front loader:

1. Warm/cold wash with MAYBE 1/4 teaspoon Amway detergent (for stain removal)

2. Hot/Cold wash with 1/2 cap sport-wash

3 & 4. 2 Warm/Warm cycles to rinse all bubbles away

Yes, it takes forever for the spin cycles, but this is the best wash routine I've found so far. If I use so little detergent that I don't have to do extra rinses, the dipes aren't clean. I'd rather have really clean dipes and do more rinses.

Good luck to you! I just convinced my mom to buy the super duper Kenmore Elite washer last week, and she's in love. :love I can't wait to wash my diapers at her house now!

Best,
Nichole

[abigailvr]

I don't do nearly as many washes as you all do. Here's what I'm doing now (it changes monthly, it seems :rolleyes:):

cold rinse of poopy diapers, to get residuals poops off

cold soak overnight of everything

spin out in the morning

hot wash cycle with "rinse plus" with 2 Tblsp of Tide he

done!

Editted to add that I have a Bosch machine.

[Charmie981]

re: conspiracy theories. I guess if I were paying more for the Tide or whatever HE detergent, then I'd wonder if it weren't a ploy to get money out of me, but since I bought my washer in 99, I've only spent $50 or so on HE detergent, so I don't think it's a ploy. I'm saving a TON of money on detergent. And FWIW, the HE stuff really does suds less than the other stuff in my machine, which is the point of HE detergent. It does make it hard to determine if your detergent is rinsing clean, though, since it doesn't suds :confused:.

[MommaSeed]

Would those of you with a working wash system edit your response to list the type/brand washer you have? I wonder if this makes a difference in how to wash the dipes. I too have been struggling with not only ammonia smelling dipes but also stiff dipes. I only use 4 Tablespoons so maybe that is still too much. I have a Neptune.
Thanks a bunch!
~Tricia

[Kermit]

If I don't use HOT water WITH the detergent, I have stinky diapers, unless I modify my routine to include extra water I don't want to be using.

[Quirky]

Georgiamilk, I have a Kenmore HE3t, and yes, the cycles do take forever - about an hour and fifteen minutes for each. I usually start a diaper load around dinner time then start the next cycle before bed, then dry/hang to dry the next morning.

At least the dipes are practically dry from being spun within an inch of their life! :LOL

[blessed2bamommie]

I'm in the market for one. I had decided on the Kenmore, (not the elite). So, any suggestions and best places would be good as well.(Raleigh, NC) When we move out of here we'll need one, since w/d was incl'd in this apt. , and we saved up for a front loader! :D

TIA!

[Charmie981]

I'm using a Frigidaire Gallery, which is almost exactly identical to the basic kennmore front loader. My cycles don't seem to take nearly as long as some others have mentioned, although I've never sat and timed them...

[Oceanone]

I agree with the ladies here. Detergent in the cold wash is really important. For smelly dipes I would do a cold soak too if you can. Then a hot wash and maybe even a rinse.

We have a Kenmore HE3 and here's what I do to combat the smellies in hemp (this has worked for some time now)

Cold soak and wash with 2 caps bio kleen (the grapefruit stuff really seems to neutralize the smell)

Hot wash with teeny tiny amount of sensi-clean and another rinse.

does the job every time.

Like I said the key for us seemed to be a really good cold wash/ soak with detergent. Baking soda didn't help us all. I thought it would too.

Good luck!

[Sofiamomma]

What does HE stand for? We have a frontloader. It's a Kenmore, I think an elite, but I'm not sure. I haven't figured out how to get the prewash to be on cold. I don't think I can, but anyway, I choose the sanitary cycle (super hot water!) with a prewash and an extra rinse. It takes 2 1/2 hours to run, but I don't have to do anything with it until it's time to put them in the dryer. I put an ounce of Bio Kleen liquid detergent in the prewash and a full scoop of Seventh Gen powder in the main wash. (You can't use liquid for the main wash when you prewash, plus I think dd may be sensitive to something in the BioKleen.)

