any interest for a quiverfull tribe?

[IfMamaAintHappy]

Hey mamas! Just wondering if there is any interest over here in the Tribal areas for a quiverfull moms thread?

Quiverfull refers to an eschewing of birth control and allowing God to plan your family size, referencing this verse from the Bible:

Psalm 127
1 Except the LORD build the house, they labour in vain that build it: except the LORD keep the city, the watchman waketh but in vain.
2 It is vain for you to rise up early, to sit up late, to eat the bread of sorrows: for so he giveth his beloved sleep.
3 Lo, children are an heritage of the LORD: and the fruit of the womb is his reward.
4 As arrows are in the hand of a mighty man; so are children of the youth.
5 Happy is the man that hath his quiver full of them: they shall not be ashamed, but they shall speak with the enemies in the gate.


Just wonderin!

Thanks! :)

[t-elaine]

I'd LOVE it! We need the support and encouragement of others who believe the same, especially since most of society is against it. Hope we find others here!
Tina

[FroNuff]

Just curious..... Is this the same as NFP?

[IfMamaAintHappy]

well, sorta. Quiverfull in its purest/most strict form tends to mean not using birth control or any kind( barrier, NFP, FAM), as well as not using any chemical birth control. Or trying to conceive. Welcoming any and all pregnancies as blessings from God. However, some women who are of that quiverfull mindset, when they feel it is necessary, do use NFP/FAM to prevent conception. Dire financial situations, spouse or child seriously ill, etc.

For anyone curious about what Quiverfull means, here is an excerpt from an article on http://www.quiverfull.com called "When your quiver overflows" by Stacy McDonald. This is generally the attitude of most families who consider themselves quiverfull. There is a thread in the Spirituality forum here about quiverfull if you'd like some more dialogue about it after reading this. :)

from "When Your Quiver Is Overflowing":

As I studied Scripture in relation to the form of "birth control" we were using, this is what I found:

Genesis 38:9-10
And Onan knew that the seed should not be his; and it came to pass, when he
went in unto his brother's wife, that he spilled it on the ground, lest that
he should give seed to his brother. And the thing which he did displeased the LORD: wherefore he slew him also.

Now, it is true that part of what was displeasing to God, in this instance, was the fact that he was deliberately trying to avoid carrying out his duty to his dead brother in carrying on his family line. (called a Levirate Marriage - Deuteronomy 25:5) But he was also enjoying physical sexual intimacy while trying to manipulate the function of intercourse. The
bottom line is that he "spilled his seed" to avoid having children. Whatever his motive in doing this thing was, he was trying to manipulate God. He was pretending to obey God (by marrying his brother's widow) while at the same time rejecting the whole purpose of the Levirate Marriage....which was to give his dead brother a child to carry on his name.

I believe this also applies to the Rhythm Method in the sense that this method’s purpose is still to AVOID children, which God says are a blessing. No matter what "form" of birth control we use, it is still what it is called....birth CONTROL! We are trying to control conception instead of trusting God to control it. Make sense?

Whether we use a medical form of birth control, or Early Withdrawal, or use a calendar to try to avoid conception....it's all the same. It says to God, "I want to be in control of this because I don't trust You to make a wise decision in this area.....so here's a little help!"

Sometimes it is so hard to trust God completely, especially when we've been raised around Christians who think God needs help. I was one of them! It's one of those "everybody else is doing it" concepts. But God wants us to look at Scripture, NOT what everybody else is doing or what everybody else thinks is acceptable to God.

Sometimes I think about Susanna Wesley....they were in an incredible amount of debt, she had a very unhelpful husband and she was ill much of her life. I wonder, if she would have had the option to use birth control, would John and Charles Wesley have ever been born? (They were some of her younger children). I tend to think that she would have been quiver minded, but we'll never know, because thankfully, she did not have the option or the same social pressure that so many ladies have today. Suzanna herself, was the 24th of 24 children! Who would have blamed her mother if she had said, "surely God knows we have enough children, one little simple surgery can cure this!"

What is interesting is that since we made this decision, it has actually changed our relationship with our children. We have had to repent of seeing our children as burdens. We now truly see them as blessings from the hand of God. We never would have actually admitted that we thought this way, but now that we see the change, we realize that is what we were doing. I was really afraid that I would have 20 kids! My husband started to point out how there was no birth control in Biblical times and women did not ALL have 30 children. Some only had one or two children and some begged God for even one little blessing! God truly is the One who opens and closes the womb. I also realized that if God gave me more children I should trust Him enough to know that He would also provide the strength to handle it. For me to say,"Lord I love you, Lord I trust you with everything, Lord take my life, take all of me," but then not trust Him with my womb, then I was a liar if I said that I trusted the Lord. The excuses that I gave for not wanting more children were all selfish and unBiblical.

______________-

[Faith]

:wave

I'm QF!

That was a great exlaination, ging-ging!

I think it says in the LLL book 'Breastfeeding and Natural Child Spacing' that the average woman will have 7.3 children naturally. (I loaned out all my good books so I can't check for sure.)

There is only one woman I know who truely is QF, and she thinks she may not be having anymore and only was given three kids. But they are great kids!

Glad to see this tribe!:love and thanks to ging-ging for explaining it for everyone!

[barbara]

Greetings to all you wonderful mamas! :love

We were quiver full before we knew there was a name for it. :wink Dh and I are thinking that perhaps our quiver is full now with 7 children and 2 grandchildren. Although I'm sure the grandchildren will keep coming, I believe that MY childbearing years have ended. Our youngest is 6 years old and I have had 2 miscarriages since she was born. We would love another child but are happy and content with the 7 wonderful children God has gien us.

[mcimom]

i am working on my quiverfull, but am only at 3 thus far :love

dh on the otherhand keeps saying "how could this happen?" so he is quiverfull in that there is no method, however, he is definitely to the burden side as i am to the blessing side.

how wonderful to find you ladies! :D

[bouyant]

Yessssssss! I just found out yesterday on here what quiverfull meant, and its exactly what I've been looking for. I have 3 children and the oldest is 3. Bf doesn't seem to matter to me. Was soley bf a 20+ lb 6 mo old (I was his sole source of nurishment) when got preg w/dd. Was in college then, husband hasn't had real job since we graduated and I am commited to being a sahm no matter what. Bf dd when got preg w new baby. Even ppl who think a lot of kids is the way to go think we're stupid to have 3 kids so close w/ no money. Even at church sometimes there are people who look at me struggling w/3 kids (dh doesn't go) and seem to me to be snooty and thinking "if you can't control them, why did you have them" You'd think I'd get more support at church, I am LDS. On the possitive side, when I was preg with new baby, I was really sick and not a very good mom, but whenever I prayed abt it, I would get this overwhelming feeling of love from God that he was so glad that I was willing to have this baby, and that I was doing the right thing.

[barbara]

greetings bouyant :w
I'm sorry that the people at your church are less than supportive, but that seems to be the way it goes. Our society simply doesn't respect certian choices. :( I'm glad that you are enjoying your children. We can never take fertility for granted, because you never know if it will continue.

:love
~b

[IfMamaAintHappy]

welcome, bouyant! Glad to know another quiverfull mama :)

[sonya_mamafor4]

I want to be quiverfull but dh is against it.:( So for now I'm using natural birth control methods.Which since I get preg.very easily who knows.Dh just thinks money and says no more!He said that two children ago,but the twins were a total suprising blessing.At least in my mind.
sonya

[be_simple00]

I just found this thread:0) I've actually just come to understand what QF means. I belong to a Christian AP group and I also started receiving Above Rubies magazine. Suddently this term/idea has been popping up everywhere - maybe God is trying to tell me something:0)

Letting go and trusting God can be hard sometimes. I'm still struggling. I haven't even really talked with my husband about this - I wanted to do some research first:0)

It's nice to see this thread!! Take care,
Rachel

[quiverfulmom]

Hey quiverful moms! Another quiverful mom here. I'm currently pregnant with our 4th, but I'm praying God will bless us with many, many more in the future.

Rachel, isn't Above Rubies wonderful! We just recently hosted a retreat here and it was so refreshing.

Anyway, I hope to see some more action on this thread!

[IfMamaAintHappy]

hello!!

[t-elaine]

Hi, to all of you more recent posters!
It's great to find other mommas who feel this way...
I want to be quiverfull but dh is against it.
I have some other friends in this predicament...PRAY! PRAY! PRAY!...prayer can do WONDERFUL things!
One thing you could lovingly mention to your dh are the verses in which God tells us not to worry...
Matthew 6:25-34
25 "Therefore I say to you, do not worry about your life, what you will eat or what you will drink; nor about your body, what you will put on. Is not life more than food and the body more than clothing? 26 Look at the birds of the air, for they neither sow nor reap nor gather into barns; yet your heavenly Father feeds them. Are you not of more value than they? 27 Which of you by worrying can add one cubit to his stature? 28 So why do you worry about clothing? Consider the lilies of the field, how they grow: they neither toil nor spin; 29 and yet I say to you that even Solomon in all his glory was not arrayed like one of these. 30 Now if God so clothes the grass of the field, which today is, and tomorrow is thrown into the oven, will He not much more clothe you, O you of little faith? 31 Therefore do not worry, saying, 'What shall we eat?' or 'What shall we drink?' or 'What shall we wear?' 32 For after all these things the Gentiles seek. For your heavenly Father knows that you need all these things. 33 But seek first the kingdom of God and His righteousness, and all these things shall be added to you. 34 Therefore do not worry about tomorrow, for tomorrow will worry about its own things. Sufficient for the day is its own trouble.
This is told also in Luke:
Luke 12:22-40
22 Then He said to His disciples, "Therefore I say to you, do not worry about your life, what you will eat; nor about the body, what you will put on. 23 Life is more than food, and the body is more than clothing. 24 Consider the ravens, for they neither sow nor reap, which have neither storehouse nor barn; and God feeds them. Of how much more value are you than the birds? 25 And which of you by worrying can add one cubit to his stature? 26 If you then are not able to do the least, why are you anxious for the rest? 27 Consider the lilies, how they grow: they neither toil nor spin; and yet I say to you, even Solomon in all his glory was not arrayed like one of these. 28 If then God so clothes the grass, which today is in the field and tomorrow is thrown into the oven, how much more will He clothe you, O you of little faith? 29 And do not seek what you should eat or what you should drink, nor have an anxious mind. 30 For all these things the nations of the world seek after, and your Father knows that you need these things. 31 But seek the kingdom of God, and all these things shall be added to you. 32 Do not fear, little flock, for it is your Father's good pleasure to give you the kingdom.
Also Proverbs 3:5-6:
Trust in the Lord with all your heart and lean not on your own understanding. In all your ways acknowledge Him and He shall guide your paths"
Maybe if he is allowed to meditate on these scriptures at his own pace, combined with your prayers, he might change his mind.
Hope that helps :)

Rachel, isn't Above Rubies wonderful! We just recently hosted a retreat here and it was so refreshing.
We will be attending the AR Family Camp in Wisconsin at thje end of March....We went last year for just Saturday and it was AMAZING and so uplifting....We are all looking forward to it. If any of you are near this area hope to see you there! :thumb

Tina :wave

[quiverfulmom]

Originally posted by t-elaine

We will be attending the AR Family Camp in Wisconsin at thje end of March....We went last year for just Saturday and it was AMAZING and so uplifting....We are all looking forward to it. If any of you are near this area hope to see you there! :thumb

Tina :wave

Oh, I'm jealous! We were gooing to go to the one in TN in the end of March, but it was cancelled.

