Homework!!

[Calrei]

My dd is in kindergarten. She gets homework twice a week. It is not hard homework at all -- mostly tracing and writing letters with some coloring mixed in. Already, though, she complains about how it's no fun and boring and she doesn't want to do it. She likes the coloring aspect and usually asks to do it right away, but doesn't like practicing her letters. If she makes a mistake or I try to tell her something is incorrect she gets histerical and says she's never going to school again, etc. I have heard many horror stories from people with older kids. I want to get into a good pattern with this because it's only going to get worse in the coming years. Is there any way to nip this battle in the bud now?

[lauren]

The thought that came to my mind was to make sure (at this age) that you sit down with her and try to help make it feel fun. You are probably already doing this. Sometimes my own anxiety about how my son will be dealing with homework in the future makes me act a little bit tense now, which he picks up on and wants to stop doing homework (he's in 1st grade). With my son I try to give him lots of praise and also talk about what we might do once he has finished his homework. I wonder what others think?

[gena]

My ds is in kindergarten too. He has a homework calendar with different fun little activities we do a few times a week. Even though it's fun stuff he sometimes grumbles about getting started. I think he'd like it better if we had a routine time to do it, because he tends to have trouble transitioning from one activity to another. I just haven't got a routine established for that yet.

I was wondering too if your dd seems particularly frustrated with the kind of homework she has (tracing, practicing letters), if you might be able to substitute some fun activities that do the same thing. I was thinking of tracing in shaving cream or using those fun markers that change colors. If her teacher's not agreeable to substituting, maybe just adding some fun homework of your own on days she doesn't have any would help.
Gena

[Alexander]

This is an extremely worrying development.

Kids (certainly at that age) should never be burdened with this tpye of activity unless they choose to do it.

Very worried.

You'll end up with a crap situation like we have in Japan if you are not careful.

What do you intend to do?

a

[Calrei]

My sister has teenagers and has battled with her son over homework all his school-age life. Her advice to me (which she wishes she had done a long time ago) was to step away and let it be between the student and the teacher. She says I should let dd do it herself and if she makes a mistake, let the teacher correct her. That just seems hard to do for a kindergartener.

[Alexander]

Originally posted by Calrei
My sister has teenagers and has battled with her son over homework all his school-age life. Her advice to me (which she wishes she had done a long time ago) was to step away and let it be between the student and the teacher.



not bad advice.


She says I should let dd do it herself and if she makes a mistake, let the teacher correct her. That just seems hard to do for a kindergartener.

I would tend to agree but for one thing. If the K teacher is a "control learn freak", then DD will end up hating going to KG! That's something that I would be enclined to delay for AS LONG AS POS.

What I would do:

1) Visit the teacher to discover the objective of the HWs.

If the word "fun" does not appear in the explanation, I would explain that "I am unhappy about making kids dowhat they are not enclined to do"

2) If I got any nonsence about "preparing children for what is expected of them in Elementary school" I would ask them to leave that job to me. Continue to receive the HWs but make it clear that the KG should not expect it to be done.

I suppose it all depends on your objective too. Are you looking to "academically educate" your child at this tender age, or have a happy child?

I suggest you visit this site to look at some online chapters (http://www.sudval.org/books.html) if you want to look more deeply at the "leave the kids alone" camp.

PM me any time if you have questions about this.

Hope this helps

a

[sleepies]

i'd suggest making it fun
you can try and turn it into a game....asking her questions and such....give her a "Star" when she gets it right. you can draw the star or get stickers.

when my oldest son gets an A on homework that gets sent back home, we put the A on a Excel Spreadsheet. This teaches him to use excel as well as tracks his grades.

when he gets X number of stars we go someplace "Special", such as the zoo or something.

little kids like stickers :)

[papabliss]

Hi,

There is a movement in education right now to encourage parental involvement especially in the early grades. In lesson planning, it is called "outreach to families."

Unfortunately, most teachers think the outreach is simply homework. School should be mostly fun at this age. My suggestions, like those above, would be to make sure it is a positive experience, something that your child wants to repeat again, even if you miss the objective of the lesson you are doing at home.

