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Old 11-08-2010, 04:40 PM - Thread Starter
 
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Old 11-15-2010, 12:03 PM
 
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columbusmomma!


Thanks!!

 

I have a question:

what does a UU Christmas Eve service look like?
 


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Old 11-15-2010, 01:51 PM
 
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Hi!

 

Well... I'm not exactly a Unitarian Universalist, but it's closest to what I am, and I guess it's inclusive enough to include me, LOL.

 

I became a Christian in high school, and I think I always wondered if it was the peace of God I felt, or the peace of certainty.  Nonetheless I was convinced that the Bible was true, and that provided an anchor in my life.  However, recently I've had the chance to practice classical Christianity as I understood it, as well as research more of the historical aspect of the development of Christianity, and I'm no longer convinced.  Not to mention the fact that I've been a heretic for most of my Christian life (14-20, Bible-believing Protestant, 20-31 or so, ecumenical heretic... ).

 

I am convinced that there is more to this life than meets the eye and that it is our duty to honor life.  I don't believe in the immaterial soul, reincarnation, or many gods, though, so I'm thinking this leaves me somewhere between Transcendentalism and Unitarian Universalism.

 

I'm not QUITE ready to put that out on my facebook yet... is there a way to change it so that the change doesn't show up on my profile?  Maybe I'm here as an in-between stage.  LOL

 

Anyway, I'm just interested to see what's going on here.  Thanks for letting me tag along... I'm not sure I need a label but for now I do feel the need to explore my beliefs in a group.  I tried to find one here but the chaplain never got back to me.  :(  My husband is Muslim and the kids are presently being raised Muslim.  I have faith that by my example, when they get older, they will be able to make a free choice as to their own beliefs.  I am happy for them to have something more certain for now, as the community we are in is very loving and accepting.

 

Okay... I took that quiz.  LOL.

 

1.  Liberal Quakers (100%)
2.  Secular Humanism (97%)
3.  Unitarian Universalism (97%)
4.  Orthodox Quaker (91%)

 

What is funny here is that I got "secular humanism" sandwiched in between "Liberal Quakers" and "UU" and "Orthodox Quakers".  Like, somewhere in between Orthodox and Liberal Quaker, you go through an atheist phase.  LMAO.  I realize that is not how the quiz is designed, but I actually don't want to be a Liberal Quaker (too indecisive, I don't want to be a "liberal" something, I just want to be that thing, by itself, if the conservatives won't have me I won't be in it, I don't feel the need to form a splinter branch... KWIM?).  Does that mean I should become a secular humanist?  This is too funny.


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Old 11-15-2010, 05:28 PM
 
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Hiya!

 

I am not with a UU church but I hear we have good congregation here. We also have a CUUPS chapter in the church and I am wondering if that is common. Do you gals have CUUPS at your church?

 

CUUPS info: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Covenant_of_Unitarian_Universalist_Pagans

 

Thanks!

 

Rhianna

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Old 11-16-2010, 08:07 AM - Thread Starter
 
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Originally Posted by columbusmomma View Post

I have a question:

what does a UU Christmas Eve service look like?
 



At my church we have two services on Christmas Eve.  The earlier service is "family-oriented" and that is the one my daughter and I attend every year.  This service usually focuses on a retelling of the nativity story, often from the point of view of the animals.  The story is usually told in parts with different readers and interspersed with the congregation singing Christmas carols.  I remember last year being impressed with the way the story was communicated from a very human slant - how tired and scared Mary would have been, how worried and frustrated Joseph must have been, what a relief to finally have a warm, safe place to rest, and the incredible joy when the baby is born.  On Christmas Eve at my church, the phrase "Every night a child is born is a holy night." is always used.  The service ends with the ritual of lighting a candle from the chalice flame and then passing the flame to candles held by all the members of the congregation.  Then we turn out the lights and sing "Silent Night" together by candle-light.  It is beautiful.

 

Here is the Order of Service for last year's Christmas Eve family service at my church.

 

The later service includes a homily and I know it also includes Christmas carols and the candle lighting ritual.  I have not attended that service, but you can read some past homilies online:

All That We Need

Christmas Eve Calling

Is It Positive?

A Wish Stays Lit

 

Here is the Order of Service for last year's Christmas Eve traditional service at my church.

 

Some notes:  I am not Christian myself but my family growing up always celebrated a secular version of Christmas.  Now that I have a child of my own, going to church on Christmas Eve has become a wonderful addition to our Christmas traditions.  In my opinion, the Christmas Eve service at my church would work for both Christians and non-Christians, but I'm sure there are a few people every year who think it is "too Christian" and also a few who think it is "not Christian enough".  It is not my favorite service of the year, but I do like it very much.


