Can't believe I'm at point that I want move to Canada or overseas (countries like Can

[jessicaabruno]

ada)

Ever since I been here, been seeing threads like this. Of course I wanted to move, but stay here, but now I come to point that I feel I need to move.

I'm not sure if I want move to Canada or just move to Europe or Down Under at this time.

Plus, I don't want my future child/ren to grow here if it still is like this when I have them. Has anyone here been in the same situation has me and has it taken place or whatever comes next?

What would suggest for me to do.

[wryknowlicious]

I'd just go ahead and try to move to Canada.:thumb

I just saw some thing on 20/20 or Primetime (one of those) about Canada needing more population group then they are producing (ie. birth rate) and so they are actively looking for new citizens. It;s sopposed to be easier then ever to immigrate to Canada (notoriously hard in past years).
And eaiser still if you have a degree or training in certain areas of industry.


I always say - if your not happy where your at - move! I would be right behind you too if my DH wasn;t such a Texas boy=allergic to the cold! :lol

Good luck!

[jessicaabruno]

I'd just go ahead and try to move to Canada.:thumb

I just saw some thing on 20/20 or Primetime (one of those) about Canada needing more population group then they are producing (ie. birth rate) and so they are actively looking for new citizens. It;s sopposed to be easier then ever to immigrate to Canada (notoriously hard in past years).
And eaiser still if you have a degree or training in certain areas of industry.


I always say - if your not happy where your at - move! I would be right behind you too if my DH wasn;t such a Texas boy=allergic to the cold! :lol

Good luck!

wryknowlicious,

:Thanks, for your response to my question here. :nod, but not at this moment because of finacial situation.

[RomanGoddess]

What is it about Canada or Europe that attracts you? Many Americans tell me that they prefer the political climate in Canada but then when they get there and find out what it's really like (very communitarian, group rights-oriented, much less libertarian), they realise that it is not quite right for them, no matter how much of a "liberal" they feel they are in the States.

[jessicaabruno]

What is it about Canada or Europe that attracts you? Many Americans tell me that they prefer the political climate in Canada but then when they get there and find out what it's really like (very communitarian, group rights-oriented, much less libertarian), they realise that it is not quite right for them, no matter how much of a "liberal" they feel they are in the States.

Caroline,

:Thanks, for your response my thread. Basically, what attracts me to those places are, well really don't know yet, but I had anough of the current situation here in the US. Or maybe Down Under.

[hakeber]

That is pretty much why I have not been back to the US to live since 2000. I moved first for a job opportunity in Asia, and since then have found many excuses not to go back...luckily I have now married a Scotsman and I don't have to go back to the US if I feel like settling down near family. I certianly hope the US politicians shape up and start doing things right, but in the meantime, I'd rather be anywhere but home.

Currently my DH DS and I are living in Argentina. We like it here quite a lot and BsAs is a LOT like NYC.

[RomanGoddess]

I love living in Europe and cannot imagine living in North America again (except maybe New York :lol ). I love

- the outdoor markets,
- the amount of fresh vegetable in my diet (way more than when I was in the US or Canada),
- the fact that people here prefer eating proper meals to eating on the run and out of a box,
- the fact that I can go topless on the beach (or nurse in public) and noone blinks an eye,
- how much prettier cities are here than in North America (Canadian cities have some of the most hideous 1960s architecture going)
- our apartment in the center of Paris (the ghettos here are in the suburbs, not the city center)
- subsidized public daycare
- free, quality public preschool for all children from age 3
- the quality of everything (think Gucci, Armani, Versace and Chanel as opposed to Calvin Klein, Ralph Lauren and DKNY :wink )

But once in a while, I do miss the convenience of living in North America, as well as how service-oriented the culture is.

And Europe definitely has its political problems. People are incredibly inflexible and conservative here when it comes to new ideas. France, for example, is still a pretty racist society (especially vis-a-vis North Africans) but if you ever mention the possibility of affirmative action here, people just jump on you and say no way. Also, Europeans are so used to the state intervening in virtually every aspect of life, which is not at all healthy for the level of initiative, individuality and entrepreneurship in a society. It will take a lot to change things like that here.

[mamabadger]

Many Americans tell me that they prefer the political climate in Canada but then when they get there and find out what it's really like (very communitarian, group rights-oriented, much less libertarian), they realise that it is not quite right for them, no matter how much of a "liberal" they feel they are in the States.

Good point.
I've met Americans who either came here on vacation or talked about moving here, but ran into some surprises when they actually looked into it. Bear in mind that today's American "liberal" is Canada's moderate conservative, in some areas at least. Make sure you know what you're getting into -- for our sake as well as yours :wink .

[josybear]

i'm canadian, living in canada. when i lived in the states (in northern california and iowa, mostly) i was shocked at the opinions of even the most liberal americans. i mean, we canadians are no europeans, we don't have nude billboards like they do in france, but there is definitley a huge gap between american attitudes and canadian ones. when i lived down there i kept accidentally offending americans by saying things that i thought were pretty standard opinions...
having lived in the states for almost two years, i'm extra happy to be living in canada. even if it is like an oven today.

[jessicaabruno]

I love living in Europe and cannot imagine living in North America again (except maybe New York :lol ). I love

- the outdoor markets,
- the amount of fresh vegetable in my diet (way more than when I was in the US or Canada),
- the fact that people here prefer eating proper meals to eating on the run and out of a box,
- the fact that I can go topless on the beach (or nurse in public) and noone blinks an eye,
- how much prettier cities are here than in North America (Canadian cities have some of the most hideous 1960s architecture going)
- our apartment in the center of Paris (the ghettos here are in the suburbs, not the city center)
- subsidized public daycare
- free, quality public preschool for all children from age 3
- the quality of everything (think Gucci, Armani, Versace and Chanel as opposed to Calvin Klein, Ralph Lauren and DKNY :wink )

But once in a while, I do miss the convenience of living in North America, as well as how service-oriented the culture is.