I would recommend to anyone within driving distance of an AR retreat/family camp to go, go, go!!! We have driven 13 hours to one and 10 hours to another and they were sooooo totally worth it.

[t-elaine]

We have driven 13 hours to one and 10 hours to another and they were sooooo totally worth it.
So how long would it take to drive to southern WI?:D

[quiverfulmom]

Lol, I don't know, but I think more than 13 hours. I'll have to find out :)

[quiverfulmom]

Well, I was wrong-- it would only take us a little under 12 hours! Unfortunately it's the same weekend of the Family Life Marriage Conference that we just signed up for yesterday. It will be our first time ever going away overnight alone since we've been married (6 years)!

[t-elaine]

Well, you have a great time!:thumb
Let me know if you are ever going to another AR retreat...it would be great to go to one somewhere else sometime. I LOVE listening to Nancy!
Tina :love

[quiverfulmom]

Well, we're actually planning another one here in MD in November. You could always come out here!

[t-elaine]

WOW! that would be great! I've never been to MD...What part is it in, so I can check out the distance from here. I'll mention it to dh...would it be cold there around that time of year?
tina :)

[quiverfulmom]

It's in Hagerstown, I think it's considered western MD. It's just starting to get cold that time of year. We had the last one Nov. 7-9 and that was the first cold weekend we had (figures:) It isn't too terribly cold at that point though.

The retreat center is absolutely beautiful-- here's their website so you can see for yourself: www.mtaetnacamp.com

[t-elaine]

It looks like it would be about 11 1/2 - 12 hours drive....I'm up for it! :thumb
Now to work on my dh...:love
We could turn it into a longer vacation. Please keep me posted on the specifics when it gets closer!
Thanks!
Tina

[quiverfulmom]

I'll put you down on my list of people to contact when we start to plan a little more.

The funny thing is we hadn't even heard back from Nancy to know if those dates were good for her or not. Today when I went to see where the retreat in WI was I saw we were on the list, lol!

[cappuccinosmom]

Hey there! We are qf, though so far with only one "arrow" (Asrat, 9 months old). Dh came to the belief through searching Scripture--his father was one of the few native preachers in his home country to speak out against the birth control being pushed by Westerners (missionaries! :angry ). Dh wanted to find out who was right, and came out on dad's side. He is one of 10 children, 9 by birth and one adopted. They still live in "traditional" housing and are very poor, but still very much believing in the blessing of having children. Actually, that is the one consistent blessing in thier lives, as they are lacking in most material blessings. For me, I just never considered anything other, and when I was old enough to think about marriage, I started researching and came up with the backing for my lifelong inner convictions. We are quite poor as well by Western standards but our lives would be lacking such light and joy if we'd decided we didn't want children at this point.

Fortunately we have the support of our parents and our pastor--the pastor and his wife are "belatedly quiverfull", and very excited about thier first reversal baby, 16 years after their youngest! The rest of the church finds it odd, but that's ok.

[barbara]

It's good to see some activity on this thread again. Blessings to you all!
I so want to encourage all of you young mothers.
As I've said before, we have 7 children and it looks as though that is going to be a quiverfull for us. Our youngest is 7 and there have been 2 miscarriages since, and then nothing. Trusting the Lord with all aspects of our lives has been a real adventure, and I wouldn't have lived life any other way. I've never regretted having our children, even when it was difficult and there seemed not to be enough money to go around. Now our oldest children are begining to have children of their own. These grandchildren are such an added blessing to us!

Trust the Lord and never look back!

[t-elaine]

Thanks, Quiverfulmom!

Hello to you, cappuccinosmom!

Barbara, (and any other "older" mommas here) I just want to thankyou for posting here and being an encouragement to us who are just starting on our quiver. I wish more women would do as you do. Please know that when I say "older" I mean it in regards to Titus 2. Thankyou so much! :love

Oh, yeah...about finances...I just recently found out that our family would still be considered a low income family! I was actually shocked because I do not feel that we are at all. In the past we have lived pay check to pay check and never had much to show for it. Now, we put our trust in God instead of that pay check and, although there are occaisional struggles, we always come out ahead and I feel that we live a very comfortable life. We have all we need and a few extras too! God is so good! I trust that no matter how many children we someday have, he will still provide all of our needs. It make living life feel so much more free to feel that way. It takes off a lot of the load! Ok...I'll quit rambling. It just feels good to have others with a similar mind to talk to!
Thanks all for being here! :grouphug
Tina :D

[IfMamaAintHappy]

bumping for interested parties

[barbara]

Thanks ging ging for bumping this thread. I know it can be challenging raising a large family in a society that is not always encouraging and supportive of motherhood. The rewards of a large family sometimes take time to see, but are so worth the effort we put into our families day in and day out.

[Ms.Doula]

just have a sec to say hello! :wave
We are trying to live according to scripture & be quiverfull. We have beeb married almost 7 years & have 2 beautiful daughters here (Kayleigh 35 mos. & Riley 18 mos) , and another one -our oldest (Emily) in Heaven.

How encouraging to find you all here!! :grouphug

And barbara THANKS! All the 'older' mothers, thanks for being Titus 2 moms... we need MORE of you!! .... :love

[qfmama]

Oh wow, another QF tribe! DH says I spend too much time on the net as it is! I am really conviceted about QF, and hubby is getting there.

So about this retreat in southern Wisconsin???? Can anyone give me more info? I live in Chicago, so it wouldn't be too far for me! I'd probably have to just go on a Saturday or something, though.

[t-elaine]

:wave HI, QFMAMA!!!
We're not that far from each other...We are about 200mi south west of Chicago in Rock Falls, IL.
About the retreat...I'm still awaiting my info packet in the mail...but I can get you the number of the family hosting it...i will PM you! It would be so great to meet a fellow MDCer there!
God Bless!
Tina :love

[IfMamaAintHappy]

Im originally from Quincy IL, about 5 hrs from CHicago. I guess I ought to look into this retreat too, maybe stay with my folks a while and go to the retreat...
Hmm....

[Ms.Doula]

check out the aboverubies website for retreat/seminar info. :love
http://www.aboverubies.org/frameset.asp?w=1024

[barbara]

I thought maybe we could get a discussion going here again. Maybe we could talk about the joys and struggles of a large family. I know for us it has always been a financial struggle, and it hasn't gotten any easier as they have grown up. Babies really don't cost much and don't need much except to be with mom and and be loved. Teens, on the other hand, can be a bit more expensive. :wink

In reality, I think it has helped my children to grow up in a home where they couldn't always have everything they wanted and they had to live with hand-me-downs and sharing toys and bedrooms, etc. It develops character and a sense of responsibility.

Another advantage of a large family is there is always someone to play with or hang out with. It can be challenging to find some quiet, but there is always something going on if you are looking for something to do. There is always someone to talk to and someone who will stick up for you outside of the family, even if they pick on you within the family. IYKWIM

[qfmama]

While I know that QF doesn't always mean a large family - it can even mean none if God so wills, but personally I'm hoping for a medium to large family (hubby's not so sure yet;). I've always been intrigued by big families. Hubby is #3 of 6 and I love listening to his mom tell stories of their everyday life like how they got chores done, how they took vacations, etc. Her children are NOT perfect by any stretch, but they are all caring, considerate people who LOVE eachother and their mom!

My SIL is the only girl of those 6, and she complains about how she was treated as a child, but she also loved having all those brothers to stick up for her. And she usually had her own room and never had to fight over clothes and dolls.

I'm hoping to conceive my #2 anytime, and can't wait to see how many (or few) arrows God has planned for my quiver!

Laura :wave

[Faith]

Just thought I would stop in and say :wave .

I would love to see this tribe keep growing.

We have a DS and a DD and are expecting #3 in the fall (probably September). It is a bit of a test of faith right now- allthough I am *very* happy and excited about having a new baby. We could definitely use a bigger home, and something bigger to drive than a car, but are not exactly rolling in money right now. I am not completely at peace with my MW this time either... She is Christian and nice and all that... just seems a little more medicalized than what I am used to.
Anyway, it will be great to have a baby again. I have picked out slings and some wooden baby toys and can't wait.

I had a huge problem with p-a-i-n in my last HB and have been reading Christian books this time that say birth should be painfree- so I will let you know it they help! The basic point they make is that all the references to pain in the Bible are mistranslations due to culture, and that God never intended it to be a painful time, just hard work.

My big decision about the birth right now it weather to have the baby here (my home) or in the MWs home- because she has a hot tub just for births!:love I want to go there, but DH thinks it's weird to have a HB at another home. (But what does he know about having a baby?:p )

[Ms.Doula]

hi there Faith!! :w

my initial reaction to your post was like: PAINFREE!!???? :eek YEAH OK WHATEVER! LIARS!"

But upon thinking of this farther I have to say I agree. I think (for me anyway) that TOTALLY NATURAL childbirth (medically & environmentally) is not actually "Painfull" I had only ONE moment that I would say I felt TRUE Pain.... crowning=burning & pressure. But I just pictured Jesus on the cross..... and I endured! :love

[barbara]

Faith, I understand about the test of faith. It is not always an easy walk, and like you, we never seemed to have an abundance of $$ when the babies were coming. It is easy, now in hind sight, to see how God's hand was on each of those times and blessed us for our obedience, even in the midst of the grumbling! It seemed like each time we discovered a baby was coming we would also get bombarded with financial issues, relationship issues, etc. I can't remember the exact verses off hand but it does seem that the enemy comes againest birth in very tangible ways.

