Is Holy water a Catholic thing? - Mothering Forums

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#1 of 19 Old 05-15-2011, 04:04 PM - Thread Starter
 
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My MIL likes to throw out nasty remarks about my dh and I chosing to not be Catholic anymore. Thing is, she used Catholicism to abuse. I was raised in both the Catholic and protestant home, but after seeing how she was using Catholicism to abuse dh and trying to use it to abuse me, we decided to raise our children protestant. Even though I know MIL does not care as much about it as she claims to, it is just about control, she often makes remarks about us going to hell and our marriage not being valid and such because it was not in the Catholic church.  But there is a lot to what she has done with regards to that. 

 

So today, she gave us Holy water from some place where she said some event happened having something to do with the Virgin Mary hundreds of years ago. 

 

Opinion?

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#2 of 19 Old 05-15-2011, 04:22 PM
 
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Originally Posted by Lisa1970 View Post

My MIL likes to throw out nasty remarks about my dh and I chosing to not be Catholic anymore. Thing is, she used Catholicism to abuse. I was raised in both the Catholic and protestant home, but after seeing how she was using Catholicism to abuse dh and trying to use it to abuse me, we decided to raise our children protestant. Even though I know MIL does not care as much about it as she claims to, it is just about control, she often makes remarks about us going to hell and our marriage not being valid and such because it was not in the Catholic church.  But there is a lot to what she has done with regards to that. 

 

So today, she gave us Holy water from some place where she said some event happened having something to do with the Virgin Mary hundreds of years ago. 

 

Opinion?


I'm not sure what you are looking for an opinio on??  It sounds like she brought you Holy Water from an Marian apparitions site.  It is a blessed item, so if you do not want it, you are supposed to burn it or bury it. 

 

 


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#3 of 19 Old 05-15-2011, 04:37 PM - Thread Starter
 
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But I mean, did she mean it as a "you need to be Catholic" remark, or is it something that would be used in other religions?

 

Since I was raised in the Catholic church, I would just give it to my dad or something.

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#4 of 19 Old 05-15-2011, 04:43 PM
 
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I don't know how she meant it.  We've given Holy Water from a Holy site to non Catholic friends before, as a gesture of well being.  A lot of religions use blessed water, but I'm 99.9% the water you were given has been blessed by a Catholic priest or deacon.  If it offends you, pass it on to someone whom it will not offend.


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#5 of 19 Old 05-15-2011, 04:56 PM
 
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I also have no idea how she meant it.  However, I was raised Pagan and we have/use holy water too (usually called sacred water or something like that though).  So it's definitely not a Catholic only thing.


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#6 of 19 Old 05-15-2011, 04:59 PM
 
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When I was a teenager, my mother used to throw holy water on me when I was going out to a dance, along with the advice "Don't do anything you'd be ashamed of". I presume it has the power to ward off boys.

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#7 of 19 Old 05-16-2011, 04:56 PM
 
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Holy water is also an Orthodox Christian "thing." I've also seen it blessed/used by "High Church" Episcopalians/Anglicans/


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#8 of 19 Old 05-17-2011, 03:39 PM
 
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Lots of faiths maintain the tradition of Holy Water.  Of course the Catholics and Orthodox do.  For protestants I know Lutherans, Methodist, Anglicans, probably other liturgucal mainline denominations.  Although it has been my experience that it is not as big of a deal to them.

 

Why did she give it to you?  Perhaps she thought you would like it, be blessed by it....who knows.  If you do not want it give it back to her or give it to someone who would like it.


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#9 of 19 Old 05-17-2011, 04:25 PM - Thread Starter
 
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Originally Posted by choli View Post

When I was a teenager, my mother used to throw holy water on me when I was going out to a dance, along with the advice "Don't do anything you'd be ashamed of". I presume it has the power to ward off boys.


LOL...did it work?

 

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#10 of 19 Old 05-17-2011, 04:31 PM - Thread Starter
 
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Originally Posted by lilyka View Post

Lots of faiths maintain the tradition of Holy Water.  Of course the Catholics and Orthodox do.  For protestants I know Lutherans, Methodist, Anglicans, probably other liturgucal mainline denominations.  Although it has been my experience that it is not as big of a deal to them.

 

Why did she give it to you?  Perhaps she thought you would like it, be blessed by it....who knows.  If you do not want it give it back to her or give it to someone who would like it.

If she had simply given it to me and there had been no hostility in the past, I would have taken it as a nice thing. But, she has done things like laugh during my child's Baptism "because it is such a joke." And inform my children that they are going to Hell because they are not Catholic and even saying my dh and I are not really married because our marriage was not blessed in the only true church. I do have Catholic family members and friends and when I was young, attended the Catholic church. But with the history of things she has said and done in the past, I wondered if this was meant as an insult or not or what it even meant at all. I have enough Catholic family and friends that if it were strictly a Catholic thing, then I would pass it on to them. I know that in the past, she has tried to push Catholic rituals on to us that actually went against our religion. Since the holy water thing was so new to me and I had not heard of giving someone holy water, I wondered what it meant. I don't even know what I am supposed to do with this regardless of religion (we let our children pick their own religions. My dh and I are definitely of different religious beliefs and my children are raised with both, but neither of us are Catholic anymore).
 

 

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#11 of 19 Old 05-17-2011, 07:20 PM
 
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I honestly can't say what was meant by the gift but there are two kinds of water referred to in the vernacular as "holy water" and they are different things in the Catholic Church. There is blessed Holy Water and there is water from springs on holy sites. "Lourdes water" is a popular water from the spring at the site of the apparition of Mary in Lourdes. It is sometimes believed to be miraculous. If this is what you received it is probably not blessed by a priest and people of different faiths or no faith are frequently interested in it. I water from one of these sites (Maryemana) and have given it to non-Catholics at their request. 