And Europe definitely has its political problems. People are incredibly inflexible and conservative here when it comes to new ideas. France, for example, is still a pretty racist society (especially vis-a-vis North Africans) but if you ever mention the possibility of affirmative action here, people just jump on you and say no way. Also, Europeans are so used to the state intervening in virtually every aspect of life, which is not at all healthy for the level of initiative, individuality and entrepreneurship in a society. It will take a lot to change things like that here.

Caroline,

:Thanks , for your response to my thread. Anyone of you whom lived Down Under or from there and live here now I would love your opinions as well.

[jessicaabruno]

Caroline,

:Thanks , for your response to my thread. Anyone of you whom lived Down Under or from there and live here now I would love your opinions as well.

Heres the link to one of the threads that I did in TV Subfolder of Books, Music, Other Media Subfolder, Natural Family Living Folder on here as well.

Don't understand why Americans who watch House Hunters International (http://www.mothering.com/discussions/showthread.php?t=474398)

[CarrieMF]

And eaiser still if you have a degree or training in certain areas of industry.

In some areas(like Saskatchewan west) all you need to know is how to use a hammer. We are crying(literally) for employees. You can go to McD's and start off at $10/hour, get a $500 signing bonus and a car loan just becuase they need people.

There are lots of companies who are now sponsoring people from the Phillipeans to come and work here.

the outdoor markets,
- the amount of fresh vegetable in my diet (way more than when I was in the US or Canada),
- the fact that people here prefer eating proper meals to eating on the run and out of a box,
- the fact that I can go topless on the beach (or nurse in public) and noone blinks an eye,
- how much prettier cities are here than in North America (Canadian cities have some of the most hideous 1960s architecture going)
- our apartment in the center of Paris (the ghettos here are in the suburbs, not the city center)
- subsidized public daycare
- free, quality public preschool for all children from age 3
- the quality of everything (think Gucci, Armani, Versace and Chanel as opposed to Calvin Klein, Ralph Lauren and DKNY )

All depends on which city you are going to. Nursing in public is a legal right in Canada, as long as your child can be there you can nip there. There are ugly cities and pretty cities. In some cities you can go topless. We do have open markets. Stay out of the cities and people are more likely to eat proper meals, partially because there are no fast food chains but also there is a slower pace of life.

Of course it all depends on your personal interests.

[jessicaabruno]

In some areas(like Saskatchewan west) all you need to know is how to use a hammer. We are crying(literally) for employees. You can go to McD's and start off at $10/hour, get a $500 signing bonus and a car loan just becuase they need people.

There are lots of companies who are now sponsoring people from the Phillipeans to come and work here.



All depends on which city you are going to. Nursing in public is a legal right in Canada, as long as your child can be there you can nip there. There are ugly cities and pretty cities. In some cities you can go topless. We do have open markets. Stay out of the cities and people are more likely to eat proper meals, partially because there are no fast food chains but also there is a slower pace of life.

Of course it all depends on your personal interests.

carriemf,

:Thanks, for your insight living in Canada.

[UmmZahra]

I have immigrated to Canada from Texas because my husband is Canadian citizen. He immigrated from Nigeria about 6 years ago and so did all his family. I'd like my family to come to Canada as well. I really love Canada.

I lived in Toronto. The taxes were high 15%(now down to 14), the prices of alot of things were higher also. Housing is expensive as well. I found it more difficult to find organic food but there is an amazing place called The Big Carrot, but still I found the llifestyle easier in TX. It took me awhile to get used to Toronto. Its very different from Houston. But over all I really liked it and it has won the heart of my family. They all want to come to Canada.

[puffelly]

I'm living in California with hubby who's an Icelandic citizen and my twin boys.
I really like California, but we will probably move to Scandinavia. I lived there for 3 years and loved it!
I just lived in Japan and while I was there, we were always seeing advertisements for immigrating to Australia. I saw a BBC special about how Australia is in high demand for trades people (mechanics, beauticians, etc.) and somewhat affordable housing (unlike California :lol ).
I looked into moving to Australia and didn't seem that difficult. I also looked into moving into Canada, which seemed a little more difficult but I'm not sure.
I say move to Denmark, Iceland or Sweden!:thumb
Good luck to you!

[Charles Baudelaire]

Being someone who's always wondering if the grass is greener...I'm subbing.

[paganmum]

My Dh and I have talked about moving out of the country, even though his mother would kill us, because we do not agree withe the direction the country is going. Politically we are pretty middle of the road.

Basically it has boiled down if the company he's working for (which operates a warehouse in canada) decided to open a sales office there I can expect a call from him that he's put in his offer to transfer up there!

Personally I'm so tired of the "my god you nurse! how gross!" looks and responces around here. Let alone that locally people are turned in to children's services for extended nursing so you have to keep a low profile and not nurse in public once the nurseling starts talking. Add to that the religious veiws and tentions locally and in the country in general put my family at a risk and under tention due to my religious beliefs. Basically we are tired of fighting 'the system' here but at the same time can't afford to just up and move. :(

We will keep watching and waiting. I've heard a lot of good thing about canada though. :)

[ATD_Mom]

paganmum - Where are you in central Illinois? I just moved to Canada from Springfield! Because my husband has a tiny support network here (and I have zero) but in Springfield we have literally hundreds of people to call upon, we often talk about one day moving back. Especially to raise children. However, your comments make me worry. Are you in a smaller town, or in Springpatch?

[DebHibb]

We went to Germany for World Cup in June, and just LOVED it!!!!! We joked about just shipping the kids out, and staying forever. Then when we got back we did some serious thinking about it, and well... here we stay. If I could take my job there, we'd move in a heartbeat.

