Amount of aluminum in vaccines - detailed list - Mothering Forums

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#1 of 77 Old 12-23-2007, 01:34 PM - Thread Starter
 
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I keep seeing posts stating that Pediarix has a lot less aluminum than its separate parts. Actually, the amount in Pediarix is only 25 mcg less than the sum of its parts. If you add up the separate vaccines that go into Pediarix, you can see that Pediarix only has 25 mcg less than its separate vaccines. Here is the list out of Dr Sears book. The only one that he mentions that actually has a lot LESS than the sum of its parts is Comvax. I hope this clears up some misinformation that has been posted. If anyone sees anything incorrect that I have posted, please feel free to correct it.

"ActHib - 0 mcg
PedVaxHib - 225 mcg
Prevnar - 125 mcg
Daptacel (DTaP) - 330 mcg
Tripedia (DTaP) - 170 mcg
Infanrix (DTaP) - 625 mcg
Recombivax (HepB) - 250 mcg
Engerix B (HepB) - 250 mcg
Polio - 0 mcg
MMR - 0 mcg
Chic Pox - 0 mcg
Hep A - 250 mcg

Combo Vaccines:
Comvax (hep B as Recombivax and HIB as PedVaxHIB) - 225 mcg. This particular combo vax has LESS aluminum than getting the shots separately.

Pentacel (DTaP as Daptacel, HIB as ActHIB and polio) - 1500 mcg. This shot has a lot MORE aluminum that the sum of its parts. You actually get 5 times the amount of aluminum than if you were to get the shots separately.

Pediarix (DTaP as Infanrix, hepB as EngerixB and polio) - 850 mcg

TriHIBit (DTaP as Tripedia and HIB as ActHIB) - 170 mcg"
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#2 of 77 Old 12-23-2007, 02:38 PM
 
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It is amazing how much they can vary for the same vaccine. And sad that it is not regulated more to minimize effects on children.
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#3 of 77 Old 12-23-2007, 03:17 PM
 
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I just read the new Mothering article about Aluminum and immediately wanted to look up the mcg for the one vaccine Milena got before we stopped (tripedia). Of the 3 DTaPs, it appears to have the least amount of aluminum. Which I guess is reassuring?? ARGH.

I'm SO glad we stopped vaxxing when we did. I am shocked at how many parents say "oh the thimerosal is out now, so they're fine." which is true until they find the NEXT thing.

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#4 of 77 Old 12-23-2007, 04:48 PM
 
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which is true until they find the NEXT thing.
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#5 of 77 Old 12-23-2007, 04:57 PM - Thread Starter
 
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I am shocked at how many parents say "oh the thimerosal is out now, so they're fine." which is true until they find the NEXT thing.
That's exactly right. Even Dr Sears, who seems very pro-vaccine in general, stated in his book that he is afraid that aluminum is going to be the "next thimerosal".

The amounts listed above are very concerning, seeing that the amount that is safe on any given day for an infant is the following:

Page 198 Dr Sears book - "Using the 5 microgram per kilogram per day criterion from the first FDA document as a minumum amount we know a healthy baby can handle, a twelve-pound, two-month-old baby can safely get at least 30 micrograms of aluminum in one day."
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#6 of 77 Old 12-23-2007, 06:43 PM
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It is amazing how much they can vary for the same vaccine. And sad that it is not regulated more to minimize effects on children.
It is regulated: www.hhs.gov/nvpo/nvac/documents/Aluminumws.pdf

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Originally Posted by amydep View Post
The amounts listed above are very concerning, seeing that the amount that is safe on any given day for an infant is the following:

Page 198 Dr Sears book - "Using the 5 microgram per kilogram per day criterion from the first FDA document as a minumum amount we know a healthy baby can handle, a twelve-pound, two-month-old baby can safely get at least 30 micrograms of aluminum in one day."
I am not questioning whether this appears in Sear's book, I don't have it, but I don't think this figure is correct. Humans ingest much more than this starting in infancy.