If the homework is rote drill and practice, maybe ask the teacher if there are other things that can be done that are more than just busywork. What about books, activities, or games? Sometimes the teachers do all the "fun" stuff at school and send home the "unfun" stuff home for the parents to deal with.

I am glad that you are interested in working toward a solution rather than attacking the idea of homework. For me, education is all the time, all life long, and almost always fun.

Cheers.

[Alexander]

Originally posted by papabliss


I am glad that you are interested in working toward a solution rather than attacking the idea of homework. For me, education is all the time, all life long, and almost always fun.
Cheers.

I run a school with my wife. Home Work is always an issue. Our policy is that children at all ages choose how much, if any HW they take home. sometimes kids take nothing for years. Eventually, they see that it has been designed to be fun, they get something out of it and thereis self satisfaction in achieving the goals they set themselves.

But THEY set the goals.

I have just re-read the paragrapgh above. It is over-simplified. There is a whole load of phycology that goes into our class and school structure designed to undo the damage that kids get at "normal" (Industrial Model) school.

There are three things worth pointing out:

1) Kids soon beg for more HW, and we are put in the position of having to restrict how much they get!

2) Kids that do no HW at all until 4th grade generally are more intelectually alert when they reach their teens, and very quickly over-take those that have been swatting.

3) The more intense the HW and cram school had been in a childhood, the more likely the child's intelect will rival that of jellyfish in their teens.

In fact, I have become increasingly worried by the origional post. It looks very much like Industrial Model schooling leaking into a place where it definately (that should read definately) does not belong.

you will notice that this post is not anti-HW.

To be sure, when our kids do take it in large quantities, the progress is unbelievable. We even have a technique we teach the parents to correctly create the right atmosphere.
We call it "the orange juice technique".

Hope this helps.

a

[3girls1boy]

When my second DD got to K-5 (last year) there was suddenly this big emphasis on teaching them how to read (gotta get those test scores up you know.) which I was not too thrilled about. She had homework 4 days a week and some times it was writing letters which I could see she just didn't have the coordination for yet and it was very frustrating.

My DH thought it would be good for her to learn responibility and I just wanted to say forget it to the whole thing. Because the teacher gave stickers for doing homework, my daughter felt she had to do it because "my teacher said" I never really pushed it on her and sometimes she did it and sometimes not. The teacher wasn't too strict about it although I know there are other K-5 teachers at our school which are much more into it.

My DD did end up learning to read last year and is now in 1st grade and working with a 2nd grade reading book. Her teacher this year hardly gives any homework, which frankly I am thrilled about. I have enough else to deal with around here. It really seems to depend on the teacher. My 4th grader has less homework this year than she did last year.

Bottom line, I don't think kindergarteners should have homework.

[Greaseball]

Has anyone read "Reclaiming Our Children" by Dr. Preter Breggin?

Breggin, a psychiatrist, says that he never got homework in grade school, and that in high school and college, he never got more homework than he could fold up and stick in his back pocket. All through college, he never even had to carry a backpack.

He also says that back when classes were small and teachers were involved with the students, they could actually *teach* the lesson instead of giving it as homework!

I am totally against meaningless busywork for kids. I read somewhere (In a mainstream publication, no less) that children should have no more than ten minutes of homework per night per year of grade. For example, 10 minutes a night for a first grader, a half hour for a third grader, an hour for a sixth grader, and two hours for a high school senior.

Now, sometimes second graders get several hours of homework a night. Pointless, repetitive busywork which serves no purpose but to create slaves for the school.

BTW, all that stuff I was told about how "if I didn't do my homework, I'd flunk out of school and never get into college" is not true. I made it out of elementary school without even knowing how to divide, I got expelled from middle school, I didn't graduate from high school, and I go to university today and get straight A's!