On the other hand God is always faithful! We would find ourselves showered with baby clothes and clothes for our children, not just overused hand-me-downs, but nice, quality clothes. For years we rarely had to buy any clothes for our children, they always seemed to be supplied if we were patient and waited upon the Lord to work in His way. I also remember many times when there was no food to put on the table and someone would be moved to bring us groceries. My children will never forget the Christmas when our car broke down and we had to use all the money we had on repair. Just days before Christmas a man we had never seen before, nor have we seen since, came to our door with an envelop, said Merry Christmas and left. The envelop held the exact amount that we had spent on the car repairs! The kids were sure it was an angel! :fairy ( hope I'm not getting too woo-woo for anyone...I really just want to encourage!)

I'll pray for your midwife situation. I know those wonderful midwives, (that everyone else seems to adore) are just a little too medical for my taste They make me a little nervous. I'm kind of a 'birth it myself' mama and prefer a midwife that will trust in the process and just kind of be there if I need her. Hard to find I guess, I know I'm blessed to have her. :wink Have any of you read Born in Zion? I know it is controversial, but when balanced with other medical homebirth books, I think there is a lot to gleen.

[Faith]

Any chance you live in WA, Barbara, and wouldn't mind sharing your awesome midwife with me?:D

I want one who will leave me alone, just be there like a lifeguard, in case I need her. My old MWs were like that. They were just wonderful! But I moved and live very far away from them now.
Everytime I hear about something now, like a MW pulling a baby out, I feel like I need to ask this new MW if she does that, just to make sure. It is making me nervous about everything about the birth. I even mentioned to my DH that now I understand why some people have UC, and he was a little freaked out and voluntered to babysit the MW for me, so I could concentrate on the birth. Not an ideal situation, but I keep telling myself I am making it worse than it is, that she is still a MW... I just don't know. My first birth was in the hospitial and I regret everything about it, and I can't take another bad birth.

Yes, I have read Born in Zion! I actually had to stop reading it, because I was getting all excited about it, and my DH thought it was craziness. I didn't want to get all interested in it, when I knew he hated the idea so much! Since then, I have read some really scary things about it on the interent... but (if it's really like the book says) I think it's great that some people have so much faith. I know if it came down to it though, I could never NOT take my child to the doctor if they really needed it. I can't even not give them medicine when they are sick.
My awesome MW I just talked about has maybe six daughters and she has not taken any of them to the doctor in around twenty years! She does everything naturally. I think that is so wonderful, but I just an not at that point yet.

That is great how you were blessed with all those answered prayers! I totally don't think it's 'woo-woo' at all! :D I know, I have a really awesome answered prayer story, and when I tell certain people, I get THE look.

We are at a very strange spot for being 'poor' during this pregnancy. We have not much cash at all, but we just got new very nice furnature for free, and a gift cert to a really nice resturaunt for the whole family... DH and I joke we are the most spoiled poor people we know. :p


Ms. Doula, my last birth was complete pain the whole time!! Excruciating- the whole three hours it lasted! I could have just died! I mean it, I did not know pain like that existed.
It made me feel bad, because all my friends had HBs, even one with a breech baby, and never felt much pain at all.

But, I was not a Christian yet when DD was born, so hopefully that makes all the difference this time!

The books are Natural Childbirth and the Christian Family by Helen Wessel, and Supernatural Childbirth by Jackie Mize- incase anyone is interested. :)

[IfMamaAintHappy]

quiverfull mindset an adoption question:

If you were to adopt, do you see doing paperwork and homestudy to adopt as TTC? As doing something to affect and impact the number of children God sends to you?

Do you think one cannot be QF and adopt?

Would you use NFP during an adoption process, as most agencies will stall the adoption until mom has given birth and baby is X months old to ensure a quality time period for the new adopted child being the "special" new member of the family?

Do you think that starting an adoption with the mindset that if you conceive and have to stop, you are doing a disservice to the child?

Soemone challenged my definiton of qf and I thought id send my questions here to those who use the definition for themselves.

discipline:

Also, do you find that most quiverfullers you know are AP types or middle of the road types... or do you find that most are the Pearl discipline types and you are the exception?

[barbara]

Originally posted by ging-ging
Also, do you find that most quiverfullers you know are AP types or middle of the road types... or do you find that most are the Pearl discipline types and you are the exception? All the qf people I know in real life are the Pearl discipline types! :(

About adoption....I'd say that one has to listen to what God is telling them. Perhaps they are not concieving because God is leading them in that direction. Why else is it so very common for a woman to concieve just after adopting or begining the process? OTOH, maybe patience is what is needed. The whole concept of qf is trusting the Lord with all parts of your life. If you are trusting the Lord in the adoption process it is qf in MHO! :D

Faith, no I don't live in WA, but I wish I did so I could share my midwife with you. She has become a friend and has also attended my dd at the births of her children (My grandchildren!!) Maybe if you explain to your midwife what you liked about your past midwife, and what you would like for this birth, perhaps she will be willing to step back and be the lifegaurd as you so aptly put it. Sometimes midwives go on the premis that women want a more medical birth, simply in the home. I think many do. So comunicate your desires and I bet she will be happy to accomidate you.

I know what you mean about the Born In Zion book taking things a bit too far, and I agree that it does. I just think it isn't a good idea to throw out the baby with the bathwater, so to speak. I think there is a lot of wisdom to be gleened from the book and she certianlly does have an amazing track record....like the midwives at the Farm!

[TreeLove]

[Ms.Doula]

does anyone go to www.quiverfull.com ?

We exalt Jesus Christ as Lord, and acknowledge His headship in all areas of our lives, including fertility. We exist to serve those believers who trust the Lord for family size, and to answer the questions of those seeking truth in this critical area of marriage.

Whether your quiver is large or small, you are welcome. Come browse our articles and resources. Be sure to check out the Quiverfull digest that boasts 1483 members.

Dedicated to providing encouragement and practical help to those who are striving to raise a large and growing, godly family in today's world!

[TreeLove]

[Ms.Doula]

Nah!- Just slow Sometimes I guess! :hug



Soooo... has Everyone here read this book;

Does the Birth Control Pill Cause Abortions? -by Randy Alcorn

[Ms.Doula]

And;

A Full Quiver -By Rick & Jan Hess

[Ms.Doula]

Ok and for those that HAVEN'T read the one By Randy Alcorn.... Its a short read. Easy to understand and hes a MD. Was looking to DISprove the ideal that the bc. causes abortion... here is a free pdf. format version of the entire book! http://www.quiverfull.com/birthcontrol.php

[weesej]

So excited to see this thread:D I have 3 kids and have had 2 miscarriages in 6.5 years. I have just decided over the last 6 months or so to be quiverful, DH has always wanted to have as many as God will give. Both DH and I are aldo baby Christians having just found Jesus in November and February. I will be moving to SC Pennsylavania to complete my midwifery apoprenticeship at the end of May, I will be about 40 minutes from Hagerstown and am sooo excited to hear about the conference. I will be in Shippensburg. Are any of you close?

[Ms.Doula]

im not at all close to ya- on the w coast actually.
Just wanted to say CONGRATS on going into midwifery! AND welcome to out tribe! And more importantly-To the kingdom of God's Grace!!! :love :wave

[Faith]

The best things I have read on QF so far are Nancy Campbell, and Mary Pride, and this magazine called The Mother's Companion.

[Ms.Doula]

Faith- I first heard of being QF from Nancie Campbell- we went to a retreat where she and her Hubby, Collin were speaking. Was AWESOME!!!:thumb I recieve her mag. Above Rubies as well as devotionals via. internet! :love

I got both books I mentioned there at the retreat!

[momto l&a]

Dh and I probably fit into the quiverfull tribe. We dont belive in birth control and will take however many children God gives to us. Tho I have had to take a natural progesterone to get and stay preggo. So that means our 2 girls where kinda"planned" but we are preggo at this time with a surprise baby which we are very happy about.

[feebeeglee]

Howdy! :wave

I'm a Catholic mom to 3 kids (4yo, 2yo, 1yo) and due in October with #4. I'd call us qf. We never charted but we did consciously avoid marital relations right in the middle of my cycle (days 9-19, usually) for about 3 months after AF returned this time at 7mos pp, but it suddenly felt "wrong" IYKWIM so we stopped paying attention to whether I was fertile or not. I conceived this wee bean the month we stopped paying attention, so we truly are blessed :bow

We had done nothing to space our children before that... now I'm having trouble even remembering why I wanted to wait to conceive... :scratch Hmm, dunno! Silly of me no doubt :LOL

Anyway, yes most everyone thinks we're crazy. DH has been out of work for almost a year and we are scraping by on occasional freelance graphic/web design and the kindness of friends and family.

I'm curious as to how everyone educates their children?

We homeschool, well, as much as one can formally homeschool a 4 year old. But yeah, we homeschool. I think DDs will enjoy Before Five In A Row and we plan on giving it a try soon.

Glad to be here-

+

[Ms.Doula]

Hi Phoebe!!! :wave :love Long time no see!! :hug

Im Homeschooling here too!! (Till at least High school!)

[Faith]

We HS, too. Hey, I didn't go thru all this work to have these DC just to hand them over to somebody else!:LOL *I* want to raise them!
My oldest is only four, but I know we will go 'all the way' thru high school.


Ms. Doula, I have read a book on the BCP and abortion, and another book about a man and his wife that have about a a dozen kids- but I no longer have the books and can't remember the authors names:o... So I don't know if they are the same book you mentioned or not.


My good friend is at a Above Rubies retreat right now! She will have to stop in tomorrow and let us know how it went.:love

[hjohnson]

For those of you out there, I suggest you check out the webpage of a family I know that has 13 boys and 1 girl. They are definitely quiverfull. http://www.famteam.com

[Ms.Doula]

Oooooohhhh... The Arndt Family... YEP! They are great! I have talked to a couple of them! ;)

[t-elaine]

AAHHHHH....So nice to see this thread getting lively again!
It's perfect timing since I just returned home from the 6th annual Southern Wisconsin Above Rubies Family Camp!!!!
It was so wonderful and SO refreshing!

