Upper Valley moms?

[happyjuly3]

Hello,

Checking to see if there are any Upper Valley (VT,NH) moms outs there...?

We moved here in April - I've left 3 messages at the Upper Valley LLL with no call back and am looking for another way to find Mothering moms.

my ds is 13 mo., still attached to my finger to walk, and attached to my breast all night... I'm tired but I love it and enjoy every day we have together. We are always looking for ways to get some fun into the day - love to hear your ideas/suggestions.

thanks

[LdyBluNH@aol]

how cool! i'm originally from the upper valley : )

[sohj]

So, where are you?

We're in NYC right now, but own land in mostly Newbury with a little bit in Bradford and plan on moving there. Lived there when little. Don't know much about the LLL up there, but have a doc who, with his wife, seems to be a "Mothering" type: http://mothering.com/discussions/showthread.php?s=&threadid=64539

So, where are you from? What brought you to the Upper Valley?

There was another discussion on this forum for this general area: http://mothering.com/discussions/showthread.php?s=&threadid=41897 and this one is NOT about the Upper Valley, but may be of some help: http://mothering.com/discussions/showthread.php?s=&threadid=18424

Oh, and a hint. I think The Valley News is a useless paper, at least since it got bought up by the LA chain. Caledonian Record is VERY conservative but worth reading, Journal Opinion is local out of Bradford and useful for knowing stuff in the area, Times Argus (Montpelier) and Burlington Free Press are also worth reading. Unfortunately, the only one that you can get home delivery with is the Valley News.

[happyjuly3]

Hi,
Thanks for suggestions about the papers. I keep buyung the UV News just for the calendar - I keep trying to find things to do with the little guy and to get to know the area but I rarely read it because it doesn't feel worth the time. I'll check out the others...

We moved from San Francisco. We've been there the last 3 years. My husband is from the UK - we were in London before SF. We've moved a lot and were looking for a place to spend some time - especially since having a baby. Trying to find a good balance between access to outdoors but not too culturally remote. I quite liked the area around Peterborough in Southern NH but coincidentally my husband was offered a job in West Lebanon so we ended up in the Upper Valley (reality hits right?). We were in Piermont for a couple of months then rented a furnished place in Norwich for a couple of months to get to know the area. We are now looking for a place to rent/buy.

It takes a lot of time...

anyway, that's a long answer to your question.

I appreciated reading the other threads you sent. I think I'll go exploring out there one day.

I love NYC. We spent a couple of fun months there a long time ago when my husband did a quicky film school thing for fun.

:D

[sohj]

Wow! Norwich! It is really hard to find something affordable there.

Go up to Bradford for the Colatina Exit for dinner or The Perfect Pear (in the Mill building). And then check out the music at Middle Earth.

There's a pretty good restaurant on the Main drag in White River Junction, just across from the entrance to the railroad station parking lot. If people are coming to visit and you don't want them in your own house, I like the Coolidge Hotel just for its history. Small, comfortable and clean rooms. I've stayed there when getting someone from the train in a snowstorm with a lot of ice and didn't feel like driving back up to Newbury at the hour the train finally arrived.

Ask me questions! Please!! :)

Vermont is rural but I really refuse to think it is culturally remote. In fact, I have better intellectual discussions up there while weeding a garden with someone than I do in NYC. I think the space and peace and quiet there allow for some serious thinking.

[LdyBluNH@aol]

the montshire museum comes to mind, even if only for the trails

[happyjuly3]

Yes we went there for the 1st birthday and he had a blast. We have a membership and I'm sure we will be there several times over the winter.

nice to have it there..
thanks

[happyjuly3]

Also, just wanted to clarify that I did NOT mean to suggest that Vermont was culturally remote. Just the opposite. It's one of the reasons we are curious about the area because it does povide excellent access to the outdoors as well as an interesting and varied community.

thanks for the restaurant suggestions, we have scoped them out as we spent the first few months in Piermont, just across the river. We don't get much chance at the moment to go out in the evening (i.e. Middle Earth) because we haven't left ds with a sitter yet. I have seen some bands that looked good though...

[sohj]

First of all, I know that you don't think VT is culturally remote...my statement was more of a "Yeah, me too! You're right." kinda thing:) .

:D And on Middle Earth...IT IS NO SMOKING AND YOU CAN TAKE KIDS!!!!!!:D

Of course, if a show runs past bedtime, you might have trouble depending on the temperment of your little one. But, I've taken the pixie there and it was a success except when we didn't like the music.:p (It did happen once.)

The guy who runs it told me he opened it 'cause he wanted a place to go to hear music where he didn't have to breathe cig. smoke but could still have a beer if he wanted one. People told him it would never work, but it is VERY successful and cig. smokers still go there to see the music, they just leave to smoke. (Even in Feb.:rolleyes: )

[gus'smama]

Hey :)

I'm in Corinth (next town west of Bradford, about 40 min from Norwich). I have a 12 mos old (in 5 days) ds (I can't quite bring myself to say 1 y.o.!).