[jessicaabruno]

I'm living in California with hubby who's an Icelandic citizen and my twin boys.
I really like California, but we will probably move to Scandinavia. I lived there for 3 years and loved it!
I just lived in Japan and while I was there, we were always seeing advertisements for immigrating to Australia. I saw a BBC special about how Australia is in high demand for trades people (mechanics, beauticians, etc.) and somewhat affordable housing (unlike California :lol ).
I looked into moving to Australia and didn't seem that difficult. I also looked into moving into Canada, which seemed a little more difficult but I'm not sure.
I say move to Denmark, Iceland or Sweden!:thumb
Good luck to you!

My Dh and I have talked about moving out of the country, even though his mother would kill us, because we do not agree withe the direction the country is going. Politically we are pretty middle of the road.

Personally I'm so tired of the "my god you nurse! how gross!" looks and responces around here. Let alone that locally people are turned in to children's services for extended nursing so you have to keep a low profile and not nurse in public once the nurseling starts talking. Add to that the religious veiws and tentions locally and in the country in general put my family at a risk and under tention due to my religious beliefs. Basically we are tired of fighting 'the system' here but at the same time can't afford to just up and move. :(

We will keep watching and waiting. I've heard a lot of good thing about canada though. :)

Puffelly and paganmum,

:Thanks, for your responses to my thread here. Sorry, for the late response here.

[Meg Murry.]

Okay, Carrie, what do they pay school teachers?

In some areas(like Saskatchewan west) all you need to know is how to use a hammer. We are crying(literally) for employees. You can go to McD's and start off at $10/hour, get a $500 signing bonus and a car loan just becuase they need people.

There are lots of companies who are now sponsoring people from the Phillipeans to come and work here.



All depends on which city you are going to. Nursing in public is a legal right in Canada, as long as your child can be there you can nip there. There are ugly cities and pretty cities. In some cities you can go topless. We do have open markets. Stay out of the cities and people are more likely to eat proper meals, partially because there are no fast food chains but also there is a slower pace of life.

Of course it all depends on your personal interests.

[RomanGoddess]

Okay, Carrie, what do they pay school teachers?

School teachers are unionized so their pay is actually not bad. I cannot give you a figure but you live fine.

But then, the downside is that you have to live in Saskatchewan.:lol :dizzy: :p (I grew up there so I'm allowed to say that).

[jessicaabruno]

How about Ireland and United Kingdom?

[jaxinsmom]

I Canadian, but have lived in Australia (for a year) and Asia (Taiwan) for 2 years.
Australia was fun, and the people are nice although I found there was a lot of underlying racisim (especially toward Aborigionals) and sexism. Now, I was in the country so that may have squewed my experience. Overall I enjoyed it, but I was also single so Im not sure how much I would enjoy it as a mother (LOADS of poisonous things...:eek )

Taiwan was fun, my dh and I taught English and partied ALL the time -- but it's super dirty, would NOT want to raise a child there.

Really, I think Canada is your best bet :thumb

[jaxinsmom]

Okay, Carrie, what do they pay school teachers?

Teacher are paid fairly well in Canada, from how I understand it -- it's based on the amount of education you have (if you have an Honours BA, you will start at the second highest pay tier). Teachers here live in middle-class neighbourhoods and have middle-class lives (from what I've observed)

[jaxinsmom]

How about Ireland and United Kingdom?

Depending on your profession Ireland is having an economic boom right now and recruiting workers from N. America (I work in the social services field, so that's the only one I know about -- try the website:
http://www.jobsearch.ie/
that may help narrow the search -- if you know what type of job your looking for you can better guess if it would be they type of place you'd like to live.

Good luck!!

[fridgeart]

Two sites to check are oct.ca and osstf.ca for teacher pay, at least in Ontario. When I started teaching, I was earning $45,000 to start (2nd tier, need a masters for top tier), and it goes up about $3000 a year, to a max of (I think) $75,000. If you're a department head, you get another $3-5000 a year, in our board. Not to mention a sweet pension!

[Hollycrand]

Originally Posted by jaxinsmom
Really, I think Canada is your best bet

Goodness, it's good to know that we've made a good choice. We're awaiting our final confirmation from the Canadian immigration authorities in Berlin and then, it's off to Canada we go.
I'm originally from the SF Bay Area (US), and dh is French. We didn't want to stay in Europe, nor did we want to move to the US (we want health insurance and better public schools).
There are always pros and cons to any country/continent you move to, and I think each individual family needs to weigh their needs and goals against what a country can offer.
I am excited about returning to North America, interested to see how cold a Canadian winter really will be (we're starting out in Montreal...then will go wherever the wind may take us).

Out of curiosity (and off topic a bit) in which cities can you go topless? Wow...now THAT's a big cultural difference between Canada and its Southern neighbour. It goes to show that Canada has a more European attitude (or is it that Europeans have Canadian attitudes?)

[Bartock]

We are putting up our house for sale in the spring :Sheepish:

[jessicaabruno]

Goodness, it's good to know that we've made a good choice. We're awaiting our final confirmation from the Canadian immigration authorities in Berlin and then, it's off to Canada we go.
I'm originally from the SF Bay Area (US), and dh is French. We didn't want to stay in Europe, nor did we want to move to the US (we want health insurance and better public schools).
There are always pros and cons to any country/continent you move to, and I think each individual family needs to weigh their needs and goals against what a country can offer.
I am excited about returning to North America, interested to see how cold a Canadian winter really will be (we're starting out in Montreal...then will go wherever the wind may take us).

Out of curiosity (and off topic a bit) in which cities can you go topless? Wow...now THAT's a big cultural difference between Canada and its Southern neighbour. It goes to show that Canada has a more European attitude (or is it that Europeans have Canadian attitudes?)