The Randy Alcorn book is very good...a good one to pass on to help educate others on birth control and it's "other side" (also, it is occaisionally updated - now in the 6th edition - so keep your eyes open for new ones since they are only a few dollars!) (PS - Faith, I got you a little something :wink)...I haven't read A Full Quiver...but I have just started reading Be Fruitful and Multiply by Nancy....(It is the same as God's Plan For Families, but with a new look and a forward by someone from Vision Forum)...It is so encouraging to read...just as is was to actually sit and listen to her (and Colin) speak. Her father was at the retreat too and was a WONDERFUL man to talk with. I got to speak to a mother of SIXTEEN!!!...(all grown now) She is an AMAZING example...
Plus being surrounded by so many wonderful blessings and blossoming mothers to be...I yearn for the day I will be expecting again :throb (In God's time)
The energy there was so uplifting! Nancy's message was on being a BEAUTIFUL WOMAN! I heard a lot that I need to hear (as usual when I hear or read her words)
If any of you EVER have a chance to attend a retreat...PLEASE DO!...you will not regret it :thumb

Feebeeglee - do you get the Above Rubies magazine? The newest issue has some GREAT articles/testimonies of families on low incomes. It could be a great blessing to you to read their incouraging words.


Well, I actually have to finish unpacking...i will return later!

Love,
Tina :love

[SheBear]

I'm so glad I found this thread (well, actually, I was directed to it!). I was asking about this very thing in TAO earlier today!

I'll just paste part of my post here:

Basically, I'd just like to talk with (learn from) some other "full quiver" families.

I am totally on board, and dh is, FTMP (but he does keep saying he hopes we have a few year's "break" before the next baby!).

I'm interested in hearing from the rest of you.....how did you come to your decision/beliefs WRT this, what books/resources can you recommend to me, what do you recommend as far as dealing with a spouse who is not quite *there*, but willing to listen?

Right now I'm reading Be Fruitful and Multiply by Nancy Campbell, and TBH, I'm not all that impressed with it yet....not sure why. I think maybe I'm not convinced that ALL the scriptures she uses to make her point are directly related to having children...there are other ways for nations and/or families to increase, IMO.

Anyway, anyone have insight into reading this book? Recommendations for books you liked better? One that you'd specifically recommend for a husband to read?

TIA--I look forward to chatting with you all! :love

[TreeLove]

[t-elaine]

YK....I was talking with someone last night about breastfeeding...and she made the comment that she believes that to not breastfeed was to say that something God created doesn't work the way you want it to and is probably very hurtful to Him....she also related this to cosmetic surgery, and such....
I find it interesting though that her dh has had a vasectomy and she approved....(Not that I judge her, because I do not)....but isn't that the same thing. God created our wombs to conceive and bear children as well, of course, as our dhs. To decide that either one needs to be changed, when they are functioning the way God made them, is telling God that His creation is not good enough...that we can do better.

God said, "Be fruitful and multiply ABUNDANTLY" (Gen 9:7)...I wasn't always QFminded...We were going to stop after 3, then I was going to follow my fertility signals to avoid getting pregnant as I was still against artificial forms of bc or sterilization. Then I was reading Genesis with dd and this statement jumped off of the page at me. I had been "debating" the topic with a close friend and this is what showed me the truth. Is 3 "abundantly"? Not in God's eyes. It was after this revelation that the verses about children being a blessing and such really made sense to me. This command was not given just this once either.

Shebear - I agree, that those verses could be used another way...but it does not stop them from giving some more backing to this idea...I think her point is that God LOVES increase. And that thought, combined with His FIRST commandment and the evidence of dc being a blessing, etc...makes it difficult to ignore.
I do not agree with everything Nancy or her family teaches...but she is doing a WONDERFUL work, trying her best to live up to the Titus 2 woman. I look past what I disagree with her on and glean the good for me....she has so much encouragement to give...as should we all. that's why I like the idea of this thread...so that we may encourage each other, something we all need when we are surrounded by the world.

BTW - :wave -WELCOME to all of those who have joined in!
And GOD BLESS!
Tina :love

[TreeLove]

[Ms.Doula]

(not speaking for anyone) but I am sure that would NOT apply to you! If you are confident in your heart, and honest & true before the Lord our God, that you do ALL you can each time.... then NO. It is NOT your fault. We live in a Sinfull world, and are in the Flesh. Bad things happen all around us. (misscarriage I throw into this explanation too) Therefore....... Crap Happens ;)


:hug

[Ms.Doula]

Shebear- first of all, :w
Glad to have ya here! (And welcome anyone else I may have missed! :wave) I will answer a couple of things you have addressed, while I drink my yummy coffee! :LOL

what do you recommend as far as dealing with a spouse who is not quite *there*, but willing to listen?

PRAY. Pray Pray. Then Let him listen. You could gently lead him to the scriptueres you believe The Lord is showing you, and ask him for his thoughts.... then Let God work through that & Keep Praying and in the meantime, be willing to submit in Love, & respect to your husband
(Though I will sometimes cheat by letting him know I am doing so :LOL Hehehehe)

as fror this; Right now I'm reading Be Fruitful and Multiply by Nancy Campbell, and TBH, I'm not all that impressed with it yet....not sure why. I think maybe I'm not convinced that ALL the scriptures she uses to make her point are directly related to having children...there are other ways for nations and/or families to increase, IMO.

I wasn't TOO impressed by it either..... same reasons actually. I felt that it was somewhat redundant (although someone not yet QF minded, may NEED the repetition) and I also felt that often times, things were taken out of context & she seemed to be 'reaching' so to speak. I enjoyed A Full Quiver By Rick & Jan Hess.

Also for me, the desision is more cut & dry. We have simplified all the 'issues' with one thing and one thing only. The ONE THING that can NOT be debated amongst believers.... That is that it is about TRUST. Some people just need more time, prayer & the Holy Spirit to come to the place that they can trust Him FULLY & in ALL aspects of their lives. Giving up that kind of controll isn't easy!!!

Trust that the God who created you and ALL MANKIND, Our God who has a PLAN for each & every one of us even before we are created, CAN And will decide the size of your family. He knows All. And He has a planfor us all! I would much rather leave things up to Him! (I tend to screw things up when I try! :LOL)


Proverbs 3:5-7 Trust in the LORD with all thine heart; and lean not unto thine own understanding.
In all thy ways acknowledge him, and he shall direct thy paths.
Be not wise in thine own eyes: fear the LORD, and depart from evil.

[quiverfulmom]

weesej-- I'm about a half hour from Shippensburg!

For us becoming quiverful was a very gradual thing. We've been married a little over 6 years and we've never used birth control, although we weren't against it when we got married. God worked on our hearts individually to give our WHOLE lives over to him including the number of children we would have. There weren't really any books or any people that influenced our decision, just the Holy Spirit.

For me it's all pretty basic. Is God sovereign or not? Does He rule over all or not? I believe that He is sovereign and rules over all-- including my fertility. Neither myself nor my husband rule over it.

Anyway, this area just comes easily for me to trust God in. There are other areas in my life, I'm sure, where I struggle just as others struggle in this area.

[Faith]

Originally posted by t-elaine
(PS - Faith, I got you a little something :wink)
:love You made my day and I don't even know what it is yet!:sunshine

[Ms.Doula]

Ahhh. You two must be the sisters ;)

:hippie

[t-elaine]

please tell me that you aren't referring to mamas who's bodies do not work. I've tried to bf all of my children and for some unknown reason I don't make but 1/4 to 1/2 ounce of milk, even after 4 months...

:O
I am SO sorry! I really hope I didn't come off as judgemental in any way. I honestly do not judge others on any of those points. I guess I was just emptying my brain a bit and not being as careful as I should have in my comments. Even the woman I was speaking to does not look down upon those who disagree with her, although she does have some strong personal convictions...and her point was specifically about those who know about the benefits of breastfeeding, but just decide that formula is the way for them and refuse to even consider breastfeeding.
And like I said, I do not judge this friend's choices, but I can't help but to have thoughts on them...they just decided that they don't want any more children...and that is their choice...I was just commenting on the inconsistency of HER comment.
Again I truly apologize if I have offended any of you. Please forgive me. I never mean ANY offense to anyone.

BTW - I am also so sorry about your difficulties with pregnancies, births and bfing. I can't imagine what I would do if I had such difficulties...accept of course to trust in God to make the best of any situation.:) :hug

(although someone not yet QF minded, may NEED the repetition)
If I understand correctly, this is why she wrote the book. To help others understand what it all means. She speaks often about sharing it with newly wedded couples. I have only read the forward and first chapter, so I do not yet have an opinion on it. But I do appreciate her messages at the retreats!



Ahhh. You two must be the sisters
Actually we ARE sisters...IN CHRIST! :D
We actually used to live very close to each other...until she and her family moved far, far away :crying :crying :crying
Faith is the close friend who shared with me the idea of QF in the first place and the one I debated the topic with.
Now we get to "visit" with each other here. :D

Have a WONDERFUL day, everyone!

:love Tina

[feebeeglee]

I have read Above Rubies, I was given a copy by Michelle at Precious Beginnings Diapers n' Things (http://www.preciousbeginningsdiapersnthings.com/) (click on About Us (http://www.preciousbeginningsdiapersnthings.com/store/WsAncillary.asp?ID=4) to see her two vas reversal babies :love)

[Ms.Doula]

bump :love

[Brisen]

Hi, I'm new here, just making the rounds to all the great threads. We're basically QF minded, though when we were praying to know what we should do, I had the distinct impression that things might change, but I would be prompted to know when/if we needed to avoid pg, and then using NFP. We have a 4 yo (getting close to 4.5), a 2 yo, and are currently pg with #3, due in Sept. I had a miscarriage this past Sept. It was terrifying to start doing this -- or rather, not doing anything to prevent (though we hadn't used bc before, we concieved #1 right away and it was before af returned that we prayed about it) -- but now it just feels so liberating. I suppose for me it's mostly due to the fact that I have seen it working, that bf has successfully (so far) spaced our kids well, even in a way that most mainstreamers would "approve" of (2, then 3 years between babies), so I just really feel spoiled. My side of the family isn't really religious, so I'm worried about comments and judgements as our family grows, but dh has a wonderful and supportive family and he is #6 of 7, so we're not that badly off. :D

[tnrsmom]

Jumping in here to say Hi! :wave

We have 5 children ages 9, 5, 4, 2, and 7 months. Lately we have talked about doing some permanant method of bc (vasectomy). Part of me thinks that it is a good idea but there is still part of me that feels that God would never give us more than we can handle.

About 15 months ago, my dh quit a good paying secure job to start his own business. This last year has been tough but we have never had to go without. As soon as things get tough and we worry that we will not be able to make the mortgage payment, a job comes in that will cover it. It has greatly strengthened our faith. We are also both involved in 12 step programs (him AA and me alanon). These programs have also helped our faith in God.