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Old 11-16-2010, 10:28 AM
 
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Thanks so much for all the info Adele! That was helpful reading.


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Old 11-16-2010, 11:56 AM - Thread Starter
 
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Originally Posted by rhianna813 View Post

Hiya!

 

I am not with a UU church but I hear we have good congregation here. We also have a CUUPS chapter in the church and I am wondering if that is common. Do you gals have CUUPS at your church?

 

CUUPS info: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Covenant_of_Unitarian_Universalist_Pagans

 

Thanks!

 

Rhianna



 

Welcome.gifRhianna!

 

We do not have a CUUPS chapter at my church.  I don't think it is "common" to have one in that if you look purely at the numbers, the majority of UU congregations do not have a CUUPS chapter.  On the other hand, it is not excessively rare either, and it is my understanding that CUUPS is strong and active and new chapters are forming.  I think chapters might be easier to find on the west coast than where I am in the midwest.  Here, UU has a strong humanist heritage that sometimes tends to dominate.  I would love to learn more about UU Paganism myself!


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Old 11-16-2010, 12:27 PM - Thread Starter
 
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Welcome.gifEdnaMarie!

 

Unitarian Universalist and Secular Humanist are always the top two on that quiz for me, sometimes switching places.  Liberal Quaker is usually in the top four for me as well.  There is even a joke that a Unitarian is just a Quaker with Attention Deficit Disorder. lol.gif

 

Orthodox Quaker never scores very high for me though.  I think because I am not and have never been a Christian.  Liberal Quaker is like UU in that it has Christian roots, but you do not have to be Christian to be a liberal Quaker.  I am by no means an expert on Quakerism, but I would not describe Liberal Quakers as a splinter group.  Like conservative Quakers, they practice the silent meeting style of worship.  There are other Quakers in the US (Pastoral, Evangelical) who no longer practice that style of worship, or at least not exclusively.  I think the quiz separation into "liberal" and "orthodox" Quakers is intended to differentiate between Quakers who put an emphasis on scripture, along with the light within, and Quakers who put emphasis entirely or almost entirely on the light within with very little or no focus on scripture.  This is just a guess though.

 

Good luck in your spiritual journey!


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Old 11-21-2010, 07:41 AM
 
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I have often thought of starting a CUUPS chapter at our congregation. I don't think many people from our congregation would attend actually, very humanist, secular, and usually the mention of God sends people running. However, I identify as pagan and have been practicing for some time. I also know that we are in a large metropolitan area with 3 other congregations nearby who don't have a CUUPS chapter so it could be a good opportunity to worship together. 

 

Right now, I would normally be getting ready to go but I am feeling disheartened and thought I would spill my brain and heart for a minute. Our congregation is made up of mostly those over 65 and I am 25. I am finding few personal connections. One of my main reasons for joining the congregation was DD and we had a great minister that the congregation let go. She has only been gone since before the summer but I am really feeling that loss. 

 

DD is the only child. I really wanted her to participate and learn and explore. Last year, we had one teen who looked after her during services and now she is in university. Now there is nothing for DD at all and when I go, I am expected to watch her myself meaning i miss the service anyways. I feel like I might as well stay home because it will be the same. 

 

This breaks my heart because I have always had a strong pull to the spiritual. Identifying as pagan means I am usually on my own to organize worship, which is good but sometimes I like to enjoy other perspectives and not have to do all the planning, leading, etc all the time. I also feel for DD because this is another opportunity for her to connect with others her age and to grow in her own way.

 

Two of the three other congregations seem to have bustling RE programs. I don't know their age demographics. They also have much more programming. Our congregation has programming targeted at seniors (ie senior home tours, etc). Not something a 25 year old is thinking about (DH is 27 so we are pretty much in the same boat). Would it be horrible to visit? Part of me feels bad because I know the president of our board wants me to start an RE program but to be honest, I still feel green to UUism and I would have to do all of that work for just one person at this point (even though I love her dearly), the rest of the congregation doesn't seem to want growth. 

 

I am not sure what direction to go in. Part of me wants to sit and talk with the ministers from the other congregations. I was watching some UUA videos (we are in Canada and part of the CUC) and it was wonderful to see all the programs for YA and children. Made me see what I am not getting spiritually from this congregation. There was one suggestion that I think came from the videos...having neighbouring congregations help us grow our RE program since they already know what they are doing. 

 

Thanks for letting me get that out (and sorry for the spelling mistakes...the resolution is odd right now on MDC so I am just typing away since I can't really see).


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Old 11-21-2010, 12:21 PM
 
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Aw, thanks!