They smell clean, and feel like all the detergent is rinsed out. It also gets all the poop out even without dunking. A few of the dipes have stains from when her poop was green when I was eating dairy, but otherwise they don't.

IKWYM about them being spun within an inch of their life! My dipes are homemade flannel and terry and the extra high spin was making them pill, so I turn it down to just high and that helps.

[Kermit]

Oceanone, isn't she already doing a cold wash with SW? I don't think she's doing a hot wash at all, as you are, with the SW. I think that would really help.....
I sometimes use Biokleen in the presoak instead of Baking Soda. That does work nicely.

[Oceanone]

Holly, you are right. I should have said that after my cold wash with Bio-kleen I think there is still detergent in the diapers. It seems to last through the hot wash and is helped by the sensi-clean. I have some fleece diapers and liners and they are always absorbent and wicking. I think it is because I always get all the bio-kleen out and the sensi-clean helps with that. I really only use a little bit of it though. I would expect that unless you are doing a second rinse after the cold wash/ soak/ prewash that there is some residual detergent. Sometimes even a lot depending how much you are using and what sort. :) Ensuring that there is some detergent in a hot wash is going to help a lot with hemp, in my opinion.

[punky]

we have a kenmore also. we just bought it less than a year ago. i don't think it's the elite, it was one of 2 in the store at the time ;)

-krista

[georgia]

We have a Kenmore He3t frontloader and dryer--don't know if that's elite or not. I tell you what, it has been the best purchase of my mothering career--frontloader, my maya, and CDs :love We were reimbursed for our homebirth by our insurance company, so I got to buy a washer to wash cloth dipes. Score :thumb

I'm going to try and do a cold wash tonight followed by the hot wash with a tiny bit of SW. I'll check back in with results.

I think it was Jane who said she did a spin on the first wash, but is it really necessary to spin after the first wash if you're just gonna wash again? Isn't the spin strictly for drying? I'm thinking it might take some time off the loads if you could skip the spin on the first wash---or am I wrong? I've been skipping any and all spinning if it's not the final wash.

Any thoughts?

:-wool,

Amy :lady

[aoife]

Chiming in late, but my system with my Kenmore Frontloader (I'm gonna guess it's the basic model) is:

1. Cold Wash/Cold Rinse cycle set on Heavy wash (we do this to get out all the poops from our special needs 3.5 year old) -- I use washing soda in this cycle

2. Hot Wash/Cold Rinse cycle set on Regular wash with generic free & clear detergent. According to the bottle it is phosphate free and biodegradable. (made the mistake last week of trying to switch to a not free & clear detergent and dh's eczema flared up big time :()

3. An extra Cold Wash/Cold Rinse cycle set on short wash with nothing but water

I do an extra rinse if I still see suds after the last rinse wash, especially since we all have such sensitive skin in my family.

[blessed2bamommie]

goodness! such long cycles, and spun within an inch of their lives, lol! How do you get ur laundry done if it takes so long! I think you can program them in advance to start, so I can get a head start before I get up! How are ur dipes holding up with those spins? I would *die* if I lost a fuz to the front loader! They're supposed to be easier than the agitators, is what I read!

[Kermit]

if a front loader lets the water out without spinning, I would still want to spin after the first saok/agitate to get all the poopy/pee pee water off the diapers as much as possible.
I would also want to spin before the last rinse, again to help get the old water with detergent in it out of the diapers.

[Quirky]

Hmm, good question on the spinning. I think it spins as part of the regular cycle no matter what, I've just been setting it for extra rinse and extra spin. I agree that it's good to get whatever dirty/detergent-filled water outta there before starting with the next wash. Maybe it's unnecessary in the scheme of things, I dunno.

Also, I don't think the spinning is hard on the dipes at all. Essentially they're plastered to the sides of the drum while the water gets spun out. I think the same is true for top loaders; it's not the spinning that beats clothes up, it's the action of the agitator during the wash cycle.