My point in this story is to tell that: I would rather be qf and just welcome whatever He feels we should have. I am going to have to do a lot more thinking about this before we make a permanant decision. Thanks for all the incredible information about QF. :hug

[SheBear]

Sorry I dropped in here and then just disappeared....been tending to my small quiver and couldn't find enough time to post anything insightful! I sure hope little Miss Maggie figures out the difference between day and night before too long! :) :zzz

Anyway, I thought I'd share a bit of my "journey" to becoming QF-minded (BTW, dontcha think we need a QF smilie? Somebody quick, grab a mod! :D).

I grew up in a good-sized family. I had 5 siblings (3 sisters, 2 brothers; my elder bro was adopted as an infant) and since my parents have been involved in foster care for over 30 years (just last year, they adopted my baby brother, who had been in their care since birth--he is 3 weeks older than my own son! So, now I have 6 siblings!), we never knew from week to week how many sorta-siblings we'd have. It was always merry chaos and good-humoured poverty (but we always had more than "enough", just not by other people's standards, KWIM?). Recently, in talking with my mom, I've discovered that they were QF before it had a name, LOL! They didn't use BC after a few half-hearted attempts with condoms and such (because they thought they were "supposed" to, yk?). They both wanted to have a large family (dad is one of 7 children, and mom is one of 6) and according to mom, "we just decided it didn't matter when [the kids] came!" So, I guess you could call them QF, even though the importance of what they were doing didn't really occur to them at the time. IMO, that just shows they had WAY more faith than I do! I'm so proud of my amazing parents... :love

Anyway, as I was finishing High School, I began to think about what my real "goals" were--what felt truly important to me. The thing that kept coming to the top of the list was motherhood. Kinda surprised me (and my sisters!) since I'd never dated in hs, and everyone figured I wasn't interested in marriage and family--that I'd be a career woman instead. I always knew that I wanted a family, but I also knew I wasn't going to go looking for Mr. Right--I knew that if that was God's plan for me, He'd lead me to Mr. Right (or rather, lead us together somehow).

And He did--I met my dh online (through a church-affiliated discussion board). He asked me to marry him before we'd ever even met in person--I said yes without even hesitating! Less than a year after that first meeting, we were married. He was starting out in the ministry at that time (he was 21 and I was 20) and we just couldn't wait to be married--better to marry than to burn, you know! :love We had originally planned to wed in June, after he'd finished college, but our house was ready to move into in Dec. and we couldn't stand the thought of it sitting empty--and us in separate beds--for another six months! So, we called my parents (on the other side of the country) and told them there was gonna be a wedding in 2 weeks!

This was where we let our "good judgement" get in the way of our faith--because of our hasty change of plans, and because of dh's rather visible position in the church, we were afraid that people might talk--and esp would if I were to get pregnant right away. :rolleyes: So I went on BC (pill), even though I have always been opposed to it because of the abortifacient aspect.

Well, I'm evidently in that special 2% category, because I got pregnant anyway! To my grief, I miscarried early on, and I know that it was more than likely because of the BC. You'd think we would have learned from that, but my OB recommended that I continue using the pill for a few months after my M/C "to give my body time to recover, and to give us both time to come to terms with the loss". Sounds good, huh? Well, we thought so, and we let his expert opinion drown out that still, small Voice once again. :crying

I got pregnant again, still on the pill, and this time God blessed us with our sweet, amazing son. The day I tested positive, I told my dh that I loved and honored him, and that I would do what he thought best, but that I would not put another Pill in my body. Ever. If he wanted to use some form of contraception, I would go along with what he thought best, but that I couldn't continue taking pills that not only messed up my body, but that I strongly felt they were interfering with my worship, as well.

Fortunately, he was totally fine with this--basically said, "we've got plenty of time (since i was pregnant) to think and pray about this, and we can come to a decision together."

God took any "decision" out of our hands though, and blessed us with Maggie (this sweet little nightowl who is nursing at the moment and trying desperately to keep herself awake!). I am more than ever convinced that I want to give this "control" over my womb back to God. I feel such freedom in not having to worry or even think about taking a pill, or messing with condoms, or charting, etc. The liberation that QF gives is heady stuff!

Not that I don't still have moments of doubt...a good friend of mine has two boys who are 13 months apart. She ultimately was unable to nurse the older baby, because her supply dropped so drastically and so quickly after she got pg again. She wanted to badly to nurse, esp since this child has numerous allergies, but she couldn't meet his needs. Things like that really shake my faith....the thought of how hard it must be to be a good mother to children so close in age is daunting, but not nearly so daunting as the idea of not being able to meet each child's basic needs. Nursing my children is such a blessing to me, that I can't imagine how I'd feel if I wasn't able to do so. Besides which, I guess I just don't understand how it could be God's plan to bring another child so soon that it was detrimental to the health of the first child.

But again, that's me "thinking" rather than trusting in God. It's so easy to get in the flesh, and so hard to get back out!

My husband, OTOH, is from a small family--he has a twin sister and that's it. His mom didn't expect to have more than one child (in fact, she didn't know she was expecting twins until 2 weeks before they were born!) :eek So, my dh is the only son of an only son, and he and his sister are the only grandchildren on both sides of the family. They have no first cousins at all, and very few second cousins. Dh's sister has one son, and no intention of having more children. The whole concept of having children is different in dh's family. I don't really understand it enough to even try to explain it--it's been a bit of an adjustment for me. It's not even that the women in his family are so much career oriented (his mom was a SAH/WAHM, and while his sister works, her schedule allows her to be with her son most days). It's more like they just don't want to be tied to children.

My own dh has said many times that he doesn't want to be still raising kids when he is 50. That, and the fear of financial burden are the two main fears he seems to have WRT surrendering to QF. I dont guess that's surprising, considering how he was raised. I'm thankful that he is such a Godly man, and willing to explore this issue with an open mind. We have been prayerfully reading the scriptures looking for God's will on this issue. I know we will come to an agreement on it, even if it takes a few years. I feel mostly peace about it, which is a wonderful feeling! I know that it must be a much more weighty issue for dh, being the sole provider and spiritual leader of our family.

Anyway, I don't know for sure why I felt the need to write my whole life's story here, LOL! Forgive my rambling, please! I am so happy to have found a tribe! :grouphug

Blessings,

Sarah

[Ms.Doula]

OHHH! Sarah!!!
I LOVED hearing your "story" (We have a simmilar one :LOL)
I just wanna HUG ya :hug & SQUEEZE YA!! :wave WELCOME!! WELCOME!! WELCOME!! SOOOOOO glad you found us here!! Stick around!!! (...yes, even when it's slow..) Share with us whenever you would like or need! :love

[TreeLove]

[Ligmom]

Hi Ladies:wave
I am so glad I found this thread...reading it has been an education and an inspiration for me. I love the whole concept of quiverful although dh and I are not quite "there" yet IYKWIM. We have been blessed with three wonderful sons...all in God's own time...and I would love to feel free to just give all of this to Him. Neither one of us (myself or dh) feel right about birth control, so I have been charting for the last several months...I still just don't have a great deal of peace about TTA pregnancy. Anyway, I look forward to reading more posts from all of you who are walking this walk. It is so good to find a place where how I feel is shared by others:) :rainbow

[ekblad9]

Hi there! I didn't get a chance to read all of the replies but wanted to speak up. We have 5 children and are currently using NFP. I'm against birth control at all but dh is a bit more conservative than I am. I'm happy to take whatever God gives us. He is too but wants to be cautious, :LOL. Anyway, the Lord will provide for all that we need. That much I know. :)

[jennay]

Originally posted by SheBear

Not that I don't still have moments of doubt...a good friend of mine has two boys who are 13 months apart. She ultimately was unable to nurse the older baby, because her supply dropped so drastically and so quickly after she got pg again.
Sarah

I am trying to be quiverfull minded but this is my situation as well. I was nursing Nathan around the clock and got pg with Ben when Nathan was 4.5 months old. So they are 13.5 months apart. I also had to stop nursing Nathan because of supply issues.

And I am one of those women who get AF back very soon pp - even though I exclusively bf. Ben is 4 months and I've already had af 3 times!!!

I'm not really charting but I am keeping track of fertility signs because I cannot imagine 3 under 2 and a half!

I want a lot of kids but not another one quite so soon. I wish I could be more trustful of the Lord's plans for us.

[momto l&a]

I'm not really charting but I am keeping track of fertility signs because I cannot imagine 3 under 2 and a half!

I have a friend that by the time her babe arirves in October she will have 4 under 4. :eek :jaw I cant imagine that at all. I need some space between babies.

[Ms.Doula]

I can understand the having 3 under 2 1/2!
My first two were 13 mos apart. and between #2 & #3 there was 17 mos. LOL Soo... do the math on that one! :LOL

[phathui5]

I like the idea of trusting God for your family size, but sometimes its hard to just relax and trust Him, you know? Right now, we only have a 3 1/2 year old and a 7 month old. I'm not on any chemical birth control, but I did get dh a big box of condoms and I'm leaving it up to him. So far, he's not big on using them, so I guess we'll see how it goes.

[TreeLove]

[ekblad9]

I've been thinking alot about this the past couple of days. I really need to convince dh that this is the right thing to do. He's SO against it. What can I do? At least he will use NFP with me but I really feel like we need to be on the same page with this. Maybe this is part of God's plan? Who knows. :confused:

[t-elaine]

HI, ekblad7...and all of the others who have joined in!
I know what you mean about wanting to be on the same page with dh. My dh and I did not agree right away...he wanted no more that 3....what really helped him was sharing with him all of the verses about dc being a blessing and where God said to "multiply ABUNDANTLY"...plus I think what helped him the most was getting around other men who were leaving it in God's hands. Seeing other fathers of large families (or not so large) that were happy and secure in their lives, and who shared their wonderful stories of God's provision really strengthened his faith in this area. Do you subscribe to Above Rubies? The most recent copy had some wonderful articles about families who had financial "handicaps"...one is a family where the dh is in a wheel chair, another is a large family in which the father passed away. There is some eonderful encouragement there....There is a great magazine for men too, but I can't remember the name...I will find Justin's copy and post again later.
Probably the most productive thing you can do, too, is to pray about it.
I will keep you and your dh in my prayers.
:hug
Tina :)

[Ms.Doula]

Just a friendly offer- For those Momthers out there needing a dose of extra support right now, and Families out there who also may be currious about being Quiver Full & trusting the Lord to choose your family size- I have a few extra copies of the latest Above Rubies Magazine (isue # 60) iF YOU ARE IN NEED, JUST PM ME and I will send one to you!!


