"dumbing us down"

[lilypad]

Has anyone read the book "Dumbing Us Down - The Hidden Curriculum of Compulsory Schooling" ? It is written by John Gatto who was a public school teacher. I just started reading it and the first chapter is v. interesting. It talks about how everything is taught in bits and pieces with no cohesion, and how the public school system is a completely artificial structure.
Alexander, I thought you might be especially interested in it since i think it talks a lot about how to (or if it is possible to )reform the public school system. ANyways, if anyone has read it let me know what you think.

[Pallas]

A marvelous book! Influenced my decision to homeschool. Amazing that it was written by a man lauded by the very system he's criticizing -- that, imo, makes him all the more credible.

[sleepies]

what bothered me about my public school was this:

we always started in the first of the book , but never finished the book. especially in math.

so we would do add, subtract, multiply, divide EVERY YEAR

but we'd never get to exponants....fractions...etc


also, in history we'd always learn the ancient stuff and never finished a book. we never made it past WW2


I love public school though. I think the PARENTS need to pay attention to what is being taught and what is NOT being taught and the PARENTS need to focus in on what is missing!

You can't expect the school to do EVERYTHING, but you should expect them to do around 90% and if they dont' MOVE to another BETTER district is my advice : )

[lilypad]

I agree with you sleepies that parents need to pay more attention to what their children are/are not learning at school and take a more active role in their child's education. I think the kids with involved parents are way more successful.
I was a teacher for 5 yrs in the public school system and it is very difficult to cover everything, especially since it seemed like 2 or 3 months at the beginning of the year are review. Which is frustrating for the teacher and for the students who remember what they did last year.
I have read a little more of the book and i really like what he says about how school places artificial time restraints on learning, for example if a student is really interested in something, when the bell rings they must move on whether they are finished or not. In a traditional school setting though i don't see any alternative to that.
I recommend the book, it is really interesting & easy to read.

[lauren]

I have the book and started it about a year ago. I really liked what I read, but got sidetracked and didn't finish it. Since you brought this up I think I'll fish it out and try to finish it!

[laralou]

I read it right before we started homeschooling too! I thought it was very interesting and wish I had it to throw at the administrators at ds's last school who were so mean to me.

[Mamaste]

Man sleepies, I thought I was the only one who'd never made it past WWI! :crying

[truly_sarah]

I don't think it's just public schools, I think it's a lot of things 'dumming us down'. Public school is just the most commonly blamed because it's where children spend a lot of time. I don't need a book to tell me about it - I can remember all the stupid countless hours I spent trying to entertain myself while the mercy of time did it's thing, the clock clicked, and the bell rang. If nothing else, school taught me to be patient and to make time my ally. It also gave me lots of time to mediate and think (sometimes about the ill effects of those darned buzzing fluorescents that were misaligned above our desks). For the most part, I had wonderful school colleagues and great teachers and most of them had independent studies in their classrooms, which meant you worked in a team of like-minded students, could move ahead as fast as you wanted, and socialize as much as you liked. I am really grateful for those teachers...and when I transferred schools I'm grateful that they let me enroll a year ahead and leave a year early rather than quoting some stupid law. (THey even let me finish out the year when we moved out of district! and the teachers sometimes gave me rides too.) I'm looking forward to going to my 20 year reunion this year.

Personally, I think the way the systems interact - the schools, the parents' work lives, the bus schedules, too much TV, lack of community resources, overzealous sports teams...all contribute to a type of apathy that is characterized by little thought and lots of going through the motions that are thought to be 'good', and it's this that leads to the 'dumbing down'. To do anything else requires too much effort, too much risk of social isolation, yet at the same time, very little effort (but lots of courage at the outset - a leap of faith/conviction).

Sarah

[laralou]

Funny thing, I was looking through a pile of books on the nightstand and guess what was on the bottom! Dumbing Us Down! I guess I reread it the last time I was home.

[applejuice]

I have read that book, and wish he had some references or footnotes to check up on and follow up on for future reading...

[saintmom]

He's also written The Underground History of Education.I think you can still buy it on his website.Their both interesting reads.Confirms my reasons for hs'ing,but then I've always thought outside the box :LOL Summerhill and John Holt are the other side of the coin.All these ideas really make you think about how to educate,how to teach or if children really need to be taught at all or instead allowed to learn for themselves.

[applejuice]

Hi! saint mom, we ARE outside the box...:LOL

[georgia]

LOVED this book! I bought copies for several friends. This book put into words so many things I didn't even realize were "problems." I'd never thought about it before.

JTG's essays that comprised the book are available online, too. Wonderfully thought provoking!!

[simple living mama]

He is in the process of making a 3 part documentary. Here is the link. I can't wait.

http://www.johntaylorgatto.com/fourthpurpose/gatto.htm

[mandib50]

i loved this book! i loved how he wasn't even a qualified teacher, took his roomates teaching certificate to get a job and has ended up winning numerous awards for teaching!

[RedWine]

Personally, I think the way the systems interact - the schools, the parents' work lives, the bus schedules, too much TV, lack of community resources, overzealous sports teams...all contribute to a type of apathy that is characterized by little thought and lots of going through the motions that are thought to be 'good', and it's this that leads to the 'dumbing down'. To do anything else requires too much effort, too much risk of social isolation, yet at the same time, very little effort (but lots of courage at the outset - a leap of faith/conviction).Sarah

Beautifully stated.

[simple living mama]

i loved this book! i loved how he wasn't even a qualified teacher, took his roomates teaching certificate to get a job and has ended up winning numerous awards for teaching!

Omg, that's a true life School of Rock!

[Karenwith4]

I was just rereading it. I do it before the holidays to give me a shot of confidence before I have to listen to my relatives tell me how wonderful school is - lol.

A friend of mine who is on the fence about homeschooling just borrowed it. I know homeschoolers rave about John Holt, but it was this book that clinched homeschooling for me and it still inspires me now.

Karen

[crunchyconmomma]

yep! LOVED this book and refer to ALL the time.

[crunchyconmomma]

He's also written The Underground History of Education.I think you can still buy it on his website.Their both interesting reads.Confirms my reasons for hs'ing,but then I've always thought outside the box :LOL Summerhill and John Holt are the other side of the coin.All these ideas really make you think about how to educate,how to teach or if children really need to be taught at all or instead allowed to learn for themselves.

one of 'em i could read for free, was it dumbing? i thought it was history b/c i remember the whole concept of the prussian model and carnegie and all being what i read online.

anyway, try to read it for free if you don't have the bucks to own since you need 'em to do all those crazy, spontaneous HSing projects with the kiddos! :wink

[crunchyconmomma]

yep you can read "history" online. just checked.

on't about anyone else, but i think that's a cool statement about the man - not so wrapped up in profits that this clouds the idea of just getting people to hear him.