SM
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#7 of 77 Old 12-23-2007, 06:54 PM
 
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Originally Posted by Science Mom View Post
It is regulated: www.hhs.gov/nvpo/nvac/documents/Aluminumws.pdf

I am not questioning whether this appears in Sear's book, I don't have it, but I don't think this figure is correct. Humans ingest much more than this starting in infancy.

SM
That was the meeting where no one could find where the maximum dosage figure came from, right?
Where they were saying the original research was lost?
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#8 of 77 Old 12-23-2007, 07:06 PM
 
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SM, I know aluminum is regulated. I said it was sad that it was not MORE regulated. Based on the list in the OP, the amount of aluminum seems to vary quite a bit between vaccines for the same VPDs.

And thanks for that link. There is a lot of information in there that I will read after the holidays.
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#9 of 77 Old 12-23-2007, 07:10 PM
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If you are referring to the San Juan meeting, then yes, I believe so. The amount of aluminum in vaccines is considerably lower than the maximum isn't it?

SM
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#10 of 77 Old 12-23-2007, 08:16 PM
 
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Originally Posted by amydep View Post
I keep seeing posts stating that Pediarix has a lot less aluminum than its separate parts. Actually, the amount in Pediarix is only 25 mcg less than the sum of its parts. If you add up the separate vaccines that go into Pediarix, you can see that Pediarix only has 25 mcg less than its separate vaccines. Here is the list out of Dr Sears book. The only one that he mentions that actually has a lot LESS than the sum of its parts is Comvax. I hope this clears up some misinformation that has been posted. If anyone sees anything incorrect that I have posted, please feel free to correct it.

"ActHib - 0 mcg
PedVaxHib - 225 mcg
Prevnar - 125 mcg
Daptacel (DTaP) - 330 mcg
Tripedia (DTaP) - 170 mcg
Infanrix (DTaP) - 625 mcg
Recombivax (HepB) - 250 mcg
Engerix B (HepB) - 250 mcg
Polio - 0 mcg
MMR - 0 mcg
Chic Pox - 0 mcg
Hep A - 250 mcg

Combo Vaccines:
Comvax (hep B as Recombivax and HIB as PedVaxHIB) - 225 mcg. This particular combo vax has LESS aluminum than getting the shots separately.

Pentacel (DTaP as Daptacel, HIB as ActHIB and polio) - 1500 mcg. This shot has a lot MORE aluminum that the sum of its parts. You actually get 5 times the amount of aluminum than if you were to get the shots separately.

Pediarix (DTaP as Infanrix, hepB as EngerixB and polio) - 850 mcg

TriHIBit (DTaP as Tripedia and HIB as ActHIB) - 170 mcg"

The amount of aluminum in the recommended indiv. dose of a biological product shall not exceed 1.250mg.

When you give multiple vaccines containing aluminum it can exceed this.
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#11 of 77 Old 12-23-2007, 08:26 PM
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The amount of aluminum in the recommended indiv. dose of a biological product shall not exceed 1.250mg.

When you give multiple vaccines containing aluminum it can exceed this.
References please.

SM
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#12 of 77 Old 12-23-2007, 09:01 PM
 
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I found the following to be quite interesting as well, specifically the first two, I'll quote the whole list for posterity.

http://www.hhs.gov/nvpo/nvac/documents/Aluminumws.pdf (your link, SM)

The second panel discussed “what we don’t know” about
aluminum-containing adjuvants and identified the following
areas to be more thoroughly studied.

1. Toxicology and pharmacokinetics of aluminum adjuvants.
Specifically, the processing of aluminum by
infants and children.