 

In the website, it discusses the differences and what I understood was that liberal Quakers take a much more relativist view of scripture, i.e. that's how the Spirit came to us in the west but it's by no means the absolute truth.  In other words, I wouldn't even say that according to the definition I understand (see another thread on here, "Can I be a Christian if...") they are Christians.  Maybe some of them are Christians, but they certainly have room under their umbrella for non-Christians, as you note.  The divinity of Christ is the main thing, I think.  But then, I have read on other UU threads that some people who do not believe in the divinity of Jesus Christ who are UU, consider themselves Christians.  I don't think Christians are actively trying to weed out heretics at this point so it doesn't really matter to anyone but them and God, I guess.
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Adele_Mommy View Post

Welcome.gifEdnaMarie!

 

Unitarian Universalist and Secular Humanist are always the top two on that quiz for me, sometimes switching places.  Liberal Quaker is usually in the top four for me as well.  There is even a joke that a Unitarian is just a Quaker with Attention Deficit Disorder. lol.gif

 

Orthodox Quaker never scores very high for me though.  I think because I am not and have never been a Christian.  Liberal Quaker is like UU in that it has Christian roots, but you do not have to be Christian to be a liberal Quaker.  I am by no means an expert on Quakerism, but I would not describe Liberal Quakers as a splinter group.  Like conservative Quakers, they practice the silent meeting style of worship.  There are other Quakers in the US (Pastoral, Evangelical) who no longer practice that style of worship, or at least not exclusively.  I think the quiz separation into "liberal" and "orthodox" Quakers is intended to differentiate between Quakers who put an emphasis on scripture, along with the light within, and Quakers who put emphasis entirely or almost entirely on the light within with very little or no focus on scripture.  This is just a guess though.

 

Good luck in your spiritual journey!


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Old 11-22-2010, 04:50 PM
 
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I don't think our church has an official CUUPS group, but there is a thriving group of Pagans at our church (now that I no longer really identify as a Pagan - lol). Our whole congregation has "6th Source Sundays" which are basically pagan rituals for the appropriate holiday, kind of watered down to do in a large group that includes pagans and non-pagans. I think this is done quarterly at a regular Sunday worship time. Then some of the other pagan holidays are done in a smaller group. I still like the rituals though - especially the small ones; they are the most spiritually moving for me.

 

I still haven't been to church in a long time. I am feeling more like I'm taking a break and less like I am on my way out though. We are planning to attend a family night event which is also a Christmas decorating thing. DD likes this and she has some kids she likes at church. She just hates the RE classes. We're there mostly for the socializing anyway so I'm OK with just doing more social/church-connected activities. This may sounds strange, but I don't get a lot spiritually out of church. I get that from art, nature and usually on my own somehow.

 

I've only been to Christmas services once. We also have a family one and then a late night candle service. They did candles at the early one last time too though. I used to celebrate Yule instead of Christmas, but we've ended up doing the cultural Christmas thing because our extended family celebrates Christmas. Our church also notes Jewish holidays, lights candles for Kwanza and the Advent at this time of year.

 

Our church has grown a lot in the past few years, so I kind of miss that smaller, more intimate feel. We've also been through some ministers. I haven't really even met the new one yet (though I helped get her here before I quit the board last year due to health reasons). I suppose this could be another reason I have been hesitant to get more into church. Both previous ministers left suddenly. It kind of felt like being dumped because I had shared a lot of personal things with the ministers in a pastoral care capacity. So for now I guess in some ways I am keeping my distance.

 

That and I know when I do finally go back to a service, I will be inundated with well-meaning and heartfelt "how've you beens" etc and I am very introverted. Just going to services can be kind of overwhelming for me. And I've realized that while I love the idea of the huge social justice focus my church has, it's a bit overwhelming for me emotionally.

 

OK. Now I am rambling here. Welcome to the new people on the thread. :wave


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Old 11-22-2010, 07:41 PM
 
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My 10yo dd and I just made our first visit to our local UU church yesterday (my 5yo dd was still asleep so she stayed home with Daddy). Dd had a great time in Sunday School and Children's Church. In Sunday School they did a science experiment; they were trying to create a volcano but it didn't work. They also had a choir practice and she liked that, too. After a nice long time playing out on the playground, they came back indoors and heard a story about a boy who grew up to be a doctor in Africa and win the Nobel Peace Prize. Then it was time to carry canned goods up to cornucopia at the front of the church. This was toward the end of the service.

 

During the Sunday School hour, I had a nice time hanging out in the church's cafe, drinking coffee and visiting with a couple of other women. I also really enjoyed the service, even though they said it wasn't really a typical service. They've been having some struggles and their pastor has been let go, and during this service everyone had an opportunity to share his or her feelings.