[sha_lyn]

I can not believe they are giving homework in Kindergarten. Am I the only one who has a problem with the fact that the schools have the kids for (on average) 7 hours a day but still send work home. Think about it. A 5 yr old usually sleeps 10-11 hr a day. Add say an hour each day to go back and forth to school and 30 min to get ready in the am. Take an hour for eating dinner and taking a bath and that That leave 3 1/2 hrs a day of "free time". Why should they have home work when the school already has them for about 2 times the amount of free time they have in the afternoon.

[lauren]

I struggle with the homework thing, though I don't let on to my son that I think it's silly. He's in 2nd gr. so it's not too bad yet, but is usually review of what they've done in the day. I would love to hear the educational pitch for why there is so much homework!

[bestjob]

Everyone's school is different, of course, but I think my daughter's school has a good balance. For the primary grades, homework is assigned on Monday and is due on Friday. You and your child have to figure out when to get it done. There is no homework on the weekends. Reading and spelling are daily assignments. If work is not done in class, it has to be finished before the next time that subject comes up. That is not a bad thing, in my opinion, because the reason the work isn't finished is often either because the child loves the assignment and wants to spend extra time on it (you should see the picture my daughter drew for her Grade Three Geography assignment tonight) or because the child is having difficulty with the work and the parents need to be aware of the problem.

As for the amount of time spent doing homework, I think that as long as they are enjoying themselves, whether or not the work is assigned is a mute point. My daughter is in Grade Three. Usually she spends about 20-30 minutes on homework, but tonight she spent an hour and a half because she was working on the gorgeous picture and because she learned how to use a the tape recorder to record her spelling dictation (and then she had to practice her opera diva performance on tape as well) and because she wanted to read more of the story than was assigned because she wanted to know how it would end. Her teachers have done a lot to ensure that the work is enjoyable.

One part of her school's homework policy is that if the child cannot do the homework, the parents should write a note to the teacher telling of the problem. They should not slave over the papers night after night, teaching what should have been taught in school. That way the child can get remedial help if it is needed, or the teacher can understand that she made a mistake assigning a particular piece of work (teachers aren't perfect and they do screw up sometimes).

One thing that I like about homework is that I have a bit more information about what the children are learning in school. I tend to view the school as a place for my kids to learn technical things and then I try to find "real life" examples of those things. My daughter is in Grade Three, the year of the multiplication tables. When multiplying comes up in our daily lives (five people times three days times two apples per person per day) we talk about it. Without homework, I'd be less sure about the connection between school and the rest of life.

So, that's my take on homework. If you're not sure about what your child is doing, the person to talk to is the teacher because every child and every class and every school is different.

[Greaseball]

If I worked 7 hours a day, I sure wouldn't want to work for a few more hours when I got home!

Some children spend more time at school and on homework than their parents do at their jobs. I think that's sad. Being a kid should be about having fun.

[Rhonwyn]

Just another reason we chose Waldorf. I want my kids to love learning and in order to do that they need down time when they can just be a kid. In Waldorf, there is generally no homework until 3rd grade.

[bestjob]

Just because a child has homework doesn't mean the child is lacking fun. They are often the same thing at our house. It just depends on how they are presented, both by the teacher and by the parents.

[mommy22]

My sons (7 and 8) go to a Montessori school. They do have homework, but...1) it's an extension of what they have done in school...2) it's a 'practical life' lesson. It's meant to teach some responsibility...3) it's generally easy and quick, mostly consisting of spelling work.

This began in kindergarten, and if my children complained, I told them they had a choice, but that they would have to explain to the teacher why the work wasn't done and take any consequences because of it. I also let them make mistakes on their homework. If I correct everything, then the teacher has no idea what they need to work on.

In all, I have no problem with homework, as long as it's an extension of what they are learning in the classroom, it's short, and non-stressful. I have little to no problem with the kids and doing homework.

But, if given a choice, I would choose no homework, but I think we could all agree that that just isn't going to happen in this society.

I consider myself lucky in that there are several schools in this area that give out 1-2 hours of homework, starting as young as 1st grade. Now that's going overboard.

[me&3]

I'm new to schooling (as a parent, that is - I taught middle school for a year, and am a religious school teacher). I started sending my ds this year to the first grade- he had been homeschooled up to now.