__________________

[ekblad9]

Originally posted by t-elaine
HI, ekblad7...and all of the others who have joined in!
I know what you mean about wanting to be on the same page with dh. My dh and I did not agree right away...he wanted no more that 3....what really helped him was sharing with him all of the verses about dc being a blessing and where God said to "multiply ABUNDANTLY"...plus I think what helped him the most was getting around other men who were leaving it in God's hands. Seeing other fathers of large families (or not so large) that were happy and secure in their lives, and who shared their wonderful stories of God's provision really strengthened his faith in this area. Do you subscribe to Above Rubies? The most recent copy had some wonderful articles about families who had financial "handicaps"...one is a family where the dh is in a wheel chair, another is a large family in which the father passed away. There is some eonderful encouragement there....There is a great magazine for men too, but I can't remember the name...I will find Justin's copy and post again later.
Probably the most productive thing you can do, too, is to pray about it.
I will keep you and your dh in my prayers.
:hug
Tina :)

Thank you :hug that gives me hope! Our homeschooling group is full of enormous families! I try to get him around those men as much as possible! :)

[KoalaMommy]

I just stopped in to see what this is all about. We're only on our 1st pregnancy, very very planned baby, but it turns out our timing was God's timing! This method of child-bearing sounds fascinating to me. I have been on and off the pill since I was 12 for health reasons, and hate it and depend on it all at once. My life is awful off the pill, but I'd be glad to just keep having kids if I could just not deal with AF more than once or twice between. DH and I have joked since we were dating that we wanted 20 kids. We're not serious of course, unless God would have us working with orphans. How did y'all get started on this method of God-driven family planning?

[Faith]

hilary,

I got started on QF as a very new Christian. DH and I were saved with in a few months of each other, and were both in that really intense fired up stage. (Not that we're not fired up now, but it was different when we were 'new' yk?)

We started going to a great church and talking to a lot of other Christians. One of them was a woman my age who was courting a guy from our church. We were swimming one day and she was telling me how she wanted to give every area of her life to God.

She said if she never did anything to control her fertility, then she would always have the *exact* children that God wanted her to have, but if she took control even once, she would end up with entirely different children (since they would be conceived at differnent times). She also said that a child is not just a child, every baby we have is an eternal soul in Heaven.

Another girl was listening to us, and started asking questions about mothering and breastfeeding, and I filled them in on how BFing stops your cycle for a while and how the longer you BF the more health benefits for mom and baby, etc. As I was talking, I realized the reason it worked so well was because it was God's plan. It was a big moment for me.

I met another woman at church who explained the whole QF concept to me (told me it had a name and gave me Above Rubies, etc). She only had three children, which really showed me it meant trusting God either way- that I was not necessarily going to end up with a zillion kids.

The more I learned, the more I talked to DH about it. It fit in perfectly with our current method of birth control (nothing:p ), and everything we saw in the Bible backed us up.

So, that was it. One night we prayed together over my tummy and told God we were trusting him in everything, etc. It was really nice.

Then I sat back and waited to have babies. It was actually the opposite. I didn't conceive forever, and then I did and had a miscarriage. Not what I had in mind.

But I am pregnant again now, and this will be my first time giving birth as a Christian. I am really excited about that, and hoping my faith will help me deal with this labor a little better than I did last time!:)

[TigerTail]

i just wanted to pop in and say 'hi' to treelove- sounds like you and the new one are doing well! glad to see you.

dh and i fluctuate about ttc again or not, but at 41 i may well be done with my three. but we'll see. i'd like another, but gosh, i get awfully sick. i gotta talk to god about this one a bit longer (or he talk to me, lol.) we'll see.

suse

[TreeLove]

[t-elaine]

Hi, Hilary123!:wave

I have a very close (and WONDERFUL :love ) friend who, after becoming a Christian, learned about the idea of letting God choose her family sizeand began to share her thoughtys with me. I was already against all forms of artificial bc and sterilization...but not NFP. Dh and I had decided that after three we would use NFP to avoid preg....but that if we did become preg it was ok because it was God's plan.
The more I thought about some points my df (dear friend) had made...and the more I searched the scriptures for myself...the more I began to lean towards this line of thinking.
I've mentioned this before, but JIC you haven't read it...
The verse that jumped out at me the most at that time is where God said to "multiply ABUNDANTLY"...and three is not nexcessarily abundantly...there are some who are QF minded that only have three...but that doesn't mean that is the number of dc I could end up having.
After much more praying and meditating on the issue, I decided that it would mean so much more to me if we placed the control into God's hands when it came to our children. Children are SO important to God...so why would I want to do anything to avoid having a child that God wants to put on this earth?
We have gone to a couple of Above Rubies family camps and it has really helped to strengthen my faith in this matter...as well as giving me (and my dh) a desire to have a large family...if that is what God has planned for us of course.
I could go on and on about what this all means to me now...but I should probably save some of it for later...:P

BTW - Please do not feel that you have to share this with me (or us) but I have been very curious, since I have heard other mothers say this too...what is the health problem you have that you have to use the bcp for? I'm sorry if I sound nosey...I just would like to lok it up for you in some of my literature to see if there are some natural remedies that might help.

PS, FAITH, In case I haven't ever said this...thanks for introducing me to the whole idea of letting God plan our family size! :love

- tina :)

[jennay]

Originally posted by Faith
hilary,

IShe said if she never did anything to control her fertility, then she would always have the *exact* children that God wanted her to have, but if she took control even once, she would end up with entirely different children (since they would be conceived at differnent times).

I'm just not sure about this...I mean, our God who created the universe can definitely control which egg is released to be fertilized and which sperm does the fertilization. He knows whether you are going to conceive or not. The children we have are the ones we were supposed to have. Of course,maybe God had MORE children in mind for someone, but to say that the children you have maybe aren't the *exact* ones you're supposed to have, well....

I don't believe in artificial means of birth control at all but I don't have a problem with abstaining if another pregnancy at a certain time would be unwise.

What do you all think?

[KoalaMommy]

Tina,

I don't mind sharing my history. I have endometriosis and a genetic bleeding disorder called von Willebrands disease. Both are treated with the pill. Acutally the pill was the mildest treatment they offered me for the endo, I refused that nasty Lupron that is so toxic to your body and puts you through menopause.

In researching to conceive, I came across vitex, and I'm interested in it as a possible herb. I do believe it is used to treat endo. However, we only tried for 1 cylce (aparently fertility is not a problem for us), and lo and behold we conceived (isn't God great!). So I don't know if vitex is powerful enough or not because I never got af after taking it. I'm willing to give it a shot after the baby is born (of course, it boosts fertility too so that could mean our quiver would be VERY full).

It could be that the pill is the only thing that will help. Believe me, I get lots of lectures against it from my more-alternative-than-me mother, but at the same time, until I tried it 4 years ago, I was in agony monthly, and I wouldn't trade the days I gained from the pill for anything.

On the positive side, I hear pregnancy can be theraputic for endo in many cases. And prayer was very helpful too, I prayed hard that I would have the strenght the make it through the months between going off the pill and actually conceiving, and I did: the first month was virtually pain-free, and the 2nd cycle lasted 40 days, and so while I should have had af 3 times before trying, I didn't have to!!!

If you see anything else out there, feel free to share. I did lots of research a while ago when I rejected the Lupron, but I wasn't able to find much of anything at the time except accupuncture which didn't work for me. There has been a lot more study of endo since then though, and it may be that some new info is out there. I had to stop looking though, I would get so upset when I read what was available at the time: lots of horror stories, no answers or insights.

[Ms.Doula]

Originally posted by jennay
I don't have a problem with abstaining if another pregnancy at a certain time would be unwise.

What do you all think?


I think that if you are giving ALL control to Our Heavenly Father, then give it ALL to Him......

He is the Creator & giver of ALL LIFE. Only He can give that life to someone. Would He NOT know better than ourselves what time is the most optimal time to create the blesing of new Life??

IMO It is like saying;
"OK God, We trust you with this!" <whispers> -"but just in case you can't handle it, or don't do things right, we are going to make sure we still get our way with the plans..."


Harsh? A little.

Honest? Very.

:hug

~In Christs Love
Melissa

[IfMamaAintHappy]

You know you are quiverfull minded when .....

you mention to your husband that your period has finally returned at 16 months post partum, and his response is "Yahoo! We can have another baby!"

It is SO FUN to be on the same page about kids.

Hear me God? BRING IT ON!!!! Bless me!!! I'm open!

:LOL

[jennay]

Originally posted by ging-ging
You know you are quiverfull minded when .....

you mention to your husband that your period has finally returned at 16 months post partum, and his response is "Yahoo! We can have another baby!"

It is SO FUN to be on the same page about kids.

Hear me God? BRING IT ON!!!! Bless me!!! I'm open!

:LOL

I'm really struggling with this... what if AF returns at 3 weeks postpartum?!!!

Maybe I really don't belong here after all.

[Ms.Doula]

Hehehehe!!!! ging-ging :love

I just got mine back too jen, after dd was 16 mos...

then have had 2 AFs

then a m/c

am awaiting the next AF in a week or 2...

[Ms.Doula]

jannay sweetie!!! As long as you are following Gods other plans as well... (ie. Breastfeeding w/o suplimenting fakes for one..) then that is SOOOOO UNLIKELY to even happen!! Honest!! :nod

AND *IF* it did anyway :eek Then rest asured it would be beyond ANYONES controll, and be God's Mighty Will! :hug

[feebeeglee]

I have 3 children and am expecting #4 in October... my kids are 4, 2 and 1, and are 15 months apart and 21 months apart.

Imagine my surprise to get my first pp AF at 5mos. I was exclusively bfeeding, no supplements no solids no paci, DD nursed at least 3x in the night.... my point is, GOD FINDS A WAY.

I was shocked by that first AF. I washed my hands after using the bathroom and discovering hre return, and I looked at myself in the mirror and said "He won't give you more than you can handle."

I got pg about 2 weeks later :LOL I was so shocked and scared and overwhelmed, but it all turned out fine and now I have two beautiful and inseperable daughters.

Then I got pg again when DD2 was about 11mo and that's when they started calling us crazy. By then I was so accepting of the idea of many children planned by God that I had no problem with it, but boy did my family freak out a bit!