Holly,

:truedat:, about there are always pros and cons to any country/continent you move to and think each individual or family needs to weigh their needs and goals what a country an country/continent can offer.

At the sametime, I don't understand why you or dh don't want to stay in Europe? Well, I only been to Italy so far, but I feel it would be fun to live there in a way, but the other way no. I do understand why you don't want live in US a little a bit.

Think thats it for now. Good luck to you and dh on your move to Canada.

[Hollycrand]

The European architecture is fabulous. However, there are many inflexibilities in the job market and in education (dh wants to go back to school and at 35 is considered 'too old'), and land prices are extremely expensive. We'll never be able to buy a house either here or in France. Even though we've saved up quite a bit.
In Canada we can buy a house as soon as we arrive (if we can and want to), dh can go back to school, find a nice job that fits his needs and competences, we can send our girls to decent schools.
I also enjoy the North American optimism and entrepreneurship. I know this sometimes turns into a bombardment of marketing and mass media, but the marketing and mass media we get in Europe too. Without the optimism and entrepreneurship.
I would like my children to grow up in a society where they feel they can 'do anything'. Here in Europe schools don't encourage that at all.

[RomanGoddess]

The European architecture is fabulous. However, there are many inflexibilities in the job market and in education (dh wants to go back to school and at 35 is considered 'too old'), and land prices are extremely expensive. We'll never be able to buy a house either here or in France. Even though we've saved up quite a bit.
In Canada we can buy a house as soon as we arrive (if we can and want to), dh can go back to school, find a nice job that fits his needs and competences, we can send our girls to decent schools.
I also enjoy the North American optimism and entrepreneurship. I know this sometimes turns into a bombardment of marketing and mass media, but the marketing and mass media we get in Europe too. Without the optimism and entrepreneurship.
I would like my children to grow up in a society where they feel they can 'do anything'. Here in Europe schools don't encourage that at all.

Well put! Exactly my thinking. There are aspects of North America that I just don't like at all (the diet, the lack of beautiful architecture...) but there are good things too that you don't get in Europe.

I would also add that the mentality of optimism and entrepreneurship is much much stronger in the States than in Canada. It is part and parcel of the American "you can do anything" culture. Europe is much more class oriented and conservative in this respect. Canada is somewhere between the two.

[RomanGoddess]

The European architecture is fabulous. However, there are many inflexibilities in the job market and in education (dh wants to go back to school and at 35 is considered 'too old'), and land prices are extremely expensive. We'll never be able to buy a house either here or in France. Even though we've saved up quite a bit.
In Canada we can buy a house as soon as we arrive (if we can and want to), dh can go back to school, find a nice job that fits his needs and competences, we can send our girls to decent schools.
I also enjoy the North American optimism and entrepreneurship. I know this sometimes turns into a bombardment of marketing and mass media, but the marketing and mass media we get in Europe too. Without the optimism and entrepreneurship.
I would like my children to grow up in a society where they feel they can 'do anything'. Here in Europe schools don't encourage that at all.

Well put! Exactly my thinking. There are aspects of North America that I just don't like at all (the diet, the lack of beautiful architecture...) but there are good things too that you don't get in Europe.

I would also add that the mentality of optimism and entrepreneurship is much much stronger in the States than in Canada. It is part and parcel of the American "you can do anything" culture. Europe is much more class oriented and conservative in this respect. Canada is somewhere between the two.

[jessicaabruno]

The European architecture is fabulous. However, there are many inflexibilities in the job market and in education (dh wants to go back to school and at 35 is considered 'too old'), and land prices are extremely expensive. We'll never be able to buy a house either here or in France. Even though we've saved up quite a bit.
In Canada we can buy a house as soon as we arrive (if we can and want to), dh can go back to school, find a nice job that fits his needs and competences, we can send our girls to decent schools.
I also enjoy the North American optimism and entrepreneurship. I know this sometimes turns into a bombardment of marketing and mass media, but the marketing and mass media we get in Europe too. Without the optimism and entrepreneurship.
I would like my children to grow up in a society where they feel they can 'do anything'. Here in Europe schools don't encourage that at all.

Well put! Exactly my thinking. There are aspects of North America that I just don't like at all (the diet, the lack of beautiful architecture...) but there are good things too that you don't get in Europe.

I would also add that the mentality of optimism and entrepreneurship is much much stronger in the States than in Canada. It is part and parcel of the American "you can do anything" culture. Europe is much more class oriented and conservative in this respect. Canada is somewhere between the two.

Holly and Caroline,

:truedat: and I always that life life in Europe is better then US, but from what I read here I'm wrong on this.

[chaoticzenmom]

My dh and I were so angry after the last election, we sold our house and moved to France. My dh is french and his entire family is here. We're near Orleans.

We actually love it here most of the time. The driving is very stressful, but the public transportation is great. Private schools are not very expensive. My children come home for 2 hours every day for lunch and we cook at home a lot. I've made some decent friends very quickly. I love going to the grocery store here and the specialty shops are great. I feel very a hight sense of personal safety and never worry about kidnapping or being personally injured. But...

We're going to move back to the U.S. for the same reasons that everyone else stated. There is a french mentality that I cannot get my mind around. It's a resistance to change in almost all aspects of life. There is a social strictness here that is hard to explain as well. If my children forget to say "bonjour" to one of the 50 people at a social gathering, it's a big deal and they will be labeled as "badly raised." Actually, I think we've already been labeled!

I don't even think that "discrimination" is a concept here, it's just an accepted part of life/work. Once someone gets a job, it's thier job for LIFE! There is no fluidity to the employment here. Everyone has thier job and that's how it is. If you don't go through the right channels to your schooling, it's difficult to find employment. If you don't go in as a manager, you will not become a manager (maybe some overgeneralization). It seems that here, there is only one way to do anything....the socially accepted, normal way. I've heard that it's a little better in Paris and that they're a little more open to change.