I've been a bit perturbed about the homework, because it seems to take so long. Last night, he had 4 pages of math work to do!!! :eek Granted, it's not calculus, or anything, but in my gut, I believe that you should do most of your learning at school. Perhaps a few fun things at home, but I think it should be optional.

Unfortunately, though, I've sent him to school, so we have to "conform" to the norm- it's a private school, to boot, so we've "chosen" it. I suppose I'm afraid to rock the boat too hard after just having arrived on it... Does anyone have any suggestions for me? My instinct in this instance is to wait until open school night and address it with the teachers. I believe, however, that the line I'll be getting is, "it's to prepare them for xxxxx...." ugh.

[mommy22]

I try not to "rock the boat" too early in the school year. If you can't wait for open house, schedule a private consult with the teacher. Tell her you think it may be too much and how long she thinks it should take to get the homework completed. You may also address the actual purpose of the homework.

I have done this many times with the teachers of my children. If I feel the work takes too long, is too difficult, or whatever, I schedule appointments to meet with the teacher.

You may get a satisfactory explanation as to the intent of the homework, and life will go on. But if you are not happy about the situation, try to meet in the middle. Suggest he do part of the work.

My son was once sent home (in 2nd grade) 50 math problems to be solved, then re-solved to check. In essence, this amounted to 100 math problems, along with other spelling homework. I had a fit, and immediately approached the teacher. We agreed that much less work was needed, and came to an agreeable compromise.

Good luck...and remember to keep your cool when discussing this situation. Keep us posted!!

[Greaseball]

I've often wondered how much power a parent has in this situation. I could always say "Sorry, but my child is only six years old and I've decided she is only to do ten minutes of homework a night, unless she herself chooses to do more." Then the teacher could just say "Well then, she doesn't go to second grade!"

[bestjob]

Maybe the school my daughter goes to is very strange, but I suspect that if you wanted to reduce the amount of homework the child was doing, the teachers wouldn't mind very much at all. They are almost all mothers, and they know that parents know their own children best. There is a section on the report card about homework completion, and the child would get a poor mark on that, but if everyone stayed calm about it, the child probably would as well. If the child was struggling to keep up, the teachers would likely suggest some different approaches to education for that child.

Children are all different. My daughter could have done the 100 adding problems in about 10 minutes, so for her it wouldn't have been a big deal to get that homework done. I think, on the other hand, that that is because she is already "expert" at such work and she wouldn't have needed the homework in the first place. For children who are really struggling with the concept of adding, the homework would have been too hard and they should not have had it assigned. Giving feedback to the teacher about what is going on with homework is not "rocking the boat" if it is presented in the spirit of helping your child get the best education possible.

[LunaMoom]

I'm fairly lucky,most of the time my dd does her homework without difficulty. In Kindergarten she had 10 spelling words a week and had to write them,I can't believe you're daughter is just tracing letters,maybe she's bored? As for going to the teacher to reduce homework I wonder what kind of message that sends to children? I mean life is full of responsibilities and chores,not all being things we are thrilled to do. Some days my husband would rather not go to work,but what if he just blew it off? Sometimes I don't feel like making dinner,should everybody going hungry so I can lay on my rear end? I tell my daughter that getting a good education is her job right now,and she needs to take advantage of every opportunity that is available to her to make a better life for herself in the future via a college education so she might have a job that's rewarding for her. The real world doesn't cut you much slack,kids need to get ready for it.

[bestjob]

Making homework flexible for children is really essential to giving them the feeling that they have some control over their work. For some children, that means reducing the amount of homework so they aren't overwhelmed. The same thing happens with preparing dinner: some families get Cordon Bleu every night, and some get reheated lasagna. Everyone gets dinner, but it depends on what the cook can manage that day.

[mommy22]

I didn't mean to imply that I go to the teachers to reduce the amount of homework just so that my kids don't have to do as much. I look at the kind of work they are doing. If they are being sent home 100 math problems that he can essentially do with his eyes closed, then what's the point. I only go to the teachers if the work is below their level, and then I ask for more challenging work that would better serve them. If the work is too difficult and therefore frustrating him and making him feel like a loser, then I ask that the amount be reduced in order to cause less stress. Children need a comfortable atmosphere to do their best. The idea of school is to get an education, not just see who can complete the work.