 

Dh has been saying he wants to stay away from organized religion, but he seemed kind of intrigued when I told him how the lady who showed us to dd's Sunday School told me about their worship team. I can't remember if she said they were called Worship Team Fellowship or Forum or what -- just that she added that, yes, they realize the initials are WTF and they actually like that. :) 


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Old 11-24-2010, 06:46 PM
 
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Short musing on UU hymns:

 

I found my deceased grandparents' old Methodist hymnal today, the one engraved with their names. I popped it open on the Christmas selections. DD was noticing that almost every song had "Amen" at the end with the music. I played a little bit of one holiday tune then started playing another I'd never heard of before. I recognized it from choir but it had different words in the Methodist book than we had used. What I found most interesting was that I am so used to the UU hymns now, that even though many are borrowed or rewritten from other traditions, it's the more traditional versions that seemed strange to me.


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Old 11-24-2010, 09:30 PM
 
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I just saw an email on our church list about CUUPs. We have a good-sized pagan group but the church is not a part of CUUPs at this time. I thought I remembered a previous poster mentioning looking for CUUPs. So even if your local congregations aren't part of it, they may still have an active earth-based community.


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Old 11-27-2010, 08:55 PM
 
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http://www.w3.org/People/Berners-Lee/UU.html

 

Fascinating article by Tim Berners-Lee, comapring the workings of the World Wide Web with UU philosophy.


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Old 11-29-2010, 10:01 AM
 
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Singin_Angel - I get where you are.  I don't have any children but aside from that our situations are similar.  I'm 23, and until I left our congregation I was the only person in their 20s.  Our minister left/resigned/was asked to resign/was fired (for totally ridiculously non-reasons that boiled down to out and out discrimination).  She was fabulous and wonderful and most of the under-40 crowd was really upset that she left (all, you know, 6 of us). 

 

I tried a few of the other "local" churches (the closest is 45 minutes away) but none of them really did it for me.

 

So I am church-less.  Which, to put it indelicately, sucks.

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Old 11-29-2010, 08:13 PM
 
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Hi Ziggy,

 

I'm so sorry about your current situation! :hug

 

Dd1 and I just went back a second time to our local UU church and it was awesome, for both dd and me!

 

I really, really love hanging out in the church's cafe and chatting with folks during the Sunday School hour. It will be hard this Sunday because they're discussing something in the Forum that really interests me (about the DREAM Act), but I may actually forgo it just because I love that morning coffee hour so much!

 

During worship a woman spoke about her experience growing up in the church youth group, leaving for a while (though she kept attending UU churches wherever she relocated), and then coming back as an adult. She shared wonderful poems by Rainer Maria Rilke ("The Possibility of Being"), Galway Kinnell ("Relearning Our Loveliness"), Kahlil Gibran (some farewell words from The Prophet), and e.e. cummings ("i am a little church (no great cathedral)"). I was touched when she spoke about sin being separation. I'd also heard this while growing up fundamentalist, but with her it was all about staying connected to one another.

 

That thought about sin being separation really stayed with me, and early this morning I felt led to pray a decade of the Rosary as I sometimes do, and the mystery that I felt led to meditate on was the rotting log in a Magic School Bus episode that keeps playing over and over again on QUBO, In this episode, Ms. Frizzle's class has a rot contest, and Wanda wins when she opens a dish of something that's been in her refrigerator since she was four. Her prize is a seedling tree, and she decides she wants to plant it in an old abandoned field.

 

The class heads over and Wanda becomes determined to clean up the field and have the old rotting log hauled away -- but of course the class shrinks to the size of bugs so they can go in and see what's really going on in the log, and of course they all decide that what's going on is WONDERFUL and they need to just leave it alone (Wanda does go back to add the rotting stuff in her dish to the Earth to fertilize her seedling tree). Anyhow, as I was meditating on the log while saying my Hail Mary's (to me, Mary is such a symbol of the Earth with her willingness to let God plant something, and start a whole process, in her that she had no control over) this resolution grew in me that I need to learn to be like the rotting log. I need to be willing to offer up myself, and my life, as food and as habitat to the Life Force in all its many forms.

 

I started thinking how similar this vision is to that of the UU Church, in the Church's willingness to release control of the growth process and to nurture and welcome (be a home to) anyone and everyone who would seek to burrow in and find sustenance in the UU community. Of course, this nurture and welcome is not without boundaries; just as there are natural laws that govern what happens inside the rotting log, in UU, mutual respect is essential, and I like the way Tim Berners-Lee compares communication in the UU church with communication on the World Wide Web in the article I linked to above. We can communicate freely as long as we respect the rules, and in UU the basic rule IS respect.


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Old 12-23-2010, 10:24 AM - Thread Starter
 
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"Baby, it's cold out there!"  cold.gif

 

It's Winter!

 

Come join us on the new Winter Unitarian Universalist Thread.


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