Customer service here is a joke. If you are lucky enough to find someone who will treat you well and care about thier job, it's only because they want to. They don't have to be nice or helpful because no employer wants to pay the fees that it takes to fire someone, so thier job is very secure....sometimes too secure. We have had so many customer service problems here it's not funny. We bought a new washing machine that broke the same day. It took the company over 2 months to fix it and they wouldn't replace it. It was NEW! Our dsl didn't work for 3 months and it cost us about 10 dollars for each call we made to them. We had to threaten to report them to some association in order for them to fix it. These things are just kind of accepted here.

We're going back to the states, but we'll homeschool. You don't realize it until you leave that in the U.S., you really can be anyone you want to be and you can reinvent yourself whenever you want. Here, you are who you are and you are who society says you are.

Ok, that's my rant. I really wish that we had rented a furnished apartment here for a few months before moving all of our stuff. Even though we're ready to leave, we'll miss it here....if that makes sense!LOL So, I can't say to do it or don't, but I can tell you that....the grass is always greener.
Lisa
Nathan 6
Chloe 4
Adrian 15 mo

[RomanGoddess]

Lisa49, I think you have described France to the letter. I could not have done it better myself. Seriously, people in the States hate Bush and want to move to Europe but what they don't realise that continental Europe is in some important ways very conservative, stuck in the mud and unwilling to change.

[Hollycrand]

Germany is worse than France...much more conservative and more 'stuck in the mud'.

[jaxinsmom]

I am excited about returning to North America, interested to see how cold a Canadian winter really will be (we're starting out in Montreal...then will go wherever the wind may take us).
IT will be VERY cold :lol

Out of curiosity (and off topic a bit) in which cities can you go topless? Wow...now THAT's a big cultural difference between Canada and its Southern neighbour. It goes to show that Canada has a more European attitude (or is it that Europeans have Canadian attitudes?)

As far as I know you can go topless while outdoors in Canada. Im not sure if that is for the whole country, but I know there was a court battle here (in ontario) a few years back, and women won the right to go topless. I haven't seen too many people do it though :o

[rayo de sol]

I'm so glad to see this thread! :innocent

I have been pondering moving to Canada for a while. I just don't know where to begin with the research I know I need to do. Are there any books out there on this?

Certain questions I have that maybe some Canadians or fellow US citizens in-the-know might be able to help me with:

If I give birth in Canada while visiting as a tourist, will my baby be considered a Canadian citizen? Will I be able to live in Canada if my baby is born there?

In the rural areas where Canada is needing more people to live and work (the northern areas, right?), are the people gay/lesbian friendly, and would they welcome a left-wing, non-vaxing, unschooling lesbian family into their community?

TIA to anyone who can offer me any insight! :)

[RomanGoddess]

If I give birth in Canada while visiting as a tourist, will my baby be considered a Canadian citizen? Will I be able to live in Canada if my baby is born there?


Your baby is a Canadian citizen by virtue of having been born in Canada. YOU, however, by no means have the right to live in Canada just because your baby is Canadian. The fact that you are the child's mother does not give you the right to residency there (otherwise everyone and her dog would be going to Canada to have a baby just to have the right to live there:wink ).

[rayo de sol]

Your baby is a Canadian citizen by virtue of having been born in Canada. YOU, however, by no means have the right to live in Canada just because your baby is Canadian. The fact that you are the child's mother does not give you the right to residency there (otherwise everyone and her dog would be going to Canada to have a baby just to have the right to live there:wink ).

Good point...hmmm. Well, so much for that idea. Thanks for letting me know. :o

[medeanj]

I would love to move to Canada, but I do not have a college degree, though I am a kick-butt admin asst (and they are a dime a dozen, right) and I am almost 40. My DH is an engineer and teacher, but is nearly 50. Just the fact that we might be too old breaks my heart.:(

I do not want my twins to be raised here in the US and quite literally I feel trapped and caged...:gloomy:

[CarrieMF]

In the rural areas where Canada is needing more people to live and work (the northern areas, right?),

BC & Alberta are both scrambling bad for employees. Basically if you can hold a hammer you can get a job. Housing is the hard part.

[***Heather***]

I would love to move to Canada, but I do not have a college degree, though I am a kick-butt admin asst (and they are a dime a dozen, right) and I am almost 40. My DH is an engineer and teacher, but is nearly 50. Just the fact that we might be too old breaks my heart.

I live in Quebec and there have been stories on the news lately about how we desperately need english speaking teachers (of any subject). I guess they're all getting old and retiring but there aren't any new ones coming in. The story I saw focussed more on Quebec City.

We also need doctors and nurses if anyone is interested...:lol

[Hollycrand]

Heather,

Do you have a link to this info? Dh and I are discussing whether we'd like to settle in Quebec City, and what you said about English speaking teachers interests me a lot. Of course, I had the impression that teachers in the Canadian school system needed to be Canadian citizens.

Immigration process in progress - waiting for the Canadian federal gov. to give us the thumbs up. Are the federal workers IN Canada as slow as their reps in the Embassies?

[the_lissa]

Heather,

Do you have a link to this info? Dh and I are discussing whether we'd like to settle in Quebec City, and what you said about English speaking teachers interests me a lot. Of course, I had the impression that teachers in the Canadian school system needed to be Canadian citizens.

Immigration process in progress - waiting for the Canadian federal gov. to give us the thumbs up. Are the federal workers IN Canada as slow as their reps in the Embassies?

No teachers do not need to be Canadian citizens. I had two teachers in high school who were American citizens.