[Greaseball]

Well, the number one most important job for MY kid is to have as much fun as possible! Come to think of it, that's the most important job for me, too. I don't believe that having fun is something you do only after all the work is done.

If teachers don't know how to assign homework that is fun and interesting and that the child can't wait to dig into, there is something really wrong with the teacher and the school. (DH is a teacher. That's what he told me.)

Education is necessary. Having fun is doubly necessary. (For adults and children.) Boring, meaningless "education" is not necessary and I will not allow it to touch my family.

[bestjob]

I'm not sure that all things worth doing are things that would be described as fun. Sometimes it is a pleasure to see the result of hard, slogging, difficult, no-fun work. In those circumstances, the thing to remember is to keep your eye on the prize!

[Greaseball]

I think it depends on what you think is "worth it." And I have to remember that what I think is worth it may be very different than what dd or dh thinks it is.

For example, dh or I may think that high school is worth it because you might get the education you need to go to a certain college (although, on a side note, most colleges take kids who were homeschooled). But dd may think that getting a GED so she can spend more time doing what interests her is what's really "worth it."

I can honestly say that today, I never do anything that is not fun. What I consider fun includes many things that most people would hate doing, partly because I'm weird and partly because I can see how it benefits me in the future.

[miriam]

Dearest Mothering Friends:

I am a private school teacher and I give lots of hmwk because that is what is expected.

However in reality...

I have to grade and correct all of the hmwk as it comes in...sometimes I am not sure that the student did it...or maybe the parent or tutor did it.

When I did student teaching, the master teacher I worked w/ went a hmwk packet home each Monday, and it was due on Friday morning. NOne of anything in that packet had anything to do with what the students were doing that week or any week. She never corrected it or graded it; I was in a subordinant position, so I really could not question any thing she did . She was the MasterTeacher...G-d almost.

I wish I had taken the CA High School proficiency test when I was in High school and left when I was 15 or 16 and then went to the community college and then off to the four year for my B.A. and then my credential.

High School was a total waste of time; so was the homework load that I turned in every day.

My own children did graduate highschool at age 15-16 by taking the CA proficiency exam. They went on to college and did well.

[butterflyma]

As a First Grade teacher, who assigns nightly homework, I feel the need to jump in here (even though I see this thread originated long ago).
My first thought, as I read the original post, was that a good question to ask the teacher is "What is the purpose of my ds/dd's homework?" My next thought was that having a routine time that is set aside as home learning time (whether there is homework or not) would probably help decrease struggles and enhance your role in your child's education. If you were to find activities that you believe are beneficial to your child's learning, this would be an excellent time to supplement the school curriculum.
I also wanted to express the reasons why I personally assign homework in First Grade. (1) to enhance parental involvement (2) to provide students with extra practice for skills that we are working on in school (3) because it is required of me. Homework should not be assigned if it is given just for the sake of assigning homework. There should be a meaningful purpose behind the tasks that we give to children.

Regarding the posts about homework being fun. Fun is in the eye of the beholder. While I do my best to make every activity enjoyable, I am held accountable by the state I teach in to teach every child certain skills and concepts. No matter how creative or supportive I am, there will be some activities that some children will not find enjoyable. (For example, children with fine motor skill deficits often dislike letter formation practice.) Although I do try to find fun ways to practice every skill, you can't please all of the students all of the time.

My advice to the parents of my students who have homework struggles is DON'T. Young children should see homework as valuable, enjoyable and as their own responsibility. Set up a regular space and time where homework is done and encourage/help your child with their homework...But, if your ds/dd does not do their homework, have them return it unfinished to me (their teacher). It is their responsiblity to do their homework, and mine to praise/reward them for completing it or provide consequences if they do not. The consequence that I employ is to have the child finish their homework in class during our free time. Parents are always amazed at how quickly the struggle ends after their child becomes personally accountable.