2. Mechanisms by which aluminum adjuvants interact with
the immune system
.

3. Necessity of adjuvants in booster doses.
4. Definition of frequency and duration of the MMF lesion
in normal people.
5. Role of aluminum in the pathophysiology of the MMF
lesion.
6. Human control studies to assess the relationship between
the “symptom complex” identified by Dr. Gherardi in
patients who have the MMF lesion and the MMF lesion.
7. New adjuvant development.
8. Expanded trials of IM rather than the SQ route of injection
for anthrax vaccine and non-needle vaccine administration
technologies.
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#13 of 77 Old 12-23-2007, 10:27 PM
 
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How about some perspective on what exactly a milligram of neurotoxin can do to the human brain. Aluminum is injected in milligram amounts. Yet it only takes .002 mg (or 2 mcg) of aluminum to alter normal gene expression in the brain.
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#14 of 77 Old 12-23-2007, 10:36 PM
 
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Insider-do you have a reference for that? I am in a discussion with someone about this and that would be the perfect fact to include, but I can't find sources.

The minimal reduction of aluminium is not worth it especially when you consider that it is then all entering the one injection site. Aluminium is known to cause the lumps in the muscle with some shots-increasing that dose of aluminium into the one spot rather than spreading it around can only be a bad thing, can only increase side effects like that.
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#15 of 77 Old 12-23-2007, 10:54 PM
 
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Here is a link to a post in a thread in the archives with some references on the dangers of aluminum, to get you started.

http://www.mothering.com/discussions...0&postcount=16
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#16 of 77 Old 12-24-2007, 01:12 AM
 
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How about some perspective on what exactly a milligram of neurotoxin can do to the human brain. Aluminum is injected in milligram amounts. Yet it only takes .002 mg (or 2 mcg) of aluminum to alter normal gene expression in the brain.
The daily estimated intake of an average adult is

8 mg - I will repeat, per day.


reference
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#17 of 77 Old 12-24-2007, 01:36 AM
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How about some perspective on what exactly a milligram of neurotoxin can do to the human brain. Aluminum is injected in milligram amounts. Yet it only takes .002 mg (or 2 mcg) of aluminum to alter normal gene expression in the brain.
Yes, please references.

SM
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#18 of 77 Old 12-24-2007, 01:39 AM
 
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The daily estimated intake of an average adult is

8 mg - I will repeat, per day.
I don't think how much aluminum an adult eats is really relevant. I'm concerned with how much gets to a baby's brain. That's where a neurotoxin does its damage.

The Most Important Person on earth is a mother...She has built something more magnificent than any cathedral-a dwelling for an immortal soul, the tiny perfection of her baby's bodyâ¦-Cardinal Mindszenty
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#19 of 77 Old 12-24-2007, 01:47 AM
 
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Thanks for sharing! I had no idea that the amount wasn't much less.

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Originally Posted by huggerwocky View Post
The daily estimated intake of an average adult is

8 mg - I will repeat, per day.


reference
Yes and we've been through the whole injection vs. ingestion thing before, too. No point in entering that whole debate again, because it really seems like we go over this topic again and again and again. I don't see much disagreement that there is a difference in the two when we're talking about pretty much every other drug.

Edit: Your own link says the average infant's daily intake is less than 1 mg. It also says this:

Quote:
While it is true that most of our daily intake of aluminum comes from food, only a very small percentage - usually less than 1% - is actually absorbed by the body.
Emphasis mine.
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#20 of 77 Old 12-24-2007, 03:03 AM
 
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If you are referring to the San Juan meeting, then yes, I believe so. The amount of aluminum in vaccines is considerably lower than the maximum isn't it?

SM
The max is .85 milligrams.
How much might someone recieve via vaxes on one day at a max? (with 4 al adjuvanted vaxes on one day).

Also, how sound is the science behind the .85 milligram limit? Was that limit designed for an infant or an adult?

How can we check that if no one knows where it came from???
If it's from the distant past, they might have had some goofy ideas about things back then. Or maybe not.
Who knows?

