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#121 of 124 Old 02-28-2002, 08:13 PM
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paula bear,
I agree with you. Very well put. I wish you would start another thread to discuss those things.


oops I was replying at the same time as you. I see you made another post discussing some of those issues
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#122 of 124 Old 02-28-2002, 08:52 PM
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Peggy and anyone else interested,
I started a new thread about the effects of feminism on the family. Please add your comments.
In Peace,
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#123 of 124 Old 03-01-2002, 01:00 AM
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I would LOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOVE to, ladies, but ds has put an hour a day restriction on my internet time which barely leaves time to answer emails and catch up on local stuff-- no time for lengthy debates of this nature. This is what I get for putting long awaited limits on his tv. I will have to prove that I can take what I dish out. Happy debating though!
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#124 of 124 Old 03-01-2002, 02:23 AM
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the mommy wars article WAS skipped the prejudicial and misogynistic statements and went straight to "Parenting is not a spectator sport." Everything from there was good, including her saying that kids are doing drugs and having sex because 1) there's no one home to stop them and 2) no one who really has the time or energy to care and 3) they have not been fully nurtured--all that is right on, in my opinion. "If there isn't any substance given to life beyond mere material possessions and acquisitions", she says, kids don't function well, socially, spiritually, whatever, as they grow.

some of the housework article i liked...i do feel better when i can clean my house (disclaimer, it never is b/c i'm single mom full time student part time museum educator full time researcher for the ap project, and honestly i wasn't very good at it when i was home full time with my son years ago). and I am getting better at it...her suggestions on how to actually make it better are good, workable i mean. but to say that dirt is the source of women's secret guilt is a bit fascist for my beliefs...anybody who has read andrea yates confession (don't do it btw i cried for three hours) will hear the overtones from her fears...she said the kids werent developing properly because she was a bad mother, hadn't kept a clean enough house, didnt feed them optimal nutrition (gee anyone else here ever guilty of either), wasn't a good enough wife to her "godly" dh even though she was homeschooling all 5. that they were all doomed by her failures.

look i am looking forward to this new baby so i can be home full time for the first time in 5 years and homeschool
my 8 year old and do LLL and AP group and my research full time...just be a lot more domestic in general, bake bread, all that. but for *me, for my kids... for all of us, and my soon to be dh wants me to be able to do that...not so i'm not a hard-edged business women who isn't eminently **ckable at his slightest twitch.

i have felt that "secret guilt" of a house that isn't clean enough, (ok it's not quite so melodramatic, i deal with the piles of books and papers and surveys and art supplies and more books and journals and clean and dirty laundry with something approaching aplomb and get to it when i truly can and dh helps alot.) but i think we should figure out ways not only to stop that feeling in ourselves, when it becomes neurotic (something you don't do anymore to feel good but to keep from feeling bad)
but to help other women stop feeling that too.

but she's right, it has to get done.

so a better solution would be i think for us women at home (and even women woh) to help each other clean our houses. it *is* fun to do it together with another person as she says (honestly though i prefer another grown up to only a 2 yr old so i can have some witty repartee, social commentary, and share gossip with). the kids prefer to play with each other around us anyway. also such work is good for making you realize any relationship problems with your significant other aren't really THAT bad, unless they are that bad, and then women usually encourage other women to leave.

guess i am trying to say that with these survey responses dwindling down i have a lot of time to wax philosophical about all this. no really i am saying theres too much isolation, alienation, fear, and paranoia in the article in toto. and not enough joy, creative work (Marx), and an appreciation of we women's commonality and therefore need for *each other* in our roles as mothers and wives.

much love


The woman is so hard
Upon the woman.
---Alfred, Lord Tennyson
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