[abigailvr]

My Fuz egg actually has two small holes in the binding. The spinning doesn't seem to be affecting any of the other diapers!

[blessed2bamommie]

:eek (note to self....) so how ru handling it, abigail, a lower setting? (thinking about the washer blindly because I don't remember the settings) I would :bawl! And its a diaper garden:( I'm just thinking about purefuz, since all reservations are taken!

[abigailvr]

It's actually just the doubler, and I was semi-prepared for it to happen, since others have talked about it. Just not so fast! :(

[blessed2bamommie]

what's the doubler? you have to buy the dipe and then the cover......can u translate that one?:confused: how can u keep it from happening?

[georgia]

I am so sorry to hear about your Fuz Egg--how tragic :(

On the Kenmore HE3t, you can set for extended spin and /or second rinse. I do the second rinse, but on my first wash, I don't opt for the super spin. The spinning is just getting the water out, according my manual. Wonder if I might try some more spinning? Hmmmm. Centrifugal force is something to behold! Life's little joys--watching the diapers swish and spin :) I agree completely that the spinning isn't harmful. My frontloader is extremely gentle on the laundry--it's amazing the experience the difference.

Sorry to be such a laundry nerd
:rolleyes:

Amy :-wool

[abigailvr]

Originally posted by wannabmommie
what's the doubler? you have to buy the dipe and then the cover......can u translate that one?:confused: how can u keep it from happening? The doubler is what is sticking out of the top of the diaper in the first picture on this page: http://www.fuzbaby.com/diapering.htm

I am not sure how you can keep it from happening. I thought that using a front-loader was more gentle, which should help. Plus I line dry my dipes, which should help. I do use a strong detergent (Tide) but I don't use much. Who knows.

[georgia]

Well, tried the COLD wash, teaspoon of Tide free, and Tbsp (or so) of baking soda. So guess what happened????

A machine full of total SUDS that won't go away---it's been 3 rinses! :crying

What the :demon is going on with me? I tried to theorize that since I used more baking soda than usual, it reacted with the acidity of the urine.....and bubbled. DH said I was definitely wrong. I'm not very happy tonight.

:bang

Amy

[Brookesmom]

whoa, weird! I've never had many suds with my frontloader.

I have a Frigidaire Gallery series (I think). Here's my routine:

cold prewash with about 1/2 Tablespoon of bio-kleen
warm/cold heavy wash with 1 Tablespoon bio-kleen
extra rinse

Then I try everything except covers on high on the "towels" setting.

It seems to work well (no hemp diapers though). HTH, Kelly

[Sofiamomma]

As far as it taking a long time, I put the dipes in the wash right before I go to bed, then put them in the dryer in the morning. I try to wash when I have about a day's worth of diapers left. That way if I have trouble getting down to dry them I can still manage.

Somebody with a Kenmore, can you tell me how to get the machine to do the prewash on cold, but the main wash on hot?

And what does HE mean?

[Kermit]

I think the baking soda should be used as a presoak without the detergent. The baking soda acts as a water softener and you get more bubbles in softer water. That's my basic understanding... not a very scientific explanation, I know.

[abigailvr]

HE means high efficiency.

[georgia]

Sofiamama---I tried mine yesterday, and my prewash is cold and main hot when i program it for hot wash w/prewash. Have you ever checked the water temp? I have the HE3t---hope that helps!

Amy :-wool

PS it's the Tide free that makes all the suds---I cut the amount down to almost zero last night---still tons of suds!!!

[istamama]

have squirmy, hair-munching baby in lap....

what are your likes/dislikes re these two kinds of machines? we need to buy a new machine and have heard the european front loaders that heat water are good (miele, AEG) but they are pricey. also someone mentioned that you can't presoak the diapers in them, but the salesman said you can just do an extra wash instead without soap. we will move soon and be on septic system so i guess the reduced water use would be good with the front-loaders, but my question is - do they get the diapers clean and non-stinky? we'll be on well water so i dont' know if that will make a difference with type of machine. also someone said that the american front loaders don't clean properly but the european ones do.
so i guess i'd like to know what are your experiences with front-loaders and diapers- like 'em or hate 'em? Are they worth the money or a waste of it?
Thanks,
Istamama.

