"maladaptive" sleep associations

[bass chick]

I was at a friend's house the other day and she was saying how her 2nd baby was sleeping through the night already (6 weeks old) and how easy it has been since they put her on a schedule of eating, being awake, then sleeping. It sounded like babywise to me. And she gave me this book called the 3 am Handbook with "tips" on how to get your baby to sleep through the night since my 18 month old is up several times and he nurses and cuddles and whines until he gets comfortable and falls back to sleep in our bed. I told her I wasn't comfortable with the CIO method and wouldn't do it and her husband kept telling her to back off because maybe we didn't want to do that with our baby. But she gave me the book anyways and stupid me, I opened it out of curiosity.
Maybe I need some validation that what I'm doing is right, or maybe I just need to vent, or maybe I actually think I've done my son a disservice. Not by not letting him CIO, but by helping him sleep by certain ways. This book says things like, "Your reward to a night awakening can also be an important factor. If you reward the child - with a feeding...or by any other soothing contact - you're sending the child a message that waking up at night brings comfort and companionship. This is positive reinforcement of the waking-up habit." My DH and I had a good laugh about that one. The stupid authors are basically saying to not soothe your baby. I almost chucked the book out the window (we were driving on the highway) but then I continued reading. And even though this book has discredited itself by saying that comforting your baby at night is wrong, something caught my attention....
"Another factor in night awakenings is sleep associations - the bedtime conditions that the child typically falls asleep with. If these are conditions that he or she can't recreat alone, the normal awakenings that can come several times a night become traps that the child can't escape. Examples of such "maladaptive" sleep associations include: being rocked in your arms; breastfeeding; being in another room or someone else's bed; listening to music the child can't restart." And it goes on to say more crap.
It's not that I agree with this stupid book, because it is stupid, but (I know....get to the point already!) am I making it harder for my son to sleep because of the way I am parenting him at night? I rock him to sleep while I nurse him when he first goes to bed and then when he wakes up we bring him into our bed and he nurses here and there and he is close to us. But he whines so much while he's sleeping with us and he tosses....like he is uncomfortable...and no one gets a good sleep. But if I pick him up and rock him he falls asleep pretty fast. I used to just nurse him laying down, but then for some reason I started rocking him and now it seems as though he needs to be rocked. We went away last week and it took him HOURS to fall asleep because there was no rocking chair and I didn't think to pick him up and just rock him on the bed. I feel as though I have just added one more thing that he *needs* to fall asleep...and I'm not really into rocking him for half an hour ever 2 or 3 hours in the night. Maybe this is just a stupid thing to post about....maybe I'm overreacting because it's 12:30 am and I'm dog-tired and should go to bed. But I feel as though I have created a sleep association that has trapped my little one. And I wish I knew why he whined so much when we co-sleep with him (which is ususally from 1 am until we wake up every day). We have a King sized bed. It's not like there's not enough room for him. I always offer the breast to him when he wakes, but he rarely wants it the past couple weeks. Sorry this is so long and discombobulated.

[Red Sonja]

"...Examples of such "maladaptive" sleep associations include: being rocked in your arms; breastfeeding; being in another room or someone else's bed; listening to music the child can't restart." And it goes on to say more crap.


Ugh, that IS a load of crap! Your son was just born to need more parenting at night, my DS is the same way. All we are doing is responding to our DC's needs, which is what AP is all about. Keep doing what you're doing, mama, and know that while it may be tough right now you are building lifelong positive sleep associations for your DS. :thumb

Heck, I for one like to go to sleep cuddled in DH's arms, I certainly don't consider that a "maladaptive" sleep association. That book belongs in the compost pile. ;)

[Pen]

Give them what they need when they need it and they won't be looking for it later. Many parents will tell you how they parented their babies and children to sleep and although it may be even years later, the children are sleeping and waking happily. But, children whose needs are not met will go on to look for it even into adulthood.
If there is a change in your child's sleep pattern, perhaps there is something going on during the day. 18 mos is a pretty exciting time! Teeth? New foods? Allergies to wet leaves? (well the stuff on the wet leaves) New friend? Lost toy? It's been a while since I've had an 18 month old so I'm just shooting in the dark here (ha, ha. get it... 'dark'?/'sleep'? - okay not so funny)
Hope this helps...hang in there

[chel]

I don't have the link off hand, but I'm sure it's floating around this board. Link is from some "offical" source but goes on to say that co-sleeping/room sharing and nursing to sleep helps to prevent SIDs.

[Alkenny]

I hate parenting/advice books of ALL kinds. Every child/babe is different. I've had babes all over the spectrum when it comes to their needs and attachment. My older DS was the most attached of all *during the day*, yet he was the same one that slept through the night the first night home from the hospital (and scared the crap out of me too!). He co-slept sometimes, slept in the crib at others. Nothing phased him.

My DD was a frequent waker, my babe sleeps right on through (both cosleepers). It just depends on the child themselves.

