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Old 05-05-2003, 09:46 AM - Thread Starter
 
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Title sounds trite and boring- but worth the read.

Interesting Op-Ed:

http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmp...still_watching

Check it out!...Joyce in the mts.

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Old 05-05-2003, 10:00 AM
 
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It's somehow a mixed bag, this article. It seeems on the one hand like things were worse during WW1, so I guess we should be thankful - yet I don't really feel like the US is so far different than then - and comparitive injustice is misleading. Interesting artilce - but a bit depressing.
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Old 05-05-2003, 11:03 AM - Thread Starter
 
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Funny...I saw it differently...I thought it was fairly predictive of ways in which things like the Patriot Acts (1&2) and the new powers for FBI and CIA can work to intimidate citizens....as similar powers had before, historically.

(But that may just be my weak reading comprehension and ADD working....and dyslexia doesn't help either. I hit the jackpot with learning issues so maybe my take on the article is mistaken.)

OT:
Perhaps "depressed" energy can be more well-spent in raising money for your favorite Dem. candidate in 2004.

I realize it is hard to change gears from war horrors to 2004, but I think it is necessary. I have seen reports that say Mr. Bush plans to raise twice what he did for his last campaign. Time to get busy. His Bush "Pioneers" are folks who pledge to raise or donate at least $100,000. Seems that if they raise even more, they get preference when it comes to appointments to cool jobs:

(From the NY Times you can get a "daypass" to read articles but here's a snip of the article)

snip from NYTimes:

"The documents, which surfaced in the courtroom fight over the new campaign finance law, offer new details about Mr. Bush's most active fund-raisers — including his top three, who were awarded plum jobs as ambassadors.

They also show that more than 500 people signed up to be "Pioneers" by promising to raise at least $100,000 for Mr. Bush from individual donors. Previously, the Bush campaign had said that about 230 people had become Pioneers by raising $100,000."

more here:
http://www.nytimes.com/2003/05/05/politics/05DONO.html

And you know...Salon already likes Mr. Leiberman (D- Republican Lite) and declared him the winner in the first debates...and so it begins...the selling of a Democratic Candidate who would be obedient and carry on the "Bush Legacy" and others' plans and goals. Wanna bet that he is nominated in 2000 no matter what?

more about that here:
http://www.salon.com/news/feature/20.../index_np.html

And then there is the issue of voting machines:
http://www.newtimesbpb.com/issues/20...l/1/index.html

Energy could even go to assisting folks, especially young'uns who will qualify in 2004, in registering to vote. Check out Granny D.:
http://www.grannyd.com/

I don't know...just rambling, I guess.

Historic info is power to prevent and if prevention is not possible, then resistance is my next action. If we give up to depression do we also give in to repeating history?

Like I said...I don't know...it remains to be seen, eh?....Joyce in the mts.

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Old 05-05-2003, 11:39 AM
 
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Quote:
Originally posted by Joyce in the mts.
Funny...I saw it differently...I thought it was fairly predictive of ways in which things like the Patriot Acts (1&2) and the new powers for FBI and CIA can work to intimidate citizens....as similar powers had before, historically.
I think you got it right and that is sorta what I meant - but I do think things haven't gotten as bad as what was written there - yet - but I am expecting more to come . . .
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Originally posted by Joyce in the mts.
OT:
Perhaps "depressed" energy can be more well-spent in raising money for your favorite Dem. candidate in 2004.
Good idea -- but I don't have a fav, yet - so I'm involved with the "Democrats Abroad", as well as "Americans in Berlin Against the War" - yet that will not appropriately deal with the overall depression and shock of how far the US has come in isolationism and violence (overt and covert)
Quote:
Originally posted by Joyce in the mts.
I realize it is hard to change gears from war horrors to 2004,
Nope, not hard at all - it was already a priority before the war horrors!
Quote:
Originally posted by Joyce in the mts.
but I think it is necessary. I have seen reports that say Mr. Bush plans to raise twice what he did for his last campaign. Time to get busy. His Bush "Pioneers" are folks who pledge to raise or donate at least $100,000. Seems that if they raise even more, they get preference when it comes to appointments to cool jobs:,
Here is where I am!!!
Do you know what the Communist Party's version of Girl/Boy Scouts was called? The Pioneers!!:LOL
Quote:
Originally posted by Joyce in the mts.
Historic info is power to prevent and if prevention is not possible, then resistance is my next action. If we give up to depression do we also give in to repeating history?
I said it was depressing - not that I am depressed - don't worry - I'm not giving up yet - but it is nice and cosey over here!
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Old 05-05-2003, 12:00 PM
 
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Originally posted by Joyce in the mts.
And then there is the issue of voting machines:
http://www.newtimesbpb.com/issues/20...l/1/index.html
That was an interesting article - a bit too long, but interesting. What amazes me is how often people can get away with unethical dealings - like those who were getting, basically, kickbacks from the voting businesses. You know, this may be waaaaaayyy T but - how can the US judge the United Nations when people (ie. Enron, et.al) are getting away with all kinds of illegal, and unethical stuff - but as long as they make money off it, they seem to be protected . . . no one really wants to go through all the effort needed to follow up on misuse of tax dollars.: sheesh!
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Old 05-05-2003, 12:10 PM - Thread Starter
 
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"...but I do think things haven't gotten as bad as what was written there - yet - ...."
Aye...THERE'S the rub: "YET"!!!! This op-ed helps us fill in the blanks about what could come, imo.

"...Communist Party's version of Girl/Boy Scouts was called? The Pioneers!!..." Believe me, the irony is not lost on me for sure! :Puke

"I said it was depressing - not that I am depressed..."
GOOD! Glad you are not depressed. You are in a unique position, where you are...and only you know how to work it!

It IS really hard to be here in the states and watch folks just accept the news, and go along to get along.

...Joyce in the mts.

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Old 05-05-2003, 12:18 PM - Thread Starter
 
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You ask a really good question, El!

And we can apply the same logic to so many other ethical issues that have come up since this administration took office.

In addition, I think we have to remember that it is one of the most basic human tendencies to project what we are capable of but hide from or don't want to "own", onto others and this may explain some of what you are asking about. But I believe it is an Achille's heel too.

If you want to know what "they" are up to...just see what "they" are accusing others of, if you get my drift...and I am sure that you do get it. Seems to work every time. Have you seen that too?

Just my take and my sick twisted mind working ...Joyce in the mts.

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