[vwmama]

So who was it that is saying american front loaders don't clean as well? Based on what? We have a whirlpool duet designed and built in Germany. SO it is american or european?

I will never go back to a top loader, not after using both a maytag neptune and a whirlpool duet for the last 4 years. They far outclean and are much much gentler on clothes than any top loader I have ever used. They are also super capacity so you can put a huge amount of clothes or bedding in and they always are clean. They also save on water and detergent costs.

Your clothes tumble through and in and out of the water as opposed to being beaten by an agitator. They also come out of the wash almost dry and they stay newer for a lot longer. Front loaders are the best!!!!! I have not washed dirty dipes in them yet so others will have to attest to that. :)

[Penguinlady]

i love front loaders! have had less wear and tear on the crotch are of jeans as well as the cuffs(these areas often used to get shredded by top loaders). my dh's jeans last longer because of the front loader.

i have washed cashmere in my front loader...so i don't need to go to the dry cleaners anywhere near as much.

my dipes are clean and stains come out of clothing even if i didn't put stain remover until right before i washed.

i can clean entire blankets and down comforters in them without having to go to a laundromat to use their large capacity front loaders and the agitator won't shred into the fairly thin fabric of the down comforter.

umm as far as my kid's clothing...well it looks pretty stellar. i have pics of stuff she has outgrown and played in etc that i can send you a link to in case you are interested in seeing for yourself

okay i will stop with the advertising but can you tell i really really like front loaders
:D :D

have fun making your decision..especially the shopping!

[istamama]

about the american vs. european thing - it was someone from an internet diaper outlet - she'd heard it from her customers. she said some people love front loaders, some hate them - and those who hated them tended to have the american - made variety - i have no idea why.
Anyone else with ideas?

[CajunMama]

Front Loaders rock! I have had one for 3 years, a Frigidare, highly rated by Consumer reports, cheaper than most other front loaders, with all the benefits. Clothes last longer and seem cleaner. I love the fact that I can wash such large loads and everything still gets clean! The water savings and using less detergent are great too! ( I buy 1 huge All Free at Sam's and that lasts me about 1 year!)

Front loaders are more expensive up front, but save you money in the long term. They are quieter than top loaders too.


:thumb

[Brayg]

I have a Maytag Neptune and :love it! I will never go back to a top-loader. My water bills have gone down and I can wash mega-loads of laundry at a time. I have no complaints (except if you forget to put something in and have already started the machine--they lock so you cannot open them). :thumb

[egoldber]

I love my Fisher&Paykel washing machine. It is a New Zealand brand and is a top loader that is supposed to be as efficient as most front loaders. One of the things that I really like, especially for diapers, is that it has an INCREDIBLY fast spin cycle. My diapers come out very dry and I have no trouble getting my diapers dry in using one 50 minute dryer cycle on medium-high heat. Even hemp diapers and inserts.

When our old washer broke, we looked at many, and this one had the features I wanted for the best price. They retail for about $600, so are less than the high end Maytags, and are certainly less expensive than the European front loaders. I have had mine for a year now and I love it.

Here's a link:
http://usa.fisherpaykel.com/Products/Laundry/Washers.html

[Gale Force]

Drool.....

OK, so how large is the capacity on these things? I have a washer that calls itself large capacity, but it is pretty average in size if not a little small.

What's a good measure?

How many towels would fit? Anyone know?