[Thorey]

I have the same fear as the poster and have tried to create different sleep associations for my dd (9 mos)- I nurse her and rock her and she wakes every few hours to nurse or suck on something, not necessarily to be rocked. She will not be put down in a crib and I just leave the room and she'll fall asleep especially now that she's walking! If I try that she doesn't cry she just sits in her crib and plays- she doesn't understand the concept of putting herself to sleep and I don't think she will anytime soon. I missed the boat on teaching her that. I think at a certain point, it's ridiculously hard to change a sleep association and very stressful for everyone. But my baby is so happy and secure she doesn't cry when I leave the room- she cries when she's tired or hungry or not feeling well or bored. I feel pretty lucky about that and I think it's because I've always responded to her needs and treated her with respect. But I do wish I created a different sleep association for her. I think it would have helped her sleep longer stretches. HOwever, she seems to be thriving in every way. Still I question my choices too especially because of the stress of frequent night wakings on me. It's selfish I admit. I'm tired and want to sleep for 4 or 5 hours in a row. One thing that helped is having my husband help out at night a bit. Last night he gave my dd water at midnnight and she didn't wake again until 5- at which point he started whining man I only got 5 hours! I was so irritated but hid it- just thanked him for helping me. I'm really working on night weaning and I need his help so I want him on my side. Not feeding my child when she wakes up is making her sleep longer- she doesn't cry when she wakes up and is soothed back to sleep by my dh with water or a pacifier. I've also noticed that she sleeps longer when not nursed to sleep, but that takes forever and I like nursing her to sleep. SO maybe this will help you? the poster? I do think the book was crap- what are you gonna do be mean to your child when it awakes so it has a negative wake up association? THere has to be a gentle way to help one's child sleep and I don't think there's anything wrong with trying to find one that works for you. And I also think it's genetic- some babes are born good sleepers and can be nursed rocked whatever and don't wake up. YOu can blame yourself or you can just say I've done what I thought was best and I'm trying my hardest and I'll keep trying. That's what I'm trying to do...

[swissmiss]

I'm in the same boat as the OP, but 3 years later! My DS whines at night, and sometimes kicks, and I nurse him lying down until he falls back to sleep, and we have been through HELL (he and I, DH now sleeps in the guest room) since the day he was born, with me constantly wondering what is wrong with him or what I'm doing wrong. Lately, he has seen episodes of a few weeks where he doesn't wake for about 6 hours, and it is BLISS! I've stopped envying all the people out there who are getting uninterrupted sleep at night, since AP just feels so right, in general. But I am sorry to say that your ds sounds a lot like mine (and those of a few friends who were honest enough to admit it) and maybe 3 is the magic age when all this fades, even if it won't disappear all together. Between the guilt and the lack of sleep, it is very hard, but I don't really think they will suffer lasting negative effects of us being loving parents. Or at least, I HOPE NOT! :blush

PM me if you want to chat more.

[Elastagirl]

Well, I personally think the whole "Improper sleep associations" theory is a bunch of bunk. Yes, babies and children may prefer certain routines to help them fall asleep, but it's not like they're never going to sleep without them! People sleep when they're tired!

I always nurse ds and dd to sleep. Always. And I was freaking out when I was pregnant with dd, knowing that I would have to be away from ds for at least one night (hospital birth). Well, guess what? He fell asleep to dh reading him stories and rubbing his back, and it was no problem! (Well, maybe a little...he cried for Mama for a short time, but then he settled in and fell asleep because he was tired!) I am also a working mother and when I'm at work he naps for his babysitter fairly easily. She sings songs and scratches his back, and sometimes he just climbs up on the couch and falls asleep without all of that. When I'm home, he nurses, BUT HE DOESN'T HAVE TO...it's just what he prefers.

Soooo, you are not damaging your child; in fact, your child associates going to sleep with warmth, rocking, nursing, and loving people around him. Isn't that better than associating sleep with dark, cold, inanimate objects staring blankly at him in the shadows of his cage (crib) bars? *shudder!*

[bass chick]

I had a nap today and having more sleep always helps me maintain confidence that I am doing the right things. That and the reassurance from you mamas.
I think it's time to try some different techniques at night to help ds fall back to sleep because nursing him in our bed isn't really helping much. He ends up just whining so much, especially in the early morning hours. And maybe it's just what he does and nothing will help, but I'm all for trying to get him to be more comfortable. His whining seems to me like he just can't quite get comfortable enough to relax and fall back to sleep. If anyone has any ideas I'd love to hear them....I've thought of putting a mattress on our floor because maybe he just finds our bed uncomfortable. I've thought of rocking him back to sleep and them putting him back in his crib. I don't know what else I could try to help him get back to sleep in the middle of the night. Any ideas are welcome (I think I am hijacking my own thread!)