Come look up this way for houses! MUCH more affordable than Norwich, Thetford or Fairlee. And stay on this side of the river :)

Elsa

[sohj]

:OT Hey gus'smama....just thought you'd get a kick out of this...:p My cousin left Corinth in the 80s for Montana 'cause it was too crowded. My land is at the top of a mountain and, I keep trying to tell him, I really don't think two vehicles an hour driving by is heavy traffic. :mischief

[happyjuly3]

I don't think I've explored Corinth yet... I'll have to wander out some day. That's a funny comment about it being too crowded.

I'm interested in your suggestion to stay the VT side of the river. I know you were jesting in part but I have had a vague sense since arriving that people really feel a distinction between the two states but haven't ever had anyone describe the reasons to me. I am aware of the differences in taxes but I was more interested in the cultural differences - the "values, attitudes, and norms or behavior". Is it possible that they really are that different or is it more an individualized self identity process?

I'm off topic too...

And back on topic....I'm going to keep an eye on the Middle Earth line up and try it sometime. I didn't realize it would be ok the bring the little guy. Thanks.

[gus'smama]

sohj -- funny. But, I guess compared to Montana, it is crowded. I mean, I can see one of my neigbors houses if I'm in my front yard. And, in the winter, I can see the roof of another one, If I crick my neck just right

happyjuly3 -- Um, in all seriousness, no they probably aren't all that different. But, we Vermonters feel strongly that we're better :). I do think the overall political climate is much more liberal here. But both states have their fair share of hippies, liberals, rednecks, conservatives, etc.

Actually, you may also want to look in Randolph. Property values have been rising there, but still cheaper than Norwich. And a nice, family centered community. (I grew up there, vowed to move away, and then the town "revitalized" while I was away, and I often wish I lived there again:rolleyes:)

What are your criteria for a community? Size? Rural or in-town? Distance to grocery store, co-op, alt. education?

S. Royalton and Chelsea are both nice too. Chelsea has a waldorf school, S. Ro has a co-op and a law school...

Its late, I'm rambling:) :zzz

[sohj]

Well, one way of explaining the differences is exactly by referring to the tax system. VT has more taxes. New Hampsters:) like to remind us of this. HOWEVER, as any small business owner in New Hampshire can tell you, though there are fewer taxes, they get it out of you in other ways...like "boiler inspection fees". (That point of view contributed by a friend with a business in Woodsville, NH, a great little town opposite Wells River, VT, another great little village, part of the township of Newbury, VT.)

So, Vermonters like to think that their way is more straight forward and easier to budget (taxes can be predicted, boiler inspection fees can't). This allows more services to be enjoyed, both financed by the state and by smaller localities. A lot of people tell me that they think the VT educational system is a lot better. I have no personal experience to back that up.

I do know that at one point, possibly even now, NH had the largest percentage of millionaires per capita in the nation, yet still had very poor services for basic things like roads. (Most roads get financed by the state government. In VT even some local roads get some state money, it is just meted out by the town selectboards.) The millionaires all live in southern NH and many work in MA. Personally, I prefer a state where the millionaires earn their money where they live so some of the rest of the population can get a job at the factory/mill/warehouse/office/whatever it is that makes so much money for someone...instead of treating the place one lives as essentially an "offshore" residence to avoid taxes. After all, as I tell anyone who'll listen, I don't object to taxes, I object to not gettting enough say in what they are put to.

But, on the other hand, the business about the taxes might not mean so much any more as I have heard that NH is changing things a little bit, centered around the way schools are financed.

And, in any case, none of this matters if you find a place you like with neighbors you want to live with. :) Ultimately, that is the most important thing in a rural town. Neighbors who respect each other. You don't have to be in and out of each other's kitchens all day, you don't even have to be friends, but, you do have to live together.



edited to add (if anyone is still reading this polemic! :eek ):

I thought of a couple of other differences that can have major implications. One, the state mottos. New Hampshire's is Live Free or Die (my husband thinks it should be Live Freeze or Die:p ) ... definately an unambiguous statement, that. Of course, putting it into effect is another story... On the other hand, Vermont's is the logical impossibility Freedom and Unity. Somehow we make it work. Not sure how. :scratch Two, Vermont, alone in the nation, has a requirement called the Freeman's Oath. You have to take it when you register to vote. (Actually, I'm not sure if you have to take it if you are Quaker...I'd assume you don't.) It states that you will vote your conscience and not your party. A radically old-fashioned political ideal, if I've ever encountered one. Also, you don't party-affiliate. Wait till the elections...see how it works!:love

Do I sound shamelessly pro-Vermont, or what?!?!?

[sohj]

Just a plug for this month's Behind the Times.... [BehindTheTimes@ItsClassified.com]

There's an article about something that sounds like a whole lot of fun called Valley Quest. It is a treasure hunt hike (or Letterbox) with all the clues in rhyme. You can also find out about it from Steve Glazer at www.vitalcommunities.org .