I can put a big bear hug worth of laundry in my washer. How many bear hugs of laundry could you fit? LOL (I am short and have short arms btw)

[janiemerle]

We bought the LG washer and dryer about six weeks ago. I :love it!!!
It's quiet, uses very little water, and gets the clothes (and diapers) really clean with only a tiny scoop of deterent. I can wash 10-12 pairs of jeans or 8 bath towels and there is still room in there. And the washer spins so efficiently that the dryer is done in less than 30 minutes. That's especially cool when I'm washing/drying Joey Bunz! :LOL

[istamama]

So it sounds like it's not necessary to have this water-heating feature that the european ones have. Do the front loaders you've been talking about have water-heating on them? It is suppoosed to be good to disinfect the dipes - any comments?
Istamama.

[janiemerle]

Istamama,

Forgive me for overlooking that feature. Yes, our machine does have it's own built-in water heater. Otherwise, I don't think the diapers would get as 'sanitized' since our house water heater isn't set that high.

[reeseccup]

I have a lower end American front loader that doesn't have a heat unit. I LOVE LOVE LOVE it. I would prefer one that has the heating unit in it since I have my water heater fairly low. I have used the European mid rang when I lived in Germany and LOVED LOVED LOVED and is what got me so hooked on front loaders. I think as long as you get a good quality front loader with the heating (not really necessary(basically it saves on energy costs_cold water is heated in the washer as opposed to using hot water from your water heater and you can control the tempreture) then you've got it made whether an American made or European made.

I will never go back to a top loader EVER. My diapers even washed on warm get nice and clean and smell so good (lol can you believe I smell my diapers?) I use only 1/8 cup of detergent of my choosing(right now SUN brand) and that is IT with a double rinse (I do a pre-wash though to get the potty out of the diapers first). I don't have well or hard water but do have a septic tank. I put the "enzyems" stuff down my toilet once a month and have lived here 3 years w/o issue. Have fun washer shopping.

[istamama]

The LG sounds good! will check it out - don't know if they have it here in Canada. I guess i can check out the Maytag and others you mentioned at the store. at the moment i've been washing with a really old heavy duty Kenmore and have had no stains - I just turn the water heater up to high before i wash but it's a pain as i usually forget to turn it back down and so get scalded when i turn on the taps - so i'd like to have the water heater built in.
thanks a lot for your info,
Istamama.

[teagan]

There is only one thing I would add. You mentioned you're moving septic. We have septic and a front loader. Even though almost all powder detergents say septic safe, they are not. Powder works best for front loaders. There are a few HE liquid detergents, but the only one I know of is Tide. I use a non HE liquid, and can only use about a teaspoon full. Otherwise I get build-up. Just something to think about. I do love my front loader, but it has made fleece diapers very difficult. Vinegar is another thing you can't use on septic. It makes stripping a real pain.

[Cloverlove]

WhooHoo Sarah'sMama!

Another front loader fan here. We bought one strictly for the environmental aspects of it, but there are a lot of other benefits as well. They are super quiet, less wear and tear on clothing, less detergent, cleaner clothes and you can cram A LOT into one of those things!

The negatives are that there is no pre-soak and water leaks out if you have to open the door to add something. It also makes wool diaper cover care trickey, as they also don't recommend using them for small loads and I haven't figured out how not to do a rinse using eucalan.

Good Luck!

[Lulu]

My experience seems different than many here! I lived in Europe until 5 years ago, and always used front loaders to wash diapers. I have to say that since moving to the States I MUCH prefer to wash diapers in a top loader. My main reason for this is that diaper cleaning is best achieved with plenty of water and the high efficiency models (generally front loaders) simply do not use enough water to achieve cleaning to my satisfaction. I also like that with a top loader you can tip a pail of dirty diapers right in, with the front loader you have to be much more hands-on! In an ideal world I would own a front loader for clothes and a top loader for diapers- hey, I can dream:p

[teagan]

Our septic guys told me that vinegar eats away all the healthy growth inside the tank that keeps the whole septic "cycle" going. I'm sure there is a more technical answer, but like you said, I have no idea what it is! Oxyclean, and amonia based products are all bad, so I'm told.