 

In either case, you don't have to burn or bury holy water to avoid disrespect. You can simply pour it out on the ground. 


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#12 of 19 Old 05-19-2011, 09:47 PM
 
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Wow. I have no advice about the holy water, but your MIL could use some schooling in Catholic teaching. First of all, you do have a valid marriage in the eyes of the Church. Secondly, all baptisms are valid. I could baptize my DD in the kitchen sink and as long as I say "I baptize you in the name of the Father, Son and Holy Ghost" it's valid. We also don't believe that non Catholics are going to Hell. Maybe as a gift to your MIL, you should give her the Compendium to the Catechism of the Catholic Church.

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#13 of 19 Old 07-21-2011, 06:14 PM
 
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Originally Posted by scottishmommy View Post

Wow. I have no advice about the holy water, but your MIL could use some schooling in Catholic teaching. First of all, you do have a valid marriage in the eyes of the Church. Secondly, all baptisms are valid. I could baptize my DD in the kitchen sink and as long as I say "I baptize you in the name of the Father, Son and Holy Ghost" it's valid. We also don't believe that non Catholics are going to Hell. Maybe as a gift to your MIL, you should give her the Compendium to the Catechism of the Catholic Church.


Not sure if the OP received the Sacrament of Holy Matrimony or not?? If not, while the marriage is "valid" in the eyes of the Church, is not a sacramental marriage. It would need to be convalidated by a priest to be sacramental. Also, a baptism is not valid if done outside the Sacrament of Baptism performed by an ordained priest or deacon. Just wanted to clarify.


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#14 of 19 Old 07-22-2011, 12:33 PM
 
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No, actually baptisms performed with the proper formula are valid. That's why the Church doesn't "rebaptize" converts from other mainline Christian denominations. And yes her marriage isn't considered Sacramental, but it is valid.

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#15 of 19 Old 07-22-2011, 01:45 PM
 
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Originally Posted by xekomaya View Post

I honestly can't say what was meant by the gift but there are two kinds of water referred to in the vernacular as "holy water" and they are different things in the Catholic Church. There is blessed Holy Water and there is water from springs on holy sites. "Lourdes water" is a popular water from the spring at the site of the apparition of Mary in Lourdes. It is sometimes believed to be miraculous. If this is what you received it is probably not blessed by a priest and people of different faiths or no faith are frequently interested in it. I water from one of these sites (Maryemana) and have given it to non-Catholics at their request. 

 

In either case, you don't have to burn or bury holy water to avoid disrespect. You can simply pour it out on the ground. 

 

It is definitely okay to pour out holy water. In my church (Orthodox) we are obsessive about burning or burying sacred items, but holy water is a kind of domestic blessing which you can more or less throw around freely. Unlike RC's, we even drink ours. If you do not want it, just water the flowers with it.
 

 

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#16 of 19 Old 07-23-2011, 06:38 AM
 
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oops. 

 

Scottish Mommy, wouldn't they have to have some sort of evidence they were baptized in the correct formula?


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#17 of 19 Old 07-23-2011, 04:02 PM
 
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My friend who is a "traditional" Catholic (and holiest person I know) has a child who was baptized by her husband.  The baby was born with a birth defect and had to be rushed into surgery so dad grabbed her quick and baptized her, emergency style, in the bathroom sink I believe, and then gave her back to the nurse to prep her for surgery.  And this was good enough.  I would think, especially if the priest knows you, he would have no reason to think you were lying about doing it or how you had done it.  I don't know why anyone would fake it.  She was sad (and I would be too) that there would be no baptism with all that goes with it.   

 

I know it can and is often done but I believe it also has to be under emergency circumstances.  

 

It is not doable in the Orthodox church (we have a different take on Original sin and do not feel as pressed to have our infants baptized as the RC church does.  Therefore there are nothing that would require an emergency baptism)  I bring this up because when someone converts the Church does accept some baptisms preformed outside the church. what will become of you if you happen to have been baptized in a questionable fashion?  Well not much, they will just do it again.  I had trouble getting proof of my baptism (good grief I have been baptized three times you would think one of them would count) and almost had to be re-baptized.  He finally just took my word for it.  After all why would I lie and miss out on receiving a real baptism?


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#18 of 19 Old 07-25-2011, 07:30 AM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by moonshoes View Post





Not sure if the OP received the Sacrament of Holy Matrimony or not?? If not, while the marriage is "valid" in the eyes of the Church, is not a sacramental marriage. It would need to be convalidated by a priest to be sacramental. Also, a baptism is not valid if done outside the Sacrament of Baptism performed by an ordained priest or deacon. Just wanted to clarify.


You are misinformed on this point.

 

http://www.vatican.va/archive/ENG0015/__P3L.HTM

 

 

Quote:
 

V. Who can Baptize?

1256 The ordinary ministers of Baptism are the bishop and priest and, in the Latin Church, also the deacon.57 In case of necessity, any person, even someone not baptized, can baptize, if he has the required intention. the intention required is to will to do what the Church does when she baptizes, and to apply the Trinitarian baptismal formula. the Church finds the reason for this possibility in the universal saving will of God and the necessity of Baptism for salvation.58

 



 

 


 

 


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#19 of 19 Old 07-25-2011, 11:17 AM
 
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You are misinformed on this point.

 

http://www.vatican.va/archive/ENG0015/__P3L.HTM

 

 

 


 

 



Yes! You are absolutely right. Glad to have been educated on this point.thumb.gif

 

I did want to add though that I was replying to the idea that anyone can lean a baby over the sink and say "I baptize you in the name of The Father, The Son and THe Holy Spirit" without giving a fink about what it means. As you rightly point out, it says, "with the right intention" - I think I was thinking more of that.


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