[momuveight2B]

I am Canadian but have lived in the states since 1977 when I entered as a free spirited hippie. Staying in the US has been easy but I would love to return with my family to Canada. How is it done? Does anyone know? Would we have a mass of paperwork to accomplish? We are both professionals and score enough points on the immigration subtest.

My understanding is that as a Canadian citizen my children are automatic citizens but must claim it by living in Canada at some point before their 25th birthdays or something like that or it expires.

[Hollycrand]

medeanj,

Have you taken the Canadian immigration assessment quiz to see if you and your family might qualify?

http://www.cic.gc.ca/english/index.html

It's somewhere on this page - choose whichever immigration category you'd want to apply for. No one is ever trapped. Where there's a will there's a way. Have you thought about going to Ireland or the UK?

[Hollycrand]

momuveight2B,

If you are Canadian I think you can go back at anytime. If your dp or kids aren't Canadian then you'd need to go through the family immigration process.
More on that with this link:

http://www.cic.gc.ca/english/index.html

If any of your kids are under 14 I'd check with the Canadian Embassy in the US to see if you can register them as Canadian citizens (because I think they'd be automatic citizens as children of a Canadian citizen).

Good luck!

[RomanGoddess]

I am Canadian but have lived in the states since 1977 when I entered as a free spirited hippie. Staying in the US has been easy but I would love to return with my family to Canada. How is it done? Does anyone know? Would we have a mass of paperwork to accomplish? We are both professionals and score enough points on the immigration subtest.

My understanding is that as a Canadian citizen my children are automatic citizens but must claim it by living in Canada at some point before their 25th birthdays or something like that or it expires.

If you are a Canadian citizen then you can enter and leave Canada as you please. The only paperwork required would be to get your children's citizenship cards. You get the citizenship card by filling in the application form for each child and providing your birth certificate and passport and your children's birth certificates. And that is it. I have never heard of the 25-year rule. Your husband would have the right to live in Canada based on being married to a Canadian.

[~~Mama2B~~]

I live in Quebec and there have been stories on the news lately about how we desperately need english speaking teachers (of any subject). I guess they're all getting old and retiring but there aren't any new ones coming in. The story I saw focussed more on Quebec City.

We also need doctors and nurses if anyone is interested...:lol

What about medical assistants? My DH is almost done with his schooling for that and supposedly his certification is good in the US and Canada... :)

I have a college degree but want to be a stay at home mom. We might not qualify to move there. I was also considering having my baby there, since it's just a few hours away. Would that help at all or make no difference? Also I heard that if you know someone who lives there they can agree to "sponsor" you or something and that makes it easier to emigrate. DO you know anything about that, all-knowing Canadian? Lol! (I hope you like playing 20 questions!)

Kristi

[SwissMama]

My understanding is that as a Canadian citizen my children are automatic citizens

Not really 'automatic' as there is still a process and some forms to fill out. You should go to the embassy and get that taken care of just to make sure, in case it changes.

What about medical assistants? My DH is almost done with his schooling for that and supposedly his certification is good in the US and Canada

Yes! lots of jobs in the medical feild, from what I've heard.

Out of curiosity (and off topic a bit) in which cities can you go topless? Wow...now THAT's a big cultural difference between Canada and its Southern neighbour. It goes to show that Canada has a more European attitude (or is it that Europeans have Canadian attitudes?)

The canadian laws are a little confusing but here is the gist of it:

In 1996 the Province of Ontario, Canada's most populous provice, became legally topfree due to a criminal court challenge by Gwen Jacob. Because the highest court in Ontario was interpreting a Canadian federal law, this case has set an important precedent for all of the other provinces in Canada. Attempts to change the law to re-criminalize women have not been supported by Canadian voters.

So basically, in Ontario, its completely legal, anywhere. In the rest of the provinces, its up to individual county/city/town laws - but subject to the precedent set in Ontario if you happen to be prosecuted. However, there is a stipulation that in ALL of canada, you are allowed to be nude in 'isolated' areas (i.e some beaches, parks, campgrounds, etc).

Having camped in Canada all my life, I can say, people will barely make a sound if they see you nude. Even though I'm in Europe now, I still think Canada is very liberal when it comes to breasts and nudity in general - compared to the U.S. It really does depend where you are though. I wouldn't hesitate to take my top off in a park in Quebec, but would think twice about Alberta. :lol

[medeanj]

medeanj,

Have you taken the Canadian immigration assessment quiz to see if you and your family might qualify?

http://www.cic.gc.ca/english/index.html

It's somewhere on this page - choose whichever immigration category you'd want to apply for. No one is ever trapped. Where there's a will there's a way. Have you thought about going to Ireland or the UK?

Thanks for the link, Holly.

I took the test and scored 45, my DH just tweaked 67. He's 'in', I'm 'out'.

[kxsiven]

I know this is kind of old threat but I just have to stick my nose into it.:duck:

Actually this is kind of petpeeve of mine.

Europe=manymanymany countries. Each of them have an unique history,culture,people,good&bad things.

Iceland and Malta are quite far away from each other. Sweden and Albania has very little common, Ireland and Poland...yep both are Catholic but that's it, otherwise very different countries.

So it is impossible to say anything about Europe in general through 1 european country.

Here is an excellent link for those who are actually moving from one country to another. No matter where you move, culture shock will catch you! It really helped my DW.

http://www.cie.uci.edu/world/shock.html

and if someone is interested in Scandinavia, I can happily provide info!

Good moving to everyone.

[Hollycrand]

medeanj,

If your hubby is 'in', then you can probably immigrate with him as the 'principal applicant'.
If it's not too personal to ask, why are you 'out'?