And this time, I did (sorta) attempt to space the births... I did not chart anything, but we did try to not DTD when I was in the middle of my cycle. (I remember why now! I wanted to be sure I would have enough breastmilk to be able to nurse my son to 12mos without having to supplement with goat's milk, which is what I had to do with DD1. And we made it, he's 13mos now and my milk is just now starting to really diminish at 14wk pg)

It only lasted for about 3mos, and I doubt we would have been able to do it anyway.. as I recall those were rather 'dry' months anyway what with the ups and downs of 3 wee ones and a hard-working husband. I'm not justifying what we did, really tho.. and I doubt we'll do that again. And anyway I got pg pretty quick no matter what we did :D

I don't even remember my point now. Oh well.

Gotta run, kids need me-

[jennay]

Originally posted by Ms.Doula
jannay sweetie!!! As long as you are following Gods other plans as well... (ie. Breastfeeding w/o suplimenting fakes for one..) then that is SOOOOO UNLIKELY to even happen!! Honest!! :nod

AND *IF* it did anyway :eek Then rest asured it would be beyond ANYONES controll, and be God's Mighty Will! :hug

LOL...well, it already happened to me - Nathan was breastfeeding round the clock, no paci, no bottles, etc. and I got pg at 4.5 months. Now, I wouldn't trade Ben for anything but I'm not sure I can do it again so soon.

[TigerTail]

nursing nonstop (tandem, in the case of the last two) never stopped me from getting af at 8 weeks pp; i think god making me so full of nursing hormones i had no interest in sex is part of his mighty plan, lol. but fwiw, i prolly am with jennay & don't really belong here. but definately am sympathetic with people who see god's will for them in qf. (a friend in my playgroup is, & deals with her 5 much more calmly then i can handle 3. i love watching her parent!)

anyway, just wanted to say 'hey!' back to tl!

suse

[Ms.Doula]

I was refering to the literal comment - "what if AF returns at 3 weeks postpartum?!!!"



I know that some of us get our AF back sooner than others (after #1 I got it at 6 weeks pp. (was not nursing though-we lost her, Emily, at birth) Then after #2 was born... I got it back at about 3/4. mo pp. i think and then This time it was 16 mo. pp (:D)

So there are 13 mo between DD#1 & DD#2 And then only 17 mo between DD#2 & DD#3

But seriously... This must be His will for us, right!? Is He not the creator & Giver of all life? Is His will not perfect?? :love

And Yes, phoebe- ITA- GOD FINDS A WAY!!! :baby (it helpd to be welcoming & trusting His will, too though!)

[ekblad9]

I'm so jealous of those of you who are on the same page with your dh. It's putting such a wedge between dh and I. :(

[cappuccinosmom]

>But seriously... This must be His will for us, right!? Is He not the creator & Giver of all life? Is His will not perfect??

I think this is the *heart* of Quiverfull. Thank you for putting it so eloquently.

[t-elaine]

Originally posted by t-elaine
HI, ekblad7.......There is a great magazine for men too, but I can't remember the name...I will find Justin's copy and post again later.

I am SO sorry that it has taken me so long to get back with this information...It has been CRAZY here!

The magazine is called Patriarch (http://www.patriarch.com)

They reccomend and sell a book called Family Man, Family Leader too that they were saying was good (at the retreat) which reminds me...I need to order it for Justin.

The mag definitely does teach that God's command to be fruitful and multiply is still valid today.

Hope it helps!

Tina :love

[jengi33]

Just read through this whole thread and am so amazed by the faith of you women! I should pray for the same. Actually my husband and I this week concluded that artificial birth control was no longer an option (after we found out the truth about it being an abortificient). But we are planning to use NFP. DH has been completely convinced since our last child that we are "done" having kids. However, I've always thought differently. In the last year he has become a Christian though and I think his thoughts are changing. We are going to have a long, thorough talk about this tonight!

[SheBear]

Just a bump.....we are coming up on my six week post-partum visit, and the midwife will ask us if we've given any thought to birth control. I know what my answer is, and I'm praying dh will feel the same. He hasn't said much about it lately, but I'm sure the app't will bring it back into discussion.

jengi33, how are you doing? Didja have that talk with your dh? I prayed for you when you first posted, then got busy and forgot to come look for updates! I hope it went well! :hug

[jengi33]

Thanks for the prayers Shebear, no we didn't have that talk. In fact we've hardly talked at all in the last few days. Hopefully this weekend, things will slow down. I have been faithfully charting this week, his only comment was, "it looks pretty risky"! I'm still undecided on the issue, we are going to go talk to our Pastor about it I think. Take care and have a good appointment. I am praying for you too!

Jenny

[catholicmama]

Hello! My name is Rebecca and my husband and I are QF catholics. We have always been open to God's blessings and we have been married about 6.5 years. We have three children(and have had 2 miscarriages), ages 4(turns 5 next month), 3, and 1. We live In Maryland not too far from DC.

My husband and I have always been on the same page as believing artificial bc is wrong. We believe in letting God do the planning.

Although, the more kids we have had LOL (and we only have 3 so far) the harder that belief seems to be LOL. I am so tired!! And some days these children drive me batty! But I know God has things planned out for us-whatever they may be. And I love these children like crazy and cannot wait to have a whole housefull!

Anyhow, My 14 month old is nursing nursing round the clock and I haven't even gotten my period back yet. So all in God's time! Everyone in our house is ready for another baby though.

Nice to "meet" everyone!


Rebecca

[Ms.Doula]

:w Rebecca! Nice to have you here with us!! :hug



Nancy asked that I pass this on to the Mommies here....

So I am.





MAY YOU HAVE A BLESSED MOTHER'S DAY


As this day is put aside to honor you as a mother, I pray that you will be blessed, honored and spoiled rotten for all your toil, faithfulness and sacrificial love. I would also like to remind you again of the high status of your calling. In the midst of all your mothering, when you often feel exhausted, worried, frazzled and overwhelmed, it is easy to forget the big picture and the divine task to which God has commissioned you.



You are not involved in some insignificant task. You have the highest calling in the nation. You may have been involved in a career at some stage and of course you had to be faithful to your employer. But you now have a far more important task. You are employed by a heavenly employer, the King of all kings and the Lord of all lords. You are now responsible to Him.



Here are a few reminders of the greatness of your divine calling.



1. YOU ARE THE REVEALER OF GOD'S MATERNAL HEART



Dear Mother, in all the activities and work of keeping your home, never lose sight of your highest purpose - to walk in the anointing of your maternal instinct. This is who you are. You are a maternal being. You were created to ooze with nurturing. This is the greatest need of your children. This is the greatest need of this sin-sick hurting world. It does not matter if you do not finish every project and every teaching course you have planned for your children, but it does matter that your children live in an atmosphere of nurture and love. Embrace your maternalness. Pour it out upon your family and all you meet. In doing this you will walk in the anointing and glory of womanhood.



2. YOU ARE A NATION SHAPER



More than anyone else, you as a mother can determine the destiny of the nation. You may feel as though you are hidden in your home while many of your neighbors drive off to work each morning. They may think you are wasting your life, but they have no idea of what you are doing! They don't realize that you are shaping lives. You are polishing and sharpening "arrows". You are getting children ready to fulfill God's divine purposes for their lives. There will come a day when they will come forth out of your home to rock this nation - and even the world!



Look out world! Get out of the way, Satan. There is a mother in this home who knows who she is and knows her calling from God. You can trifle with this woman. She is like an awesome army with banners! (Song of songs 6:4,10)



3. YOU ARE A LEGACY MAKER



You not only can you determine the destiny of this nation, but you will influence the generations to come. Ruth became the great-grandmother of King David and I am sure she had the privilege of holding him in her arms. Did you ever read about Hudson Taylor who founded the China Inland Mission? His godly generation started with his great-grandfather who lived in the time of John Wesley. This godly line has passed on from one generation to the next and there are now nine generations of preachers in the Taylor family.



What mighty children will be born in your following generations as you strongly impress God's ways into the hearts of your children?



4. YOU ARE AN ETERNITY FILLER



Your influence goes even beyond the many generations to follow. Motherhood is an eternal career. Every precious baby that you embrace from the hand of God is another eternal soul that will live forever. There is absolutely nothing more powerful and more eternal that you could do in this life than bring an eternal soul into this world! You will leave everything in this world behind - except your redeemed soul and the redeemed souls of your children.



5. YOU ARE A HOME NESTER



Don't let this humanistic society deceive you to think that your home is a boring place. On the contrary, it is a place of divine appointment for you. It is a sacred place. God chose the home as the place where He wants His children nurtured and raised. Before God gives us children, he first puts us in a home. Psalm 113:9 "He makes the barren woman to keep house, and to be a joyful mother of children." Our humanistic society provides daycares for children but these are poor substitutes for the home. A little boy was asked why he didn't like daycare. "Because I didn't have a mommy," he replied.



Embrace your home. Thank God for it. Know that it is where God wants you to be to fulfill your great commission.



6. YOU ARE THE SENTINEL OF YOUR HOME



Husbands guard the city gates but you stand sentry at your home, guarding against all inroads of the enemy. You watch in prayer. You watch over the bodies, souls and spirits of your children. As I raised our children, I made Paul's prayer for the Thessalonians in 5:23 my goal, "I pray God your whole spirit and soul and body be preserved blameless unto the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ."



7. YOU ARE A WALKING PRAYER MEETING



Prayer should be inseparable from motherhood. It is pretty difficult to adequately mother without constantly looking to the Lord. Abraham Lincoln said, "I remember my mother's prayers, and they have always followed me. They have clung to me all of my life."



Perhaps you have a child who has gone astray or is giving you much concern. Don't despair. Keep praying. They cannot get away from your prayers. When the great Latin Church father and theologian, Augustine, went away to college, he got in with the wrong crowd and became a worldly young man for many years. Monica, his mother, had one vision - that her son would know God and be a preacher. She prayed and interceded continually. Her whole life was given to prayer. When he eventually came to the Lord in answer to her prayers she said, "I have fulfilled my task. I am now ready to go to the Lord," and she died soon after.



8. YOU ARE THE BEST TEACHER AND TRAINER OF YOUR CHILDREN



There is no one who can teach your children better than you can. Proverbs 6:20-23 says, "Do not forsake the law of your mother. Bind them continually upon your heart; tie them around your neck. When you roam, they will lead you; when you sleep, they will keep you; and when you awake, they will speak with you..."



Abraham Lincoln said again, "The greatest lessons I ever learned were at my mother's knees.



George Washington said, "All that I am I owe to my mother. I attribute all my success in life to the moral, intellectual and physical education I received from her."



John Wesley said, "I learned more about Christianity from my mother than from all the theologians of England."'



Dear mother, God has chosen you to be the mother of your children. No one can do it is well as you can. And God is behind you all the way. He has commissioned you to the task and He will empower you.