[mezzaluna]

i think babies definitely do have sleep associations... and that these are set early on and can only be changed later through greater efforts... i recommend the book no cry sleep solution if you are interested in changing the sleep associations in a gentle way.

for me i prefer that my baby's sleep associations be things like sharing a bed with us, having us sing to him, putting a hand on his chest... i'd rather those than something artificial or mechanical. but his favorite ways to get back to sleep take a little more effort: nursing and being rocked/walked. it does take a lot out of us to wake up very often and help him get back to sleep. i don't know if i would call these associations "maladaptive" though - that's a very negative term!

i try to think about what parents would have done in a pre-modern society - certainly not leave their babies alone... and there were no such things as pacifiers, mobiles or white noise machines... it just seems intuitively obvious that nursing and other forms of person-to-person physical comfort are what babies would expect!

what we've been doing since 6 mo. is have DH participate more in getting our DS to sleep - he puts him down occasionally for naps, and most bedtimes now... then i nurse DS back to sleep at all his nightwakings since it's the quickest and easiest way for us all to go back to sleep - yet we still have DS regularly going to sleep without being nursed, so he's not 100% reliant on that.

[johub]

Whether or not somethign is "adaptive" depends entirely on the situation that is being adapted to.
So if the situation is crib sleeping in the other room and waking frequently. Then needing to nurse to go back to sleep is maladaptive to that situation.
But if the situation is cosleeping and snuggled close than needing to nurse IS adaptive to that situation.
So the first thing to consider whether somethign is maladaptive or not is to ask the question "to what circumstance" Yes a baby sleeping alone in a crib down the hall would be better served if he could suck his thumb to sleep than if he needed mom's help.
If a parent doesnt expect a child to sleep all night on their own, then whatever sleep pattern they have developed IS adaptive to their chosen situation.
On the other hand I do not believe sleep associations are set in stone or hard to break. THey evolve over a lifetime.
If people could only fall asleep in one way their whole life, the travel industry would take a nose dive. Nobody would ever buy new pillows or sheets. Spouses would be unable to sleep in the same bed after spendnig their younger years sleepign alone.
Humans are adaptive by nature. That goes for most babies too. (albeit there are certainly some stubborn exceptions at any age)
Joline

[CalBearMama]

My ds seemed uncomfortable and thrashed around a lot in our bed until recently, when I started learning about EC (elimination communication). Only then did it occur to me that he might have to go to the bathroom, but he didn't want to go in his diaper, so he was holding it and that was preventing him from getting restful sleep. Since starting night-time EC, ds has slept much more soundly and for longer stretches. I realized that he wasn't waking up because he wanted to nurse (although nursing him would generally get him back to sleep) - he just had to pee.

There are lots of ways to practice night-time EC, so the logistics will depend on what you and your child are comfortable with. I started by getting my son comfortable with the idea of going in the toilet (I hold him over it) during the day. (This is important, because until he was comfortable with the whole process, I couldn't do it at night because it seemed to freak him out - now he practically sleeps through peeing in the toilet.) Now when he starts to thrash around at night, I nurse him first to see if that does the trick. If he is still restless, I just take him to the bathroom, quickly pull off his diaper, hold him over the toilet while he pees, replace diaper, and we're back to bed in about a minute. Then a little more nursing back to sleep, and he's out like a light - sometimes for 4-5 hours or more. The whole episode probably takes less than five minutes and happens maybe twice a night. There are no more endless hours of getting kicked by a restless baby, no more worrying that he isn't getting good quality sleep (because I knew I wasn't), and no more changing leaky diapers in the middle of the night, because for the most part, he stays dry.

This may or may not have anything to do with your situation, but I just thought I'd suggest it because it has worked so well for us so far. The only other comment I would have is that you are doing a great job by being there for your child, day and night - toss the book, and listen to your heart.

[Periwinkle]

I hate parenting/advice books of ALL kinds.

:yeah: After 3 kids, this is where I am too. There's not a single one written that I don't have serious problems with somewhere. This particular one sounds like one of the worst! Blech.

[aira]

Didn't read all the replies, but wanted to laugh at this:
If you reward the child - with a feeding...or by any other soothing contact - you're sending the child a message that waking up at night brings comfort and companionship. :laugh: Stupid babies! Where do they get off thinking that they get *comfort* after the sun goes down?! Geesh, kiddos!

Anyhoo, I thought I'd relate a weird conversation I had with the ped a couple of years ago... In his office there was an article posted about bad bad co-sleeping, idiot parents who rock babies... blah blah... The "expert" gave an analogy that rocking and BFing babies to sleep and then putting them down in a crib would feel like if you fell asleep happily in your bed and then suddenly found yourself awake in the middle of the night on the kitchen floor. The babies are confused and scared, and it's totally selfish and unfair to them to trick them by giving comfort. So the conclusion was to put them in the crib to CIO so that they wouldn't be confused.

So I asked if he thought that anyone faced with this alarming problem of waking up uncomfortable on the kitchen floor would think for a moment that the solution was to go to sleep there to avoid the fear and confusion they must feel in the middle of the night?!?!? No one would think about doing anything other than finding a way to stay asleep where they are comfortable. Duh!

Then I told the ped that this was purely in the realm of parenting, and that his world was medical advice, and he was overstepping his bounds by posting this crap article.

Who the he// wants to sleep alone? Ever? Even when you're all grown up and single, lying in your bed, don't you think about having a parner to snuggle with? Why is it maladaptive to seek what all humans want and need?

:demon <--- "Experts" and their "maladaptive sleep associations"