[MountainLaurel]

What is it about Canada or Europe that attracts you? Many Americans tell me that they prefer the political climate in Canada but then when they get there and find out what it's really like (very communitarian, group rights-oriented, much less libertarian), they realise that it is not quite right for them, no matter how much of a "liberal" they feel they are in the States.

That's exactly why it attracts me: That's its very community oriented, as opposed to every person being out for themselves. :duck:

[RomanGoddess]

Quote:
Originally Posted by momuveight2B
My understanding is that as a Canadian citizen my children are automatic citizens

Not really 'automatic' as there is still a process and some forms to fill out. You should go to the embassy and get that taken care of just to make sure, in case it changes.

Yes, automatic. Your children ARE Canadian from birth by virtue or their mother being Canadian. The forms to fill out are merely to obtain the citizenship card and the citizenship card is merely evidence of being Canadian. Is is not what makes you Canadian.

[JennyBC]

In the rural areas where Canada is needing more people to live and work (the northern areas, right?), are the people gay/lesbian friendly, and would they welcome a left-wing, non-vaxing, unschooling lesbian family into their community?

TIA to anyone who can offer me any insight! :)

I'm not sure you're still following this thread, but I thought I'd respond. I live in British Columbia. Here, there are a variety of types of small towns. Some are red-neck towns that you might not feel welcome in. There are however many, many "crunchy" towns and islands here. Check out Nelson, BC http://www.nelsonbc.ca/ in an area called the "Kootenays" which has lots of nice small towns, and the Southern Gulf Islands http://wikitravel.org/en/Southern_Gulf_Islands Neither of these areas are in the north. I'm not too familiar with northern BC, but I know that many of the "red neck" areas are up there. I can't generalize for them all though, since I haven't lived up there. Good luck!

[CCChanel]

Being someone who's always wondering if the grass is greener...I'm subbing.

:yeah:

[AmyMN]

subscribing...

[kxsiven]

I just read an article about work situation here this morning. Scandinavia needs workers - desperately soon.

Ofcourse the language thing is problem - it is easier to move to Canada.

Just thought I drop this info in.

[Hollycrand]

Do you have a link?
Traditional Scandinavia is Norway, Denmark and Sweden. Are all three looking for people?

[kxsiven]

Really? I guess when you are here and talk about Scandinavia, it means also Finland&Iceland and ofcourse Faroe Islands, Greenland, and Åland. Thanks, I have to remember this and use the words 'Nordic countries' in the future so there won't be mix up.

Unfortenately I have only read newspapers so I don't have any direct links, at least not in english. But I know for sure that at least Denmark,Finland and Sweden are soon in desperate situation. Norway and Iceland are not part European Union so I am not so sure about their situation.

[AmyMN]

I know someone from Sweden (and she can post in here as soon as she gets internet hooked up again) who says Sweden has an incredibly high percentage of unemployment! .

[kxsiven]

Bur there are no educated people to do the work when baby boomers are retiring. And that is happening in next couple of years. Allready in some areas companies do not find educated workers. It is a paradox. There is unemployment but at the same time there is not enough workers. Unemployment is structural, lot of these people are not educated and been unemployed for years and years.
But
I just read that there are companies in Denmark who are losing up to 40% of their workers in near future because of retirement and many of them are looking workers abroad.
Here in Finland there is huge shortage of for example nurses, doctors, truck drivers, metal workers - just to mention few. I'd be highly surprised if Sweden would not have the same 'retirement-bomb' - waiting. And according to news articles here, it is.

Ofcourse if you are coming from EU country it is much easier to get work from another EU country.

If you are coming outside EU, getting in is much harder. Work permits etc.

[RomanGoddess]

I know someone from Sweden (and she can post in here as soon as she gets internet hooked up again) who says Sweden has an incredibly high percentage of unemployment! .

I don't think so. I think it's at about 5%, which is very low and basically means that you have full employment (the 5% who are unemployed being structural unemployment).

[prettymom]

Please don't leave. If all the politically educated and breast feeding women leave the states, who will be left to educate the rest? Ignorant people need your help. Don't jump ship yet... work for change.

[RomanGoddess]

I wonder if the OP is still following this thread....:lol

[EdnaMarie]

Just saw this thread. My DH has a US green card and he is trying to get citizenship, but does anyone know whether we could just go to Canada instead? He likes Germany, I don't particularly like it, I like southern France, he hates France, neither of us like the US much but it's easier to have a US passport than a passport from the middle of nowhere, corruptionland. Seeing this thread has made me want to go to Vancouver again. Has anyone done that, immigrated to a third country with a spouse who had a US green card?

Oh, and regarding unemployment in Scandanavia: (1) It's partly the way they count it, and (2) the benefits make it so that for people like single moms can stay unemployed to be with their kids, and these are also counted as unemployed, whereas in the US, that would just not happen, because you'd be hungry. It doesn't mean that there aren't any jobs there.

[Hollycrand]

izobelle,

Where is your dh from? My dh has a green card, we are currently living in Germany but immigrating to Canada (it's a LONG process...).
It doesn't really matter about the green card for immigrating to another country. A Green Card is only valid in the US - the Canadian authorities could care less.

[EdnaMarie]

Holly, he's from [edited for anonymity].

[amydidit]

I think I'll be following this as well. DH and I have been thinking for years about leaving the US and each day just makes us want it more and more. We're currently thinking about either the UK or Canada, but we're open to other options as well. Only problem is I don't think we qualify to move anywhere. We've taken the Canadian entrance points test thing and both failed. BUT the company he used to work for, and likely will again in the future, has hotels in both the UK and Canada, as well as many other places. We're wondering if they transfered him somewhere else if that would be enough to get us in? Neither of us have a college degree. He works in hotel management, I usually work in customer service or as an office assistant. We have two kids, and not really any savings (right now). We don't speak any foreign languages and don't really have *skills*. I'm pretty sure we're SOL, but I'm not going to give up researching it.

