Which exemption for Montessori preschool? - Page 2 - Mothering Forums

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Old 03-25-2007, 12:45 AM
 
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Hey Knowerofnada, the not understanding each other goes both ways. By your definition of religion you are lying, by my definition of religion you are not. But your definition is definitely the one you live with, so if you say you are lying, then you are.

And I do agree with you that it is lousy that the current laws require people to define themselves as "religious" in order to protect their children from toxic drugs...or homeschool. Since defining themselves as religious is, in fact, offensive to people, these laws are unfair.

I just like philosophical arguments and meant absolutely nothing personal about you or your beliefs.

For me the religious, the spiritual and the philosophical do shade into each other.
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Old 03-25-2007, 02:26 AM
 
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I wanted to add that the whole question of what is or is not "religion" is an incredibly complex and confusing one.

Religion includes: ancient and modern paganism (and paganism is a very broad term covering hundreds, if not thousands of variations); shamanism; every possible variation on monotheism; every oddball cult and group that call themselves a religion; voodoo; wicca and probably many things I've forgotten and overlooked; for example Buddhism.

So, please, someone tell me what all these varieties of "religion" have in common? And what is this common factor that makes it impossible for some people to describe themselves as religious?

I could see it if we could define religion to just include the major modern religious sects: Hinduism, Buddhism, Christianity, Judaism and Mohammedanism, but that is, IMO, very unfair to all the other varieties of religious belief and experience. If someone wants to worship the Olympian gods...more power to 'em! Or nature spirits. Or truth, goodness and beauty. The Ancient Greeks used to sacrifice to rivers before they crossed over them. A matter of courtesy AND appeasement.

I like the quirkiness and diversity of the human picture and delight in the odder bits of human history. And much of our religious history definitely qualifies as odder bits (for the record I disapprove of human or animal sacrifices).
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Old 03-25-2007, 04:25 PM - Thread Starter
 
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Originally Posted by timberwolf View Post
Oh Hey there! Yep the winters are still the same, you're not missing out ha ha.

I am overall pretty pleased with the laid back atmosphere of vaxing here (so far my GP is very cool). Like I said it is really just next year for a few days a week and then he is in public school which should be fine.

Good luck with the system there, hey you could always come home

Terri
Well, I have thought of coming home......briefly.....then I talk to my sister after a 40 below stretch and come to my senses! We'd love to move to Vancouver or Victoria though.

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Originally Posted by wednesday View Post
DH is an attorney and you should hear him on the topic. He's very into the clarity of language in legal statutes, like whether or not they are clearly defined. The simple fact is that you can't define a religious belief in the first place. A religious belief is whatever a person says it is, you can't "prove" or "disprove" what a person says they believe.

We don't have a philosophical exemption in NC so it's a moot point for me, but I agree with those who feel a religious exemption is "safer". It really is pretty sacred in our culture that you don't mess with people's religious beliefs, even when they seem kooky.


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Originally Posted by knowerofnada View Post
ITA that a religious belief does not mean that you have to subscribe to a particular religion; that has been very well established multiple times on this forum and elsewhere, even being written into the laws regarding religious exemption.
ITA with you guys. It's not that I disagree that the religious exemption is appropriate for my situation. I actually do believe there is a greater power that guides us but I just don't think any organized religion (that I've come across. Admittedly I haven't really felt the need to look too hard because I'm very comfortable with my personal beliefs and have never felt the need to join any organized group to share with) really does it justice imo.

My beef with the religious exemption is that I just think it's unfair that we are forced to fall back on a religious belief to defend what isn't necessarily a decision that has anything to do with religion. Sure, I believe that whatever greater power it was that guided us into creation included some pretty amazing mechanisms that allow us to fight disease and even heal ourselves. What I don't believe is that any government has the right to force medical treatment on me or my child.

So, really I guess the reason I don't vax my kid is because I don't feel it's necessary because of a somewhat religious belief. However, I don't feel that that is anyone's business but my own and I should have the right to refuse vaccines even if I do believe they are of value. It should be my choice. In other words, I don't feel I'm lying if I submit a religious exemption, I would just rather be able to comfortably use a philosophical exemption to object to the practice of forced vaccination.

As I said before, I will do whatever it takes. But I don't have to like it!

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Originally Posted by onelilguysmommy View Post
look at it this way- if you ever move to a state without philisophical, youd have to pull religion, right?
okay so then someone miught question why you didnt do it to begin with, etc and it might be a headache....
That's a very good point. For us, however, there's very little chance we'll live anywhere else in the US. If we ever move again, it'll be back to Canada. We love it here in the Pacific Northwest - the weather is nice, the people are amazing, and we still get CBC-TV on cable (a must for my hockey-loving husband). And we're only a couple hours drive from Canada!

Still, I am in agreement that the religious exemption is the way to go. Like I said, I'll do what it takes.

Thanks again for a great discussion on this subject!

Tracy
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Old 03-27-2007, 06:26 PM - Thread Starter
 
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Well, I took the paperwork over to the school this morning. The director shuffled through the papers, glanced briefly at the exemption form and asked if I knew about the requirement to keep my kid home if there is an outbreak. I said yes. He went on to explain (or maybe defend himself) saying that it had nothing to do with the school (I took this to mean that if he had it his way, the unvaxed kids would be able to stay) but that the Public Health Dept. tells them what to do in those cases (ie. they tell the school to send all the unvaxed home). Then he said they've never had to send unvaxed kids home due to an outbreak in the 30 years he's run the school. Feeling good right now.
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Old 03-27-2007, 07:41 PM
 
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Glad it worked out!!!
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Old 03-27-2007, 10:19 PM
 
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Originally Posted by traycanadian View Post
Well, I took the paperwork over to the school this morning. The director shuffled through the papers, glanced briefly at the exemption form and asked if I knew about the requirement to keep my kid home if there is an outbreak. I said yes. He went on to explain (or maybe defend himself) saying that it had nothing to do with the school (I took this to mean that if he had it his way, the unvaxed kids would be able to stay) but that the Public Health Dept. tells them what to do in those cases (ie. they tell the school to send all the unvaxed home). Then he said they've never had to send unvaxed kids home due to an outbreak in the 30 years he's run the school. Feeling good right now.
Awesome news. I pray our family's experiences are similar when the time comes for them to enter private school. So did you stick with the religious exemption?
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Old 03-28-2007, 01:22 PM - Thread Starter
 
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So did you stick with the religious exemption?
Of course! You don't think I'd solicit 2 pages of wise-mama opinions and then just ignore them, do you? Okay, well, I might....but not this time! Religious all the way. Thanks ladies!
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Old 03-28-2007, 09:34 PM
 
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I am so glad this worked out, and I appreciated reading everyone's very thoughtful comments on religion and identity. I had felt so many of the same frustrations about religious exemption in the beginning, too, but the form vaguely defines it as "deeply held personal belief" and that couldn't be more accurate for most of us here, and all of us in this thread.

::: Just another WAHM using this forum to put off picking up toys and cleaning my house.
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