Love from NANCY CAMPBELL

[umm aishah]

Luv it!

Too bad Im not that fertile. I'd always wanted a big family.

you know THIS IS THE PLACE when you can discuss bc NOT being an option.

[yorkies]

HI! Where is this? What is it? How far from Swansea, SC is it?

[quiverfulmom]

I wanted to let you ladies know about an upcoming Above Rubies family camp. It's going to be in Hagerstown, MD from November 12-14. Email me (click on my title) if you want info. It's going to be a really great time and there will be lots of fellowshipping with like minded families :)

[Daniella]

You can count me in as QF. I just joined here, just so I could email someone. I'm looking around now to see if I belong here. :) I'm not the "hippy" type.

We're just starting our family, but staunchly believe in QF. We're Christians who believe God when he says that children are blessings and we don't want to miss out on any blessings He has in store for us!

Daniella
Wife to DH
Mom to 1 1/2 year old ds
and a bun in the oven

[NatureMama3]

I would love to lurk here. :D :lurk:

We have rather gradually come to the QF idea/decision and haven't used birth control of ANY sort in well over a year now. (we only used condoms 2 cycles since Noah was born, the rest have been unprotected - and AF was back for me at 8 weeks despite EBF and cosleeping)

I would join, except that my body doesn't believe in keeping babies. :( I require progesterone support in my luteal phase or I lose any pregnancy. I've had 10 losses thus far and only 2 live births. :( (3 kids)

We do believe in QF however and will continue to practice it. I simply need to be vigilant with charting and taking my supplements.

[Ms.Doula]

Dear Above Rubies friends,



Here is a reminder for our last Above Rubies retreat for the year - a camp for the whole family in Maryland. It's coming up very soon but there's still time to register. Here are the details.



12 - 14 NOVEMBER, MARYLAND

2ND ANNUAL FAMILY CAMP

Camp Mt. Aetna, Hagerstown, Maryland

Contact: Tom and Jenn Cleary

Phone (301) 733 9102

Email: jennclear63@hotmail.com

Or Phil and Kelly Passerelli, Phone: (301) 694 5676



And here is the new date for the postponed Gulf Shores Ladies Retreat that was cancelled because of Hurricane Ivan. The venue where we were scheduled to hold this retreat was totally demolished but Darlene and Kate have now found a new venue.



You will be able to start the New Year by attending the "looked forward to" Gulf Shores retreat.



14 - 16 JANUARY, 2005

GULF SHORES, ALABAMA

2nd ANNUAL LADIES RETREAT

Contact Darlene Barnett, PH: (251) 931 3309

Email: darlene@christward.org

Or Kate Christenson, Ph: (850) 944 6051

Go to the web page to register: http://christward.org

Information of camp site: www.campbaldwin.org

To read testimonies from last year go to: http://christward.org/arubies_testimony2003.htm



Look forward to seeing you.



Love from NANCY CAMPBELL

[mammalove]

I am a qf mamma. I thought I would drop in and say hi. I am new to the boards! ;)

[feebeeglee]

Newest addition born October 8th :D

see here (http://blog.gleeson.us/sean/2004/10/09/after_action_report) for the father's description of the birth and here (http://blog.gleeson.us/phoebe/2004/10/20/birth_of_matthew_gilbert_gleeson) for my description. Sean's is much better than mine.

and here (http://blog.gleeson.us/sean/2004/10/25/the_baptism_of_matthew_gilbert) is the baptism.

[Ms.Doula]

:w mammalove!!! glad to see another believer here!! :love

PHOEBE!!! Oh my!!! I *LOVED* looking at your site(s) you are so blessed! Your husband seems Wonderfull & your family is beautiful!!! :love :love :love :love :love :love

:hug to you, my sister!! Thanks for sharing w/ us!!! :love

[KittyKat]

Hello!

Didn't even know this group was here.

I am definitely of the QF mindset. They are blessings, each one.

I have 4 with #5 expected in 2 months (or so!)

My first 2 are 18 months apart, then 14 months between #2 and #3 (THAT was rough, but God is good!) #4 is 22 months younger than #3, and This one will be my widest spacing so far with about 27+ months between #4 and #5.

We did have a time where we used "protection" and charting to avoid. It really started to weigh on me though, because I *knew* I was not trusting God to do what He said. DH didn't agree at the time, and that was a strain too.

Well, #4 was conceived while "avoiding" but we knew I was fertile, and I told DH, and he opted not to avoid. As it turns out #4 is daddy's little pride and joy, and looks EXACTLY like DH's baby pictures. All the other ones resemble my side of the family more than Dh's, not that it affects how he feels about them, but he really enjoys having one that looks more like him. After #4 was born, we never "avoided" PG again, but I had 11 months of LAM and several more of short luteal phase from BF. As soon as my LP lengthened I got PG though. It was the same week DH got fired from one job, and he got hired at a new job the week after we found out I was PG. God really DOES work everything out. :)

So anyways, it's really great to see you all here, though it looks like this may be a slow group. Imagine that, we have better things to do than play at the computer huh? LOL!

[momto3g3b]

HI!!! This is the first board I have found that I think I can probably *really* fit in at! Woo hoo!!! :D

I have 6 kids and am open to having more, according to God's will and blessing.

My oldest 2 kids are 10.5 months apart in age and then we have an almost-7 year gap between #2 and #3. #4 & #5 (twins) were born 27.5 months after #3 and #6 arrived 26.5 months after the twins. So....I have an almost 13 year old dd, 12 year old ds, 5 year old dd, boy/girl 3 year olds and a ds who is almost 11 months. I am still bf'ing and haven't had a pp AF yet, but I've gotten pg with this scenario before, so I wouldn't be shocked to become pregnant again.

NO ONE around us understands how we can have "so many" when my dh's career is in restaurant management. People are always making comments about how we afford to have so many children. We just smile and say that God provides for the children He blesses our family with. And it's true. We have everything we need and plenty of what we want, as well! :) Like everyone else with large families, we hear "you're not having any more, right?" on a regular basis, and dh and my response is usually to laugh and say, "Not today!" LOL We have explained to our friends our qf mindset and they accept/respect our decision, even if they don't agree with it. The biggest opposition dh and I have run up against is well-meaning individuals who feel it's their duty to "warn" us against having more children due to the fact that we have 2 kids on the autism spectrum already, plus 2 others with medical issues. People say, "What if you have another disabled child?" I have to admit, I used to be worried about that. I NEVER thought I could handle having disabled children. But I've come to realize that God knows what He's doing and I *can* take care of a disabled child (or 2 or 4). God equips us to do whatever job He gives us to do, kwim?

When I allow myself to care what others think of my lifestyle, I sometimes doubt myself and my choice to be qf. When people I respect "explain" to me how it's MY responsibility to use birth control, that God doesn't want everyone to procreate just because they can, I often feel like a chastised child who is "doing it all wrong". Luckily, however, I am married to a man who doesn't care what the world thinks of him or us or our family. He says that as long as we are doing what we KNOW God told us to do (homeschooling, allowing God to plan our family, etc), it doesn't matter what anyone else thinks. I try to lean on dh when I'm feeling shaky..... it helps! :)

Our family's reactions to our having a large family are quite funny (not in a ha ha-funny way, but in a strange-funny way). I am the youngest of 5 kids, and my 4 siblings have 4, 3, 3, and 1 child in their families. My husband is the 11th of 14 kids (no twins) and all but one of his siblings have 2 or 3 kids. One of his sisters has 6 kids, too, but she's not qf-minded and is "done". You'd think, though, that our mothers would be supportive and think it's great that dh and I are having a large family, but NOPE! They are just appalled! My MIL always greets the announcement of a new pregnancy with, "When are you two going to stop?" (like she should talk, after having 14???). My mom is really rude and snotty and says things like, "I wish you'd get that taken care of," or "When are you going to figure out what causes that and stop?" So, needless to say, I don't look to my mom or MIL for support. :eyesroll

My best friend has 5 kids and dreams of more, so she is completely supportive of my open-minded attitude toward children, which is really great.

I guess I'll shut up now and stop babbling, LOL! I just want to say that I'm THRILLED to find a LOT more like-minded women to chat with! To know that if/when I get pregnant again, I have someplace to go to celebrate my happiness where others will GET IT is such an awesome feeling! Yippee!!!!!!

So happy to meet you all! :love

[Ms.Doula]

Welcome, Kate!! :w

Glad you found us!!
Sounds like your DH is a wonderfull partner/support!! :clap AMEN!!

What a wonderfull family you two are blessed with!!
-and it is perfect in the sence that it is JUST what the Lord intended you to have! :nod

[cchrissyy]

I'll pop in to show support too. We've got the QF mindset pretty much too. Been married 3 years, have 1 child, 2 lost, and 1 on the way.
Used to be Catholic and used NFP, but no BC for us anymore, natural or not!

[Ms.Doula]

ccrissyy- Welcome!!! I see you are in N. CA! How far North?? I am in Visalia. & have relatives all over this state!! Maybe we're close? PM me!! :wink

[TheJoyfulMom]

I just saw this thread today. We are also quiverfull minded. God has blessed us with 3 so far. :)

We are having some issues with finding an ob that supports our mindset though... all 3 children have been c/s babies. We can't find an ob that will do more than 1 more. Any suggestions?

[Ms.Doula]

Find a Midwife! :thumb

:hug Hello & Welcome to our "Tribe"!

[feebeeglee]

I agree w/ Ms. Doula... mw is the way to go! Assuming a vag birth is sought for the future tho.... if you are planning another c-sec that could really be troublesome. I know that seems to be the 'standard of care' for c-birth, four being the limit. Hmm.

Good luck and welcome... welcome to everyone

[TheJoyfulMom]

I am hoping to find a midwife. Sadly, most will not take me either. :(

[tryinghardmomma]

www.christianuc.com?

Have you ever been to MOMYS.com? They were just talking about how many have had 6, 7, 8, even 11 c/s.
There's a momy there who had 3 or 4c/s, then the next few VBACs, then a few Unassisted births.

[knittingmomma]

It is so nice to read of other attachment parent type Christian Moms - so hard to meet in "real" life:)

Even at our church, we are a bit of a "show". - Most families are dressed to the hilt and seem to have money - we live very simply, believe in letting God decide our family size and absolutely are crazy about our children.

I look forward to following this thread.
Blessings!

[cappuccinosmom]

I'm sure I've introduced myself here already. Several times, probably. :eyesroll

Regarding C-sections--I also suggest looking for a midwife. They at least can be a little more unbiased about whether you really need another C-section. You might also go to