[Hollycrand]

izobelle,

When I have been to the US Consulate here in Germany I have spoken to quite a few non-Germans who are applying for a Green Card from Germany, even though they are from places like Russia, Albania, Ukraine, and some of the -stan countries (Turkistan, etc.).
We are in the process of immigrating to Canada, but also applied at the same time for my dh (French/German) to get a Green Card (why not?). The Canadian and US Immigration Bureaus don't talk to each other, and as long as you pay all the fees and do everything 'by the book' I don't think it really matters. I know that in life people sometimes change their minds, or have job opportunities elsewhere. So I don't think that any immigration office would have the attitude of 'Can't they make up their mind'? At least not in my experience with the US and Canadian Immigration offices. We'll probably continue with dh's Green Card application when we're in Canada, so that we'll have a Green Card...because you never know where the wind will blow ya...
But we're not too keen on living in the US now, so the US Green Card thing is sort of for 'emergencies'.

With the Canadian Permanent Residence Permit, you can come and go across the border into the US as a Canadian citizen would. So 3 months tourism is allowed.

[Hollycrand]

amydidit,

Applying for the Skilled Worker Permanent Residence Visa for Canada is but one route into the country.
I read somewhere a couple of weeks ago (in German) that in upper BC many hotels cannot open in the summer/winter season because there is an acute shortage of qualified people to work in hotels, etc. Perhaps if you and dh look for a job in a hotel up there (or any other place in the country) you could get a job offer and come to Canada as an immigrant with an offer of employment.
It might mean living somewhere that is not your dream destination, but after 5 years you'll be able to qualify as a permanent resident and then have the choice to go any where you want to go.
That's what I would do if I were in your situation.
You could try to go the same route for the UK, but immigration there is much harder and hotels aren't necessarily looking for Americans to fill the jobs...they prefer cheaper Europeans who don#t need to go through the hassle of a work permit and all.
If you have any questions I'd be happy to answer them!

[EdnaMarie]

Holly, thank you for that! That's very, very interesting. Good luck with your immigration process!

[<~*MamaRose*~>]

Hello All! I've been following this thread and just wanted to throw out there that I'm in Ottawa, Ontario Canada and love it here so I thought I'd post our sites...http://www.gov.on.ca/ and for Ottawa specifically...http://www.ottawa.ca/.
Cheers!

[SwissMama]

Yes, automatic. Your children ARE Canadian from birth by virtue or their mother being Canadian. The forms to fill out are merely to obtain the citizenship card and the citizenship card is merely evidence of being Canadian. Is is not what makes you Canadian.

I guess its semantics then. Although i am Canadian, my kids are NOT recognized as Canadians at the border until we fill out those forms. They are Swiss. You need to apply for citizenship. Yes, it will be granted, but its not automatic and there are rare circumstances where it wouldn't be granted. Spirit doesn't count to the immigration officials, as we find out every time we fly in.

[RomanGoddess]

I guess its semantics then. Although i am Canadian, my kids are NOT recognized as Canadians at the border until we fill out those forms. They are Swiss. You need to apply for citizenship. Yes, it will be granted, but its not automatic and there are rare circumstances where it wouldn't be granted. Spirit doesn't count to the immigration officials, as we find out every time we fly in.

Your children are Canadian and if you can prove at the border that they are your children (for example, showing a long-form birth certificate identifying you as their mother, plus other photo identification confirming their identity (such as their Swiss passports)), the border patrols MUST allow your children entry and they know this. The Canadian constitution guarantees free movement of all Canadians in and out of the country. If you show proof of Canadian citizenship, you must be granted entry, even if you do not have the passport or the citizenship card on you.

[Hollycrand]

Thanks for the links on Ottowa!

We're supposed to be moving to Montreal in early 2008 but are thinking about Quebec City or the Ottowa area (living in Quebec - working in Ottowa). I also see there are lots of MDC mamas in Ottowa.....hmmmm....

[Inanna_Mama]

Thought I'd join in to keep this excellent thread alive. I'm especially hoping the OP is checking in as I have some Australia experience...

DH is an Aussie and I've made several trips over the past 12 years. Most recently, spent 6 months traveling the entire country in a van :hippie.

DH immigrated to the US because of many of the issues people have mentioned about Europe. At the time (12 years ago), Australia frowned upon people with an entrepreneurial spirit. There remained quite a bit of classism from the UK settler days and the "tall poppy syndrome" was rife in public schools (anyone who excelled were cut down by their peers for being too tall).

Now, some of that is changing. Australians seem to want a bit more of what America has (material wealth). So, I've seen attitudes shift slightly from the "no worries" days of old to working long hours to be able to afford stuff. Of course, perhaps it's just everyone we know is getting older and more responsible :lol

At least once each visit back there, I run into sexism that makes me want to vomit. Of course, it's alive and well here in the US, too. But, it always surprises me there because Australians (please pardon the upcoming over generalization) tend to have a beautiful "live and let live" attitude that doesn't mesh well with their sexism (or racism that was mentioned by another poster).

Sadly, their current political state is not much more impressive than here in the US. :duck: I'll leave it at that.

We are contemplating a move back there so our son can be nearer his Nana for a while and so DH can attend grad school, but it won't be permanent for many of the reasons I mention, as well as those mentioned by other posters. B.C. is another matter entirely (we lived just across the border for a number of years and love it there!)

[flapjack]

I think if you move to the UK, you are going to spend your life constantly fighting racism in your children and the people who are around your children. The media is full of racist comments that pass unhindered. The "illegal immigrant" myth. At the same time, the elements that you dislike most about US culture are becoming an issue for us, here- for instance, recently artificial baby milk adverts have been shown on primetime television :( The best thing you can do for this PLANET is to help sort the USA out.