I am sorry if I have rambled on, I guess this subject struck a nerve. I do hope that your difficulties with homework are resolved.:)

[mommy22]

I have used the concept of homework being the responsibility of the child, and it works wonderfully. When my children do hassel me, I just tell them that they don't have to do it but it's their responsibility to let the teacher know why, and to take the consequences from the teacher. It takes about 2 seconds for them to be at their desk doing their homework!

[miriam]

To Butterflymaiden and all mothering friends:

I agree w/ everything you said about homework. It should get the parents involved and show them how their little offspring is learning and progressing.

However, many parents bring their own emotional baggage to the task. I had one parent of one of my students smugly tell me her son never does the reading I give him. I told her his grades reflected it (they did). I don't understand why someone would pay to send their child to a school and then brag to the teacher that their child is not doing the assigned work and they will not make him do the work.

As a parent, I made sure that my children did the assigned work, but the work itself was their work. I guided them to dictionaries and encyclopedias and atlases, but the work itself was done by them, alone. A CPS social worker told me this was child abuse.

I guess everything is child abuse today including teaching responsibility.

[mommy22]

That comment from the social worker, in and of itself, reflects the intelligence of those people who are suppose to be protecting our children. It makes me sick!!

And for the parents who take little to no interest in the education of their children...they are the ones that will be complaining about the state of affairs in the world when their children are grown, and blaming it on the education deficits in the world.

[Greaseball]

This is from "Talking Back to Ritalin" by psychiatrist Peter Breggin.

"Real life? How many adults will be asked every day to sit silent and still on hard chairs in a room of thirty peers through hour after hour of lectures and rote exercises by single instructors of varying ability? How many will have to raise their hands before being able to go to the bathroom? How many will be unable to leave the room at all during the entire day simply to take a break, get a snack, or call home?...How many will have to contend at work with openly hostile cliques that exclude anyone who seems at all different?" (page 330)

In my years of experience in my chosen field, I have never had to bring work home with me. (Unless I chose to, and when I did I was paid for it.)

County jails typically give inmates more freedom than elementary schools give to their students.

[butterflyma]

Mommy22~ yikes, sounds like that social worker is getting a little overzealous! I have children who come to my class dirty and unfed on a daily basis. Where is the social worker to step in and help them? ( off topic: Yes, I have made referrals to child protective services, but they rarely act on anything :( ) It sounds to me like you are supporting your children by giving the time and tools that they need to learn!

Miriam~ I too see many parents bringing their emotional baggage to school: concerning homework and every other aspect of education imaginable. I find that parents who have had unsuccessful experiences in school often expect that their child will also, and they come prepared to defend them. Sometimes, I spend entire conferences educating/debriefing parents so that they are able to support their own child, rather than try to resolve their personal educational nightmares. It is worth it if we can later shift our focus to their child.

Greaseball~ I have not read the book you mentioned, it sounds very powerful. I am not one who thinks homework prepares a child for "real life". Homework is part of a child's real life. Homework (ideally) provides children with practice to improve their skills and enrich their minds. That is the job of a child in school, to learn. The classroom Dr. Breggin and you mention sounds pretty horrible (rote exercises, sitting all day long and any likeness to a county jail..aah!). I believe that many classrooms (including mine) are not so horrible of a place to be. I try to create an atmosphere of excited learning and of mutual respect.

As for the responsibilities of a job~ I work at least 10 hours unpaid during the week, almost always have work that I need to bring home, I am unable to take a break when I need one and can only go to the bathroom before school at lunch and when the children leave. Of course, I choose to be in a job where I don't have a lot of freedom during my work hours; I would not trade it for anything. I do understand, however, that children do not make the choice of their learning environment. That is why it is up to us (guardians, parents) to make really good choices when we decide on a learning environment for them and to advocate for them. I urge any parent who sees that their child is in a classroom that they are uncomfortable with, or where their child is being given work that seems unfair, to communicate and work with their child's teacher until a better arrangement is made or to find a different/better learning environment. (just my lil ol opinion
:o :D )