I found an old link to the Puerto Rico discussion on it, btw:
http://www.mothering.com/discussions...2&postcount=63
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#21 of 77 Old 12-24-2007, 03:10 AM
 
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If the numbers in the OP are right, and the average al content is 250 micrograms, times 4 that's 1,000 micrograms, being 1 mg...that's over the limit, although not by much.
Correct?
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#22 of 77 Old 12-24-2007, 03:12 AM
 
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Originally Posted by huggerwocky View Post
The daily estimated intake of an average adult is

8 mg - I will repeat, per day.


reference
The uptake by the gut is very, very low.
.1% for aluminum hydroxide.
The gut is good at keeping aluminum OUT.
No comparison to something injected.
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#23 of 77 Old 12-24-2007, 09:07 AM
 
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Actually, if I'm not mistaken...thimerosal was NEVER removed from the vaccines. As of the "effective date" pharms were not allowed to create vax's with thimerosal...and that ban has since been vetoed, so they're back to doing it again.

However, the pharms were allowed to finish producing the vax's that were started before the effective date of the ban and also allowed to distribute the vax's that were created before the ban because no one wanted to waste any vax's.

It's kind of disturbing to know that my cat's get vaccinated with vax's that are thimerosal free because it's been banned by the Veterianian Association (don't remember the exact name)...but children are still getting vaxed with thimerosal-preserved vaxs.

Minute amounts, maybe, but add up all the vax's that they are "required" to get (up to 136 between birth and 5 years) and it's no wonder that there has been a rise in children's health/mental health issues...
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#24 of 77 Old 12-24-2007, 12:10 PM
 
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The amount of aluminum in the recommended indiv. dose of a biological product shall not exceed 1.250mg.

When you give multiple vaccines containing aluminum it can exceed this.
Comes from the Book of Regulations for how people can regulate vaccines-cite: 21CPR Title 21 Vol 7. Sec 610.15

Unfortunately they aren't following it or taking into consideration that when you give multiple vaccines in one day containing Aluminum, they are exceeding that.

Same thing happened with Thimerosal.
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#25 of 77 Old 12-24-2007, 12:38 PM
 
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Actually, if I'm not mistaken...thimerosal was NEVER removed from the vaccines. As of the "effective date" pharms were not allowed to create vax's with thimerosal...and that ban has since been vetoed, so they're back to doing it again.

However, the pharms were allowed to finish producing the vax's that were started before the effective date of the ban and also allowed to distribute the vax's that were created before the ban because no one wanted to waste any vax's.
There was never any nationwide ban, actually. They removed it voluntarily, at the request of the government. They did, however, finish using up the stock that had already been manufactured, all of which expired in 2003, IIRC. So aside from the flu vaccine, all of the vaccines on the regular childhood schedule are either thimerosal-free or have only trace amounts, which means that thimerosal was used in the production to keep it sterile, then filtered out at the end. If you start giving vaccines not on the schedule, though, some of them might have thimerosal.
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#26 of 77 Old 12-24-2007, 03:02 PM
 
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Pentacel (DTaP as Daptacel, HIB as ActHIB and polio) - 1500 mcg.
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#27 of 77 Old 12-24-2007, 03:35 PM
 
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Yep...pentacel has 1.5 milligrams of aluminum phosphate:
package insert
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#28 of 77 Old 12-24-2007, 03:56 PM
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MK, Let's try and find out what the amount of aluminum is in Pentacel which is the crux of the discussion.

SM
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#29 of 77 Old 12-24-2007, 04:44 PM
 
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Alumium phosphate is an aluminum salt. My impression is that when the limit was set, it was for the salts. There's not a different limit for al hydroxide and al phosphate, for example. (that I know of).
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#30 of 77 Old 12-24-2007, 04:45 PM
 
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I tried to look this up and found what mk says. I also found that my baking powder, Rumford, is alum-free. Not that I actually bake a lot but I thought it was interesting that it is.
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