Also, in case any Upper Valley people aren't familiar with it, the paper is worth getting just for info. about events in the area and the Selectboard Reports.

[maxmom]

Hi!
I'm a Mama, writer, midwife and wife, living in Randolph with my 20-m.o. son and my husband who's going to law school in So. Royalton. We relocated from Santa Fe NM just over a year ago. It's nice to come across this discussion.

happyjuly3--I'm sorry you didn't hear from the LLL Leaders in your area but you're more than welcome to join the group I go to in Montpelier. We meet every third Tuesday of the month at 9:30 am at the Unitarian Church on Main. Also the annual "Baby Sale" is happening on Sat, Sept 6th at the Bethany Church on Main from 9-1. Good baby gear, clothing, etc all to support the local LLL. If you would like to get introduced to Randolph we could maybe meet at a nice park here, let me know! I'm always looking for like minded women here. It takes more effort here, which I'm learning to make.

[happyjuly3]

Hi all,

Well we decided to rent to give ourselves more time to get to know the area and to go through a winter and see how we fare. The end of the month was closing in so we chose the best of what I had seen and it happened to be in NH....I really chose the house more for the inside (space for the winter months) and less for the location. We will be on lake mascoma which is very pretty and peaceful but I don't get any sense of a community since it is a vacation area. I may come to regret that. hmmm. we'll see.

Anyway. thanks for the VT vs NH commentary :) I have found that I prefer the feel of VT towns in general but wasn't quite sure why. If we were to settle here I imagine we would end up in VT. It just feels better. For now we really wanted a short commute for dh so he can spend as much time as possible with us.

Maxmom, thanks for the info about Montpelier. I like the town a lot and am happy to have an excuse to go up there. I will try to make a meeting. I'm returning from a trip on Sept 4th so probably won't make the sale but will tell a friend who goes up a lot.

I would love to come to Randolf. We like parks and it would be nice to get together.

What's the best way for me to get in touch? I don't get a chance to log on too often but manage it at least once a week. It's not too far from Corinth or Bradford either... maybe the others are interested too?

Sohj - thanks for the behind the times tip and Valley Quest. I've seen the book but had not managed to learn when the walks were scheduled. I'll check the website.

bye all

[sohj]

good thinking happyjuly3. Take your time and get to know the area. I don't suggest following my example, but, just to give you an idea of my glacial pace in finding a place to live, I took twelve years to find the right piece of land in the right place before buying. :rolleyes: And I lived in Newbury as a little child and my mother's god mother lived there (until she died in 2000) and loads of friends. So, its not like I was coming in cold.

Lake Mascoma IS beautiful. Enjoy it. And, you're right, vacation areas tend to be low on the obvious community. But, if you are a church goer, or make an effort to go to whatever events there are "off-season" (like game suppers...no, you don't play games, you eat game:p [of course, that isn't an option if you are vegetarian:O]...or community meetings on whatever topic -- no matter how frustrated you are with something being said, don't add your two cents, just listen, you'll find out soooo much about potential neighbors that way!:)) you can get to know those who live there all year round.

And, please, :nono don't call Montpelier a town...that's our Capitol!:wink When you go there, check out Bear Pond Books, Rivendell Books (?, the used book store up the street from Bear Pond), and the DMV. I'm serious. It is sooooo small. The same people have been working there for years. You can catch up with them when you go in to renew your license. And old timers are complaining these days about how impersonal it is.

And, if you'd like to come up to Newbury/Bradford area, I'd be happy to meet. I'm up there about twice a month, more if I can manage it. (I work in NYC for my sins...someday I'll have my own company working with wind power generation based out of my "compound" in Newbury!) edited to add: either pm or e-mail me through this board.

gus'smama, maxmom and I will be your cruise directors.....:wave

[maxmom]

I don't know where Lake Mascoma is, but good luck with it. I hope you're not too far from a nice place that allows for winter activities. I mentioned that I feel like it takes more effort here to make friends, and I feel the same about activities. It's more work to find the things and places to go with my babe, especially in the winter. But Randolph has a library with story time, and we'll be doing a toddler music class in MtPelier this winter. Look for a story time activity near you, and if you're near Montshire that's a great place to pass an afternoon.

If you want to get ahold of me, just use the Personal Mail (PM) option here and we can make arrangements to meet. There's a great park in Randolph on the 3rd Branch of the White River with a playground that we walk to regularly and we could easily walk into town from there if you want. Or if you want to come up to the next LLL meeting which is on Tuesday, we could meet there just as well!

[sohj]

This is an article about how hard it can be to find an affordable place to live in the Upper Valley. It is written by someone who is generally a good writer, even though it is in my least favorite VT newspaper. http://www.vnews.com/news/otherside/one.htm

And this is a page from a state government website that has a list of links to learn more about the state: http://www.vermontpersonnel.org/jobapplicant/aboutvt.cfm